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Durkin Tactical Franklin Armory
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Posted: 5/13/2002 6:51:16 AM EDT
I decided on upgrading to Badger Ordinance Rings and Bases for my PSS.

I two questions..

First I have a PSS in a 308, and a Leupold 6.5-20x50 Long Range Target (30MM tube) scope.  

What height rings should I get for this?

I also noticed that the Badger Ordinance bases have a 20MOA kant to give more adjustment for long range.

Is this enough out to 1000yards with a 308?
Second, How about 100 yards, Will I be able to come down enough at 100 yards?

Link Posted: 5/13/2002 8:02:44 AM EDT
Going from memory here so take it for what it is worth:

I think the drop for a "match" round at 1k is around 39".

What is the internal adjustment of your scope?

Most likely you can reach 1k without the angled base. However you need to check. Plus, by the time you center (mid point of clicks for both W&E) your scope and then zero - the real question is how much adjustment is left.

20 MOA seems to be what everyone has. Most likely - it will not be an issue for 100 yrds.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 8:54:28 AM EDT
The LRT has 72" at 100 yards according to their site, I haven't actually went and tried to move it that much.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 10:28:16 AM EDT
Bob243 - I am screwed up 39" isn't even close.

Your probably (depending on the ammo, atmosphere, elevation, where your zeroed, and height over bore) more like 360" to 420".

So assuming 1/4 clicks, assuming 360" drop

You've got 72" *4 clicks = 288 clicks.

Assuming you "use up" 15 MOA (60 clicks - a total guess)you still have 228 clicks left.

360" / 10 = 36 MOA

36 MOA * 4(clicks) = 144 clicks.

228 - 144 = 84 clicks or 21 MOA remaining.

However, you also ought to confirm ever thing I said with a balistics program.

Secondly - a big portion rests with "what do you have left over after centering and zeroing"?

My scope has 61 MOA total. Zero used 14.5 MOA. With my 20 MOA base I still have 66.5 MOA left after zero.

Long story made short - it depends on many variables.

Good luck
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 10:31:32 AM EDT
20 MOA should not bottom you out for 100 yards, it'll put you Near the bottom though and that's good since it gives you the Majority of your elevation adjustment to get out to 1000 yards.  That's real important because a .308 rifle with 24" barrel firing Federal Gold Medal Match ammo with 168 grain MK HPBT bullets suffers a TON of bullet drop.  If zeroed for 100 yards, that bullet is gonna drop 421 inches BELOW point of aim.  You need over 41 MOA's to come up from a 100 yard zero to a 1000 yard zero...OUCH!

Keep in mind that the elevation adjustment limits in your scope's manual cover the entire travel from bottomed out to the bery top of the screw. So a scope with 80 minutes of elevation adjustment has only 40 minutes above and below dead bang middle. If your scope zeros for 100 yards at pretty much the middle of it's travel which most scopes do, you've lost half of your available elevation adjustment and a solid headwind, significant difference in elevation between you and the target, or less efficient ammunition, might eat up a lot of what's left. Frankly that sucks.

In my opinion, Scope mounts should be designed so that the average scope will zero in the lower quarter of it's elevation travel at 100 yards. Really you only need a couple minutes below 100 for in close precision work, but variations from gun to gun, even in a given model, make a 25% rule a good bet.

You will need AT LEAST medium height rings to get the front bell to clear the barrel by at least 4-5 mm. That depends upon barrel profile as well.  The cant of the Badger Ordinance rail will affect this as well.

Call Premier Reticles and ask for their help.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 11:42:47 AM EDT
I have the high rings on my SA 4-14x56mm scope.  There is still about 1/4" clearance.

Go with the meduim rings, and you'll be fine.

Link Posted: 5/13/2002 11:55:59 AM EDT
The high rings work great with my 4.5-14x50 which has the same dimensions as yours.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 12:03:45 PM EDT
A note before you try shooting the .308 at 1000 yards...get some 175 grain ammo.  168's run out of steam around 900 yards.  Federal Gold Medal Match 175's (GM308M1) will work at 1000 yds.  The range I shoot at has a rule against using 168's for 1000 yard shooting.  Plus the drop for 175's is less than for 168's.  Both Federal loads have the same muzzle velocity.  Military M118LR should work too.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 12:16:35 PM EDT
Thanks for the advice everyone!!!

Anyone have anything good (or bad) to say about the service from Premier Reticles?

Arock, Thanks for the ammo tip...  I will load up some 175's when I go out to the 1000 yard range.

Do the screws for these bases come with the standard Remington thread size, or do I need to have them redrilled and tapped?
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 12:47:18 PM EDT
Premier Reticles is who I ordered my base from...Answered all my questions and the package got to my door in 3 to 4 days. (can't remember exactly).  Email response from them was real fast so you might get a height recommendation from them.

The screws for the rem base will match your rifle.  I didn't have any problems, just make sure you use a torque wrench with the correct settings.


Link Posted: 5/13/2002 1:17:23 PM EDT
I have the badger Ordnance base and "high" rings on my PSS as well. Both SWFA and Primier Reticles are sold out of the "medium-high" Badger Ordnance rings. I have about 1/4" clearance with a 56mm objective. The screws are the same size as the factory Remington holes. You just need to check to make sure that the DO NOT bottom-out in the receiver holes. I measured and had one front hole that was too shallow and had to switch my screws around. Also, be sure to torque everything to spec. The base-to-receiver screws are 15-18 inch-pounds with blue Loc-tite. The rings attach to the bases with 65 inch-pounds (no Loc-tite). The ring caps also torque 15-18 inch-pounds (no Loc-tite). Hope this info helps.
Link Posted: 5/13/2002 4:16:01 PM EDT
You might try Georgia Precision.  They may have them in stock.

Link Posted: 5/13/2002 9:40:28 PM EDT
As far as internal adjustments, you should be fine. Dick M and the PR staff know their stuff. They will be able to reco the correct height. Remember there has to be a small gap for any butler creek flip ups, or etc. I searched high and low, at the time PR had the best prices on the BO one piece base and matching rings. They are worth the small investment. Their customer service is great. Ask for a catalog..
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