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Obviously not. But if it came from the Spartan Lower production line then it's a Spartan Lower in their eyes and on their books. They sold the guy a ML-15 Blem. Not a Spartan ML-15 Blem. It doesn't get any simpler than that. |
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http://images.memes.com/meme/428882 JBO currently sells THREE different Spike's lower BLEMISHED receivers. All have different markings. If I order the ZOMBIE blem lower and it arrived as a SPIDER blem lower, then I didn't get what the fuck I ordered in spite of the fact they are the exact same lower in every other function/way. |
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Obviously not. But if it came from the Spartan Lower production line then it's a Spartan Lower in their eyes and on their books. **due to a manufacturing slip up, it's really an automatic V6. But since the manufacurer "ran the V8 program" it's still on our books as a 5.0 and you should accept fault and eat our accidental cost. |
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Dumb move on JoeBob if that is legit. Quoted:
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Screenshot of email. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/mfblog/Guns/AR-15/589C1F91-1F2C-44E7-9152-402C91D1656A_zpsi8jl8m0y.jpg |
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Looks to me like this email was part of a larger conversation. Do you have those emails as well? It's hard to condemn someone for "AROCK'ing" without the context behind, what I assume, were multiple back and forth emails. I.E. how did the conversation about "e-stalking" and where the OP's buddy works even get started? Quoted:
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Screenshot of email. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/mfblog/Guns/AR-15/589C1F91-1F2C-44E7-9152-402C91D1656A_zpsi8jl8m0y.jpg I.E. how did the conversation about "e-stalking" and where the OP's buddy works even get started? |
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http://images.memes.com/meme/428882 JBO currently sells THREE different Spike's lower BLEMISHED receivers. All have different markings. If I order the ZOMBIE blem lower and it arrived as a SPIDER blem lower, then I didn't get what the fuck I ordered in spite of the fact they are the exact same lower in every other function/way. |
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Clone car builders everywhere wish all their customers were like you. Quoted:
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Again, if it has the engine, interior, suspension of the Stage 1 Roush, and the badge says "GT", sold. |
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If you send me a F150 that functions exactly the same in every way (design, speed, performance, interior fitout) as a new Lamborghini for the price of a F150, sold. You'd be a fool not to take that. I'll have someone else put the badges on if I'm vain enough to care that everyone knows it's a Lamborghini. Or I'll just stick a fake badge on my keychain like all the other posers. This is a problem with our society. No one cares about function, as long as they can impress the Jones with the rollmark. Quoted:
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Lol at this and the other car examples. It's a roll mark, so it's more like getting a Lamborghini where the badge fell off. I used to debadge my cars anyway because I thought badges looked like shit (and I order range tool lowers with no roll mark), but to each his own. Therefore my Blem Lamborghini that closely resembles a Ford F-150 (and is within spec and functional) is equally acceptable! Pay up. Lemme know where you want it sent. PS. No returns. It's a Blem This is a problem with our society. No one cares about function, as long as they can impress the Jones with the rollmark. 
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Google Cache never forgets.
Here's how the page for the Spartan Blem Lower probably appeared when the OP ordered: 
Full size here: http://imgur.com/a/kz0f4 It says nothing about the logo possibly being missing. It does now, because the website has been changed. It does say, "Logo: "Molon Labe" w/ Spartan Helmet" If I ordered this, then this is what I would expect to get. "Blem", obviously, is short for "blemish", which means "a small mark that spoils the appearance of something". The lack of a logo is the exact OPPOSITE of a mark. It's no mark. That's not a minor point. This isn't a cosmetic defect. This is a glaring omission of a feature that is specifically listed in the original page for the lower. You can't just say "It's a blem...no returns" and then ship whatever you want. Well, I guess technically you CAN, because we all know that it happened, but you get reactions like this. And disappointed customers. And bad PR. And a nasty thread on Arfcom. I don't know if JoeBob's set out to be intentionally deceptive, and I certainly would never accuse them of that, but any reasonable person would believe that he was getting a Spartan lower and would have no idea that the omission of the logo would be the "blem", since a blem, by definition, is a mark, and the lack of a logo is NOT a mark. IMO, JoeBob's needs to eat this one. |
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I don't think that comparison is accurate. If I bought a new Ford F150 Lariat that "may have lot dents and/or scratches," I think I'd be upset if what was delivered was a Ford F150 XL with lot dents and/or scratches. The lowers should have been refused at the FFL, and Joe Bob dun fucked up. Quoted:
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Lol at this and the other car examples. It's a roll mark, so it's more like getting a Lamborghini where the badge fell off. I used to debadge my cars anyway because I thought badges looked like shit (and I order range tool lowers with no roll mark), but to each his own. Therefore my Blem Lamborghini that closely resembles a Ford F-150 (and is within spec and functional) is equally acceptable! Pay up. Lemme know where you want it sent. PS. No returns. It's a Blem This is a problem with our society. No one cares about function, as long as they can impress the Jones with the rollmark. |
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Looks to me like this email was part of a larger conversation. Do you have those emails as well? It's hard to condemn someone for "AROCK'ing" without the context behind, what I assume, were multiple back and forth emails. I.E. how did the conversation about "e-stalking" and where the OP's buddy works even get started? Quoted:
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Screenshot of email. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/mfblog/Guns/AR-15/589C1F91-1F2C-44E7-9152-402C91D1656A_zpsi8jl8m0y.jpg I.E. how did the conversation about "e-stalking" and where the OP's buddy works even get started? 
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WRONG /Trump They sell ML-15's with no roll mark. They added the description about MISSING rollmarks to the Spartan link AFTER the buyer's complaint. If anyone has one, does the SN indicate anything about it being a Spartan lower? Because that's the only way we can end this argument right now
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There is a difference in interior fitout, comfort, function and other real tangible things between a Lariat and XL. We're talking about a badge (i.e. rollmark) here. No difference in what it actually does. If you order an ORANGE Ford XL and they deliver a BLUE Ford XL then they fucked up. |
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You should have no expectations with a blemished product other than the fact that it is 100% functioning. Quoted:
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Regardless of how awful spartan shit is, dude ordered a spartan lower. Fulfill the expectations you establish, that's more of a problem these days. |
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Except for the roll mark (badge) there is no distinction between the two products, based on the seller's own description. Therefore my Blem Lamborghini that closely resembles a Ford F-150 (and is within spec and functional) is equally acceptable! Pay up. Lemme know where you want it sent. PS. No returns. It's a Blem Lambo is Lambo, Ford is Ford. Better analogy. Here's a blem Lambo with no bull or here's a Ford F-150 with no F-150 logo. Same item manufactured in the same place with no logo. Buyer knowingly purchased a blem, the blem appears to be no rollmark. |
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If anyone has one, does the SN indicate anything about it being a Spartan lower? Because that's the only way we can end this argument right now Edit: Photos direct from JBO: 
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I don't care what they added after the fact. I'm stating what I think. If anyone has one, does the SN indicate anything about it being a Spartan lower? Because that's the only way we can end this argument right now 
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would love to see all the emails to see what was said before and after......
cached version of the 2nd link in the first post https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Ab5WhlKjDmQJ:https://texags.com/forums/34/topics/2854588/1+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us |
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I don't think that comparison is accurate. If I bought a new Ford F150 Lariat that "may have lot dents and/or scratches," I think I'd be upset if what was delivered was a Ford F150 XL with lot dents and/or scratches. The lowers should have been refused at the FFL, and Joe Bob dun fucked up. Quoted:
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Lol at this and the other car examples. It's a roll mark, so it's more like getting a Lamborghini where the badge fell off. I used to debadge my cars anyway because I thought badges looked like shit (and I order range tool lowers with no roll mark), but to each his own. Therefore my Blem Lamborghini that closely resembles a Ford F-150 (and is within spec and functional) is equally acceptable! Pay up. Lemme know where you want it sent. PS. No returns. It's a Blem This is a problem with our society. No one cares about function, as long as they can impress the Jones with the rollmark. 
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Neither result justifies a vendor arocking a customer, so I think you could probably just pack it in without resolution and nobody'd much care. And he's wrong anyway, because a ML 15 without the Spartan isn't a blem its just a...ML-15 lower. Car analogy would be better if he ordered a Ford Mustang GT V8 with cosmetic blem issues and they sent him a V6 Ford Mustang and called it a "blem", and then tried to threaten him if he was unhappy about it. |
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Car analogy would be better if he ordered a Ford Mustang GT V8 with cosmetic blem issues and they sent him a V6 Ford Mustang and called it a "blem", and then tried to threaten him if he was unhappy about it. |
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I don't know what to believe anymore. After reading this and the other email it seems like Joe is explaining he only dropped the name of where dude worked because they probably have a similar policy on products and return policy.
As well as explaining how he attained said customers email. Also kind of looks pretty professional and that JoeBob was not trying to pull the wool over said customers eyes. ETA: the looks pretty professional part was meant to only encompass the fact that they weren't trying to fool anyone by selling nonmarked Spartan lowers. As I stated though, still not sure if they tried to arock said customer or not. |
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Seems all of the bad reviews on their facebook page have a poor customer service theme to them.
there isn't any way that I can review them with less than one star so thats why i gave them one
I've been dealing with a company called Joe Bob's Outfitters for a Radical Firearms upper I purchased from them. It arrived three days after I bought it. Unfortunately it had scratches on the picatinny rail, the gas pipe was loose and had moved in shipping and the trunnion had been drilled so far out of spec that i could not insert the pivot pin all the way through the lower I put it on. I tested the upper on all four of my lowers and it would not fit well on any of them so i contacted customer service for Joe Bob Outfitters and was told that that is a problem that i had to take up with Radical Firearms. They do not have a policy in place to accept DOA product return they have shipped to their customers. Wow, really bad customer service on their part so I'm trying to get Radical to replace the upper i bought from Joe Bob's cause they take your money and don't care what happens next. The VP, Tyler i emailed back and forth with at Joe Bob's told me it didn't matter that the gas pipe moved and that just because the Pivot pin wont seat properly, that doesn't mean the upper is in unuseable condition. So, Ive stopped dealing with him and hope that Radical will honor the sale and warranty. as the pin will "walk" and eventually fall away, loosening the upper while it is being fired, dangerous!. Not ever doing business with Joe Bobs Outfitters again. The price was good but there is no customer service after the sale. Got a 9mm bolt for my build. It didn't fit with my receiver. Tries to send it back and they will not accept it because it has been used/installed. How the F are you supposed to make sure a part works with your rifle without "using/installing" it. Never get another dime of my business. |
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Stupid analogy. Lambo is Lambo, Ford is Ford. Better analogy. Here's a blem Lambo with no bull or here's a Ford F-150 with no F-150 logo. Same item manufactured in the same place with no logo. Buyer knowingly purchased a blem, the blem appears to be no rollmark. Quoted:
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Except for the roll mark (badge) there is no distinction between the two products, based on the seller's own description. Therefore my Blem Lamborghini that closely resembles a Ford F-150 (and is within spec and functional) is equally acceptable! Pay up. Lemme know where you want it sent. PS. No returns. It's a Blem Lambo is Lambo, Ford is Ford. Better analogy. Here's a blem Lambo with no bull or here's a Ford F-150 with no F-150 logo. Same item manufactured in the same place with no logo. Buyer knowingly purchased a blem, the blem appears to be no rollmark. While my Ford/Lamborghini analogy is humorous, the product reality here is that the blemished item conforms NOT to the advertised item (Spartan lower, Blem), but to a different product as described by seller as an M15 lower, identical to a Spartan lower minus the rollmark. In other words, they sent an F-150 instead, and then proceeded to look up purchaser's IP information, making statements about his workplace. Think about that for a bit. 
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Seems all of the bad reviews on their facebook page have a poor customer service theme to them. Quoted:
Seems all of the bad reviews on their facebook page have a poor customer service theme to them. Though I'm not sure I'm going to take this guy's evaluation of AR-15 quality very seriously: the gas pipe was loose 
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Looks to me like this email was part of a larger conversation. Do you have those emails as well? It's hard to condemn someone for "AROCK'ing" without the context behind, what I assume, were multiple back and forth emails. I.E. how did the conversation about "e-stalking" and where the OP's buddy works even get started?
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Everybody wants to be known for a Primary Arms level of customer service, until it's time to do Primary Arms level of customer service things |
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Have to say JoeBobs is in the right on this one.. A blem is a blem. People are just used to getting lowers that are indistinguishable from good ones without every really thinking what COULD be wrong with the lower as a blem. The real moral of this story is that if you're going to be a cheap fuck, don't buy a "blem" specifically for a feature that is entirely cosmetic... That's just dumb.
What if he bought it and somehow the spartan helmet was mis engraved and looked like a penis? Would he still bitch then? Probably. |
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Doesn't surprise me. Though I'm not sure I'm going to take this guy's evaluation of AR-15 quality very seriously: Quoted:
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Seems all of the bad reviews on their facebook page have a poor customer service theme to them. Though I'm not sure I'm going to take this guy's evaluation of AR-15 quality very seriously: the gas pipe was loose |
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Have to say JoeBobs is in the right on this one.. A blem is a blem. People are just used to getting lowers that are indistinguishable from good ones without every really thinking what COULD be wrong with the lower as a blem. The real moral of this story is that if you're going to be a cheap fuck, don't buy a "blem" specifically for a feature that is entirely cosmetic... That's just dumb. What if he bought it and somehow the spartan helmet was mis engraved and looked like a penis? Would he still bitch then? Probably. |
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Have to say JoeBobs is in the right on this one.. A blem is a blem. People are just used to getting lowers that are indistinguishable from good ones without every really thinking what COULD be wrong with the lower as a blem. The real moral of this story is that if you're going to be a cheap fuck, don't buy a "blem" specifically for a feature that is entirely cosmetic... That's just dumb. What if he bought it and somehow the spartan helmet was mis engraved and looked like a penis? Would he still bitch then? Probably. ETA: "Moron Labia" inscription for icing on the cake. |
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Hey let's sell these plain jane lowers as blemished versions of a lower with a sweet rollmark.
Nobody will care, right? And if they do, F 'em. We'll just get personal. That's a winning business strategy. Hopefully, for JBO's sake, this is a rogue employee that will be dealt with accordingly. I say this as a retail manager. The customer is often not always right, but this time they are. |
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Hey let's sell these plain jane lowers as blemished versions of a lower with a sweet rollmark. Nobody will care, right? And if they do, F 'em. We'll just get personal. That's a winning business strategy. Hopefully, for JBO's sake, this is a rogue employee that will be dealt with accordingly. I say this as a retail manager. The customer is often not always right, but this time they are. If this was 2008 or post-Sandy Hook, I could see it. Not now. |
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So he bought a blem lower and he is mad that it's a blem? It says 'cosmetic blemish' not a complete lack of manufacturing logo. The company misrepresented what it was selling IMHO and then to attemp to AROCK a customer is baffling. 
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How about the trunnion issue on the upper. Haha Quoted:
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Seems all of the bad reviews on their facebook page have a poor customer service theme to them. Though I'm not sure I'm going to take this guy's evaluation of AR-15 quality very seriously: the gas pipe was loose |
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I can't stop watching this
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| JB needs to pony up and swap out the "Non Spartan" blem lowers. They may be keeping some of their loyal fans that hear about this, but will probably lose a bunch and ward off potential customers from even considering them. The small amount of revenue they're quibbling about is gonna compound many times over in the loss column when the dust settles. |
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I don't know what to believe anymore. After reading this and the other email it seems like Joe is explaining he only dropped the name of where dude worked because they probably have a similar policy on products and return policy. As well as explaining how he attained said customers email. Also kind of looks pretty professional and that JoeBob was not trying to pull the wool over said customers eyes. ETA: the looks pretty professional part was meant to only encompass the fact that they weren't trying to fool anyone by selling nonmarked Spartan lowers. As I stated though, still not sure if they tried to arock said customer or not. |
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Have to say JoeBobs is in the right on this one.. A blem is a blem. People are just used to getting lowers that are indistinguishable from good ones without every really thinking what COULD be wrong with the lower as a blem. The real moral of this story is that if you're going to be a cheap fuck, don't buy a "blem" specifically for a feature that is entirely cosmetic... That's just dumb. What if he bought it and somehow the spartan helmet was mis engraved and looked like a penis? Would he still bitch then? Probably. A blem is a blem. However, being sent an entirely different product is not a blemish. It's Joe Bob's failure to maintain inventory control and pass that screw up onto an unsuspecting customer. |