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Posted: 3/16/2001 9:20:40 AM EST
[#1]
I could be lining myself up for disappointment again, but it looks like a good one to me. The story is true....and pretty incredible.
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Posted: 3/16/2001 9:35:07 AM EST
[#2]
Review from St. Paul pioneer press= 2 stars (of 4) sounds like they drown out the war stuff with love stuff. But these reviewers never like any of the good movies...
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Posted: 3/16/2001 9:45:27 AM EST
[#3]
It should be a good one then. Although the Pioneer Press isn't quite as bad as the 'Enemy Paper', the Star Tribune, they are very much ati-gun. They are both very Liberal papers here in MN.
They wouldn't want to show people that [b]guns[/b] are [b]usefull[/b]. Yes, they were once used to fight tyrrany, an they will be needed again. It has occured thoughout history after governments dis-armed citizens. |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 10:34:03 AM EST
[#4]
That would be the Red Star, not the star tribune. Get it right next time!
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Posted: 3/16/2001 10:44:33 AM EST
[#5]
The tomatometer reads 64% fresh so far!
[url]http://www.rottentomatoes.com/movie-1105774/[/url] |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 11:57:18 AM EST
[#6]
Save your money. It looked great on the previews so I took part of the day off to go to the early show. What a horrible production. The equipment and props were great but the acting and story sucked. I would have rather had seen English sub titles than listen to heavily accented Brits trying to be Russians. The love triangle between the sniper a political commisar and some sniper chick made the movie terrible ( in my mind). The only good thing I can say is that is may have been slighly better than the Thin Red Line, at least I didn't leave before it ended. Hope I save some of you some money.
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Posted: 3/16/2001 1:10:51 PM EST
[#7]
TUBBY, I guess all you could really complain about is the acting. It was just produced so the people who dont read can hear the story. The book 'Enemy at the Gates' was written by William Craig. The book also includes the love stories. Were they suppose to change historical events and write their own story? If you wan't to see a fictional 'Sniper' movie, rent SNIPER, starring Tom Berringer.
Well, I goota get ready for the theatre. Show starts in 1 hr 52 min. Take care |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 1:32:00 PM EST
[#8]
I haven't seen the movie yet..hell I haven't seen Saving Private Ryan yet..but this is quotes from a review in our daily rag."Jean-Jacques Annaud apparently was so impressed with Saving Private Ryan he not only wanted to duplicate it, he wanted to top Spielbergs body count..... The Battle of Stalingrad scenes are thunderous,bloody and bleak,as well they should be. But despite a strong cast and occasional flashes of creativity, the cat and mouse action thriller by Annaud........ is boring.
Enemy at the Gates also would have functioned just fine better probably without a romantic subplot. It goes on to say the showdowns between the two marksman should have been the most suspenseful part of the film but due to poor character development of Konig the audience doesn't know what drives him,etc,etc,etc. Take it for what it's worth. Now..I wonder if BlockBuster still has a copy of Saving Private Ryan [:)] |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 2:21:35 PM EST
[#9]
Crap, that figures.
Another opportunity to produce a fine war flick gets blown by the studio types. |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 2:33:59 PM EST
[#10]
I also took part of a day off to see the movie. As Tubby stated, the acting wasn't all that great, but I did like the story. The love triangle wasn't that much to me, but overall I'm glad I went to see it. To me it was very interesting, but I'm easily entertained. On a 1-10 scale, probably about a 7.
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Posted: 3/16/2001 2:44:00 PM EST
[#11]
I thought this might be about Konings and Zeizta(I'm sure I spelled that wrong). Too bad if it got screwed by hollywood, great story about snipers, coulda been great. I'm just waiting for memorial day "PEARL HARBOR", they better not screw this one up.
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Posted: 3/16/2001 3:07:29 PM EST
[#12]
I saw Enemy at the Gates today and Im not gonna be as hard on it as some of you guys.But it's true the movie was definatly Hollywoodized,the battle cinamatogrophy was very good though,it was a good movie just not an accurate movie.The only true parts of the story is that yes the Russians won the battle of Stalingrad and two Zaitsev killed Thorvold(Koenig),or at least thats what I thought until I loged onto SniperCountry and read that many authorities don't beleave that the battle between the two snipers ever occured,most beleave that it was Soviet propaganda,even Zaitsev never confermed killing Thorvold!Anyway it was a fun movie but very smoozy at times,go see it it's worth the price of the ticket.
Dead Eye |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 3:17:00 PM EST
[#13]
I saw it, and I think it's worth the money. I'd give it a 7.5 or a 7. I'm glad they showed the Soviets for being brutal thugs. The Nazis were basically faceless enemies. The most obvious CGI was the bombing runs of the HE-111's or whatever they were, bombing the city. They were flying way too low.
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Posted: 3/16/2001 3:18:26 PM EST
[#14]
Ok for Hollywood Pure shit for History!
[sniper] Pearl Harbor next I guess |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 5:20:38 PM EST
[#15]
Just for the record, THIS IS NOT A TRUE STORY!! Researchers have repeatedly combed through German War personnel records and Major Konig (or Thorvald) did not exist (ANYWHERE in the Wehrmacht)!
This is a fictional Russian tale about a fabricated hero intended to raise morale among the Russian people. |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 7:02:58 PM EST
[#16]
Wanna "true" sniper story read about Gunny Hathcock...he and the NVAs best went toe to toe ...he put a .308 through the enemy snipers scope as he was being glassed by the NVA sniper....after a considerable dueling stalk....one of Americas greatest heros..but since he killed commies probably never see whollywood touch it...imo
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Posted: 3/16/2001 7:23:51 PM EST
[#17]
Originally Posted By Kevin N: TUBBY, I guess all you could really complain about is the acting. It was just produced so the people who dont read can hear the story. The book 'Enemy at the Gates' was written by William Craig. The book also includes the love stories. Were they suppose to change historical events and write their own story? If you wan't to see a fictional 'Sniper' movie, rent SNIPER, starring Tom Berringer. Well, I goota get ready for the theatre. Show starts in 1 hr 52 min. Take care Kevin, eating crow yet? This movie SUCKED and was nothing, and I mean NOTHING, like the book. Where's the band scenes with the tunnel, where's his sniper "school", and so on . . . and, the girl lived- WTF?!? THAT'S NOT EVEN WHAT HAPPENED IN REAL LIFE! This movie was a joke- not even close to history or the book. DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY. |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 7:32:41 PM EST
[#18]
Just returned for seeing the movie with my 17yr old son. What a disappointment. I can honestly say that it wasn't even close to the book. Bad acting and a bad history lesson make for a thumbs down in my book....
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Posted: 3/16/2001 7:46:31 PM EST
[#19]
You guys are tough critics. I read "War Of The Rats" and loved the book. I still need to read "Enemy @ The Gate".
I loved the movie, I consider it one of the top 10 war movies. The action scenes were fantastic, the view of war was realistic. The authenticity was perfect. My only beef was Sasha, pretty unrealistic. Too bad the "real" sniper war was just Soviet propaganda. I also think it was very accurate they way it showed how the Soviet war machine treats its troops. [sniper] You guys are going to be disappointed in "Pearl Harbor". That really looks like a Hollywood movie. |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 8:10:26 PM EST
[#20]
I won't spoil it for you except to say that the last action that takes place in the movie wouldn't occur to a real combat sniper even after he'd had 3 hits of acid and a gallon of tequila........ VERY UNREALISTIC.
John |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 9:52:59 PM EST
[#21]
Well Steve, I spent $8.50 and seen a movie that at least interested me, although my own mental picture of the story differed often.
Anyway, afterwards my friends and a couple family members stopped off at the local country club for some entertainment/drinks. I spent $50+ to watch a bunch up cowboys/cowgirls line-dance. After that experience, the $8.50 spent at the movie didn't really feel like a 'waste of money". It was surely better than any of the other movies playing at the theatre. I spent more on gas driving my truck there. You will have to recommend a good movie for me to watch. I really havn't seen anything entertain me since Private Ryan. I enjoy [b]combat[/b] movies, and can't wait for Pearl Harbor. I will be buying the video for my collection. Don't care what anyone else thinks. Worst combat/military movie(s) I have? 'Courage under Fire' & 'GI Jane'. They were terrible. Enemy at the Gates doesn't seem that bad now, does it? Good Luck |
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Posted: 3/16/2001 10:45:02 PM EST
[#22]
I am looking forward to this movie (even though I know hollywood has probably given it a lil bit of it's usual twists) But i'll take an "ok" war movie any day over the many Dude Where's My Car types coming out lately.
I have read the book though and it is an excelent read. Out of the 400 plus pages, the sniper duel took maybe 10 of them (and even the book raised the fact that the sniper duel was never confirmed. But if you want a good idea of what it was likeover on the eastern front, read it. |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 1:34:39 AM EST
[#23]
Did'nt gunny Hathcock use ane 06?
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Posted: 3/17/2001 3:25:53 AM EST
[#24]
Definite "war is hell" theme a la "Ryan," lots of gore, makes you glad you weren't there unlike Rambo who made war look like fun.
Silly plot for the most part. Irritating listening to "Russians" with British accents. Overpowering and annoying score. Worth seeing, but it ain't no "Ryan." Spielberg may be a Klinton-supporting pinhead, but the man knows how to make a movie. |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 4:09:18 AM EST
[#25]
pop Platoon in the DVD player, get out the pre-ban M4...you will enjoy watching Platoon while cleaning and "loving" your weapon...if that is still not enough...take out the AK and polish it up too while watching Full Metal Jacket.
All others, even Ryan's Privates, pale by comparison! [uzi] [heavy] Kubrick and Stone in their finest hours! |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 4:10:03 AM EST
[#26]
btt
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Posted: 3/17/2001 6:38:25 AM EST
[#27]
Originally Posted By Kevin N: I spent $50+ to watch a bunch up cowboys/cowgirls line-dance. After that experience, the $8.50 spent at the movie didn't really feel like a 'waste of money". Now that, my friend, is money well spent, so long as there is alcohol involved. I still feel it was a waste of money, however and more significantly, it was a waste of TIME; I could have been at Desperato's watching drunk people get thrown from a mechanical bull (including myself). You will have to recommend a good movie for me to watch. I really havn't seen anything entertain me since Private Ryan. I enjoy [b]combat[/b] movies, and can't wait for Pearl Harbor. OK, I'll give that a shot. Try these (unless you have already seen them): 1) [b]The Beast[/b] (about a Russian tank crew in Afghanistan) 2) [b]Gulipolli[/b] 4) [b]The Big Red One[/b] 3) [b]Black Hawk Down[/b] (OK, so it's not a movie, but it's a great book and soon to be f*cked up by hollywood in a theatre near you). Check those out- I know they are a little old, but nothing lately has impressed me since Ryan. Worst combat/military movie(s) I have? . . . 'GI Jane'. . . Enemy at the Gates doesn't seem that bad now, does it? Good Luck YOU ACTUALLY SAW THAT MOVIE? God help you [;)] I have a few friends that were so pissed at that movie they practically had to go to a therapist for anger managemnet. During filming, she came to Virginia Beach and insisted on going to the SEAL reunion held at Little Creek. No one wanted her there but because it was "good press" (wrong), she got in- one of my friends almost got ejected because he mouthed off to her. |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 8:30:24 AM EST
[#28]
I give it 4 out of 5 stripper clips.
It really gave me a sense of being there. But if you want a movie that gives you a sense of being there, try "Das Boot" with the subtitles. In the theatre, I was dodging the blown rivets. That is my all time favorite war movie, with "Cross of Iron" coming in second [sniper] |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 9:06:06 AM EST
[#29]
Right, I forgot about Das Boot (subtitled ONLY). That should have made my list.
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Posted: 3/17/2001 10:27:56 AM EST
[#30]
[b]"I could have been at Desperato's watching drunk people get thrown from a mechanical bull (including myself)." orginally posted by Steve in VA[/b]
Wasn't that you Friday night in the tight Wrangler's and Justin ropers leaning nonchalantly against the bar, eyeballing the mechanical bull, longing to duplicate that historical ride of '98 that lasted 8, no, 9 seconds until the beast shifted out from under you and you arced over the hay bales, onto the hard floor where you lay a crumpled mass of blood and broken bones? I thought it was..... [;)] |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 1:03:08 PM EST
[#31]
http://snipercountry.com/sniphistory.htm
Addendum by Martin Pegler Curator of Weapons, The Royal Armouries, Leeds, UK Scott, While researching for a book on sniping, I used some contacts at Russian museums to look into the veracity of the much reported fight between Zeitsev and Koenig [Thorvald]. Despite the fact that Russian company and regimental records were faithfully kept even throughout the worst days of the Stalingrad seige, nowhere is this duel reported in war diaries. This would seem to be an odd omission, particularly in the face of the cult of 'Sniperism' that the Soviet press were so keen to extoll. I tend to agree with Anthony Beevor's opinion that the shooting match never actually happened and was the result of propoganda reporting by the press who were always keen to promote new 'Heroes of the Soviet Union'. Apparently Zeitsev himself never confirmed or denied the event, an odd attitude in view of its apparent historical importance. |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 1:37:31 PM EST
[#32]
MM, just for the record, that ride lasted 17 seconds and I only broke my coccyx.
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Posted: 3/17/2001 4:30:23 PM EST
[#33]
I will still probably go see Enemy at the Gates. I never read the book, so maybe it won't suck so bad for me. The love story thing does suck, and its sad they had to try to make the film appeal to women. There would be so many more good films, if Hollywood didn't try to make them appeal to women.
I heard that Pearl Harbor was a Jerry Bruckheimer film. If so, there is probably a 99% chance the film will suck as a result. This man only makes bad films, period. What really hurts is that he is supposed to be producing the Blackhawk Down film also. This man really should be taken out and shot for producing so much crap. I seem to recall hearing about the plot of Pearl Harbor, and if I am not mistaken, it sounded like the film was basically a love story with the Pearl Harbor attack as a background story, pathetic. |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 5:52:39 PM EST
[#34]
I got drug off to see Enemy At The Gates by some of my young friends. There are some good action scenes which make it almost worth seeing. There are also long periods of inactivity that could put you to sleep. Not exactly a RIVETING movie.
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Posted: 3/17/2001 7:50:55 PM EST
[#35]
I say go see it - I mean, compare it to most of the other crap that Hollywood turns out!! I, personally, was entertained, annoyed at times, but entertained.
observations: 1. showed what it is like to be a valued member of a communist country's armed forces - most of the sheep in this country have no idea 2. cinematography was good 3. props were good 4. all head shots? yeah, right! 5. at times, it looked as though the distances involved were waaaaaay to short for sniping |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 7:58:29 PM EST
[#36]
Don't get me wrong, but did anyone else find themselves cheering for the guys carrying Mausers? I just can't find many redeeming qualities in the Nagant.
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Posted: 3/17/2001 8:06:19 PM EST
[#37]
As a German American, I hate to admit this, but on the Russian Front in WWII, German snipers would steal the rifles of Soviet snipers after they shot them, because the Russian rifle was more accurate.
Kind of like in "Iron Cross", when the Germans prefer Soviet SMG's. [uzi] I would still prefer a MP-38 over a PPSH-41 |
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Posted: 3/17/2001 8:27:02 PM EST
[#38]
Well I am still going to see it with the girl tommarow. hope it doesn't suck too bad. A good movie I rented recently was the german production "Stalingrad." Not a great movie but good. I got it with the directors cut of Das Boot. I had high hopes for Pearl Harbor, it will be a shame if Hollywood screws this one up. But not to worry, my copy of Tora Tora Tora is standing by. The BEST movie about Pearl. By the way, anyone remember the movie "Pearl"? What a POS that was.
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Posted: 3/17/2001 9:20:52 PM EST
[#39]
The theatre was packed. Not with only dudes either. The love triangle was an important element both to the screenplay and to the broader appeal the movie was designed to have. If you want realism read books or watch the History Channel. This is Hollywood and a "true story" needs to be fictionalized to make it play onscreen. I thought it was fine. The writers, I thought, wanted to dramatize the inner struggle the Russian sniper had with his intention of disengaging from the German sniper until events occurred that made him ultimately do what he did. I didn't go there to learn a thing about rifles or about wartime sniping, I brought my wife and kept my mouth shut, mostly.
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Posted: 3/18/2001 2:28:54 AM EST
[#40]
Quoted: 1. showed what it is like to be a valued member of a communist country's armed forces - most of the sheep in this country have no idea. [green]Good point. At least the movie does that. It is easy to forget that most people have no clue.[/green] |
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Posted: 3/18/2001 11:44:26 AM EST
[#41]
Another fine opportunity to produce a good war flick gets a mortal wound to the head.
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Posted: 3/19/2001 7:41:55 PM EST
[#42]
First off, I was very dissapointed in the movie. What's up with Ed getting up and WALKING ACROSS THE BATTLEFIELD IN BROAD DAYLIGHT? Talk about a poor adaptation.
Steve in VA, here is a tidbit of historical trivia for you. The chick really did survive in real life. She was sent to gulag for a few decades after the war. She is still alive to this day and was interviewed on the History channel. Her kills exceeded 300+ She was in fact married to Zeitzev, but they never saw each other again after the war, he had thought (as well as her family) that she was dead. I hope they don't choke on BlackHawk Down, and PH this bad. |
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Posted: 3/19/2001 7:48:47 PM EST
[#43]
I liked the movie. I did feel bad when that beautiful mauser was just left there. It is my opinion that the love story is so guys can tell their dates it is a romantic drama, and still see people get shot.
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Posted: 3/19/2001 11:04:53 PM EST
[#44]
havent seen it yet -- but from what i read the director wanted the end to be a tribute to sergio leone (of spaghetti western fame) thats why it had the high noon part
would the germans still keep strict records of there Famous well skilled and proficent Head Sniper being killed by some lowely russian ? embarrassment may have caused them to deny or destroy any known records of the actual duel -- that is IF it really happened thats just my take on it |
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Posted: 3/20/2001 1:19:12 AM EST
[#45]
For what it's worth, our local military historian says that one of the most glaringly inaccurate parts of this movie is the portrayal of this sniper dude as a professional wolf hunter. He was, in fact, a professional deer hunter.
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Posted: 3/20/2001 11:08:40 AM EST
[#46]
Robbins' "War of the Rats" was stretching it enough already! This movie took the errors of that book, amplified them, and turned it from lame entertainment into pure garbage!
German snipers dumping their sniper 98s for the superior accuracy of the Mosin Nagants? That's a laugh! Maybe it was the smoother bolt operaton? or.... Maybe it was the "superior gas system" that the MN had according to Robbins! Hahhahahhaha! I'd rate this movie up there with Tom Berenger in "Sniper"! Nerk! Nerk! DaMan |
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Posted: 3/20/2001 11:45:40 AM EST
[#47]
Oh geez, market crash, agreeing with Daman, what else can go wrong today?
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