They won't send local NG troops or police to do the rounding up. They will send people that are from a few states away. That have no ties to the community.  You might shoot a few but in the end they will burn your house down with everyone in it.  By the time it comes down to rounding people up to fight, a little war crime will be acceptable as long as quotas are met.  

So when do the Ukrainians, who are doing so well, going to push the Russians out of their country? Or, if they can't/don't, how does the war end? Sure, the Ukrainians have done great to still have their country and hold back the Russians, but how long do they last in a war of attrition? As far as I can see, they don't have any real offensive capability, and are shoving their troops in to hold what they have with minor pushes here and there. If they don't do something to end this war in the next few months, the Russians will pound on a spot that will collapse, and through the gap they can roll. Russia doesn't seem like they are anywhere near the point where they give up and fall back, and I don't see Ukraine having the ability to maintain their hold for another couple years.

That 2nd statement we agree on if nothing else. With substantial outside support Ukraine has managed to bog down Russian forces and degrade some of their finest equipment. It’s been extremely beneficial to our foreign policy.

If WW3 ever goes hot we’ve managed to tear up 1 of 3 axis nations without ever using our troops to do it. With any luck Ukraine can keep it going for another 662 days.

If they were Russians would you feel the same way?  That they need to go back and fight for their country?

I have seen tons of comments on here of people saying they wouldn't fight for America. I'd imagine a lot of those posters are ironically the ones also critical of the draft dodgers in Ukraine.

Just a bunch of chest moob pounding

What is the over/under at this point that US troops are deployed?

UKEbois will talk a good game but tend to act french the first chance they get.

Hating your leaders doesn't mean you hate your country. Nobody here is racing to Canada (unless its a KISS concert).


Rather tired of 20+ years of shrubbies' wars.

You could certainly try....but if we are fighting your kid is on the line. Sorry about that.

No it's not.

Ukraine is a corrupt little shithole.

Our last wars have been retarded, I agree. But nobody got worked up in 2014 when Russia took parts of Ukraine. So who is pulling your chain now?

Ukraine is their home. It is being invaded by the Russians. There are no words that remove the stain of cowardice and shame from the decision not to defend your homeland. Corruption doesn't enter the conversation. These are old rules. When a people aren't capable of maintaining them they disappear.

Correct. I’m in no hurry to fight in a near-peer conflict but if I see PRC landing craft hitting US coastlines my first thoughts aren’t of leaving my nation.

Overall, the Ukes have done pretty well for themselves though. If Iraqis or Afghans had half the Ukrainian spirit the ME would look different. Sure, some Ukrainians fled and others refused to return home and help but that’s not an anomaly, even Americans have done that.

I don't think Ukraine has the ability to push Russia totally out of their country but that is not the metric for victory for Ukraine.



The big IF is not the Ukrainian will to fight. They have it. The big IF is the Western will to support them with ordnance and weapons.



Russia has had 3 failed offensives this year and one that was partially successful. Vuhledar was the largest massacre of Russians since the Bilohrivka crossing in mid 2022. Then we had the Kreminna offensive which our own pro-Russian legion assured us had broken Ukrainian lines..yet has not had any significant changes in months. And then we have the Avdiivka offensive which has been the Russian equivelant of playing frogger with DPICM, Javelins, and 155mms.

This is why I am calling my senators and sending emails to my congress critter.



To be fair very few of those have tanks under their screen name.

Fighting for anything is beyond them but criticizing people who do is not.



And at this point they are still farther from Kyiv than in 2022. Why would they be "advancing" if they had already accomplished their goals? Why the need to send meat assaults into RAAM, Bonus, DPICM, and 155mm rain if you haven't accomplished your goals yet?

Burning up your forces for small gains is what folks used to attack the Ukrainian summer offensive..but magically you seem to forget that here?

The Russian losses in Avdiivka are simply staggering. For what?

Reminder: Russia had over a million flee and they weren't being invaded.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/27/we-want-to-run-russian-men-fleeing-conscription

"We're scared, we want to run: the Russian men fleeing conscription".

The majority of people fleeing Russia were men.

The majority of people fleeing Ukraine were older men and non combatants.

They are not the same.



I remember when Russia marched into Tbilisi and annexed the country after the Russian backed invasions earlier.

Did that happen?



There's a thomas the tank engine in your profile pic but no tank Icon. Why?



There are tens of thousands of  women and children murdered, abducted, and raped and this is about money?

Some of ya'll need to take a look inside.




Correct and at some point in the future when/if this Asiatic war goes hot for the 2nd time in 100 years having one of China's biggest allies knocked out and in PCU it'll be easier to focus on where we can excel.

Trump was right to designate Russia as one of the primary threats.

If only the election fraud didn't win none of this would have happened. F'in 4am vote dumps and Domion vote rigging

LOL

Russians are using better tactics?

Give me a break.

Who do you have to bribe to be put on the western border so you don't have to fight the Russians? Those guys looked in good fighting health to me, they also had good equipment.

Seems like a free country worth supporting.

Jokes on them, Russia stripped a lot of units from the western nato borders to send to Ukraine because they were scared of nato aggression

[quote

It's an interesting discussion.  Would you risk your life or your sons and daughters to defend a take over of California or would you let it happen?

This should be a post all its own. With a poll.

It's part of America, so yes.

And so is Alaska.

Both are part of Russia's claim.

@markl32 want to create a thread on it and a poll?

Somehow cross referenced with people who have wished for California to fall into the ocean

Would you die for that corrupt, power mad fuck? No? Then you might want listen to this man.

What did he say that isn’t true? Name me the last war that benefited the average man? The Spanish American war gave us at least new lands to sow. Everything else has been for the benefit of Bankers.

You grave overestimate the amount of honor the last century has had in war my friend.

Op is also concerned for Russian draft dodgers. He’ll be posting about that soon…

Imagine your house is burning down and the ungrateful, lying, corrupt fuckheads in this government and the puppet state they created are tell you “you just haven’t given us enough money” as they steal more and more of it as our borders are being invaded every day.

I’m a real American, as is he. What did Washington say about Foreign Entanglements? What did Madison say about going out and looking for Monsters to slay?

But at least it was done “legally” right?

Ukraine is their home and it is being invaded by Russians. But it's only been independent for 30 years. And once again, they didn't do a thing in 2014, why should they fight now? They're going to lose, it's just a matter of when. Russia has the magic button.

Ukrainians aren't going to disappear. The conquering army shares a lot of genetics and culture. This isn't Arabs wanting to erase Jews.

Every single thing you have listed about Ukraine I can honestly say about Russia.

If Russia can “Pound That Spot And Advance” why aren’t they in Kiev, Kharkov, Odessa, or Kherson?

Good post. I would use John McCain's "Russia is a gas station masquerading as a country" analogy, and say that Ukraine is like the gas station that was stealing credit cards and being used for money laundering, and it's about to be under new management. Not erased from the map.

The premise was 'invaders in our land...'

Why is it burning down? Is there an outside party involved?

Um...they've been fighting and taking casualties since 2014.

yep no sleep lost look myself in the mirror and say next.  come for my little girl and see

Again, context is everything. After the Pedophile In Chief replaced the Taliban with well armed with $80 billion of US hardware Taliban, you can't understand why people are hesitant to encourage their children to die for globalhomo?

Now, US territory being invaded is a different story. Context.

In Ukraine, to fight Russia? Not going to happen.

I have seen comments here referring to the latter example

the governments are the ones to hate but by dint of allowing them to control us we are deserving of the misfortune too

Not really

Attached File

Dont forget all the women that fled to the US and are now clubbing and going to parties

US territory is being invaded, if you try to go and stop it the government will kill you.
But if there's an unapproved invasion the government will kill you for not trying to stop it.
Yeah that's weird that somebody might not want to get involved with the military

In the USA during WW2 women practiced austerity and didn't go to dances, parties, or had any kind of social life.

So did English women.

It was a no fun zone from 1939-1945.

Oh well. Fuckers are perfectly fine running us further into an insurmountable amount of debt that is crippling us and the next 5 generations. They should all be fighting tooth and nail, regardless of whether or not they want to.

Ukraine at the start of this conflict had about 300,000 real men who could serve in a warrior capacity.   Probably around 30,000 to 40,000 of those men have been KIA (figure times three wounded).  

These conscripts aren't going to be worth much and they're backfilling them into units that haven't been rotated off the front, these replacements just get sent right to front line units with little time to train with them in the rear secured areas.    

Trust me, in the USA we'd have the same damn problem.  Hell, probably worse in the USA if we ever had to actually draft men now.

If the Californians have taken up arms and are fighting hordes of Chinese soldiers the answer to your question is clear; go fight.

I have zero issue with anyone who’s personal opinion is “we shouldn’t have a military” or “we shouldn’t be involved anywhere else in the world” but I hate it when people bring up Washington and misquote him to give themselves credibility. Annoys the shit out of me

I dont know. Are you fighting for your country or the biden-zelinsky corruption comedy tour?

Really tough to condemn them in light of the latter.