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Link Posted: 7/27/2020 10:22:32 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC:


Hi Will. To further clarify on all this we talked to the "Captain" over at Elbit. Main guru, etc. who's been around since the ITT days...

There is no XLS grade like that. All XLS are fall out tubes with all of them having the same minimum spec. IF a dealer wanted a XLS tube that was non autogated, he could order it but they would NEVER send out an XLS tube non gated unless a specific request is made...Quote
If a non-gated tube is sold, it is sold as a non-gated tube with the buyer having complete knowledge of that fact.

I have the email if you would like to read it, but we wiill not post entire emails on the internet like that.

Bottom line, ALL XLS tubes are autogated unless ordered without them.

Hope this helps.

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Originally Posted By TNVC:
Originally Posted By will-1:


Wait, so is there an actual Elbit XLS grade?


Hi Will. To further clarify on all this we talked to the "Captain" over at Elbit. Main guru, etc. who's been around since the ITT days...

There is no XLS grade like that. All XLS are fall out tubes with all of them having the same minimum spec. IF a dealer wanted a XLS tube that was non autogated, he could order it but they would NEVER send out an XLS tube non gated unless a specific request is made...Quote
If a non-gated tube is sold, it is sold as a non-gated tube with the buyer having complete knowledge of that fact.

I have the email if you would like to read it, but we wiill not post entire emails on the internet like that.

Bottom line, ALL XLS tubes are autogated unless ordered without them.

Hope this helps.



Thanks for sharing the info.  Out of curiosity (for my own knowledge), are you aware of anyone selling new manufactured elbit non-gated tubes?  
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 11:02:24 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 11:17:43 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC:


As Augee mentioned, we cannot speak to the internal grading systems used by other vendors to sort tubes, or what they offer.  I do know for a fact these NGI XLS systems are
indeed ALL autogated tubes based on our data sheets we have shown along with a email statement from the "Captain" over at Elbit. It's unfortunate rumors get started like this.

Either way, NGI has the most affordable PVS-14 and other goggles systems out there for the price backed up with a 10 year tube and lifetime system warranty all built in-house.  By the sheer numbers of units sold, we feel the community that brought NGI's new web site to it's knee's on the day of the sale, (the volume of people that visited and ordered) are pretty happy. Even Sam flew back into California to help with the build process, which he's still there as I write this.  

Thank you.
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Originally Posted By TNVC:
Originally Posted By Honda4828:
Originally Posted By TNVC:
Originally Posted By will-1:


Wait, so is there an actual Elbit XLS grade?


Hi Will. To further clarify on all this we talked to the "Captain" over at Elbit. Main guru, etc. who's been around since the ITT days...

There is no XLS grade like that. All XLS are fall out tubes with all of them having the same minimum spec. IF a dealer wanted a XLS tube that was non autogated, he could order it but they would NEVER send out an XLS tube non gated unless a specific request is made...Quote
If a non-gated tube is sold, it is sold as a non-gated tube with the buyer having complete knowledge of that fact.

I have the email if you would like to read it, but we wiill not post entire emails on the internet like that.

Bottom line, ALL XLS tubes are autogated unless ordered without them.

Hope this helps.



Thanks for sharing the info.  Out of curiosity (for my own knowledge), are you aware of anyone selling new manufactured elbit non-gated tubes?  


As Augee mentioned, we cannot speak to the internal grading systems used by other vendors to sort tubes, or what they offer.  I do know for a fact these NGI XLS systems are
indeed ALL autogated tubes based on our data sheets we have shown along with a email statement from the "Captain" over at Elbit. It's unfortunate rumors get started like this.

Either way, NGI has the most affordable PVS-14 and other goggles systems out there for the price backed up with a 10 year tube and lifetime system warranty all built in-house.  By the sheer numbers of units sold, we feel the community that brought NGI's new web site to it's knee's on the day of the sale, (the volume of people that visited and ordered) are pretty happy. Even Sam flew back into California to help with the build process, which he's still there as I write this.  

Thank you.


I agree, I am one of the people who jumped on that sale. My RNVG will be here this week . You guys have the hottest deal going IMHO.

I was just curious about the non-gated stuff because I don’t think I’ve seen any new manufactured devices with new non-gated tubes being offered anywhere.


Link Posted: 7/27/2020 11:27:52 AM EST
Two obvious things here:

1. The NGI XLS line using XLSH tubes are 100% autogated.

2. JRH was implying they were not but has corrected it to only subtly imply that they are not, lol.




Link Posted: 7/27/2020 11:57:21 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 12:53:32 PM EST
Maybe they did that because someone kept saying they weren’t autogated?

I’m trying to be funny btw, lol
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 3:31:55 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 6:13:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2020 7:05:46 PM EST by Synyster06Gates]
My TNVC/NGI 14 came in today
Photocathode 2274
Halo 0.96
EBI 0.32
Res 64
SNR 27

Pretty decent I’ve gotta say! With the daylight filter I see a couple tiny zone 3 blems but I’ll get a better look when I’m home.

ETA - really clean, I'd almost be willing to call them peppering vs blems.

Link Posted: 7/27/2020 6:25:20 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Synyster06Gates:
My TNVC/NGI 14 came in today
Photocathode 2274
Halo 0.96
EBI 0.32
Res 64
SNR 27

Pretty decent I’ve gotta say! With the daylight filter I see a couple tiny zone 3 blems but I’ll get a better look when I’m home.
View Quote


Solid specs, That ebi is banging.
Link Posted: 7/27/2020 6:33:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/28/2020 2:39:55 PM EST by MattR]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Synyster06Gates:
My TNVC/NGI 14 came in today
Photocathode 2274
Halo 0.96
EBI 0.32
Res 64
SNR 27

Pretty decent I’ve gotta say! With the daylight filter I see a couple tiny zone 3 blems but I’ll get a better look when I’m home.
View Quote


That was pretty quick. Looks like some good specs.

Received the tracking notice on mine today. Will be out of town when they attempt delivery though.

Link Posted: 7/28/2020 8:15:20 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/28/2020 9:29:04 PM EST
Here's some side by side with a NGI XLS PVS-14 (XLSH) against L3 filmless. Specs are listed at the beginning. Great tube!

Link Posted: 7/28/2020 9:47:12 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By will-1:
Here's some side by side with a NGI XLS PVS-14 (XLSH) against L3 filmless. Specs are listed at the beginning. Great tube!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tyD1OnEpVM
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Great video! Would love to hear the experts chat a little about that crazy low EBI and how it affects the image. I’m still not clear on how it’s noticed when comparing tube images.
Link Posted: 7/28/2020 10:05:35 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jwramp:

Great video! Would love to hear the experts chat a little about that crazy low EBI and how it affects the image. I’m still not clear on how it’s noticed when comparing tube images.
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I’ve got a decent comparison of that - two Elbit tubes of relatively similar specs. Then a filmless WP just for comparison. Look at the details, shadows, etc. inside the cabinet and the candle holders on the wall.

Tube 1 -
Res - 64
SNR - 29.9
EBI - 0.75
Halo - 0.97



Tube 2
Res - 64
SNR - 27
EBI - 0.32
Halo - 0.97



Tube 3
Res - 72
SNR - 34.9
EBI - 0.5
Halo - 0.7

Link Posted: 7/28/2020 10:07:47 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Synyster06Gates:


I’ve got a decent comparison of that - two Elbit tubes of relatively similar specs. Then a filmless WP just for comparison. Look at the details, shadows, etc. inside the cabinet and the candle holders on the wall.

Tube 1 -
Res - 64
SNR - 29.9
EBI - 0.75
Halo - 0.97

https://i.imgur.com/f9cNTix.jpg

Tube 2
Res - 64
SNR - 27
EBI - 0.32
Halo - 0.97

https://i.imgur.com/ZXxt9OK.jpg

Tube 3
Res - 72
SNR - 34.9
EBI - 0.5
Halo - 0.7

https://i.imgur.com/M72xQ3W.jpg
View Quote


Interesting - tube image 2 looks hugely sharper than 1. Crazy how different those shots are.
Link Posted: 7/28/2020 10:11:53 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jwramp:

Great video! Would love to hear the experts chat a little about that crazy low EBI and how it affects the image. I’m still not clear on how it’s noticed when comparing tube images.
View Quote


Thanks bro!

I’ve never had a tube with EBI this low so when I read the data record I wasn’t sure what to expect. When I first used it TBH nothing stood out to me as extraordinary in regards to the EBI.

My impression of this particular tube’s performance compared to the slightly higher spec GP SLG’s I’ve owned before (NVD HP+) is that it’s practically the same just in WP.

It’s a nice tube. I’m tempted to ditch my GP’s for a pair of these actually. 🤔
Link Posted: 7/28/2020 10:24:34 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jwramp:


Interesting - tube image 2 looks hugely sharper than 1. Crazy how different those shots are.
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It is definitely a lot more sharp. But the 10% increase in SNR is noticeable
Link Posted: 7/28/2020 10:29:10 PM EST
Just for some more pics since I played with this unit some tonight. Really impressed with it.





Link Posted: 7/29/2020 2:54:24 AM EST
Just so I am clear, if you hit something with an illuminator, tube quality is mostly irrelevant at that point within the Gen 3 family pretty much, correct?
Link Posted: 7/29/2020 5:06:39 AM EST
This page is what I’ve been waiting for.  Thanks guys for the photos and videos.
Link Posted: 7/29/2020 7:05:13 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JohnDough:
Just so I am clear, if you hit something with an illuminator, tube quality is mostly irrelevant at that point within the Gen 3 family pretty much, correct?
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It will help level the playing field - but I wouldn't say that it's irrelevant. Just makes some numbers less important.
Link Posted: 7/29/2020 2:03:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/29/2020 2:04:50 PM EST by TNVC]
Link Posted: 7/29/2020 2:27:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/29/2020 2:27:19 PM EST by Synyster06Gates]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC:


Very happy you're still liking the unit.  Like the pics you presented, thank you again for your business.  
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Yeah but you’re making me want to change my Filmless 14 order to a set of these binos...
Link Posted: 7/29/2020 5:41:28 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 12:33:03 PM EST
Got my TNVC/NGI elbit RNVG’s today. There is a zone 3 spot in both tubes. I’m super excited and very impressed. Can’t wait to get these out this weekend!

Specs
Pho: 1774/1710
Halo: 0.88/0.94
Ebi: 0.10/0.18
Res:72/64
Fom:1692/1472
Snr: 23.5/23

Link Posted: 7/31/2020 1:35:24 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 1:36:52 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Honda4828:
Got my TNVC/NGI elbit RNVG’s today. There is a zone 3 spot in both tubes. I’m super excited and very impressed. Can’t wait to get these out this weekend!

Specs
Pho: 1774/1710
Halo: 0.88/0.94
Ebi: 0.10/0.18
Res:72/64
Fom:1692/1472
Snr: 23.5/23

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It should look similar to the tube I used in the video. The specs for that tube were:

1916 sensitivity
.92 halo
.18 EBI
64 res
27.4 snr
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 4:23:34 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2020 4:24:04 PM EST by MattR]
I got a package in from TNVC today and was jacked, going to the camp this weekend so a perfect place to try out my new NV.

Instead, it was my Ops Core bump, laser, and mowhawk. This makes week 4 of the 1-2 week wait for the 14, but also week 4 of the possible 18 week wait for the bump so I guess it's a fair tradeoff.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:06:39 PM EST
I'm there with you.  Ordered at 0900 on 7/3 and given the 1-2 week lead time.  I'm still waiting.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:31:53 PM EST
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Originally Posted By 545Fan:
I'm there with you.  Ordered at 0900 on 7/3 and given the 1-2 week lead time.  I'm still waiting.
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Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:44:46 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:44:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2020 5:55:10 PM EST by DV8EDD]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By -Abyss-:

Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.
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Originally Posted By -Abyss-:
Originally Posted By 545Fan:
I'm there with you.  Ordered at 0900 on 7/3 and given the 1-2 week lead time.  I'm still waiting.

Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.

Yeah I'm kinda feeling this too b/c I'm in the 8-10 week. I bet there was probably more orders than anticipated but if the 1-2 week folks are delayed, what does that mean for everyone downstream?

A 20 week wait could change my buying choice, despite the awesome communication I've from TNVS so far.


ETA: response moments before my post, hopefully catch up works out so all timelines aren't extended.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:48:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2020 5:52:25 PM EST by MattR]
Originally Posted By 545Fan:
I'm there with you.  Ordered at 0900 on 7/3 and given the 1-2 week lead time.  I'm still waiting.
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0610 was my order time on the invoice

Originally Posted By -Abyss-:
.

Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.
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Yea, it's going to be a bit. How much more than 8-10 weeks is the question. That said, looking through the previous threads makes it look like the wait is always very long. JRH was the best deal before this, and it was $3295 so you're paying significantly more to not wait (even though that tube has better min specs from what I have read).

Originally Posted By TNVC:


Our apologies. We have a crap ton of tubes that have come in, a bit of a delay was the housings themselves. Several hundred more housings are due in next week and several hundred very soon after that. It's been very busy to say the least.
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Maybe an email or some communication would be a good idea for people that don't check this thread. For those of us buying our first NV (and not used to the wait periods), not having any idea of where you are on a several thousand dollar purchase keeps you anxiously hitting the refresh button on your email server.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:55:50 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 5:59:42 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2020 6:00:35 PM EST by PA452]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By -Abyss-:

Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.
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I don't think it makes a difference. I ordered an L3 unfilmed -14 in April, given an 8-10 week estimate. I hit 14 weeks this past Tuesday. I emailed a few weeks ago, was told it should ship around last Friday. Still waiting.
Link Posted: 7/31/2020 8:57:00 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By PA452:


I don't think it makes a difference. I ordered an L3 unfilmed -14 in April, given an 8-10 week estimate. I hit 14 weeks this past Tuesday. I emailed a few weeks ago, was told it should ship around last Friday. Still waiting.
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Originally Posted By PA452:
Originally Posted By -Abyss-:

Well that's discouraging. I was given "8-10 weeks". I'm thinking it may be better to pay a premium and actually get my -14 sometime this year.


I don't think it makes a difference. I ordered an L3 unfilmed -14 in April, given an 8-10 week estimate. I hit 14 weeks this past Tuesday. I emailed a few weeks ago, was told it should ship around last Friday. Still waiting.

You're probably right. I'm a night vision noob and didn't realize that this is just par for the course.

It does suck though that overpromising with regard to ETA is the name of the game. If the lead time is X weeks, then say it's X weeks. Don't lie to make the sale and then hope to keep the customer dangling to the point that he has too much sunk time to bail to one of your competitors. It's just sleazy.
Link Posted: 8/1/2020 10:02:09 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By -Abyss-:

You're probably right. I'm a night vision noob and didn't realize that this is just par for the course.

It does suck though that overpromising with regard to ETA is the name of the game. If the lead time is X weeks, then say it's X weeks. Don't lie to make the sale and then hope to keep the customer dangling to the point that he has too much sunk time to bail to one of your competitors. It's just sleazy.
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It sounds like TNVC just had an issue with a single component not arriving that held up the whole process. Since they actually assemble them in-house, it just extends the whole batch rather than a few drop shipping every day from a third party assembly line.

Anytime you are competing with the .mil for parts, they are going to win in the priority department.
Link Posted: 8/2/2020 7:50:55 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/2/2020 9:35:29 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC:


+1000, we dont allow anyone to drop ship anything for us! Too many thousands of your hard earned dollar expects us to have eyes on everything! We inspect EVERYTHING before we ship and in this case unfortunately the famed green bag was a culprit.

Another large batch going out this week.
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I'm willing to wait as long as it takes, for you to find the best tube for my order.
Link Posted: 8/3/2020 12:15:26 AM EST
dumb question and stupid to ask but I am guessing this deal expired?

Link Posted: 8/3/2020 12:42:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/3/2020 12:42:51 AM EST by kersty52]
I think you guys who got these on the deal got a HELLUVA deal.  Looks like many of y’all got better numbers than the L3/Harris thin film WP PVS14 I got today.  HOPEFULLY this means my DTNVGS I hav on order will make up for it with some stellar tubes in film less WP
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 6:21:11 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jozsi:
dumb question and stupid to ask but I am guessing this deal expired?

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@Jozsi yes the deal ended.  however, these are still a quality purchase that should be considered depending on what you're looking for.  they are meant to be a "budget" offering all things equal.
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 6:36:38 AM EST
Mount.
Dual dovetail.
Helmet.

When you have a setup ready to go, but 7 more weeks to wait.
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 10:47:06 AM EST
Not as bad as waiting for tax stamps......
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 11:57:44 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By deputygadget:
Not as bad as waiting for tax stamps......
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debatable!
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 12:07:40 PM EST
Completed a Rhino 2 dovetail conversion

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Link Posted: 8/4/2020 12:16:36 PM EST
What part(s) did you use to do the conversion? I'm waiting on my PVS14 as well, and was thinking of going with a Rhino 2 like you did so I'm curious. Thanks.
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 1:00:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/4/2020 1:01:27 PM EST by bradpierson26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mrclark2:
What part(s) did you use to do the conversion? I'm waiting on my PVS14 as well, and was thinking of going with a Rhino 2 like you did so I'm curious. Thanks.
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Norotos 15/18 socket
Norotos Dual dovetail adaptor
On page three of this thread there is a YouTube tutorial
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 1:01:18 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By bradpierson26:
Completed a Rhino 2 dovetail conversion

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/184182/E4EA5D76-E01C-4F39-970D-04168A648572_jpe-1532482.JPG
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About damn time
Link Posted: 8/4/2020 1:02:52 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Gopherboy128:


About damn time
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I was on the beach rupturing my Achilles and running over my eye glasses for 8 days

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