Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Posted: 10/6/2014 5:41:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 5:42:21 PM EST by itstock]
Before I find a real life person to ask , I had a question of how much work it would take...

I have a rancher where half the house is full basement, and the other half slab on grade. I want to tunnel under the slab and connect it to the full basement which has cinder block. I would like to do a roughly 6' wide by 30' tunnel to possibly use but not really use for things like suppressed shooting. Or perhaps a bowling alley would be nice. Or an archery range. The use is not relevant.

The slab is 10" thick with rebar. I have drilled down and cut in to multiple spots for plumbing issues. The slab is on grade, but it is also resting on top of the cinder wall towards the basement side. A plumbing issue from the previous owner essentially left a 2' gap under the slab closest to the concrete wall (the main drain runs along the cinder wall, UNDER the slab and the pipe broke at some point). Something needs to be done eventually anyway to fill that void (probably just pump the mud in there at some point), thus my brilliant idea of an archery range/something like that.

Feasible? Not feasible do to cost restrictions? Not feasible at all?
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 5:45:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By itstock:
Before I find a real life person to ask , I had a question of how much work it would take...

I have a rancher where half the house is full basement, and the other half slab on grade. I want to tunnel under the slab and connect it to the full basement which has cinder block. I would like to do a roughly 6' wide by 30' tunnel to possibly use but not really use for things like suppressed shooting. Or perhaps a bowling alley would be nice. Or an archery range. The use is not relevant.

The slab is 10" thick with rebar. I have drilled down and cut in to multiple spots for plumbing issues. The slab is on grade, but it is also resting on top of the cinder wall towards the basement side. A plumbing issue from the previous owner essentially left a 2' gap under the slab closest to the concrete wall (the main drain runs along the cinder wall, UNDER the slab and the pipe broke at some point). Something needs to be done eventually anyway to fill that void (probably just pump the mud in there at some point), thus my brilliant idea of an archery range/something like that.

Feasible? Not feasible do to cost restrictions? Not feasible at all?
View Quote

Digging under the house, eh?

Link Posted: 10/6/2014 5:54:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 5:59:05 PM EST by mattellis2]
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 5:56:51 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.
View Quote



Think he'll get a building permit?
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 6:01:27 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:



Think he'll get a building permit?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.



Think he'll get a building permit?


Nah, you don't need that. Or soils information. Or calculations. Or a working knowledge of structural mechanics. Just get a shovel and git 'er done.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 6:05:39 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:


Nah, you don't need that. Or soils information. Or calculations. Or a working knowledge of structural mechanics. Just get a shovel and git 'er done.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.



Think he'll get a building permit?


Nah, you don't need that. Or soils information. Or calculations. Or a working knowledge of structural mechanics. Just get a shovel and git 'er done.



I wonder whether he has a PTSOG.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 6:09:00 PM EST
That would be even more rare than a 2 way slab/grade beam scenario, especially in a residence.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 6:12:18 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 6:18:22 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?
View Quote


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 6:53:23 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.
View Quote



I'll let you Jr. engineers handle it for a while and if there is no progress, I'll give it a shot.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:02:10 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:06:01 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By itstock:


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.


Go hire an engineer.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:09:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 7:18:40 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:


Go hire an engineer.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.


Go hire an engineer.



Hmm
I think you missed my first post, or maybe someone pissed in your Cheerios.

This was meant to be is it possible. Is it possible without major expenses incurred. Is it not possible.

I figured if it were option c, it would be pointless to hire a structural engineer and I would strike it as just another dumb idea. If you don't want to help, just say so or don't reply? Heck, I'm not even asking for details on how to do it, just thinking that it would be possible and not that expensive. If it is not easily doable or not doable at all, I'd like to not think about it.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:21:18 PM EST
Got any "Basement's and Crawlspaces 'R Us" type business in your area? I've seen some that advertise being able to turn a crawlspace into basement and I assume that they have an engineer of staff to handle such issues before they take a job and start digging.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:24:50 PM EST
I would be surprised if there is really rebar in the slab...
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:25:40 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By itstock:



Hmm
I think you missed my first post.

This was meant to be is it possible. Is it possible without major expensives incurred. Is it not possible.

I figured if it were option c, it would be pointless to hire a structural engineer and I would strike it as just another dumb idea. If you don't want to help, just say so or don't reply?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.


Go hire an engineer.



Hmm
I think you missed my first post.

This was meant to be is it possible. Is it possible without major expensives incurred. Is it not possible.

I figured if it were option c, it would be pointless to hire a structural engineer and I would strike it as just another dumb idea. If you don't want to help, just say so or don't reply?

What do you consider a major expense?
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:27:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 7:32:11 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By replicators:

What do you consider a major expense?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By replicators:
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By itstock:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
You should ask VBC. He's a pro at such matters.

I'd be REALLY shocked if your slab is actually uniformly 10" thick and doubly reinforced. I've designed industrial one way slabs for very high floor live loads that were not that thick.

Eta: after thinking about it for a minute, I wonder if you have really crappy/unstable soils, and your slab is actually a waffle slab on grade beam system?


It is definitely 10" thick in multiple spots far away from other spots. It could be less in certain spots though. There are no beams. I thought it was odd when I did the plumbing stuff. I was pretty pissed off when I was expecting 4-8".

And yes, honestly this would be with a building permit. I got a permit for cutting down two trees for crying out loud.

I was thinking 1 or 2 30' beams with cross sections on lollys/posts every 6' with concrete on the ground tied to the existing basement floor would make it plausible and not all that expensive. Dang, that's a run on.


Go hire an engineer.



Hmm
I think you missed my first post.

This was meant to be is it possible. Is it possible without major expensives incurred. Is it not possible.

I figured if it were option c, it would be pointless to hire a structural engineer and I would strike it as just another dumb idea. If you don't want to help, just say so or don't reply?

What do you consider a major expense?


Over $20k I wouldn't even consider it. I think $10k would probably be the realistic line drawn.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:27:56 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 7:31:24 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Orion_Shall_Rise:
I would be surprised if there is really rebar in the slab...
View Quote


Just in the spots the plumber moved the fixtures in both bathrooms

Then again, I guess it's possible the bath area was reinforced do to the giant holes they used originally for drains?

Can I assume that may be true? And if so, does that make the idea way less likely of even being possible?
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 7:30:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 7:35:17 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyingGorilla:
Got any "Basement's and Crawlspaces 'R Us" type business in your area? I've seen some that advertise being able to turn a crawlspace into basement and I assume that they have an engineer of staff to handle such issues before they take a job and start digging.
View Quote


Yes, I'm an electrician and have done electric for projects like that. They basically dig around the existing supports for the beams then just relocate, so it's really not the same thing. I wish I just had a full basement.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:04:23 PM EST
I think it is possible, and if your slab is as described, you're better off. That said, $10k won't touch that project.

I'd charge you between $1500 and $2000 just to evaluate it, and give you a design.

Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:07:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/6/2014 8:19:46 PM EST by itstock]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
I think it is possible, and if your slab is as described, you're better off. That said, $10k won't touch that project.

I'd charge you between $1500 and $2000 just to evaluate it, and give you a design.

View Quote




See, that is all I needed to know. Just good old bringing me back to reality. Thank you!

It would be cool to have, but I think anyhing over $10k, I'm better off just going to the indoor shooting/archery range 5 minutes away and continuing to pay the $200/year membership.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:17:57 PM EST
Originally Posted By itstock:
Before I find a real life person to ask , I had a question of how much work it would take...

I have a rancher where half the house is full basement, and the other half slab on grade. I want to tunnel under the slab and connect it to the full basement which has cinder block. I would like to do a roughly 6' wide by 30' tunnel to possibly use but not really use for things like suppressed shooting. Or perhaps a bowling alley would be nice. Or an archery range. The use is not relevant.
View Quote


If you have a budget, it is. An indoor shooting range is more than just a concrete box with targets at one end. If you're going to be shooting down there, you need to keep in mind there will be significant costs for proper air handling and filtration. Lead poisoning isn't something you want to subject yourself or your family to (especially if you have kids).
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:21:56 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shaggy:


If you have a budget, it is. An indoor shooting range is more than just a concrete box with targets at one end. If you're going to be shooting down there, you need to keep in mind there will be significant costs for proper air handling and filtration. Lead poisoning isn't something you want to subject yourself or your family to (especially if you have kids).
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shaggy:
Originally Posted By itstock:
Before I find a real life person to ask , I had a question of how much work it would take...

I have a rancher where half the house is full basement, and the other half slab on grade. I want to tunnel under the slab and connect it to the full basement which has cinder block. I would like to do a roughly 6' wide by 30' tunnel to possibly use but not really use for things like suppressed shooting. Or perhaps a bowling alley would be nice. Or an archery range. The use is not relevant.


If you have a budget, it is. An indoor shooting range is more than just a concrete box with targets at one end. If you're going to be shooting down there, you need to keep in mind there will be significant costs for proper air handling and filtration. Lead poisoning isn't something you want to subject yourself or your family to (especially if you have kids).


I was thinking more so archery, and maybe a round or two to sight in 22's, certainly not heavy or even medium use. I know if a lot of shooting were tj be done, serious expenses would happen with ventilation. Thst was never an intention though.

The thought has been washed away anyway and I'm back on earth,
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:24:50 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
I think it is possible, and if your slab is as described, you're better off. That said, $10k won't touch that project.

I'd charge you between $1500 and $2000 just to evaluate it, and give you a design.

View Quote



With the liability, I'd charge at least 8k for plans and specs. And then even more for observation.
Link Posted: 10/6/2014 8:26:53 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:



With the liability, I'd charge at least 8k for plans and specs. And then even more for observation.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tcrpe:
Originally Posted By mattellis2:
I think it is possible, and if your slab is as described, you're better off. That said, $10k won't touch that project.

I'd charge you between $1500 and $2000 just to evaluate it, and give you a design.




With the liability, I'd charge at least 8k for plans and specs. And then even more for observation.


CA, where even the janitors make bank!
Top Top