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Posted: 5/28/2009 5:36:13 PM EST
Any of you guys run subsonic .308 ammo through your suppressors?
If so, what twist rate and have you experienced baffle strikes or stability issues?

Gemtech cautions that a fast twist rate (1:8) is required to prevent baffle strikes when using subsonic ammo.
My Remington 700 has a 1:12 twist.


Link Posted: 5/28/2009 6:11:48 PM EST
I've shot subs in my Remington 700P and an FN SPR I used to have, both with 1:12 twist barrels. Weight and shape play the biggest role in determining if the bullet will stabilize or not. I've had good luck with TTI 170gr subs as well as subsonic reloads using Hornady 170gr FP Interlock bullets with Trailboss powder. I think EBR is the only subsonic round manufacturer that Gemtech recommends but you should check with them first.

If you choose to use subs try them WITHOUT the suppressor first and make sure you don't get oblong or keyhole shaped holes in your targets. I check the distance at less than 3ft, 20ft, 50yds, and 100yds (arbitrary distances I decided upon).

-X
Link Posted: 5/28/2009 7:18:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/28/2009 7:19:05 PM EST by kel]
Link Posted: 5/28/2009 7:22:36 PM EST
Like was already said make sure your rounds are stabilizing.Just use your head and dont do some stupid crap like running 240gr in a 12 twist through your can.
Link Posted: 5/29/2009 12:08:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By jjfischer:
Any of you guys run subsonic .308 ammo through your suppressors?
If so, what twist rate and have you experienced baffle strikes or stability issues?




I've run EBR Thumper through my MK14 SEI Mod 0 with an 18" 4 groove 1:10 ROT
and an SEI M14DC 0.30 Caliber Sound Suppressor without a single problem
Link Posted: 5/31/2009 4:41:06 AM EST
mjohn3006 has worked up some loads that I can outrun.

I'll send him a link to this thread
Link Posted: 5/31/2009 8:13:03 PM EST
I shoot EBR Thumpers and love them...spooky quiet.
Rifle: Savage 10FP
Suppressor: AAC 762SD

I chose the Savage over the Remington for a few reasons:
1) Savage comes with a 1:10 twist to stabilize subsonic ammo better (Remington is 1:12)
2) Savage is about half the cost of Remington
3) The Savage Accutriger IMHO is better than the Remington trigger.

I second the notion that you should fire the subsonics at a paper target without the suppressor to make sure they are punching clean holes. I'd rather find out my rifle isn't stabilizing the ammo by seeing an oblong hole in a piece of paper than by hearing an awful clang come from my suppressor.
Link Posted: 6/1/2009 7:37:45 AM EST
1:11.25

10.1 grns of TB

180 Nosler Rnd Nose

Again make sure it stabilizes and chronos before attaching your can.
Link Posted: 6/1/2009 5:59:51 PM EST
FWIW, my .308 subsonic load is:

170gr Hornady FP Interlock bullet
10.2gr Trailboss Powder
FGMM Large Rifle Primer
2x or 3x FGMM case
COAL I think is 2.570 (will have to check when I get home, on vacation right now)

I run this load in a chopped Remington 700p at 22 inches. So far it's been a really good load and moa/sub moa capable at 100yds with the same drop as the TTI 170gr subsonic load. Best of all, it's REALLY quiet with my new Gemtech Sandstorm can (had an HVT before).

-X
Link Posted: 6/1/2009 6:11:04 PM EST
So where are the pics of the can ?
Link Posted: 6/2/2009 8:14:13 AM EST
Originally Posted By Black-X:
FWIW, my .308 subsonic load is:

170gr Hornady FP Interlock bullet
10.2gr Trailboss Powder
FGMM Large Rifle Primer
2x or 3x FGMM case
COAL I think is 2.570 (will have to check when I get home, on vacation right now)

-X


Mine is pretty close to that. Remember to work down so you don't end up with a round stuck in he tube. Here's a video of one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq0N1LD937A

Pmc

Link Posted: 6/2/2009 10:04:55 AM EST
Originally Posted By mah827:
So where are the pics of the can ?


On my home computer and I'm in SC.

-X
Link Posted: 6/7/2009 11:56:34 PM EST
All my 308 rifles are 1-10 twist and I shoot a lot of subsonic ammo through them . I have never had a baffle strike with this ammo but I load my own . I use 168 or 175 grain bullets . It is stable enough to hit 8' steel targets at 200 meters . A longer heavier bullet is desirable if you don't want baffle strikes .
Link Posted: 6/7/2009 11:59:06 PM EST
Originally Posted By H2O_MAN:
Originally Posted By jjfischer:
Any of you guys run subsonic .308 ammo through your suppressors?
If so, what twist rate and have you experienced baffle strikes or stability issues?




I've run EBR Thumper through my MK14 SEI Mod 0 with an 18" 4 groove 1:10 ROT
and an SEI M14DC 0.30 Caliber Sound Suppressor without a single problem


You need to get yourself a press and I will give you the data for 308 subsonics .
Link Posted: 6/8/2009 5:50:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/8/2009 5:52:52 AM EST by mjohn3006]
I have run 170 grain bullets with 8 grains of CLAYS through my M1A Scout and YHM phantom 7.62. I have only shot 10 rounds. I had no baffle strikes. But I don't have a range longer than 50 yards to check for keyholing. And I only shot the 10 shots I shot at 25 yards. I do not know the twist on my scout.

It was quiet though. Insanely ridiculously, absurdly quiet.

Bullet and gun pics.

I have loaded up 20 more to check them out. but have not had the chance yet.


Link Posted: 6/8/2009 6:01:44 AM EST
Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
I have run 170 grain bullets with 8 grains of CLAYS through my M1A Scout and YHM phantom 7.62. I have only shot 10 rounds. I had no baffle strikes. But I don't have a range longer than 50 yards to check for keyholing. And I only shot the 10 shots I shot at 25 yards. I do not know the twist on my scout.

It was quiet though. Insanely ridiculously, absurdly quiet.

Bullet and gun pics.

I have loaded up 20 more to check them out. but have not had the chance yet.
http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2777.sized.jpg

http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2662.jpg


Oh lord, that is sexy. I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A...

Is the Clays powder position sensitive? I know that some powders don't fill up enough of the case volume and tilting the rifle up before firing is needed to ensure full and correct powder burn. While this might not be the case with Clays (never used it) I know that there are some powders, mostly pistol, that require this and I tend to stay away from them for subsonic rifle loads.

-X
Link Posted: 6/8/2009 6:17:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/8/2009 6:17:54 AM EST by mjohn3006]
Originally Posted By Black-X:
Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
I have run 170 grain bullets with 8 grains of CLAYS through my M1A Scout and YHM phantom 7.62. I have only shot 10 rounds. I had no baffle strikes. But I don't have a range longer than 50 yards to check for keyholing. And I only shot the 10 shots I shot at 25 yards. I do not know the twist on my scout.

It was quiet though. Insanely ridiculously, absurdly quiet.

Bullet and gun pics.

I have loaded up 20 more to check them out. but have not had the chance yet.
http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2777.sized.jpg

http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2662.jpg


Oh lord, that is sexy. I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A...

Is the Clays powder position sensitive? I know that some powders don't fill up enough of the case volume and tilting the rifle up before firing is needed to ensure full and correct powder burn. While this might not be the case with Clays (never used it) I know that there are some powders, mostly pistol, that require this and I tend to stay away from them for subsonic rifle loads.

-X


I have been told I should use Trail boss because the CLAYS can be position sensitive. I bought some trail boss and will give it a try. But Hodgen's website specifically lists this load, and the 10 rounds I shot were very consistent. So who knows. CLAYS is some very light stuff. Not as light as trail boss, but it takes a sizable amount to hit 8 grains.
Link Posted: 6/8/2009 7:44:44 AM EST
Originally Posted By Black-X:


Oh lord, that is sexy. ... I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A...


Sure you do... MK14 SEI with SEI M14DC 0.30 Caliber Sound Suppressor.



Link Posted: 6/8/2009 3:29:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/10/2009 6:58:14 PM EST by esquared]
Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
Originally Posted By Black-X:
Originally Posted By mjohn3006:
I have run 170 grain bullets with 8 grains of CLAYS through my M1A Scout and YHM phantom 7.62. I have only shot 10 rounds. I had no baffle strikes. But I don't have a range longer than 50 yards to check for keyholing. And I only shot the 10 shots I shot at 25 yards. I do not know the twist on my scout.

It was quiet though. Insanely ridiculously, absurdly quiet.

Bullet and gun pics.

I have loaded up 20 more to check them out. but have not had the chance yet.
http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2777.sized.jpg

http://nullbits.foxxz.net/albums/gun/IMG_2662.jpg


Oh lord, that is sexy. I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A, I don't need an M1A...

Is the Clays powder position sensitive? I know that some powders don't fill up enough of the case volume and tilting the rifle up before firing is needed to ensure full and correct powder burn. While this might not be the case with Clays (never used it) I know that there are some powders, mostly pistol, that require this and I tend to stay away from them for subsonic rifle loads.

-X


I have been told I should use Trail boss because the CLAYS can be position sensitive. I bought some trail boss and will give it a try. But Hodgen's website specifically lists this load, and the 10 rounds I shot were very consistent. So who knows. CLAYS is some very light stuff. Not as light as trail boss, but it takes a sizable amount to hit 8 grains.


I have been using this type of powder for subsonic ammo for a long time and have never had a failure to fire and I have fired thousands of rounds of it . When the primer goes off it fills the case with fire and sparks , it is going to light .
Link Posted: 6/9/2009 3:03:34 PM EST
Nice M1!!!!!

Have you experienced any problems with cycling the action when using subsonic ammo?

If not, any idea why the M1 cycles with subsonic while an AR won't?
Link Posted: 6/9/2009 5:59:14 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/9/2009 5:59:39 PM EST by mjohn3006]

Originally Posted By jjfischer:
Nice M1!!!!!

Have you experienced any problems with cycling the action when using subsonic ammo?

If not, any idea why the M1 cycles with subsonic while an AR won't?

No. It will not cycle. But I kind of like that fact. Makes it that much quieter. The loudest part of shooting my suppressed 10/22 is the CLICK CLACK of the action. The loudest part of shooting the suppressed M1A with sub sonics, is the bullet impact.
Link Posted: 6/10/2009 2:03:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By mjohn3006:

Originally Posted By jjfischer:
Nice M1!!!!!

Have you experienced any problems with cycling the action when using subsonic ammo?

If not, any idea why the M1 cycles with subsonic while an AR won't?

No. It will not cycle. But I kind of like that fact. Makes it that much quieter. The loudest part of shooting my suppressed 10/22 is the CLICK CLACK of the action. The loudest part of shooting the suppressed M1A with sub sonics, is the bullet impact.


+1

None of mine will cycle sub sonic ammo.
Here is an old VIDEO of me and my suppressed MK14 SEI that clearly demonstrates this.
Link Posted: 6/10/2009 6:33:05 PM EST


Custom 240 grain bullet with Trail Boss, Priceless!
Link Posted: 6/12/2009 7:27:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By kel:
I'll tell ya though, I recently got my first AK47 in fifteen years and it cycles sub EBR with an HVT mounted, which was a neat surprise... I assume that the cost of sub vs. super gap has narrowed in the past few months, so if you haven't played around with the EBR, it's a real treat.


Cool, I'm waiting on my tax stamp on a HVT. I didn't know you could put the bi-lock on an AK. Gotta look into that.

Link Posted: 6/15/2009 7:06:50 AM EST
Originally Posted By kel:


In my opinion, EBR has it down better than anyone else.



+1

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