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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:29:50 PM EDT
If you haven't seen the first video check out this http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1703245_If_You_Own_or_Want_Body_Armor_You_Might_Want_To_Watch_This_Video.html&page=1
Since so many people asked me to repeat the test with a Level IIIA panel behind the plate, and since http://www.ar500armor.com/ was so generous as to send me a IIIA panel, I made it out to the range today and took another shot at it.  I will let you guys check out the video and comment before I really say anything else. Enjoy!! Phone linky http://youtu.be/vsZ53ber3YE
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:36:49 PM EDT
[#1]
that's scary
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:40:22 PM EDT
[#2]
Cool. Thanks for the video.
Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:44:50 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:45:50 PM EDT
[#4]
Cool. Thanks for posting.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:47:35 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
that's scary LOL not this again |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:50:05 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep same everything as last time. I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Wow, that's more surprising. It sounded like the general consensus was that a 16'' barrel wouldn't have made it through? ETA: I understand it's still beyond the armor's capabilities and ratings, but I had high hopes. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:50:36 PM EDT
[#7]
Fine work and a good post.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:51:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep same everything as last time. I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Interesting. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:52:03 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
that's scary And yet not really surprising. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:52:13 PM EDT
[#10]
Iirc, most people did NOT believe the soft armor would make a big difference. Cool stuff.
Since you already wrecked the plate, the soft, and the gel, howbout a magdump next? 
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:55:22 PM EDT
[#11]
Lessons learned class......
Smoke the motherfucker getting ready to shoot at you, first. Don't count on a damn body army panel to protect you. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:56:28 PM EDT
[#12]
You should really do some curls.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 9:58:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wow, that's more surprising. It sounded like the general consensus was that a 16'' barrel wouldn't have made it through? ETA: I understand it's still beyond the armor's capabilities and ratings, but I had high hopes. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Wow, that's more surprising. It sounded like the general consensus was that a 16'' barrel wouldn't have made it through? ETA: I understand it's still beyond the armor's capabilities and ratings, but I had high hopes. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:00:16 PM EDT
[#14]
And this is why I use a 20" with 1-12" twist and light bullets. It gets shit done. I wish someone would make a FMJ 40 or 45 grain version of the M193 projectile. Velocity is king.
I know what was going to happen, and results are even better with a slower twist. a 77grain OTM or amax type projectile would probably be defeated most likely. I would be interested to see the results using a heavy copper projectile like the TSX or protected hollow point from a fast twist 16" barrel against that armor. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:01:06 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Iirc, most people did NOT believe the soft armor would make a big difference. Cool stuff. Since you already wrecked the plate, the soft, and the gel, howbout a magdump next? I actually made 2 more videos with the plate today lol. I would have made 3 but I think I fucked the cheap front sight on my m&p 10 up. I think you guys will like the other videos too. That IIIA panel is almost brand new! I can do a lot more with it lol
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:01:21 PM EDT
[#16]
Well, I was wondering, and a lot of people have wondered, if a soft backer would stop them.
I had no idea. Thank you. I always figured a soft backer would exacerbate one of the major problems with steel plates anyway, weight. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:02:49 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And this is why I use a 20" with 1-12" twist and light bullets. It gets shit done. I wish someone would make a FMJ 40 or 45 grain version of the M193 projectile. Velocity is king. I know what was going to happen, and results are even better with a slower twist. a 77grain OTM or amax type projectile would probably be defeated most likely. I would be interested to see the results using a heavy copper projectile like the TSX or protected hollow point from a 16" barrel against that armor. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:05:15 PM EDT
[#18]
WOW!!! M193 is totally awesome!
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:06:27 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, I was wondering, and a lot of people have wondered, if a soft backer would stop them. I had no idea. Thank you. I always figured a soft backer would exacerbate one of the major problems with steel plates anyway, weight. If you saw it in person it looked even more eye opening. It was clean the way it went through.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:14:52 PM EDT
[#20]
Your vids are very interesting , thanks  Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep same everything as last time. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. GAWDANG!!  |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:16:23 PM EDT
[#21]
Thanks for the video.
Would like to see an M193 round fired at 10 yards using a 16" carbine. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:16:32 PM EDT
[#22]
Even a 16" barrel is spitting M193 out at over 3000fps. An M4 will spit M193 over 3000fps most of the time. M855 averages around 2920fps from 14.5", so 5.56 does as it was originally intended: penetrate armor.
The whole reason we have 5.56x45 and not .222 Remington in the AR15 is because Army Ordnance kept moving the goal posts, thinking the AR15/SCHV would not perform well when it was just .222 Remington. The .30 cal nazis were trying to kill the idea of the SCHV, so when it perforated a steel helmet at 200,300, and 400yds, they moved the criteria to 500yds, at which point it "only" penetrated, but didn't perforate. Stoner was fed up with the whole mess, and asked Remington to blow the shoulder forward, see if they could use a boat tail bullet instead of a flat base, ramp up the charge weight, and perforate the stupid helmet so Army Ordnance Board could move the goals posts again or just say "no more, this isn't going anywhere anyway." Even with Stoner being a proponent of the 7.62 NATO, and not fond of the SCHV, it did go somewhere. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:17:17 PM EDT
[#23]
Do we know the distance at which the plate would stop the M193? Out of a 20'', or a 16''?
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:23:13 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lucky me I was just sent a box of 70 gr TSX for testing. If a green tip wouldnt go through I doubt those will but I'm not sure how hot SSA loads them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
And this is why I use a 20" with 1-12" twist and light bullets. It gets shit done. I wish someone would make a FMJ 40 or 45 grain version of the M193 projectile. Velocity is king. I know what was going to happen, and results are even better with a slower twist. a 77grain OTM or amax type projectile would probably be defeated most likely. I would be interested to see the results using a heavy copper projectile like the TSX or protected hollow point from a 16" barrel against that armor. Sweet. Thanks. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:45:54 PM EDT
[#25]
Cool.
Did the soft armor stop any of the fragments? |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 10:56:41 PM EDT
[#26]
Cool videos man, they were an eye opener for me. I also had no idea the ar500 brand armor so affordable and would like to get some in the future so a will for them too. Thanks for sharing.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:03:30 PM EDT
[#27]
Excellent!
What distance? |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:04:39 PM EDT
[#28]
Velocity wins, same reason M193 penetrates steel better than M855 at distances less than 100 yards. When there is not much bullet, make it go faster.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:06:41 PM EDT
[#29]
so what stops m193?
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:08:11 PM EDT
[#30]
whatever
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:13:18 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: so what stops m193? Lvl IV |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:20:40 PM EDT
[#32]
It's hard to stop small and fast. Why lvl iv is worth it.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:29:30 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Chris Christie probably. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
so what stops m193? Chris Christie probably. Lulz Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:36:23 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Your vids are very interesting , thanks I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. Quote HistoryQuoted: Your vids are very interesting , thanks Quoted: Quoted: Cool. Thanks for the video. Edit- Was this with a 22" barrel again? I filmed a new video with the 16" barrel and it went right through too using independence xm193. Still deadly in the gel too. GAWDANG!! |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:36:25 PM EDT
[#35]
Thanks OP. I gotta say the last video put me over the edge, I'm going for level IV.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:37:06 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks for the video. Would like to see an M193 round fired at 10 yards using a 16" carbine. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:38:04 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even a 16" barrel is spitting M193 out at over 3000fps. An M4 will spit M193 over 3000fps most of the time. M855 averages around 2920fps from 14.5", so 5.56 does as it was originally intended: penetrate armor. The whole reason we have 5.56x45 and not .222 Remington in the AR15 is because Army Ordnance kept moving the goal posts, thinking the AR15/SCHV would not perform well when it was just .222 Remington. The .30 cal nazis were trying to kill the idea of the SCHV, so when it perforated a steel helmet at 200,300, and 400yds, they moved the criteria to 500yds, at which point it "only" penetrated, but didn't perforate. Stoner was fed up with the whole mess, and asked Remington to blow the shoulder forward, see if they could use a boat tail bullet instead of a flat base, ramp up the charge weight, and perforate the stupid helmet so Army Ordnance Board could move the goals posts again or just say "no more, this isn't going anywhere anyway." Even with Stoner being a proponent of the 7.62 NATO, and not fond of the SCHV, it did go somewhere. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:39:44 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. Did the soft armor stop any of the fragments? |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:39:53 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lulz Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
so what stops m193? Chris Christie probably. Lulz Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Shit and where off |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:40:35 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool videos man, they were an eye opener for me. I also had no idea the ar500 brand armor so affordable and would like to get some in the future so a will for them too. Thanks for sharing. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:40:37 PM EDT
[#41]
Definitely the best defense is the first offense. There's no second place in gun fighting.
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:41:17 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Excellent! What distance? |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:41:59 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks OP. I gotta say the last video put me over the edge, I'm going for level IV. |
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Posted: 1/10/2015 11:50:18 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It didn't stop shit. Seriously I don't mean to hate on it because I'm sure it's lovely for what it's rated for, but it was NO match for this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Cool. Did the soft armor stop any of the fragments? Neat. I anticipated it catching partial fragments and some spall, but still being defeated. Interesting that it didn't catch any of it. Cool test. |
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Posted: 1/11/2015 12:15:15 AM EDT
[#45]
Nice banana clip shirt
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Posted: 1/11/2015 5:36:02 AM EDT
[#46]
so naturally the question i have is, is this new carbon nanotube armor as good as proven aramid fiber panels for stopping threats such as this?
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Posted: 1/11/2015 8:02:01 AM EDT
[#47]
I was really surprised and disappointed with the failure of the green tip to penetrate in the previous video.
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Posted: 1/11/2015 8:06:15 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Neat. I anticipated it catching partial fragments and some spall, but still being defeated. Interesting that it didn't catch any of it. Cool test. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Cool. Did the soft armor stop any of the fragments? Neat. I anticipated it catching partial fragments and some spall, but still being defeated. Interesting that it didn't catch any of it. Cool test. It looked like there may have been fewer of the smallest fragments (subjective observation, YMMV), but anything big enough to do serious injury didn't seem to be slowed down at all. |
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Posted: 1/11/2015 8:27:01 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lvl IV Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: so what stops m193? Lvl IV Level 3 ceramics or HDPE also stop it. As I posted in the other thread: Steel: Stops M855 does not stop m193 Ceramic: Stops everything, but falls apart doing it. HDPE: Stops m193 does not stop M855 |
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Posted: 1/11/2015 3:01:24 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: so naturally the question i have is, is this new carbon nanotube armor as good as proven aramid fiber panels for stopping threats such as this? |
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