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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 11/17/2001 3:31:27 PM EDT
I would like to ask a question without starting a war...
I have been devouring all kinds of info in the last two weeks, got a bunch of catalogs to pour through, and I have made up my mind... kinda.., on which AR to buy, narrowed down to two, so now I need some help.
I want to shoot tight groups from a bench, with a scope, at 200 yds, with an AR.
The two models I have boiled down to are;
Oly PCR-1, (maybe with a bull barrel) or
BM XM15E2S V Match Competition
both are close enough in price that price is not a factor, HOWEVER, I don't want to be limited to expensive ammo all the time, I would like to go out and shoot 500 rounds for fun from time to time, and not go broke
So, what do you think?

Thanks, Lance, in Mi.
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 3:41:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/17/2001 3:34:38 PM EDT by FALARAK]
No question. Bushmaster if you want to shoot any ammo.

Oly if you want the tightest groups possible, with the SUM barrel, and willing to deal with some stoppages due to the tight chamber. Personally, mine does not have a problem with Mil-surp or Wolf ammo, unless I start blasting... which I dont do with this barrel.
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 5:12:48 PM EDT
I always say Bushmaster for the first timer. Good luck with whatever you choose.
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 5:23:18 PM EDT
I was in your position about a year ago. I went with an Oly. I have to say I wasn't dissappointed at all. I heard a lot about Oly's being tight in various places but that has long been fixed. My Oly looks/shoots great. I would guess that the Oly would be more accurate, but Bushy is the larger company. You really wouldn't be able to go wrong... you narrowed it down pretty good. Make sure you get us pics when it arrives!
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 5:28:25 PM EDT
I'd also say Bushmaster if you're going to shoot it a lot. You probably can't got wrong with either, though I'm not experienced with Olympic Arms, it sounds like they're decent too.

I know Bushmasters are good.
Link Posted: 11/17/2001 6:24:06 PM EDT
I have a 20" BullBarrel AR and absolutely love it, althought I wish I would have gone with the 24" for more velocity. Personnaly I would go with the Bushy, just because their overall reputation is better. Either rifles will shoot just about any type of ammo. If it is accuracy you want them you will need to shoot expensive match grade ammo....or learn to hand load. The best cheap accurate ammo I found is Sellor&Bellot, however each rifle is different. Other things that really help with accuracy are two stage trigger ($130), quality Harris Bipod ($60), freefloat tube, and really good scope (I use a Simmons 4x12x44AO).

Personnally I reccommend hand loading since in the long run you will save money and get much better accuracy. Handloading will have the biggest effect on accuracy over anything else. The best .223 match grade ammo I have found is Federal Match for $12/box of 20. I can handload ammo that works just as well in my AR for about $3/box of 20. With either load I have shot 1/2" 5 shot groups @ 100yrds!! A quality single stage press would only cost around $250 and you can always hand load for all calibers that you own.

I know handloading is an extra cost that you weren't planning...but trust me, it's worth it. And it's a whole other hobby.

Sgtar15
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 3:14:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/18/2001 3:08:12 AM EDT by Rancid]
Ok, I forgot 1 other question, I have read that the BM chamber is Mil-spec M-16, ond can shoot .223 or 5.56, is the Oly Mil-Spec chamber? or will I be limited to .223?
Also, there are not any Oly dealers in my area, [>(] can anyone reccommend where to shop for the best price on an Oly? I have an FFL here willing to do transfers.

Thanks, Lance
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:24:44 AM EDT
The only problem I have heard about Oly is that they use match chambers. This makes them more touchy about what ammo they can use reliably.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 7:40:05 AM EDT
I just put 700 rounds through my Bushmaster yesterday without a single stoppage.
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 10:35:40 AM EDT
Lance,

When I decided that I was going to get an AR15, I was in a similar situation as you are. I wanted a rifle that was pretty good at accuracy and also good for casual shooting. I wanted it all.

Well, I found that there is no perfect rifle out there. If you want precision, then its getting the longer heavy barrel and an accurized rifle. If you want portability and durability, then its the opposite.

I finally settled on the Bushmaster Commando Carbine VMATCH. Here's why:

free floated barrel
16" barrel - chrome lined
heavy aluminum handguard
Bushmaster quality/reputation

Yes, it is mil-spec and can handle 5.56 pressures.

No, it is not the optimum precision AR15 due to the shorter barrel length and chrome lining and due to the heavy stock trigger.

BUT, for me it works. I can shoot 1 moa off the bench at 100 yards using Lake City ball ammo or Q3131A ball ammo (well, sometimes I can).

It is light and portable and not too long.

It's a nice rifle that has never jammed on me even once. I clean it thoroughly after every range session and I clean it lightly after every 100 rounds or so.

For me, it is the best multi-purpose rifle.

Here's a picture of it:



Get the Vmatch - you won't be dissapointed.

Link Posted: 11/18/2001 1:36:29 PM EDT
ESP.......SWEET...GOOD JOB
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 4:07:37 PM EDT
Hadem both, likem both buy the "Bush."
The BM will hold value a bit better.

As usual the advice you have been given is accurate and on point.

(Rancid, you might define "tight groups" as that would give these knowledgeable guys a little more to work with. I would think you're probably talking about two-inches and under at 200 yards but only you know for sure.)
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:06:24 PM EDT
I do not agree with the non Mil-Spec no chrome lining on the Oly Arms barrels.

Especially if you intend to do some rapid fire and not clean your firearm every time you cap one off.

Build up a gun with either upper/receiver but go with a chrome lined or stainless barrel
Link Posted: 11/18/2001 8:20:37 PM EDT
MANY of Oly's barrels are stainless.

The Barrel he mention he wanted in the original post, is an Oly Stainless.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 3:41:22 AM EDT
5subslr5 Said:


(Rancid, you might define "tight groups" as that would give these knowledgeable guys a little more to work with. I would think you're probably talking about two-inches and under at 200 yards but only you know for sure.)


Good point, I would like to get the groups specified in the Oly catalog, 1/4' at 100 yds.
I would be happy with 1" at 100 yds, but MOST important, I want to shoot the thing, for fun, with ANY ammo, and not lay awake nights worrying about loads, ballistics, etc..
so, 2" at 200 yds would be good, but no fuss would be my main concern, I do not intend to compete in any way, just plink, and have the most fun/most accurate I can buy between the two!
Thanks so far for all you guys suggestions,
I do appreciate your taking the time to reply.

Lance, in Mi.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 7:39:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By David_Hineline:
I do not agree with the non Mil-Spec no chrome lining on the Oly Arms barrels.

Especially if you intend to do some rapid fire and not clean your firearm every time you cap one off.

Build up a gun with either upper/receiver but go with a chrome lined or stainless barrel



Coming from a man who will NOT clean a barrel to save his life...Dave is a good source.
Link Posted: 11/19/2001 8:34:55 AM EDT
I just got a PCR rifle kit from Oly an slapped it on an RRA lower... works fine. Great rifle, fit and finish on all the Oly parts is GREAT. Someone said Oly recently started chambering their rifles with the M16 chamber, and not the SAAMI chamber anymore, but I'm not sure on that... they don't mention it on their site. The milsurp I shot through it recently works just fine, but I haven't shot much yet...
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