I am in the middle of having a house built by a large contractor...I signed the contract 1year, and 3 months ago, they actually started working on it about 3 months ago, and it is about 75/80% complete right now.
I have no problem with the timeframe...because it allowed me some time to save up some more $$ before I close...and, I was told at the beginning it would take over a year to build the house.
(Houses are going up like weeds around here...and my builder, alone signs over 300 contracts per month...and they are only ONE, of about 20 major contractors operating here)
An added bonus of the long timeframe will also be the equity I have in the home when it is complete, property values have skyrocketed around here...I signed the contract for 120,000 with the lot and all...similar houses are now selling for 175,000 to 180,000.
My lot was aquired for 18,000 just after I signed the contract...the same size lots are now 50,000 in the same area.
So, I will have some equity...that is what keeps me from going ballistic with the builders

My original contract, as signed, stated that I wanted the garage made 4 feet wider, and 2 feet deeper, and that I wanted the washer/dryer moved into the garage (it was in the kitchen for some reason)
4 months after I signed...I get a phone call telling me they cant make the garage wider because they would have to "re-engineer" the trusses (this is bullshit, the way the house is set up...they would just have to order larger trusses for that part of the house, and reflect the change on the plans which they have on computer, in CAD).
After some fighting...they offered to make the garage 6 feet deeper (which just takes more of the same size trusses)...and to not charge me for moving the washer/dryer.
I finally agreed to this.

Well...now the house is starting to come together...and, I cant believe some of the bonehead crap some of the sub-contractors have done.
Their jobs are not being coordinated properly.

The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side.
then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco

The inside of the house has about 60% of the baseboards installed, and all but one interior door.
BUT...the paint guys came, and went right ahead and sprayed the inside (which is not finished yet)
Two days later...they came back and sprayed the interior doors, and trim (which are not all installed yet) without masking anything...so, they are going to have to paint the walls again...BUT the electricians came, and installed all the switches and stuff, and the cabinets have been installed now.
Another crew pored the driveway, and sidewalk...instead of making me a nice curved, or even octagonal curved walk...they made a big assed right angle, that sticks all the way out into the middle of the front yard. (and its not even level).

Now...I know I get a walkthrough, to point out any things Im not satisfied with...but GEEZE!, I mean how freakin hard is it for someone to say to themselves: "Hey, this trim isnt finished... maybe I shouldnt paint it yet"?

You live I a boom town don't you? My uncle lives in a place like that in Henderson, NV. (Vegas)

A contractor is a guy with a pickup truck and a cell phone who knows a bunch of workers. I wouldn't hire one for the last two houses that I built and it saved me at least 20%. YMMV

Quoted: A contractor is a guy with a pickup truck and a cell phone who knows a bunch of workers. I wouldn't hire one for the last two houses that I built and it saved me at least 20%. YMMV

Yes, I know...but I got in house financing, and lot aquisition, good warranty, ect.

OH, I forgot to add the part that ispired me to write this post

Today...I went by the house, and noticed that the sliding glass doors are installed with the locks on the OUTSIDE

Quoted: A contractor is a guy with a pickup truck and a cell phone who knows a bunch of workers. I wouldn't hire one for the last two houses that I built and it saved me at least 20%. YMMV

We have flatbeds and the workers are legal, dammit!

But residential contractors are VERY often shady fellas.

Welcome to 90% of the people who build homes.

I have this one customer that was told by her husband. "You have a choice. ONE kitchen remodel or TWO affairs"

She told me "If I knew the hell I would have gone through with the contractor and this kitchen, I would have gone with the affairs. At least I would have had fun"

This won't help, but -
Unfortunately, craftsmanship is all but dead in the US and especially so in the building trades.

There is a custom builder in Arizona that installs a brass plate with his signature and date when he is satisfied; after the owner is signs off on the build, the contractor must still be satisfied that the house is ready.

The thing is, all stick built homes are custom, they just have different grades of trim, and there is no reason every house shouldn't be the pride and joy of the owner and builder.

Around here, the first problem is to get the tradesman to show up to do the work.

YUP, been there and done that.......

I have a friend who is a contractor, and he handled the house, BUT he did cut me a decent deal, BUT he also screwed me on a  couple things as well.....

No more have a "friend" in the business build me another house......he never really took me serious about osme of the issues I had with the palce when it was finished, and I ended up having to take care of some little bull shit problems......

Good luck.......

FWIW, 120K aint shit up here. My mom bought her house for 30K in 1976 and a new house thats not even on an acre of land next door went up a year ago and sold for 340K.

I had a house built as well. Absolutele craziness. Hows this for "on the ball" My foundation bolts? Installed. The walls? about 6 inches from the bolts. Thats interior walls only, the exterior are bolted down. But, how the hell do you come up 6 inches off on the foundation?! And check the wiring. I have all the basment and garage outlets wired onto 1 breaker. Ridiculous. My son watches TV, I run the radio and hit the drill press go button...pop.....

Next house, I'm going to be far FAR more "on the ball" and come out every day and babysit and check up on the guys doing the work. Never again will i trust the builders themselves to be "on the ball" because their not even in the fucking game.

You can go after their bond if they refuse to make it right.

I just built a custom house, and other than typical delays and hassles, it was a smooth process.  My builder is a trim carpenter by trade and the build quality is outstanding.  In fact, I have hired him to build my shop.  

Calm Down there Nancy!

I Work for a large sub-contractor her in AZ.  We do cabinets.

Give the guys a break, they are probably doing the best they can, we are human after all.

Maybe the Trim guy ran out of casing for the door.  Don't go jumping all over his ASS till its closing time and then its not done.

Besides thats what the general contractor is for.  You hired him to do this for you, let him do his job.

Hate to tell you this but its not even your house yet.  It is still the builders house, till you sign closing papers its his.  Even then it will still  belong to the bank.

You will get your hose the way you want it if not, then you will have walk through items.

Just relax a bit.

$120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.  

Sorry if I'm being a bit harsh.  I have to deal with Jack ASS(not saying you are, mind you)  homeowners all day long over their Cabinets.   Seems like everyones grandfather or Uncle is/was a master cabinet maker in Iowa...

People don't seem to realize that wood is a natural product.

Just pisses me off.

ETA:

"The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side.
then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco "

Thats odd, the trim should go on top of the stucco.

Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.

Umm...no, Im acting like it is a house Im spending my money on, and paying someone to do a quality job building.

"The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side. then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco " Thats odd, the trim should go on top of the stucco.

No, on this application the trim is "set in" to the stucco.

I am building a house too. All is going smooth so far. Already had the trees cleared, They blast on Sept 10th, and the house should be ready by spring sometime. Sold a 3000sqft house and am building a 6000+sqft home on 20 acres. Should be pretty sweet when it is done.

$120,000.000? Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.

HAR HAR HAR....yeah jeez madmedic, whaddaya think yer buyin man? Yer lucky they're even letting you set foot in the place for 120k.

Stoopid customers, don't they realize we're trying to run a business here?

/sarcasm

And that my friends is what has become of American pride in craftsmanship.

Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.   Sorry if I'm being a bit harsh.  I have to deal with Jack ASS(not saying you are, mind you)  homeowners all day long over their Cabinets.   Seems like everyones grandfather or Uncle is/was a master cabinet maker in Iowa... People don't seem to realize that wood is a natural product. Just pisses me off. ETA: "The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side. then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco " Thats odd, the trim should go on top of the stucco.

Perfect example of why builders have such a good reputation. Their subs are just morons.

Quoted: Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house. Umm...no, I'm acting like it is a house I'm spending my money on, and paying someone to do a quality job building. "The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side. then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco " Thats odd, the trim should go on top of the stucco. No, on this application the trim is "set in" to the stucco.

I agree that you should have what you paided for.  I'm sure you will get it.  Just let the builder do what he need's to do.  If you ride the supers on every little thing(even if its big to you), he will be less likely to look out for you.  Be supportive and nice to the supers and they will take care of you.  I promise.  I'm being serious you would be amazed what a little sugar will do for you.

For example...

There is this one house that we did.  The H/O took a cotton ball and rubbed all the cabinets doors and face frames to see if was at all rough.  She was really making it so I didn't want to do anything extra for her.  Then I flipped a door for her.  She did a 180 with her attitude, she was thankful and supportive.  Instead of critical and down talking.  Well After that I went over the cabs really good for her.

Also how hot is your wife?  Seriously she can get things done that you cant.

The builder will take it in the shorts if you don't close on time.  You have that power, well at least in AZ.

Also here in AZ we have what is called The Register of Contractors"

I hope that I wasn't being to much of an ASSHOLE.  I kinda took all the crap iv delt with this last 6 months out on you.

I apologize.

MJR

Quoted: Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.   Sorry if I'm being a bit harsh.  I have to deal with Jack ASS(not saying you are, mind you)  homeowners all day long over their Cabinets.   Seems like everyones grandfather or Uncle is/was a master cabinet maker in Iowa... People don't seem to realize that wood is a natural product. Just pisses me off. ETA: "The exterior trim guy must have run out of daylight, or materials while putting trim on the front door...so he left, with trim on the left side, and the top (but not the right side)...then the stucco guys come, and stucco the left side and top properly (with the trim)...but stucco right up flush with the right side. then the trim guy comes back...and just sticks that piece of trim right on top of the stucco " Thats odd, the trim should go on top of the stucco. Perfect example of why builders have such a good reputation. Their subs are just morons.

Look I'm a Cabinet guy in AZ, not a trim guy in FL.

Ill have to look at the casing on the houses tomorrow, and report back how its done in AZ.  
I was wrong.

I am a project manager for a commercial GC in Ft. Lauderdale.  I have worked in the field in residential construction.  Allow me to clarify something for you.

EVERYONE in the homebuilding business is a scumbag.  From the GCs to the subs, from the architects to the inspectors.  period.  I have done residential carpentry, electrical, and kitchen cabinets.  Every company, and 99% of the workers, I came across was a complete piece of shit.  And don't let the fact that WCI or Centex Homes is a big company fool you.  I had a friend go to work for WCI as an architect and they were doing $500k and up homes that were complete pieces of shit.  

I'm in the market for a house right now.  You couldn't give me a house built in the last 10 years for free, because I know I'd wind up spending twice what a used house would cost me in repairing shitty work.  My mother just had a house built in Tallahassee by a large "reputable" GC, and they are having all kinds of problems.

In their defense, ordering new trusses longer DOES in fact require re-engineering.

IIRC, you're not too far from me.  If you want/need me to come take a look at what they're doing, and point out some areas you might want to talk to them about I'll be happy to.

With all of this said, $120k sounds like a hell of a deal.  What's the SF/# of rooms?  How far west are you?

Quoted: Another crew pored the driveway, and sidewalk...instead of making me a nice curved, or even octagonal curved walk...they made a big assed right angle, that sticks all the way out into the middle of the front yard. (and its not even level).

Usually when subdivisions are being built, the concrete is contracted out. They are either given plans by the General or just do it on the fly (Its really generic, its only concrete not rocket science). Its not unusual for a crew to come in and do 2 or 3 houses a day in one subdivision.

The workmanship is usually better by a sub than if done by the General (cost cutting). Curves cost money. A lot more form time and manpower to setup. L shaped front walks are the norm everywhere.

"Fall" is usually put in driveways and larger area slabs to control where the water runoff goes, but even if done on a walkway (probably not) should not be noticeable to the naked eye.

Quoted: I am a project manager for a commercial GC in Ft. Lauderdale.  I have worked in the field in residential construction.  Allow me to clarify something for you. EVERYONE in the homebuilding business is a scumbag.  From the GCs to the subs, from the architects to the inspectors.  period.  I have done residential carpentry, electrical, and kitchen cabinets.  Every company, and 99% of the workers, I came across was a complete piece of shit.  And don't let the fact that WCI or Centex Homes is a big company fool you.  I had a friend go to work for WCI as an architect and they were doing $500k and up homes that were complete pieces of shit.   I'm in the market for a house right now.  You couldn't give me a house built in the last 10 years for free, because I know I'd wind up spending twice what a used house would cost me in repairing shitty work.  My mother just had a house built in Tallahassee by a large "reputable" GC, and they are having all kinds of problems. In their defense, ordering new trusses longer DOES in fact require re-engineering. IIRC, you're not too far from me.  If you want/need me to come take a look at what they're doing, and point out some areas you might want to talk to them about I'll be happy to. With all of this said, $120k sounds like a hell of a deal.  What's the SF/# of rooms?  How far west are you?

Im in Port Saint Lucie...
$120k is what I signed the contract for, over a year ago...the market around here has gone way up over the last year, and continues to climb...big housing boom.
4 years ago you could buy a standard lot for $5000 now you cant even look at one for under 40,000 (most are more than that)...and, 4 years ago...my house was a $65k home.

My house will be worth alot more than I paid for it when it is completed...so I am pretty happy about that.
Its not a really big house...(just me living there):  1400sq ft, CBS, 3/2/2.
It comes with alot of nice features (all interior corners are rounded, remote keyless entry/lights, high speed cable routing for phones and TV, blah, blah, blah)

In their defense, ordering new trusses longer DOES in fact require re-engineering.

I mis-stated this part...The expanded garage was an option that they already offered when I signed my contract...so, they already have plans for it in their system.
4 months after I signed on, they decided "Oh, we cant offer that anymore...we're just too busy".

LET ME CLARIFY MY POSITION...Im not hassling the construction super, he is actually very nice.
And I realize I get a "walk through"...so, none of this stuff is really a big deal (unless they refuse to fix it)...I have every indication that they will do right by me when it is all said and done.

I am just amazed by some of the stuff that would be much easier to do right the first time...than to have to come back and fix, after the house is done. (I.E. the wall fixtures installed before the painting is done...painting done before the walls/trim are finished, ect. ect.)...

The sliding glass door installed with the lock on the outside?!

Quoted: Im not hassling the construction super, he is actually very nice.

You should be.  They rely on the fact that you won't, and once the house is done they'll rely on you to get tired of fighting and just go away.  They're doing the exact thing to my mother right now.

Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.

Well if you look down on a $120,000 house, then you will think I am impovershed.

You see, I had my place built for a total cost of, including land, $53,000. I bought the land out right to start.

When it was finished the banks appraiser appraised the house at $64,000. That was 6 years ago.

Not bad for a Okie, thankfully houseing is fairly reasonable here, BUT we do have a few $500,000 houses here, and higher.

I have a nice 2 bdr, 2 bath, home in the country, and I like it just fine Thank you.......

and yes I was "picky" about a few things, BUT it was MY MONEY, and it is MY HOUSE, and I wanted it done right, no matter if it is only a $53,000, not as good as a $120,000 starter house.....

 See ya around.......

Quoted: The workmanship is usually better by a sub than if done by the General (cost cutting). Curves cost money. A lot more form time and manpower to setup. L shaped front walks are the norm everywhere.

They are not the norm around here...I rode all over looking at other peoples walks, and could not find another one like mine. (not to mention that my job takes me up and down peoples sidewalks every shift)

"Fall" is usually put in driveways and larger area slabs to control where the water runoff goes, but even if done on a walkway (probably not) should not be noticeable to the naked eye.

Its very noticeable on this one...standing in front of the house, you can see tha walk sloping toward the middle of the front lawn.

Quoted: Quoted: Im not hassling the construction super, he is actually very nice. You should be.  They rely on the fact that you won't, and once the house is done they'll rely on you to get tired of fighting and just go away.  They're doing the exact thing to my mother right now.

Norman...my builder is Renar, anything I should know about them?

Quoted: I am a project manager for a commercial GC in Ft. Lauderdale.  I have worked in the field in residential construction.  Allow me to clarify something for you.

Norman: who do you work for?

Quoted: Quoted: I'm not hassling the construction super, he is actually very nice. You should be.  They rely on the fact that you won't, and once the house is done they'll rely on you to get tired of fighting and just go away.  They're doing the exact thing to my mother right now.

I guess we have a different breed of Super's here in AZ.  Iv been on "Final Walks" allot(We are doing atleast 30 different sub divisions in the Phx, AZ area).  Its easer to do a cabinet T/A then, than after the H/O has moved in.  All the supers I've seen really try to take care of the Buyer.  But, if the Buyer has been a Bitch/Asshole.  Then its a different story.



Oh BTW we bought a 10 year old house for 107,000 4 years ago.  Still here and wont be moving anytime soon.


Post some pics of your home.  Especially your cabinets.  Who made your cabinets?

Quoted: Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.   Well if you look down on a $120,000 house, then you will think I am impovershed. You see, I had my place built for a total cost of, including land, $53,000. I bought the land out right to start. When it was finished the banks appraiser appraised the house at $64,000. That was 6 years ago. Not bad for a Okie, thankfully houseing is fairly reasonable here, BUT we do have a few $500,000 houses here, and higher. I have a nice 2 bdr, 2 bath, home in the country, and I like it just fine Thank you....... and yes I was "picky" about a few things, BUT it was MY MONEY, and it is MY HOUSE, and I wanted it done right, no matter if it is only a $53,000, not as good as a $120,000 starter house.....  See ya around.......

I don't think you could get a tent on a lot here in PHX for $64,000.00.

No, I don't look down on them see the post above.  I was in a bad mood this morning.  Once again I apologize.

Quoted: I wouldn't hire one for the last two houses that I built and it saved me at least 20%. YMMV

That's what you think.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: $120,000.000?  Thats a starter house, and you are acting like it is a $1,000,000.00 plus house.   Well if you look down on a $120,000 house, then you will think I am impovershed. You see, I had my place built for a total cost of, including land, $53,000. I bought the land out right to start. When it was finished the banks appraiser appraised the house at $64,000. That was 6 years ago. Not bad for a Okie, thankfully houseing is fairly reasonable here, BUT we do have a few $500,000 houses here, and higher. I have a nice 2 bdr, 2 bath, home in the country, and I like it just fine Thank you....... and yes I was "picky" about a few things, BUT it was MY MONEY, and it is MY HOUSE, and I wanted it done right, no matter if it is only a $53,000, not as good as a $120,000 starter house.....  See ya around....... I don't think you could get a tent on a lot here in PHX for $64,000.00. No, I don't look down on them see the post above.  I was in a bad mood this morning.  Once again I apologize.

No problem, I just had to slam ya a little.........

Quoted: Quoted: Another crew pored the driveway, and sidewalk...instead of making me a nice curved, or even octagonal curved walk...they made a big assed right angle, that sticks all the way out into the middle of the front yard. (and its not even level). The workmanship is usually better by a sub than if done by the General (cost cutting). Curves cost money. A lot more form time and manpower to setup. L shaped front walks are the norm everywhere.

Exactamundo. You want curves? Sure...but it'll cost ya.

I do concrete, BTW.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Im not hassling the construction super, he is actually very nice. You should be.  They rely on the fact that you won't, and once the house is done they'll rely on you to get tired of fighting and just go away.  They're doing the exact thing to my mother right now. Norman...my builder is Renar, anything I should know about them?

I don't know anything particularly better or worse about them than any of the others.

Today i took my camera with me to take some pics. these hoses start at about $350,000.00

This first one is the way the stucco meets up to the door jamb(NoVaGator):




This one showes the caseing on top of the stucco:





Here is a sidewalk for you:

I always demand a completion bond to protect me from lousy as contractors.

Hehehe. My mom ended up buying a place in one of those 'retirement communities'. She got in when they were selling the lots, so she got to specify all the setup/options she wanted. Well, one of the things she asked for was hardwood floors, with a very light coloring. Well, on one of the weekly trips out just to see how the place is coming along, she sees that they've got the hardwood floors in. Problem is the floor they installed was something like a DEEP mahogany. Absolutely the wrong color....so she goes to the office and explains this to them. They assure her that everything will be takes care of promptly. Well, the visit next week found them taking care of the problem. Two guys were running sanders through the different rooms, sanding off the finish of the installed floors, and another two guys were on their hands and knees applying a finisher to the sanded wood (and doing a pisspoor job of it). At that point my mom got a tad upset, and walked into the house and demanded that they stop. Well, it would have worked, but not a single one of them could understand a lick of english...much less speak it. Eventually it was sorted out, and a new floor of the proper coloring was installed. Problem being that about a short time before everything was finished with the house, three areas in the master bedroom began to bulge upward...so much so you could see them from across the house.

I learned one thing from that whole sordid mess. Not to touch any home that ain't at least 15-20 years old, and pay as much as it takes to get a GOOD inspector for it.

One of my neighbors/hunting buddies works for a large drywall company here and his recommendation for the ENTIRE Phoenix metro area is:

DO NOT TRUST ANY  OF THE HOMEBUILDERS HERE.

He says they're all crooks, use too many illegal aliens to do the work and they cannot properly read plans and blueprints.

He says the things he's had to cover up-"fixes" from problems the inspectors caught-would make you give up your down payment and walk away if you knew about them.

He even specifically mentioned some of the builders doing the high profile "Planned Master Communities".

He started in the business about 30 years ago and he said THEN people had integrity and CARED about what they built.

Not anymore, Monty.

I formerly worked for a home inspection company and they inspected new homes also. The things they'd find-and the contractor would argue about with them-were ridiculous. Improper headlap on the roof. Tile with bulges in it. Windows installed so cockeyed that they would not open. GFCIs improperly wired. Plumbing under sinks leaking severely.

If you buy a new home, go over it with a fine-toothed comb. Be an ass. YOU'RE the one spending a couple hundred thousand on it. MAKE it come out like YOU wanted it to.

I feel your pain. I just spent the last three years building a home and dancing with RYLAND homes
They suck ass bad-just like the other builders i'm told

Quoted: Today i took my camera with me to take some pics. these hoses start at about $350,000.00 This first one is the way the stucco meets up to the door jamb(NoVaGator): members.cox.net/mjrowley1/construction/stuco.jpg This one showes the caseing on top of the stucco: members.cox.net/mjrowley1/construction/finished%20door.jpg

That is an ENTIRELY different design than what I have...My trim is "set in" to the stucco (for lack of a better word)...On the sides that were done correctly, the stucco meets up to the trim nicely.
On the OTHER side, the piece of trim is just nailed right on top of the (textured) stucco.

Here is a sidewalk for you: members.cox.net/mjrowley1/construction/sidewalk.jpg

Make that walk extend 15 feet further from the front door...and 20 feet to the left, so the point of the angle is right in the middle of the front yard...and then make it visibly lean toward the point....and you will have a walk like mine.