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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/25/2005 6:23:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/28/2005 8:29:14 AM EDT by TraumaLevel1]
I have a standard SA M1A.
I modified in the following ways which I recommend;
(If you want pics e-mail me at traumalevel1@aol.com)

1. Replace the Flash suppressor with a Smith Vortex FS without sight post - this will hide 99% of the flash

2. Get a Gas tube front sight by Smith - the front sight will now be a circle and is much easier to aim. Its like the HK type front sight

3. Get a rail for the barrel where you can put an Aimpoint on. Much easier to walk and shoot with.

4. Get a stock with cheek rest. I put a Rooster cheek rest on a synthetic stock

5. Get USGI parts especially the bolt and barrel. My SA came with a Winchester barrel and forged bolt but I also have a TRW bolt,

6. Get a bolt release (rooster or Smith) so you can charge the bolt from the left side by pushing a button - like the AR15 (I still need to get one of these)

optional ; 9 inch harris bipod

Link Posted: 8/25/2005 2:12:50 PM EDT
Lots of wonderfull M1A gadgets and Gizmos available to customize as you like.

1. Vortex ; Nifty looking but not worth the $ to hide % 99 Flash when the GI one works pretty good.

2. Gas lock sight : Looks cool but you lose sight radious and the ability to mech zero for windage, Great Idea on socom and short bush versions.

3. Aimpoint : For those who can't shoot iron sights.

4. Cheek rest : Not really needed if you are barrel mounting an aimpoint, If a traditional scope set up yes.

5. Yes on the GI bolt, though a SA inc Med weight barrel will prob shoot better than a used GI chrome lined.

6. It's a " Bolt Catch " not a release, use it as a release and one day it won't fully chamber a round when you need it too. Spend money on ammo and practice mag changes .
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:26:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2005 3:30:55 PM EDT by H2O_MAN]
1. The DC Vortex works as well as the GI plus it's shorter and you can easily put a sound suppessor on it.

2. Two versions of the GLFS exist, HK/ghost ring and the dovetail.

3. Irons rule - Aimpoint or EOTech on a KAS rail would be sweet.

4. Cheek rest - only if needed.

5. A GI bolt and a quality barrel work great together.

6. Bolt stop, Bolt catch, can be used as a Bolt release in a pinch. I like the SEI version but the GI works.

Good luck with your build.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 8:16:45 PM EDT
I would only add chopping 2" off the stock for a shorter LOP.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 8:44:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By tangeant:
Lots of wonderfull M1A gadgets and Gizmos available to customize as you like.

1. Vortex ; Nifty looking but not worth the $ to hide % 99 Flash when the GI one works pretty good.

Everyone knows the vortex is the best FS and I sold the GI FS w/ sight for 60 and paid 75 for the smith vortex

2. Gas lock sight : Looks cool but you lose sight radious and the ability to mech zero for windage, Great Idea on socom and short bush versions.

You do lose sight radius but you will be more accurate matching 2 circles then a circle and a "V"
I have already tried it


3. Aimpoint : For those who can't shoot iron sights.

I'll get faster target acquisition then with iron sights. Also its much easier to walk and shoot with both eyes open - I also have tried it and beat others in a walking match who used iron sights

4. Cheek rest : Not really needed if you are barrel mounting an aimpoint, If a traditional scope set up yes.

I feel better with an adjustable cheek rest which isn't too expensive

5. Yes on the GI bolt, though a SA inc Med weight barrel will prob shoot better than a used GI chrome lined.

You cant put a scout rail on anything other then a standard barrel from what I understand
also a standard barrel is fine for a battle rifle


6. It's a " Bolt Catch " not a release, use it as a release and one day it won't fully chamber a round when you need it too. Spend money on ammo and practice mag changes .



the advantage of adding a "bolt catch" as a release is to make your mag changes faster. you dont have to use your right hand to chamber a round. And if a round doesnt chamber then you always do the same thing you do when you get a jam - cycle the action
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 8:51:44 PM EDT
Vortex wasnt added yet



Link Posted: 8/26/2005 12:52:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

Originally Posted By tangeant:
Lots of wonderfull M1A gadgets and Gizmos available to customize as you like.

1. Vortex ; Nifty looking but not worth the $ to hide % 99 Flash when the GI one works pretty good.

Everyone knows the vortex is the best FS and I sold the GI FS w/ sight for 60 and paid 75 for the smith vortex

2. Gas lock sight : Looks cool but you lose sight radious and the ability to mech zero for windage, Great Idea on socom and short bush versions.

You do lose sight radius but you will be more accurate matching 2 circles then a circle and a "V"
I have already tried it


3. Aimpoint : For those who can't shoot iron sights.

I'll get faster target acquisition then with iron sights. Also its much easier to walk and shoot with both eyes open - I also have tried it and beat others in a walking match who used iron sights

4. Cheek rest : Not really needed if you are barrel mounting an aimpoint, If a traditional scope set up yes.

I feel better with an adjustable cheek rest which isn't too expensive

5. Yes on the GI bolt, though a SA inc Med weight barrel will prob shoot better than a used GI chrome lined.

You cant put a scout rail on anything other then a standard barrel from what I understand
also a standard barrel is fine for a battle rifle


6. It's a " Bolt Catch " not a release, use it as a release and one day it won't fully chamber a round when you need it too. Spend money on ammo and practice mag changes .



the advantage of adding a "bolt catch" as a release is to make your mag changes faster. you dont have to use your right hand to chamber a round. And if a round doesnt chamber then you always do the same thing you do when you get a jam - cycle the action



Long as you're happy with your sample survey of one, so be it.
As far as the "everyone knows the Vortex is best" bs, I seem to remember the open ended flash hider on the original '16s causing problems with tangling on stuff before the Army wised up and changed it. The Vortex would likely do the same. But, I forgot, we already know where all the future wars are gonna be and we're never gonna fight in the woods again so it doesn't matter. So let's just go ahead and make our weapons more specialized and less all around capable while we're at it.Hell, we're never gonna need bayonets again either

Some of your recommendations are good, some are crap. All are your personal preference so that's alright.
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 1:22:27 PM EDT
For the Class 3 crowd, including myself, items # 1,2, 5 and 6 are very nice to have items. # 1 - no more cleaning the M14E2 stablizer of carbon residue. # 2 The combination gas cylinder lock front sight allows me to install my Fisher Enterprises M14 DC sound suppressor (as soon as the Form 4 comes back from the NFA Branch). # 5 - At 720 rpm in automatic, the USGI chromium plated barrel is "da bomb." # 6 - The SEI extended bolt stop/lock makes the magazine changes faster when shooting from the prone in the M14A1 configuration.
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 5:16:56 PM EDT


Long as you're happy with your sample survey of one, so be it.
As far as the "everyone knows the Vortex is best" bs, I seem to remember the open ended flash hider on the original '16s causing problems with tangling on stuff before the Army wised up and changed it. The Vortex would likely do the same. But, I forgot, we already know where all the future wars are gonna be and we're never gonna fight in the woods again so it doesn't matter. So let's just go ahead and make our weapons more specialized and less all around capable while we're at it.Hell, we're never gonna need bayonets again either

Some of your recommendations are good, some are crap. All are your personal preference so that's alright.


Vortex is the best at hiding flash especially at night. They may get cought up in deep brush but thats not a good enough reason not to use the most effective FS. Also, the M14 vortex has a lot wider spacing between the slots.

As far as "making our weapons more specialized and less all around capable" the above mods didnt change the "all around capablilty" at all, it just made it a better weapon.
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 5:32:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

As far as "making our weapons more specialized and less all around capable" the above mods didnt change the "all around capablilty" at all, it just made it a better weapon.



+1
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 5:56:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/26/2005 5:59:03 PM EDT by tangeant]

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

As far as "making our weapons more specialized and less all around capable" the above mods didnt change the "all around capablilty" at all IMOP, it just made it a better weapon for me .



Kinda figured from the first post you weren't really looking for input. " Different strokes for different folks" it's your rifle to do what you wan't with.
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 6:31:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By tangeant:

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

As far as "making our weapons more specialized and less all around capable" the above mods didnt change the "all around capablilty" at all IMOP, it just made it a better weapon for me .



Kinda figured from the first post you weren't really looking for input. " Different strokes for different folks" it's your rifle to do what you wan't with.




I'm asking your opinion and respond by defending why I think my recommendations are good. Thats how we learn. If you disagree thats cool too, but if you dont have any thing constructive to say dont post here.

Always a few a$$holes around unfortunately

Link Posted: 8/26/2005 7:44:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

They may get cought up in deep brush but thats not a good enough reason not to use the most effective FS.





Actually, to me, it is. A military rifle needs to be capable in all environments and some things must be compromised. Regardless of how cool it is to say something like "In a world of compromise, we don't" etc, tradeoffs happen. Nature of the beast and all.
Not worth it to me to trade what might be, say, a 90% effective FH (USGI) for something that may be 95% effective (Vortex) that causes other potential problems. And yes, I pulled those percentages out of my ass just for an example.

Just because the Vortex and all things SEI are the latest rage with some of the M14 crowd doesn't mean I need to jump on that wagon without looking at their "upgrades" with a critical eye as to what works for my needs and wants.

And anyway, disagreeing with your opinion doesn't make me an asshole, other stuff does that
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 2:31:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/27/2005 2:31:45 AM EDT by H2O_MAN]

Originally Posted By bishopm14:
Just because the Vortex and all things SEI are the latest rage with some of the M14 crowd doesn't mean I need to jump on that wagon without looking at their "upgrades" with a critical eye as to what works for my needs and wants.



I can't speak for the others but I sure looked hard at all of my "upgrades"
with a critical eye as to what works for my needs and wants -- No regrets.
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 2:47:07 AM EDT
Good ideas. Post pics and a range report.

Max
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 5:06:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bishopm14:

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

They may get cought up in deep brush but thats not a good enough reason not to use the most effective FS.





Actually, to me, it is. A military rifle needs to be capable in all environments and some things must be compromised. Regardless of how cool it is to say something like "In a world of compromise, we don't" etc, tradeoffs happen. Nature of the beast and all.
Not worth it to me to trade what might be, say, a 90% effective FH (USGI) for something that may be 95% effective (Vortex) that causes other potential problems. And yes, I pulled those percentages out of my ass just for an example.

Just because the Vortex and all things SEI are the latest rage with some of the M14 crowd doesn't mean I need to jump on that wagon without looking at their "upgrades" with a critical eye as to what works for my needs and wants.

And anyway, disagreeing with your opinion doesn't make me an asshole, other stuff does that




You make a valid point about the brush and the vortex. I disagree, but I see how some wouldn't want it in heavy bush. I just dont think you have make statements like following to get you point across;

Kinda figured from the first post you weren't really looking for input. " Different strokes for different folks" it's your rifle to do what you wan't with.

If you make a good point people will agree or disagree. You dont have to make nonproductive comments.
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 5:23:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:
1. Replace the Flash suppressor with a Smith Vortex FS without sight post - this will hide 99% of the flash.



Try actually shooting your rifle at night. The GI FH is very effective. I know.
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 6:51:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/27/2005 6:58:32 AM EDT by Trumpet]

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:
I have a standard SA M1A.
I modified in the following ways which I recommend;
(If you want pics e-mail me at traumalevel1@aol.com)

1. Replace the Flash suppressor with a Smith Vortex FS without sight post - this will hide 99% of the flash

2. Get a Gas tube front sight by Smith - the front sight will now be a circle and is much easier to aim. Its like the HK type front sight

3. Get a rail for the barrel where you can put an Aimpoint on. Much easier to walk and shoot with.

4. Get a stock with cheek rest. I put a Rooster cheek rest on a synthetic stock

5. Get USGI parts especially the bolt and barrel. My SA came with a Winchester barrel and forged bolt but I also have a TRW bolt,

6. Get a bolt release (rooster or Smith) so you can charge the bolt from the left side by pushing a button - like the AR15 (I still need to get one of these)

optional ; 9 inch harris bipod




I guess it all depends on what you want. I got one of the "limited GI" M1As last year (I think it was the MA9102...or 3?). SAK barrel...

Anyway I think what's "needed" as opposed to what's "neat" are different. All I had done to mine was I had Charles Maloney due a mild (not much point in a "super match" trigger in a non-match battle rifle) tune to a NIW USGI trigger group and drop it in, shim the gas system, and put in a USGI bolt.

1. Nice, but honestly not really necessary for most all M1A owners.

2. Cool, but the regular USGI sights are working just fine and the longer sight radius is a plus. I'm not convinced that the HK style sight is necessarily "better", although it does look "cool". If it really is better, then it would be better still to just mount it out where the traditional FS is. That way you'd get the claimed ease of the circle AND the extended sight radius.

3. Once again, nice but not necessary. I'm a big "irons" guy (don't get me wrong though, I have an Aimpoint on my M4gery, and a M3LR on my GAP rifle).

4. Only needed if you have an optic mounted. I have a Fiberglass "Whamo Camo" stock on mine and love it. Good ole' USGI birch or fiberglass is fine for irons.

5. Totally agree.

6. Nice addition. I also have a Rooster NM spring guide.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing the changes you made. It's really a "whatever floats yer boat" situation. If you believe the changes make you a better shooter, then rock on.


R

Link Posted: 8/27/2005 8:51:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

Originally Posted By bishopm14:

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

They may get cought up in deep brush but thats not a good enough reason not to use the most effective FS.





Actually, to me, it is. A military rifle needs to be capable in all environments and some things must be compromised. Regardless of how cool it is to say something like "In a world of compromise, we don't" etc, tradeoffs happen. Nature of the beast and all.
Not worth it to me to trade what might be, say, a 90% effective FH (USGI) for something that may be 95% effective (Vortex) that causes other potential problems. And yes, I pulled those percentages out of my ass just for an example.

Just because the Vortex and all things SEI are the latest rage with some of the M14 crowd doesn't mean I need to jump on that wagon without looking at their "upgrades" with a critical eye as to what works for my needs and wants.

And anyway, disagreeing with your opinion doesn't make me an asshole, other stuff does that




You make a valid point about the brush and the vortex. I disagree, but I see how some wouldn't want it in heavy bush. I just dont think you have make statements like following to get you point across;

Kinda figured from the first post you weren't really looking for input. " Different strokes for different folks" it's your rifle to do what you wan't with.

If you make a good point people will agree or disagree. You dont have to make nonproductive comments.



If you'll go back and reread your thread, you might find that I didn't make the nonproductive statement you're crediting me with.

I say you've got a pretty nice rifle there, and if it's set up for what you want and need, that's great. Some of the mods aren't my cup of tea and there's nothing' wrong with that either. At least nowadays there are options out there for us '14 freaks, compared to just a few years past when it was GI style or nothing.
Link Posted: 8/27/2005 8:06:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/27/2005 8:09:14 PM EDT by varoadking]

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

Originally Posted By tangeant:

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

As far as "making our weapons more specialized and less all around capable" the above mods didnt change the "all around capablilty" at all IMOP, it just made it a better weapon for me .



Kinda figured from the first post you weren't really looking for input. " Different strokes for different folks" it's your rifle to do what you wan't with.




I'm asking your opinion and respond by defending why I think my recommendations are good. Thats how we learn. If you disagree thats cool too, but if you dont have any thing constructive to say dont post here.

Always a few a$$holes around unfortunately




Seems to me that the title of this thread included the following verbiage:


What do you think?


Next time just ask people to stroke you and maybe you'll just get the answers you seek...

500 posts in 3 months and not a team member yet. Yup, you're right...there are always a few assholes around...

Link Posted: 8/27/2005 10:37:05 PM EDT
IMHO ......The direct connect Vortex FS is a waste,esp if you can't own a can, I may be wrong but I'm sure SE design of the gl sight is for instalation of SS ,why else shorten your sight radius?(on a battle rifle) if you don't have access to a can i think you degraded your rifles shooting potential,that is if your using irons only.......use the "bolt catch" as its intended, install a "bolt release" you'll have option for faster release but sooner or later it won't serve as a catch!.....thats what the op rod handle is for !
All these add ons may have a "cool" factor ,yet they do comprimise the 14's capabilities

Longhunter
Link Posted: 8/28/2005 2:57:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By longhunter:
use the "bolt catch" as its intended, install a "bolt release" you'll have option for faster release but sooner or later it won't serve as a catch!



What part(s) fail if you use it as a release?
Link Posted: 8/28/2005 6:02:37 AM EDT




I guess it all depends on what you want. I got one of the "limited GI" M1As last year (I think it was the MA9102...or 3?). SAK barrel...

Anyway I think what's "needed" as opposed to what's "neat" are different. All I had done to mine was I had Charles Maloney due a mild (not much point in a "super match" trigger in a non-match battle rifle) tune to a NIW USGI trigger group and drop it in, shim the gas system, and put in a USGI bolt.

1. Nice, but honestly not really necessary for most all M1A owners.

2. Cool, but the regular USGI sights are working just fine and the longer sight radius is a plus. I'm not convinced that the HK style sight is necessarily "better", although it does look "cool". If it really is better, then it would be better still to just mount it out where the traditional FS is. That way you'd get the claimed ease of the circle AND the extended sight radius.

3. Once again, nice but not necessary. I'm a big "irons" guy (don't get me wrong though, I have an Aimpoint on my M4gery, and a M3LR on my GAP rifle).

4. Only needed if you have an optic mounted. I have a Fiberglass "Whamo Camo" stock on mine and love it. Good ole' USGI birch or fiberglass is fine for irons.

5. Totally agree.

6. Nice addition. I also have a Rooster NM spring guide.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing the changes you made. It's really a "whatever floats yer boat" situation. If you believe the changes make you a better shooter, then rock on.


R

Trumpet thanks for the reply

I also have a NM Spring guide but forgot to state it
As far as the HK type front sight you realy should try it. It makes a big difference and I got a better groups with it. You could try mine if your ever in the area

I also do some walking and shooting from time to time. The Aimpoint makes it much easier to walk and shoot with both eyes open.

Link Posted: 8/28/2005 6:09:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/28/2005 6:15:01 AM EDT by TraumaLevel1]


Next time just ask people to stroke you and maybe you'll just get the answers you seek...

500 posts in 3 months and not a team member yet. Yup, you're right...there are always a few assholes around...


Another a$$hole!

Once again, if your not going to add anything to the post then just leave.

I put in for membership already and am waiting a response from webmaster@ar15.com



PS I dont need people to stroke my ego here. I have enough people who work to do that for me.
Link Posted: 8/28/2005 6:19:32 AM EDT

You could try mine if your ever in the area



Hmmm sounds good, but "USA" is kinda broad, dontcha think?


R
Link Posted: 8/28/2005 6:35:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TraumaLevel1:

I put in for membership already and am waiting a response from webmaster@ar15.com



Not to hijack the thread but I made my payment a week ago and am still waiting for my membership to take effect.

What is the delay?
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