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AR15.COM
8/19/2016 2:58:04 AM EDT
I am dumb at the maths.  I have no idea how to solve this, but am interested from a literary point of view.

A man has developed an engine that can boost 1.5 gee all day. He wants to go to the asteroid belt, in the middle where it is more dense, about 150 million miles from home.
He had built a large craft that will accelerate at 1.5G until 24 hours from mid-point, coast for 48 hours while rotating in free fall, then decel at the same 1.5G.

What would be the max velocity at midpoint, and the times to midpoint and destination?
8/19/2016 3:19:02 AM EDT
[#1]
Okay, I gotta tag this one.
8/19/2016 3:24:55 AM EDT
[#2]
Heck, this site has actually rocket scientist and NASA employees, I'm sure one will be along shortly.
8/19/2016 3:25:11 AM EDT
[#3]
87,000 fps

eta... that was GD response, of course, but I bet it's not far off.
8/19/2016 3:36:49 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote History
Quoted:
87,000 fps

eta... that was GD response, of course, but I bet it's not far off.
View Quote



It's waaaaay too low.
32.2 fps².
Every second it's another 32.2 fps faster.  1900 fps after the first minute, unless I am completely addled.  you hit 87k in less than an hour.
8/19/2016 3:45:25 AM EDT
[#5]
2,794,000 m/s to midpoint

8/19/2016 3:46:31 AM EDT
[#6]
Let me fire up kerbal space program and I'll get back to you.

8/19/2016 3:47:10 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote History
Quoted:



It's waaaaay too low.
32.2 fps².
Every second it's another 32.2 fps faster.  1900 fps after the first minute, unless I am completely addled.  you hit 87k in less than an hour.
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Quote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
87,000 fps

eta... that was GD response, of course, but I bet it's not far off.



It's waaaaay too low.
32.2 fps².
Every second it's another 32.2 fps faster.  1900 fps after the first minute, unless I am completely addled.  you hit 87k in less than an hour.



You're correct.

I can barely get Kerbins into a stable orbit.  

And at 1.5 g boost over 48 hours..
8/19/2016 3:55:44 AM EDT
[#8]
T= sqrt (2d/a)
T = 127775s each leg
Max v = 1878297 m/s

ETA: back of an envelope and distracted. Might have made a stupid rounding error somewhere.
8/19/2016 4:11:46 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote History
Quoted:
T= sqrt (2d/a)
T = 127775s each leg
Max v = 1878297 m/s

ETA: back of an envelope and distracted. Might have made a stupid rounding error somewhere.
View Quote



127,775 seconds?  To midpoint?
At 4 million miles per hour?
8/19/2016 4:13:25 AM EDT
[#10]
Does deceleration occur at "coast for 48 hours while rotating in free fall?"
8/19/2016 4:13:29 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote History
Quoted:



127,775 seconds?  To midpoint?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Quote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
T= sqrt (2d/a)
T = 127775s each leg
Max v = 1878297 m/s

ETA: back of an envelope and distracted. Might have made a stupid rounding error somewhere.



127,775 seconds?  To midpoint?


If I mathed right.
8/19/2016 4:13:54 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote History
Quoted:
Does deceleration occur at "coast for 48 hours while rotating in free fall?"
View Quote


I omitted this nuisance from my math.
8/19/2016 4:14:44 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote History
Quoted:
Does deceleration occur at "coast for 48 hours while rotating in free fall?"
View Quote



No. Reach "midpoint" then spend 48 hours in freefall while rotating, then start decel.
Keeps a standard "down" while under acceleration. Simplifies construction.

ETA: And allows 48 hours of zero grav sex.
It's a fun book.
8/19/2016 4:21:16 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote History
Quoted:



It's waaaaay too low.
32.2 fps².
Every second it's another 32.2 fps faster.  1900 fps after the first minute, unless I am completely addled.  you hit 87k in less than an hour.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Quote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
87,000 fps

eta... that was GD response, of course, but I bet it's not far off.



It's waaaaay too low.
32.2 fps².
Every second it's another 32.2 fps faster.  1900 fps after the first minute, unless I am completely addled.  you hit 87k in less than an hour.

Launching from earth? Gotta figure the well and escape velocity, plus know launch latitude to get specifics normalizing to the ecliptic.

1.5G constant would get you there right quick, though.

Out in the beyond, neglecting orbital elements, the equation becomes simpler.  With constant thrust, you'll have traveled halfway when you reach 75,000,000km. At constant acceleration from dead stop, d = 1/2*a*t^2. d = 75,000,000M km = 75,000,000,000m, a = 14.7 m/s^2 (1.5G). t^2 = 2d/a = 101015s, or about 28 hours, with peak velocity of a*t = 1484.9km/s (about .005C). Total trip time in flat space about 56 hours, with peak velocity just under 1500km/s.
8/19/2016 4:21:37 AM EDT
[#15]
OP postulated a 1.5 g boost.

Have you taken that into account?

Eta... answered, sort of.
8/19/2016 4:28:30 AM EDT
[#16]
What the hell is a gee?

8/19/2016 4:35:03 AM EDT
[#17]
bit rusty

acceleration = A
velocity = AT + Vo
distance = (1/2)AT^2+VoT+C

something like that, go from there.
8/19/2016 4:35:56 AM EDT
[#18]
do you understand the kinds of speed you are dealing with?



just launching where you are fighting Earths gravity well modern rockets achieve escape velocity in a short time, under 10 minutes to hit 25,000 mph







i may be wrong but I think if you did 1.5 Gee it would only take 4 days, 1 day to accelerate, two coasting at 3.1 mil mph and 1 day to slow down
8/19/2016 4:45:23 AM EDT
[#19]

Quote History
Quoted:
No. Reach "midpoint" then spend 48 hours in freefall while rotating, then start decel.

Keeps a standard "down" while under acceleration. Simplifies construction.



ETA: And allows 48 hours of zero grav sex.

It's a fun book.

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Quote History
Quoted:



Quoted:

Does deceleration occur at "coast for 48 hours while rotating in free fall?"






No. Reach "midpoint" then spend 48 hours in freefall while rotating, then start decel.

Keeps a standard "down" while under acceleration. Simplifies construction.



ETA: And allows 48 hours of zero grav sex.

It's a fun book.

you wouldn't reach midpoint and then quit accelerating, midway is some 24hrs after you quit, then another 24 until you light the burner to slow down

 
8/19/2016 4:48:25 AM EDT
[#20]
I'm hoping everyone in the thread has read Poul Anderson's Tau Zero.

Great little novel.
8/19/2016 4:52:37 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote History
Quoted:
you wouldn't reach midpoint and then quit accelerating, midway is some 24hrs after you quit, then another 24 until you light the burner to slow down  
View Quote

This - if you want to spend 48 hrs coasting, then you've got somewhere between 18-21hrs at 1.5G, coast, then the same amount of time as before to decel.

With a 1.5G drive, I'd guess less than an hour added for takeoff from the surface and orienting to the ecliptic.
8/19/2016 5:03:39 AM EDT
[#22]
I get this:











Accelerate 18.92 hours, to about 1,002,000 meters/sec





Coast 48 hours





Decelerate 18.92 hours





Total time = 85.84 hours





Time to midpoint = 42.92 hours








I did it like this:






Imagine a graph of velocity vs time:  it looks like a trapezoid.  You know the length of the top (48 hours), you know the area (150 million miles), and you know the slope of the sides (1.5 g).  Make the units agree, and solve for the height (max velocity) and the length of the bottom (total time).
 
8/19/2016 6:55:39 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote History
Quoted:
I'm hoping everyone in the thread has read Poul Anderson's Tau Zero.

Great little novel.
View Quote



Yeah. Back in the '70s I spent a day with a Casio scientific calculator running inverse tau equations.
8/19/2016 12:31:46 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote History
Quoted:
I'm hoping everyone in the thread has read Poul Anderson's Tau Zero.

Great little novel.
View Quote



I haven't, but I just downloaded it for next.