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Posted: 5/21/2005 3:11:10 PM EDT
There seems to be a trend in precision ARs to have long handguards. Why is this?

The latest is the Larue with a length of 13.2 or thereabouts. This is to cover the gas block of course, but why have the extra weight? Mid-length handguards leave just enough room for a rail cover and a bipod. What more do you need?

No flames intended. I just want to know Why.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:51:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By StormSurge:
There seems to be a trend in precision ARs to have long handguards. Why is this?

The latest is the Larue with a length of 13.2 or thereabouts. This is to cover the gas block of course, but why have the extra weight? Mid-length handguards leave just enough room for a rail cover and a bipod. What more do you need?

No flames intended. I just want to know Why.

I can't imagine that a 12" RAS weighs much less than a 13.2".

To me, a longer RAS covers more of the bbl which is a good thing - more of the bbl is protected. It also gives you more real estate to use when supporting the rifle on a barrier.

Regardless, I went with a Larue 9.0 on my mid-length because a 7.0 is too short for me to grab comfortably. It might also be nice for a bipod too.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:52:05 PM EDT
+1



I would not do it either.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:53:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/21/2005 3:54:47 PM EDT by mongo001]
A few reasons off the top of my head:

1. Longer sight radius with rail mounted BUIS.

2. Bipod out farther for a more stable platform.

3. Longer rails cover more of the barrel, so when you drop your rifle down on the sling and transfer to your sidearm, more of the barrel is covered and an exposed, hot barrel is less likely to burn your leg.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:55:30 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:56:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By mongo001:
A few reasons off the top of my head:

1. Longer sight radius with rail mounted BUIS.

2. Bipod out farther for a more stable platform.

3. Longer rails cover more of the barrel, so when you drop your rifle down on the sling and transfer to your sidearm, more of the barrel is covered and an exposed, hot barrel is less likely to burn your leg.




...and there you go.



Hey, I forgot one - it's the newest, coolest thing going right now.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 3:59:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/21/2005 4:00:14 PM EDT by Yojimbo]

Originally Posted By mongo001:
A few reasons off the top of my head:

1. Longer sight radius with rail mounted BUIS.

2. Bipod out farther for a more stable platform.

3. Longer rails cover more of the barrel, so when you drop your rifle down on the sling and transfer to your sidearm, more of the barrel is covered and an exposed, hot barrel is less likely to burn your leg.



+1 To all of the above!

Once you experience #3 above you'll agree that the full length rail really does help!
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 4:02:54 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 4:03:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mongo001:

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By mongo001:
A few reasons off the top of my head:

1. Longer sight radius with rail mounted BUIS.

2. Bipod out farther for a more stable platform.

3. Longer rails cover more of the barrel, so when you drop your rifle down on the sling and transfer to your sidearm, more of the barrel is covered and an exposed, hot barrel is less likely to burn your leg.


...and there you go.



Hey, I forgot one - it's the newest, coolest thing going right now.



If you are so inclined, think about the physics involved. Up to a point, the more forward you place a bipod, the more stable it will be. Cool has nothing to do with it.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 4:09:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By Yojimbo:
Once you experience #3 above you'll agree that the full length rail really does help!




Bah, wuss. Nothing wrong with having your knee branded "MP-C"



LOL

I must be a slow learner or a glutton for punishment because it still took several times before I learned my lesson.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 4:14:38 PM EDT
Covering more of the barrel would seem to keep more heat in.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 4:38:23 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 5:56:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 7:12:04 PM EDT
If I can add to mongo's list:

+1 Some shooters grasp the forward end of the tube and "point" with their left hand. Besides us "gamers", I know one DOE trainer who uses this technique.

+2 If you need to brace on something, having more tube length can be helpful.

Link Posted: 5/21/2005 7:35:03 PM EDT
It's been said, but it's important enough of a reason to say it again...

When I'm at the range, shooting for accuracy, I have to lean WAY in to get my mid-length DD forend to rest on the front rest. With a longer forend I wouldn't have to squeeze my "suddenly even with my chest, and fast approaching the lead" gut up against the table so much.

I don't think it looks cool, in fact, I think it looks goofy, but it's got a purpose.

I would also think that a Bushmaster Dissipator with "handguards" would keep the heat in, but a fancy DD or Larue forend SHOULD help pull some of that heat away from the barrel.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 7:45:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Zak-Smith:
If I can add to mongo's list:

+1 Some shooters grasp the forward end of the tube and "point" with their left hand. Besides us "gamers", I know one DOE trainer who uses this technique.




Probably not exactly what you meant, but close.
Our KevinB
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 7:46:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stryfe:

Originally Posted By Zak-Smith:
If I can add to mongo's list:

+1 Some shooters grasp the forward end of the tube and "point" with their left hand. Besides us "gamers", I know one DOE trainer who uses this technique.




Probably not exactly what you meant, but close.
Our KevinB
img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/EvilKev/RAVnStuff012.jpg



Yep, I thought of that pic when I read that comment.
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 8:32:18 PM EDT
Kinda.. but...

the left hand grasps the *end* of the tube, either from the bottom with the thumb pointing at the target (like in a "parallel thumb" pistol hold), or the thumb is more on top of the tube, the hand more on the side, and the first and second finger pulling back on the actual LHS of the tube's end.

Either way, the object is to control the rifle with more leverage, pull it in, and use kinesthetic awareness to help point the rifle.

-z
Link Posted: 5/21/2005 11:06:24 PM EDT
cause the market is full of doo-dads that have throwlevers

and without adequate railing you wont have a place to put it all.
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 4:48:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 6:50:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pcurtis:

If you are so inclined, think about the physics involved. Up to a point, the more forward you place a bipod, the more stable it will be. Cool has nothing to do with it.



True, the farther forward the less apparent motion caused by the shooter moving.

However, physics is a double edged sword here - the farther forward the bipod, the more torque is applied to the barrel nut, potentially shifting your POI up. One game-oriented AR builder I met recommended the bipod just ahead of the mag well for this reason.
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 10:15:00 AM EDT
My skunk gun isn't a "recce", but it is a 16" carbine with a rifle length forend. Like Mongo and others stated above I prefer it this way for:

-longer sight radius

-stable platform for Harris bipod

-more to hold onto (have you ever tried holding a carbine length forend with a bipod attached?)

Here's mine:
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 10:50:00 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 11:40:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By new-arguy:
I have not yet seen that one CJ!!! Nice!


Thanks Neil!

I have gotten some grief for bastardizing an innocent Colt AR6721, but so far I've been very happy with the outcome. This carbine is much handier for dispatching skunks than my former skunk rifle, a 13 pound when loaded Colt 6601 HBAR.
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 12:34:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By Yojimbo:
Once you experience #3 above you'll agree that the full length rail really does help!




Bah, wuss. Nothing wrong with having your knee branded "MP-C"



Could be worse

"Made by GiFFMAN"

or somesuch
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 7:31:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2005 7:33:11 PM EDT by PowershipMC]
+1 for all the reasons above. I just started building it last week so its not yet finished. This one has the LaRue 13.2 rail.



Link Posted: 5/22/2005 8:18:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PowershipMC:
+1 for all the reasons above. I just started building it last week so its not yet finished. This one has the LaRue 13.2 rail.

ronmoyer.com/ar15dotcom/rons_cqb_ar_2/DSC00066_rs.JPG

ronmoyer.com/ar15dotcom/rons_cqb_ar_2/DSC00068_rs.JPG



Someone buy that guy some carpet FAST!

Nice setup.
Link Posted: 5/22/2005 10:05:55 PM EDT
Well, it's a precision rifle that supposed to be used in a tactical setting. It's gotta be durable and failure resistant, Joe with Sniper School under his belt can still be Joe sometimes.

The more stuff you run around the outside of the barrel and gas system, the better off I'd feel about dragging it around or wedging it between the rafters of a building. Besdies, if you're gonna protect it, why not make it easier to hold onto?

Shooting from long distances means you have to be in a stable position for a long time somtimes, if you have more places to grab onto or rest your hands, the more comfortable and stable you can make your position.

That last part, now that translates into better overall operator performance. That means the better chance you have of making a hole in that thing.... that you wanted to make a hole in.

Link Posted: 5/23/2005 5:14:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2005 5:15:26 AM EDT by giffmann]
Link Posted: 5/23/2005 6:20:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Resq47:

Someone buy that guy some carpet FAST!

Nice setup.




If that was my carpet I would shoot myself. Thats just a red bath towel.
Link Posted: 5/23/2005 1:56:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/23/2005 1:58:13 PM EDT by Trey-W]

Originally Posted By Stryfe:

Originally Posted By Zak-Smith:
If I can add to mongo's list:

+1 Some shooters grasp the forward end of the tube and "point" with their left hand. Besides us "gamers", I know one DOE trainer who uses this technique.




Probably not exactly what you meant, but close.
Our KevinB
img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/EvilKev/RAVnStuff012.jpg



What length is that URX-II & barrel? Rifle Length or shorter? It looks shorter than normal
Link Posted: 5/23/2005 4:17:00 PM EDT
It is a rifle length cut at KAC to midlength (16" bbl) with some short ears.

With a BOTB can it makes the longer rail a no go.



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