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Posted: 8/12/2004 10:07:19 PM EST
I was watching a show about bullets (remedial but okay) and they said something about not being able to use something you could shoot quickly and accurately like a .22 for police work or something. Anywho, I was thinking couldn't you make a .22 frangible that had a very quick acting poison like cyanide, I'm sure there's more lethal, as a compound? Even a minor wound would cause death.
I know lawsuits, just wanting to disable, blah blah reasons are out there. But isn't it a sound idea?
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 2:34:00 AM EST
NO!
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 6:54:13 AM EST
I dip my carry ammo in Holy Water in hopes that the threat will find a righteous path as the bullets enter his body.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 6:57:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/13/2004 6:57:24 AM EST by wedge1082]
Just get a blow gun already.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:00:53 AM EST
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:01:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Yep. It means you were shooting to kill, and not to "Stop the Threat"
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 7:45:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Can you site just even one case where a legitimate self-defense shooting that ended with the death of the assailant with a poison bullet resulted in a first-degree murder conviction for the shooter?

Your statement is completely untrue.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 8:19:30 AM EST
dip em in pig blood
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 8:32:36 AM EST
Don't Marines use pig fat so Shiites don't make it to heaven?
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 8:25:54 PM EST
Poisoned bullets?
Sounds like it's for Black ops guys - probably been done. I sure would like to read about it.
Link Posted: 8/13/2004 8:30:02 PM EST
Poison bullets are impractical. There is no sure way to ensure the poison survives firing or gets distributed upon impact.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 7:14:32 PM EST
The average oral lethal dose of potassium cyanide is around 50 mg (milligrams). Even if the bullet with a 'core' of poison expands and deposits the poison in a vascular tissue such as muscle, it will take several minutes or longer to absorb the poison and incapacitate your attacker. This is plenty of time for an assailant to shoot/stab you. Other poisons would actually take even longer to act ie. ricin which usually takes 24-48 hrs to kill you. You could use neuromuscular blocking drugs that paralyze and cause death by suffocation, but this would still take several minutes or longer to absorb. When you watch those curare-tipped poison arrows hit a monkey, the tapes are edited to make it look like the monkey falls down within a few seconds when in reality it takes several minutes. Curare-type drugs that are used in medicine do cause paralysis within seconds (?5-20) but these are injected intravenously and not 'shot' into a muscle.

Impractical idea unless your goal is to make sure the person dies but your time-frame is flexible. I'll stick with fragmenting 5.56 or 4th generation JHP .45/9mm.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 9:18:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By kensteele:

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Can you site just even one case where a legitimate self-defense shooting that ended with the death of the assailant with a poison bullet resulted in a first-degree murder conviction for the shooter?

Your statement is completely untrue.



Do you want to be the first person to be indicted and convicted for such action so we can read about it in law school's textbooks?
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:03:29 PM EST
Hmm.. maybe "lead poisoning"???
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 1:32:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By second:

Originally Posted By kensteele:

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Can you site just even one case where a legitimate self-defense shooting that ended with the death of the assailant with a poison bullet resulted in a first-degree murder conviction for the shooter?

Your statement is completely untrue.



Do you want to be the first person to be indicted and convicted for such action so we can read about it in law school's textbooks?



Since there are no such laws on the books right now, they won't be making up one just for me. Maybe after it happens the first time, somebody might decide it's a big enough threat that yet another law needs to be written.....well, never mind, ain't gonna happen.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 2:08:19 PM EST
No sense in poisining a conventional round. They have plenty of power to kill on their own. Where poising becomes effective is with darts or piercing weapons. You could hollow out a BB and fill it with Ricin and have someone come down dead in a few days. That is if the BB managed to puncture the clothing and skin.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 6:27:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 6:28:55 PM EST by Tortfeasor]

Originally Posted By kensteele:

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Can you site just even one case where a legitimate self-defense shooting that ended with the death of the assailant with a poison bullet resulted in a first-degree murder conviction for the shooter?

Your statement is completely untrue.



You are welcome to be the first. How would you like to see your name in State versus Kensteele? You have no idea how our criminal justice system works - my guess is you are in high school, so I won't be too harsh. I will say the jail is FULL of people just like you that thought their act was not illegal, or they would not be prosecuted, or if they were, a jury would not convict...
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 6:30:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By kensteele:

Originally Posted By twl:
Putting poison on a bullet is considered "premeditated murder" and will get you a Murder 1 conviction, even in a self-defense case.



Can you site just even one case where a legitimate self-defense shooting that ended with the death of the assailant with a poison bullet resulted in a first-degree murder conviction for the shooter?

Your statement is completely untrue.



By the way, I base my opinion on cases where the type of bullet (hydra shok) was argued by prosecutor to show pre meditation....I always carry FMJ Ball for that reason.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:15:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 8:17:28 PM EST by kensteele]
I graduated from college in 1987. You guess wrong. Again you are wrong. Maybe you are the young person.

I know the law. You obviously do not. Since you don't understand what the conditions are for a self-defense shooting. And since you don't even know the defintion of first-degree premeditated felony murder. Forget about this State vs Kensteele being the first. I could be the first to laugh someone to death, that doesn't make it illegal. Kensteele only uses legal bullets and kensteele only shoots in self-defense. Kensteele follows the laws as they are written in the statute. Therefore it is [technically] impossible for kensteele to be charged with capital murder....ever.

The type of bullet you use is no more relevant than the type of firearm you use when you kill in self-defense. If you kill an intruder in self-defense and the killing is justified, it doesn't matter how you kill him; the laws says you can use deadly force, which means dead by a knife, a baseball bat, an old japanese sword, a vase, a flashlight, hot water, a 2x4, your mini-van, hydrashock bullets, poison bullet, guard dog...anything that is legal. What part of that don't you understand? If a poison bullet is illegal, then you are guilty of using a poison bullet. I didn't find that in my state laws.

I'm not going to argue this one with you. Show me the [similar] case or provide a reference. If you can't, it is just your opinion....and a bad one. I suggest you drop it.

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