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11/20/2019 5:07:11 PM
Posted: 10/23/2013 2:48:50 PM EST
I am considering a low powered variable scope. What is the best one as far as quality and illuminated reticle? I need this as an up in your face and out to 400 type of unit. I can get a 20-30% discount on leupold and trijicon so you can include ones that are aorund 1500 if they are that brand. Thanks!
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:05:12 PM EST
SWFA SS HD 1-6X FFP
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:06:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By eracer:
SWFA SS HD 1-6X FFP
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At $1000, likely this.

I'd personally opt to drop a few more bucks and go with the Vortex Razor HD Gen 2 1-6x though.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:14:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/23/2013 3:23:31 PM EST by Brutus2]
Leupold 1-6x24 VX-6 Multigun Riflescope ( http://swfa.com/Leupold-1-6x24-VX-6-Multigun-Riflescope-P57682.aspx)

At under $1000 to begin with and with all the great features, inherent quality plus Daybright illumination. This scope is going to be extremely hard to beat . Add on top of that the 30% discount ( about $800 out the door) you get as an LEO and I would venture to say it is an unbeatable deal.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:20:23 PM EST
Used Vortex Razor HD
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:28:18 PM EST
Those razors appear to be really heavy like 25oz or seething before a mount? Is this wrong?
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 3:33:15 PM EST
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Originally Posted By emtothedee:
Those razors appear to be really heavy like 25oz or seething before a mount? Is this wrong?
View Quote


They're heavy, but they're really nice.

I personally find the Razor HD Gen 2 superior to even the Leupold Mark 6.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 4:03:48 PM EST
Most cheaper variables are going to weigh a pound at least. You get a discount from Trijicon I'd use it; and get an accupoint 1-4x if you must have a variable. 0-400Y IMO I'd get a TA33 if you want some magnification and be done with it.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 4:32:55 PM EST
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Originally Posted By BB:
Most cheaper variables are going to weigh a pound at least. You get a discount from Trijicon I'd use it; and get an accupoint 1-4x if you must have a variable. 0-400Y IMO I'd get a TA33 if you want some magnification and be done with it.
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A $1400 optic is "cheaper?" The only optic mentioned in here to be heavy is the Vortex Razor HD Gen 2, and it's far from cheaper.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 4:48:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/23/2013 4:49:34 PM EST by JimboJones1]
I'm pretty sure that the Schmidt and Bender offerings are pretty heavy too...

23 oz... for a 1-8 short dot at $3600.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 4:50:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/23/2013 4:50:49 PM EST by Lancelot]
Topic Moved
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 5:08:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By JimboJones1:
I'm pretty sure that the Schmidt and Bender offerings are pretty heavy too...

23 oz... for a 1-8 short dot at $3600.
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Yeah thats true...I think the USO are that heavy as well. I'm spoiled by NF
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 6:13:13 PM EST
If I'm planning on running an offset micro (because I have one of those and only one rifle) is it still a good call on a variable or am I better off with an acog if I go that route? How are those tr24's? Mike from CS tactical said they were just eh
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 6:26:51 PM EST
I'd pass on the TR24. Look hard at the Leupold MK6. Its a damn nice optic and worth saving a bit for.

ACOG plus an MRDS is a good option. Its pricey for a fixed 4x, and frankly for longer ranges or accuracy work, I sort of prefer the 6x. It just makes it easier to see smaller targets. Acog should be lighter than a 1-6/1-4 and considering youre running an MRDS too, less weight is a good thing.

I run an swfa 1-6x and an offset mini red dot, but its rare that I use the red dot, since the 1-6 stays on 1x most of the time.
Link Posted: 10/23/2013 8:15:42 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/23/2013 8:16:16 PM EST by AR-Ryan21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chrome308:
I'd pass on the TR24. Look hard at the Leupold MK6. Its a damn nice optic and worth saving a bit for.

ACOG plus an MRDS is a good option. Its pricey for a fixed 4x, and frankly for longer ranges or accuracy work, I sort of prefer the 6x. It just makes it easier to see smaller targets. Acog should be lighter than a 1-6/1-4 and considering youre running an MRDS too, less weight is a good thing.

I run an swfa 1-6x and an offset mini red dot, but its rare that I use the red dot, since the 1-6 stays on 1x most of the time.
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I expected to fall in love with the Mark 6.

While it's an incredible optic, I compared it side by side with the Razor HD Gen 2, and found the Razor superior - to my surprise.

Frankly, if the Razor was a tad lighter, I think it'd be hands down in its own realm.
Link Posted: 10/24/2013 6:40:07 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/24/2013 6:45:44 AM EST by eracer]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By emtothedee:
Those razors appear to be really heavy like 25oz or seething before a mount? Is this wrong?
View Quote

I was a bit surprised at how heavy the SWFA 1-6X was. 22.4 oz.

If you get it, make sure you get the throw-lever, as the zoom ring is REALLY stiff, and doesn't have a terribly good gripping surface.

Note also that the Vortex has an MOA BDC reticle, whereas the SWFA has a mil-dot reticle with 0.5 mil hash marks.

Also, the Vortex has capped turrets, while the SWFA includes thread protectors, so you can use the turrets uncapped if you want.

Disclaimer - I do not work for SWFA...lol. And I know the Vortex is a fine optic. Different feature set.
Link Posted: 10/24/2013 7:30:00 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eracer:

If you get it, make sure you get the throw-lever, as the zoom ring is REALLY stiff, and doesn't have a terribly good gripping surface.

View Quote


Made a night and day difference with my swfa 1-6, great scope.
Link Posted: 10/24/2013 7:38:42 AM EST
if i run a red dot offset, am i better off with more of a 3-9 or 3-10 type primary or is running a 1-4 or 1-6 still a good option if i wanna run an offset red dot. I basically want magnification but dont want to give up anything in close quarters...any ideas?
Link Posted: 10/24/2013 12:10:28 PM EST
A Vortex 2.5-10x32 with an offset red dot would be a /very/ nice spr setup.

Agreed on the cat-tail on the swfa 1-6x.
Link Posted: 10/24/2013 8:40:26 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chrome308:
A Vortex 2.5-10x32 with an offset red dot would be a /very/ nice spr setup.

Agreed on the cat-tail on the swfa 1-6x.
View Quote


This. If you're gonna offset a red dot, step up to a 10x.

The Vortex PST 2.5-10x FFP is a badass optic as well.
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 2:03:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/25/2013 2:26:24 AM EST by dcnyli]
i have one of the 2.5-10x32 pst's on its way to me. both my SWFA 1-6&soon to arrive Vortex will be in the identical Bobro Mounts... I will try and do some side by side comparison on the same rifle
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 9:48:01 AM EST
do things like eye relief on your primary optic become less of a big deal when you add a red dot as a backup? I am considering the ta31 acog option with my red dot in an offset, and knowing that the eye relief sucks, i feel as though it wouldn't be as big a deal with a red dot on there as well. You also would get instant magnification adjustments ya? What part of that setup would make it a no go?
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 10:57:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/25/2013 10:58:33 AM EST by ShiftSix]
idk, I think for weight and quality youd have a hard time beating this for the price.

http://www.opticsplanet.com/trijicon-accupoint-3-9x40-rifle-scope-tr20.html

depending on what you call low power, its an illuminated 3x-9x zoom, under $800 bucks, and 12.8 oz

Plus you already get a Trijicon discount
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 11:53:29 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eracer:
SWFA SS HD 1-6X FFP
View Quote


Nailed it
Link Posted: 10/25/2013 3:30:11 PM EST
IIRC the close eye relief on that model does get you a wider field of view. Wider in fact than the 3.5x TA11. Amazingly wide for a 4x optic.

Close isnt really all that bad of a thing, and a close eye relief doesnt necessarily mean the entire eyebox is narrow or difficult. Now, if you're shooting a heavy recoiling gun.... or if you like to have your stock fully extended then the eye relief may be an issue. Having a red dot or not doesnt change much about the suitability of the eye relief for the scope, which is your primary (and most expensive) optic.

Link Posted: 10/26/2013 12:14:23 PM EST
just put the vortex on my ar and sighted it in, very crisp adjustments, about 3-4oz lighter then my SWFA 1-6(both in same mount), I like it alot so far.

The illumination isn't as bright as the SWFA, but it doesn't create a "red ring" at the highest setting either, granted it's a different animal.

going to do a 100&200yd side by side this week...
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 1:05:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Chrome308:
I'd pass on the TR24.
View Quote

Why's that? Played with a buddy's yesterday, and loved it.
He was with Marine SOC in the 'Stan and does 3 Gun and thinks it is the best thing he has used (though he never used a S&B Short Dot . . ..)
Link Posted: 10/26/2013 10:18:05 PM EST
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Originally Posted By dcnyli:
just put the vortex on my ar and sighted it in, very crisp adjustments, about 3-4oz lighter then my SWFA 1-6(both in same mount), I like it alot so far.

The illumination isn't as bright as the SWFA, but it doesn't create a "red ring" at the highest setting either, granted it's a different animal.

going to do a 100&200yd side by side this week...
View Quote


It's crazy how light the Vortex PSTs are...and of course the quality and features you get for the price.

Back to weight, my PST 6-24x FFP is under 1.5 pounds. Crazy light for a quality high magnification optic.
Link Posted: 10/27/2013 9:09:19 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AR-Ryan21:


This. If you're gonna offset a red dot, step up to a 10x.

The Vortex PST 2.5-10x FFP is a badass optic as well.
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Originally Posted By AR-Ryan21:
Originally Posted By Chrome308:
A Vortex 2.5-10x32 with an offset red dot would be a /very/ nice spr setup.

Agreed on the cat-tail on the swfa 1-6x.


This. If you're gonna offset a red dot, step up to a 10x.

The Vortex PST 2.5-10x FFP is a badass optic as well.


I'm running a Mark 6 1-6x with a T1 on a Larue LT724 offset mount. What makes the Larue offset mount really nice is that it maintains the height over bore as your primary optic. At least it's the same as the LT104 mount. What this does is that it allows the shooter to maintain the same cheek weld when transitioning to the offset optic. There's no need to adjust your head to see the red dot. As you rotate the rifle from the primary optics to the RDS, the red dot literally appears to just replace the reticle of the main optic without any movement of your head. It is a very quick and efficient transition. I can't speak to the other offset mounts offered, but this is something to consider when running an offset RDS. However, the draw back to this set up is that you need to have low profile knobs on your main optic. The Mark 6 knobs are about the tallest you'll want with the Larue offset mount. It just barely obscures a small portion of the T1 window. Any bigger and there would be too much obstruction of view. I don't know how tall the knobs are on the PST 2.5-10x or the Nightforce 2.5-10x, but they definitely look a lot taller than the Mark 6 knobs. Also, the larue offset mount is not a 45* offset. I don't know exactly how offset it is, but I'd guess it's more along the lines of a 30* offset. What's nice about this is that you need less of a can't to acquire a sight picture with the Larue mount. I couldn't tell you if a true 45* offset would clear the taller knobs of the Vortex or Nightforce knobs.

Anyway, since this topic came up, I thought I'd throw out some considerations when running a magnified scope with an offset RDS.

While I've never had the opportunity to try the Vortex Razor 1-6x, if it's truly "better" than the Mark 6, then it's got to be one hell of a scope because the Mark 6 is very nice. The one thing I hated about some of the scopes I did try was that at 1x there was an obnoxious black ring around your field of view. With the Mark 6, you hardly see any of this black ring. All you notice is the actual thickness of the ocular. Also, I don't think there is a lighter 1-6x or 1-8x scope on the market right now. The Mark 6 is listed at 17 oz while the Vortex is listed at 25.2 oz. I'm not usually into counting grams or ounces, but this did have an influence in my decision since I knew I was going to run a dual optic set up. My first time out with the Mark 6, I shot it in the late afternoon and into the evening. So I was able to shoot it through dusk and in to the night. The range used some flood lights on top of the overhang above the firing line to light up the targets. The clarity in the lower light was amazing. I was still able to see my 200 yard zero target very easily. In fact, the light transmission was so good, it almost appeared to be brighter when looking through the scope. Also, the illumination is, without a doubt, daylight visible. During the middle of the day, with the sun shining directly on the white doors of my outside shed, I could still see the lit reticle. Like I said, I never had the opportunity to try the Vortex, but the Mark 6 is a superb scope. If it's as good as others have claimed, then it would probably come down to budget and weight.
Link Posted: 10/27/2013 9:58:00 AM EST
The issue with the Vortex Razor HD is that is it a gun gamer scope only. The lack of ranging abilities in the reticle is a no go for serious users. The excess weight is also a downside. The swfa 1-6 is problematic at best.

Save a little while longer. With Leupold MK6 1-6x now going for $1599 as well as the Nightforce 1-4x at around $1300, it wouldn't take long to save up for a quality optic that can take abuse.
Link Posted: 10/27/2013 10:22:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/27/2013 3:16:26 PM EST by dcnyli]
just back from the range, put the 1-6 SWFA against the 2.5-10 MRAD PST, here's what I observed

1. they are both solidly made, SWFA is 3OZ heavier
2. the reticle in the Vortex was more delicate but still easy to pick up and see, at 10X its quite a bit thinner then the SWFA at 6X
3. with both at 6X, I shot pretty similar groupings, the wind was 15mpg cross range which was interesting.
4. the central point on the SWFA is heavier then the Vortex, I did not like this since it took up too much space in my view. Yes it's small but it's what I saw
5. the eye relief on the SWFA was better and more consistent, the Vortex I had to move around a little bit but nothing I could not get used to

I removed and remounted them both a few times, they both held zero (love bobro mounts, sold on them now 100%), but was only able to work at 100yds, the 200yd line was full and the only benches open were next to the dudes with the .50cals and no thanks.... The SWFA was less ideal for my eyes, but quicker due to the 1X option(previous sessions as 25/50yd), I am pretty blind and the 2.5X is a benefit for me.

I am going to try out the Vortex @ 200yds this week, but so far the Vortex is winning.... I did not use any illumination today, sun was out and it was amazing weather, aside from the cross wind. I left early because some turd a few benches down was showering me with hot shells from his AK47....
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