Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 9/6/2004 7:40:20 PM EST
Matthew 18
8If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell. [Jesus' words]
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:42:24 PM EST

How do you sin with your foot?
Big Toe Tickle?
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:45:37 PM EST
You KNOW what's right and what's wrong...so do the right thing!

Something like that.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:46:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By BusMaster007:
You KNOW what's right and what's wrong...so do the right thing!

Something like that.




How did you get that from the verse?
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:48:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/6/2004 7:48:54 PM EST by Crock]
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.

Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:50:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.





or...AR15?
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:54:00 PM EST

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.



+1 for the (as I believe it) correct answer.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:56:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By parshooter:

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.



+1 for the (as I believe it) correct answer.




Yep, don't let temptation rule you.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:58:09 PM EST
Your brain can lead you to sin...
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 7:59:18 PM EST
Whatever distracts you from god and his will is expendable ?

Body parts just illustrate that point effectively.


GM
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:07:53 PM EST
so i should cut offf my penis then?

damn it
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:08:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By clean_cut:
Matthew 18
8If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell. [Jesus' words]



Ok lets set the context... The speaker her is Jesus. In Verse 3 he tells us that we must be like children... and for those of us who wonder how we can be like children he answers that in vs 4:"Therefore whoever humbles himself like this child is the greates in the kingdom of heaven"

So first of all lets establish that Jesus talks in metaphores at times. Obviously we can't be children, but we should aspire to believe with the same faith a child has.

Second, Jesus never contridicts scripture. It would be contrary to scripture to emiaciate yourself. It will not atone for sins. Nothing we can do can atone for our sin.

Proceeding on, to your scripture above. Does our thumb make us sin? Our hand? Our eyes? No... its our hearts... its our hearts that desire those things that are hollow and sinful.

So why refer to these body parts? Because once we realize they don't cause us to sin, its our heart. Then those desires of a sinful heart are what we must constantly try to cut out. This is the circumcision of the heart you will read latter on in the New Testiment.

If this doesn't help, just let me know.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:08:45 PM EST
Jesus doesn't play around. If you can't stop sinning by looking at other women instead of your wife (for example), and it comes to the point of either being blind and going to heaven or going to hell with your sight, He will not hold it against you after you die. Heaven is THAT important.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:09:19 PM EST
Metaphor

Whatever actions lead you to sin, get rid of them, they will eventually destroy you. Is your foot gonna leave your body to go and sin? No, the whole body suffers from where the foot/hand or eye lead you. I believe Jesus is emphasizing the courseness of sin and the importance of staying from it. Of course you don't cut off your hand for it doing something sinful..for it was the mind that lead the body to it.

Do you ban guns for killing people or prosecute the person for comitting the crime? No.

Again, I believe Jesus was emphasizing the separation from sin in the story he was relating.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:10:14 PM EST
Context is everything. The verse explains itself, but since you asked...

Life as you know it now including your body is temporary.

What you do now has permanent effects on your future in eternity.

Chapter 18 starts off with the disciples asking who gets to be big shots in heaven.

Jesus puts a kid in his lap and tells them, if you have ambitions, follows this little guys example.


-and, being nice to him is being nice to me.

-and, messing with or hurting one of these kids is bad; so bad that you'd be better off sleeping with the fishes.

Now, bad things are going to happen in this world but if you are the one who makes them happen, especially to a kid like this, then you are in for it. That means I'm gonna brimstone your sorry backside when it comes time to settle accounts. So if you are in the habit of beating on kids, or kicking them around, you're better off losing the tool. Capische?

Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:11:15 PM EST

Originally Posted By Arlis:
Context is everything. The verse explains itself, but since you asked...

Life as you know it now including your body is temporary.

What you do now has permanent effects on your future in eternity.

Chapter 18 starts off with the disciples asking who gets to be big shots in heaven.

Jesus puts a kid in his lap and tells them, if you have ambitions, follows this little guys example.


-and, being nice to him is being nice to me.

-and, messing with or hurting one of these kids is bad; so bad that you'd be better off sleeping with the fishes.

Now, bad things are going to happen in this world but if you are the one who makes them happen, especially to a kid like this, then you are in for it. That means I'm gonna brimstone your sorry backside when it comes time to settle accounts. So if you are in the habit of beating on kids, or kicking them around, you're better off losing the tool. Capische?





The Bible according to a capo?
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:13:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By Arlis:
Context is everything. The verse explains itself, but since you asked...

Life as you know it now including your body is temporary.

What you do now has permanent effects on your future in eternity.

Chapter 18 starts off with the disciples asking who gets to be big shots in heaven.

Jesus puts a kid in his lap and tells them, if you have ambitions, follows this little guys example.


-and, being nice to him is being nice to me.

-and, messing with or hurting one of these kids is bad; so bad that you'd be better off sleeping with the fishes.

Now, bad things are going to happen in this world but if you are the one who makes them happen, especially to a kid like this, then you are in for it. That means I'm gonna brimstone your sorry backside when it comes time to settle accounts. So if you are in the habit of beating on kids, or kicking them around, you're better off losing the tool. Capische?




Oh my... that is spot on, but hillarious!
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:17:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By clean_cut:

Originally Posted By BusMaster007:
You KNOW what's right and what's wrong...so do the right thing!
Something like that.


How did you get that from the verse?



I'm not sure. The verse is made up of metaphores, so I metamorphasized!
It sounds like Jesus is saying we are better off giving up a part of ourselves to avoid going to Hell ( the place of no hope of being in God's presence ) than to indulge all parts of ourselves in this world.
Knowing, as we do, what is right and wrong, and making the right choice, will keep us from the 'wages of sin'.
It's late and I'm not doing very well with this. But, I gave it a try. Good night!
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:17:49 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:19:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.





+1, anything that you have, use or do that leads you into a sinful practice, do away with.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:24:06 PM EST
I didn't want to get carried away but I think the meaning fits. And if you look at how jesus uses the example of a lazy or corrupt judge who can be pestered into doing the right thing, then contrasts himself with that judge, I don't think its wholly innapropriate to make the comparison. Obviously here jesus is speaking plainly but if you make the comparison yourself, would you mess with a Capo's kid?
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:30:12 PM EST
I think the metaphorical sense of it is made much more clear in Mark's account (Mark 9, vs. 42-48) - since he follows it immediately with the metaphor about salt - and it is quite clear nobody is supposed to literally keep salt in themselves! In the Matthew account, he speaks immediatley afterward about handling a brother who is a sinner - it is clear from this that his apostles understood the body part thing as a metaphor for things outside of one's body but in their life - and either someone asked, or it was clear that the question was, "what if that thing leading me to sin is another person?"

In summary - It is definitely not a literal statement (i'm not sure if that is what you were getting at or not, you tend to have pretty off the wall things to ask), but a metaphor for things in your life. Notice that he doesn't condemn things - body parts - that don't glorify God - just those things that drive one from Him. (Kinda reminds me of the Mason arguments here).

Interestingly, if you read the account in Mark, Jesus has one of his classic quotes talking about other people, but before the line in question. Mark 9, vs. 39-41 is similar to Pres. Bush's favorite line, and is one that the divisive, anti-ecumenical Christians on this board and elsewhere tend to have a hard time reconciling.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:34:24 PM EST

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.


Amen!

Eric The(Agreeable)Hun



Wow - I spend a few minutes looking up the right verses and everyone beats me to it - oh well, at least my extra detail might be helpful.

Now if I could only get Eric to agree that much of the Old Testament is also metaphor, I just might have a breakthrough!
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:35:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By Adam_White:

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.


Amen!

Eric The(Agreeable)Hun



Wow - I spend a few minutes looking up the right verses and everyone beats me to it - oh well, at least my extra detail might be helpful.

Now if I could only get Eric to agree that much of the Old Testament is also metaphor, I just might have a breakthrough!




I take it you're not a fundamentalist.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 8:38:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By clean_cut:

Originally Posted By Arlis:
Context is everything. The verse explains itself, but since you asked...

Life as you know it now including your body is temporary.

What you do now has permanent effects on your future in eternity.

Chapter 18 starts off with the disciples asking who gets to be big shots in heaven.

Jesus puts a kid in his lap and tells them, if you have ambitions, follows this little guys example.


-and, being nice to him is being nice to me.

-and, messing with or hurting one of these kids is bad; so bad that you'd be better off sleeping with the fishes.

Now, bad things are going to happen in this world but if you are the one who makes them happen, especially to a kid like this, then you are in for it. That means I'm gonna brimstone your sorry backside when it comes time to settle accounts. So if you are in the habit of beating on kids, or kicking them around, you're better off losing the tool. Capische?





The Bible according to a capo?



Since some don't have bibles and I don't want them to think I'm pulling this out of my hat I will post the text from the New King James translation pulled from bible.gospelcom.net/cgi-bin/bible?language=english&passage=matthew+18%3A+1-9&version=NKJV



1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, "Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"
2Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them, 3and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. 4Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me.


Jesus Warns of Offenses
6 "Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea. 7Woe to the world because of offenses! For offenses must come, but woe to that man by whom the offense comes!
8"If your hand or foot causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life lame or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the everlasting fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.


Link Posted: 9/6/2004 9:14:55 PM EST

Originally Posted By clean_cut:

Originally Posted By Adam_White:

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.


Amen!

Eric The(Agreeable)Hun



Wow - I spend a few minutes looking up the right verses and everyone beats me to it - oh well, at least my extra detail might be helpful.

Now if I could only get Eric to agree that much of the Old Testament is also metaphor, I just might have a breakthrough!




I take it you're not a fundamentalist.



I don't want to hijack your thread, like I am afraid I will if I go into detail.

Short answer, no.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 9:20:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By Adam_White:

Originally Posted By clean_cut:

Originally Posted By Adam_White:

Originally Posted By EricTheHun:

Originally Posted By Crock:
If a thing you hold dear causes or leads you to sin, do away with it. Nothing of this world is more important than the eternal.

That "thing" could be your job, the TV, your PC, video games, this forum, alcohol, drugs, money, your hobby, etc.


Amen!

Eric The(Agreeable)Hun



Wow - I spend a few minutes looking up the right verses and everyone beats me to it - oh well, at least my extra detail might be helpful.

Now if I could only get Eric to agree that much of the Old Testament is also metaphor, I just might have a breakthrough!




I take it you're not a fundamentalist.



I don't want to hijack your thread, like I am afraid I will if I go into detail.

Short answer, no.




What the heck, go ahead and hijack.
Link Posted: 9/6/2004 9:39:14 PM EST
Your hands and feet represent parts of your life. For example a friend that you let talk you into doing stupid stuff (cut ties with them). Places you shouldn't be (stop going to them). The verse is basically telling you to take some responsibility for your actions. IMHO.
Top Top