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Posted: 8/13/2001 11:26:04 AM EDT
What type of accuracy can I expect from an out-of-the-box varmint AR-15 rifle with 24" free floating barrel? Are they sub-moa? Are the rifles from RRA or Bushmaster or Armilite pretty similiar in terms of accuracy? What's the dealer costs for these comparable rifles? TIA,
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 11:53:00 AM EDT
Not to say the V-match Bushmasters are inaccurate but their barrels are chrome lined just like the Hbars and the accuracy does pay a bit of a price because of it, unless ofcourse you were to get the newest Bushmaster which has the chrome-moly non-chrome lined barrel where that is probably a pretty accurate little gun and likely the most capable of the Bushmater V-match lineup. That said, the Armalite and the Rockriver Arms rifles with freefloated stainless or chrome lined barrels are probably the more accurate rifles of the 3 you listed. The stainless barreled Armalite M15s have done pretty well for a lot of people, Rockriver Arms is pretty decent as well. Just go with the non-chrome lined barrels so that the lining won't be holding you back. Yes, these things can CERTAINLY go sub-MOA, even the Bushmaster V-match rifles with the chrome lined barrels only the chrome lined V-match rifles are sometimes hard to find a sub-MOA load. My custom AR15 that I've got currently is a solid sub-MOA performer, one of my loads is averaging around 3/4 inch for 10 shots at 100 yards. It will do subMOA with a LOT of handloads as well as factory loads. Can't really comment too much on price anymore as I've been out of the loop ever since buying my last AR15 back in 1998, livin in Ca. Armalite will likely be the most expensive but they do have very high quality not to mention a lifetime warranty with fairly decent customer service.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 12:21:30 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 12:42:57 PM EDT
My armalite standard rifle (m15a2) is the most accurate rifle I`ve ever shot, out of the box.....for some reason though, it has a barrel stamped "nm"....anyway, it will stay with any of the bolt guns...scoped of course....perfect for varmints just the way it is!!!!....[:)]
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 2:04:14 PM EDT
How about those DPMS Bull Barrel rifles. THey look really good - but do they shoot well?
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 2:32:34 PM EDT
The Les Baer AR-15 varminter shoots 1/4 MOA straight out of the box.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 7:56:48 PM EDT
I had a Colt HBAR Comp that I bought new for $685 back before the President got scared of bayonett lugs. It would shoot most any well prepared handload under an inch at 100 yards, liking the 69 grain Sierra bullet and 55 grain Noslet balistic tip best. (Scoped of course) it wasa nice varmint rifle. Like a dummy I sold it. It shot everything well and a few loads just superbly, day in, day out. After I sold that Colt I bought a bolt-action Savage Tactical in 223, big mistake as this one would not shoot worth beans. We all make mistakes in life, just try not to sell an accurate rifle, that are rare unless you spend lots of money. BillSP1 out BillSP1
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 8:12:20 PM EDT
Errrrr, LesBaer, sorry, so sick of hearing about that thing as if it's the end all be all of AR15s like he'd have you think it is. Am I the only one who thinks that Les Baer's pistol smithing skills don't neccesarily translate directly to AR15s? Does the term "johnny come lately" come to mind? Does anyone even know what brand barrel or how Les chambers his barrels so as to make your job as a handloader easier? Or is that considered "proprietary" information that he isn't willing to release because of fear of being copied? In a sense I've already been down this road with my JP Enterprises upper assembly, sure it shoots good and I'm only using basic handloads, maybe one of these days I'll get a handload that will hold under 1/2 inch for 5 shots but that's it for now. I still don't have the information I desire though as to what make of barrel JP uses for blanks or how they ream their chambers. And looking at the JP Enterprises line and the LesBaer line there's a lot of similarities between the two. It's for those reasons as well as a few others that my next upper assemblies will be totally custom jobbers built by smiths who are willing to cater to you in terms of barrel and reamer selection. For production based rifles though I'm gonna save my money from now on. But bmwguy, as ARChoo stated the things can go WAY sub-MOA if you're willing to pay the price and if you consider the LesBaer a box stock rifle in the same category price range as the others listed. Guess I'm a bit sensitive after seeing how much a person can dump into one rifle. That's it, personal gripe is over now.
Link Posted: 8/14/2001 3:16:17 AM EDT
I can not speak for other brands, but I have a Colt CR 6724, 24" Elite free-floated, aluminum hand-guard, 1/9" twist, w/ 2-stage Jewell trigger, stock Colt one-piece scope mount which came w/ gun and topped w/ Leupold 4.5x14x40mm AO Scope (Mil-Dots & Turrets, shimmed 40 thousandths in rear to get elev. travel). Dad, Uncle own same and w/ once fired Rem. cases, Rem. 7.5 BR primers, 24.0 grains of Accurate 2460 (red-line DO NOT PUSH) and 77 SMK Molys loaded to mag length this gun in good air w/ shoot sub-0.5 moa out to 800 yards. On good air day we can keep 10 rounds in 10" at 1000 yds. Every one of the guns are set-up the same except for scope powers and will all shoot this consistently.
Link Posted: 8/14/2001 5:04:28 PM EDT
mr_wilson, WOW! That's awesome, especially with a 1:9 twist barrel. It's fun developing a load and watching to see what it does and does not like. My own 1:9 twist barrel really likes light weight balistic tip style bullets while it doesn't so much like the heavier bullets up around 68-70 grains. But I haven't played around with the heavys too much, I have just been slappin together my ammo(mixed cases and not so painstakingly calculated seat depth) and I still manage to get some incredible accuracy. One of these days I've got to actually start sorting and processing my brass while actually taking care to create some first rate ammo with careful seat length and powder charges.
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