[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Dances With Wolves (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 4/20/2016 10:50:15 PM EDT
| Why were all the deer in the water at the camp? Did the Indians put them there to poison the water supply for the camp? |
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Quoted: Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further |
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Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. |
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Quoted: Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. Quoted: Quoted: Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. |
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Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. Quoted:
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Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. It may have been. He said it when he was burying the cave entrances and burning the carcasses. |
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Possibly in the book? Quoted:
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Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. Was that in some extended version or something? I don't remember any mention of the deer being shot. I haven't seen it in a long time, but I have seen a version of the movie with some extra scenes. I remember seeing a scene once that showed a few of the soldiers from the fort prior to it being completely abandoned. Don't remember the context though and I think I only saw it one time. |
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I'm watching it now. He never mentioned it. Just shows him go to the water and then he's burning carcasses. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Quoted:
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Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. |
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Quoted: Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. |
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Quoted: Best character in that whole movie. Him and that smelly guy who drove that team wagon. "Bet sumbody back home wonders why he don't write home....heh, heh." Quoted: Quoted: Sir knight? I've just pissed in my pants... and nobody can do anything about it. Best character in that whole movie. Him and that smelly guy who drove that team wagon. "Bet sumbody back home wonders why he don't write home....heh, heh." |
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Quoted: That's a great movie, but it's just that: a movie. I know that even a lot of actual Lakota were pissed off at the "noble savage" routine. Still: "I am Wind in His Hair! I am not afraid of you!" was really cool! |
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The dead deer signify the corruption and decadence of the white man. I liked the movie when it came out - and I still do ("I want to see the frontier before it disappears" resonates) - but that's pretty much the point of the movie. Conveniently, the uglier aspects of native American culture were omitted or greatly minimized. Hollywood. < shrug > |
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Quoted: I liked the movie when it came out - and I still do ("I want to see the frontier before it disappears" resonates) - but that's pretty much the point of the movie. Conveniently, the uglier aspects of native American culture were omitted or greatly minimized. Hollywood. < shrug > Quoted: Quoted: The dead deer signify the corruption and decadence of the white man. I liked the movie when it came out - and I still do ("I want to see the frontier before it disappears" resonates) - but that's pretty much the point of the movie. Conveniently, the uglier aspects of native American culture were omitted or greatly minimized. Hollywood. < shrug > |
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One being vulgar and the other was bats hit insane I presume from syphilis. Kicking Bird and Wind in His Hair were rather endearing though. Wes studi always plays an asshole. I enjoyed his demise. Quoted:
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Sir knight? I've just pissed in my pants... and nobody can do anything about it. Best character in that whole movie. Him and that smelly guy who drove that team wagon. "Bet sumbody back home wonders why he don't write home....heh, heh." I presumed that the crazy commader (who capped himself) was at the end of his rope. There, at the end of what was supposed to be an illustrious military career, finds himself in a frontier shithole with what is probably a terminal condition (bladder). He meets glory boy who's requested that location. It was his last straw. The mule team driver...well, he had a sweet side. He loved his mules. :) I did not like Graham Greene's character. Too soft and feely for a man of the plains. Greene's best "indian" movie was in Clear Cut. Studi was better in Last of the Mohicans, IMO. More believable. |
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Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. Quoted:
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Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. The extended version shows and explain the soldiers leaving the fort. It also show the Lakota having killed and mutilated the buffalo hunters they caught. |
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Interesting tidbit:
Most of the American Indian actors in the film did not speak Lakota, which has gendered speech patterns. The language coach was a woman, and the actors learned feminine speech patterns as a result and the crew knowing that few would be able to translate. So, whenever you're watching a deeply emotional or stoic scene in which two male characters are speaking together, perhaps exchanging wisdom or conveying mutual respect, they're actually talking to each other as girlfriends would, which Lakota speaking audience members found pretty hilarious. |
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Quoted: Interesting tidbit: Most of the American Indian actors in the film did not speak Lakota, which has gendered speech patterns. The language coach was a woman, and the actors learned feminine speech patterns as a result and the crew knowing that few would be able to translate. So, whenever you're watching a deeply emotional or stoic scene in which two male characters are speaking together, perhaps exchanging wisdom or conveying mutual respect, they're actually talking to each other as girlfriends would, which Lakota speaking audience members found pretty hilarious. |
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That's funny Quoted:
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Interesting tidbit: Most of the American Indian actors in the film did not speak Lakota, which has gendered speech patterns. The language coach was a woman, and the actors learned feminine speech patterns as a result and the crew knowing that few would be able to translate. So, whenever you're watching a deeply emotional or stoic scene in which two male characters are speaking together, perhaps exchanging wisdom or conveying mutual respect, they're actually talking to each other as girlfriends would, which Lakota speaking audience members found pretty hilarious. Oh snap! 
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She's 63 now....and a flaming liberal. 
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Epizootic hemorrhagic disease (EHD). EHD is a hemorrhagic disease of white-tailed deer.
The deer congregate in water to try to cool off because the EHD makes them feel hot. Two summers ago my brother's neighbor found over forty dead deer all together in the swamp on his farm. The deer herd numbers still have not came back from getting significantly reduced back then. Full disclosure - I'm a member of DLDWW (there was a "Farside" cartoon about us). MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Funny inwatched this Tuesday on VHS, found it for 99c at half priced books. One of my favorite movies. I always hate whitie at the end though. Kind of why I've never watched it. Figured it was going to be a white man = bad guy and we should all feel bad movie. |
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Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Nor did they elaborate how the Sioux banded together with white trappers 30 years before to steal that land from other tribes. Or how they delighted in chopping up people they killed, most of all cutting off genitalia, usually after torture. Not a bunch you really wanted to get caught by or have ogling your buffalo herd. Or Oglala-ing your buffalo herd either. 
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Read the book a few years ago. From what I remember-
The Capt that shot himself was described as ironically picking a few minutes before Dunbar went in to snap. As a result, no one knew Dunbar was going to the fort. The soldiers at the fort had waited for resupply and none had come. There was a mutiny. Eventually they decided to leave. I don't remember if the water was intentionally poisoned by the dead deer or not. The soldiers leaving the fort on the way back to the larger compost passed within a mile of Dunbar and Timmons going the opposite direction to the fort. |
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I'm watching it now. He never mentioned it. Just shows him go to the water and then he's burning carcasses. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Quoted:
Quoted:
Dunbar mentioned in his narration that the animals had been shot, presumably by the soldiers. I figure that when the mutiny got really bad, they did that just because. The Souix only said "the soldiers couldn't even make it one winter" they didn't elaborate further Lots of stuff is answered in the extended version-like the animals having been shot. The Indians also hunt down and kill the white traders that killed the field of buffalo. |
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Read the book a few years ago. From what I remember- The Capt that shot himself was described as ironically picking a few minutes before Dunbar went in to snap. As a result, no one knew Dunbar was going to the fort. The soldiers at the fort had waited for resupply and none had come. There was a mutiny. Eventually they decided to leave. I don't remember if the water was intentionally poisoned by the dead deer or not. The soldiers leaving the fort on the way back to the larger compost passed within a mile of Dunbar and Timmons going the opposite direction to the fort. I'm thinking the damn autocorrect had its way with you |
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Kind of why I've never watched it. Figured it was going to be a white man = bad guy and we should all feel bad movie. Quoted:
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Funny inwatched this Tuesday on VHS, found it for 99c at half priced books. One of my favorite movies. I always hate whitie at the end though. Kind of why I've never watched it. Figured it was going to be a white man = bad guy and we should all feel bad movie. It's not an overwhelming vibe to the movie. not in my view at least. You can't deny that we seriously fucked over the Indian people as a whole though. |
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I'm thinking the damn autocorrect had its way with you Quoted:
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Read the book a few years ago. From what I remember- The Capt that shot himself was described as ironically picking a few minutes before Dunbar went in to snap. As a result, no one knew Dunbar was going to the fort. The soldiers at the fort had waited for resupply and none had come. There was a mutiny. Eventually they decided to leave. I don't remember if the water was intentionally poisoned by the dead deer or not. The soldiers leaving the fort on the way back to the larger compost passed within a mile of Dunbar and Timmons going the opposite direction to the fort. I'm thinking the damn autocorrect had its way with you  I was reading that thinking, WTF? I need to make more coffee.
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I liked the movie when it came out - and I still do ("I want to see the frontier before it disappears" resonates) - but that's pretty much the point of the movie. Conveniently, the uglier aspects of native American culture were omitted or greatly minimized. Hollywood. < shrug > Quoted:
Quoted:
The dead deer signify the corruption and decadence of the white man. I liked the movie when it came out - and I still do ("I want to see the frontier before it disappears" resonates) - but that's pretty much the point of the movie. Conveniently, the uglier aspects of native American culture were omitted or greatly minimized. Hollywood. < shrug > Damn, same here! It's become the template for Hollyweird. Avatar is Dances With Smurfs Last Samurai is Dances With Sushi What are some of the other White Man is Evil epic movies? |
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I liked the movie, but I also keep in mind that Dances with Wolves was made by flaming liberals intent on re-writing history. Let's get a few facts straight..... Indian tribes all over the Americas went to war with one another and massacred the shit out of the losers. There wasn't this huge kumbaya among all tribes living in peace and harmony with one another. I do not doubt that as individuals and their own religious beliefs that evolved over thousands of years to be one with the earth and in touch with nature, yes that part I believe, but the rest of it no. For example, I recall reading some article from a seafaring expedition from Europe a long time ago that essentially just traveled up the modern day east coast. It described all sort of shelters with plumes of smoke rising from every one of them, so they were just burning wood to keep warm. The problem was that they used up pretty much all the trees in the nearby lands and stripped it bare using up all their resources. So much for being in tune with nature I guess. I'm sure a lot of them froze to death that winter. It's interesting to me to also take a broader view of European contact with American indians starting in 1492. Essentially in another 350 years their whole way of life would be wiped out for the most part. Sure their traditions survive to some degree, but it is this romanticism that a lot of people love to paint with this brush that theirs was superior. Superior how? It was not, quite frankly. Look at actors in these damn movies. Hell all of them have reaped the benefits of modern dental care; you think indians had that in the 1700s? Hell no, and let's keep in mind that tooth decay was a major killer back then. Yes, you read that right, tooth decay can kill. It's the same bullshit you see going to any medieval festival people love to go to these days dressed up as some 1500s english or french noble, eating turkey legs and drinking mead thinking it's awesome and they'd love to live a life like that. The fact was that maybe only a few hundred people lived like that, everyone else had a pretty shitty life. But those facts are conveniently glossed because of the utter stupidity of most people. There's no doubt in my mind that if the roles were reversed the same thing would happen. Suppose American indian society advanced a great deal while Europeans were stuck in some type of stone age. You better damn well believe that the indians would have conquered those newly discovered lands to the east, why? Because they're human beings like everyone else and everyone is the same. Everyone wants to conquer someone else and the victors spread their culture. Of all the modern day movies I've seen centering around the indians during 'modern' times, I would say Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee was pretty decent. One scene in particular that really moved me was an indian father, probably in his 40s or something (keep in mind this movie is set around 1870s? America i think), trying to instill in his son that he needs to adapt to this new way of life because the old one he grew up with his father taught him is not going to last. He convinces his son to go a school to become educated and hopefully have a better future, so the son manages to go along with this. The scene with the dad and son at the train station as the son heads off was particularly striking to me. |