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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - POF Rifle quality (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 10/22/2013 5:09:59 AM EDT
| Thinking of picking up two POF rifles upon return from a deployment. Thoughts on fit and finish, quality and price? Anyone happy with them? Would you do it again? |
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I have three Noveske's and love them! I thought about the KAC but the cost made me reconsider... I would love to get a LaRue but aren't there wait times a year out +?? As of now, yes. But, they are starting to get rifle's out the door with their new barrels and the ball is rolling, so in a year... who knows? It could be a wait time of 2 months. 
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| I'd also recommend the Colt LE6940P. Just purchased one myself and did a lot of research on it before "pulling the trigger" and they appear to be quality rifles with above average fit and finish. Having said that, I'm still in the 10day waiting period, so no personal experience with it yet. But didn't come across anything negative about the Colt (and a lot of positive comments) during my 9 mos research and visited at least 15 different dealers and several forums...(with the exception that they are hard to find, typically snapped up as soon as they hit the market). Also keep in mind that the Piston vs DI debate is still going strong, so you have to separate the negative BS spread by haters and listen to folks who actually own a piston system. |
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Good rifles with quality parts, however, they are heavy, very over priced, and POF is notorious for terrible customer service. I would skip this brand and grab a KAC, Noveske, LaRue, BCM, or even a LWRC if you are dead set on a piston system. ^ Nailed it......I love my Larue's!! 
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Ever think about some of the Ruger offerings? Their ARs are decently priced and are of great quality from what I see on my SR556E. They even make a 308 version now, the SR762. They're fairly heavy but it's a rock solid system. Good write up on it here. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/625493_WOW___Ruger_Enters_the_AR10_Market___PICS_Added_to_Page_Three_.html |
| I personally like the "aesthetic" appeal to POF's. However I say this with regards to their earlier guns that had the older style rails. Not so much a fan of the newer style rails (samething just different cutout pattern). As for their Customer Support I have delt with Cody over there in which he provided me with SUPERB AWESOME Customer Support. I think at one point in time their Customer Support was not all that but improved over the years. Personally I have nothing but good to say about them. I can also say the same for LWRC as I have a few of their A2 line and love them as well and their Customer Support is also Superb, too. |
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Good rifles with quality parts, however, they are heavy, very over priced, and POF is notorious for terrible customer service. I would skip this brand and grab a KAC, Noveske, LaRue, BCM, or even a LWRC if you are dead set on a piston system. LMT if you are set on a piston. |
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Personally I’d take both positive and negative comments without any corroborating stories of ownership or at least hands on experience with a grain of salt.
POF was in the last issue of Recoil magazine. Check it out. I have an attractive two year old 415-7 however my op rod did break this past weekend and wedged itself in tight to the bolt carrier. I called POF 4 minutes after they opened Monday morning and immediately got the operator who patched me right through to the shop. Without hesitation he said they would call UPS for a pickup and the next morning it was off, free of charge. The only way customer service could be better is if they sent me a loaner. I still have to get it back within two weeks to give them an A+ rating so I’ll keep you posted. http://i432.photobucket.com/albums/qq43/jbarchitect68/13_8_8_zps50e5ae84.jpg |
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Personally I’d take both positive and negative comments without any corroborating stories of ownership or at least hands on experience with a grain of salt. POF was in the last issue of Recoil magazine. Check it out. I have an attractive two year old 415-7 however my op rod did break this past weekend and wedged itself in tight to the bolt carrier. I called POF 4 minutes after they opened Monday morning and immediately got the operator who patched me right through to the shop. Without hesitation he said they would call UPS for a pickup and the next morning it was off, free of charge. The only way customer service could be better is if they sent me a loaner. I still have to get it back within two weeks to give them an A+ rating so I’ll keep you posted. <a href="http://s432.photobucket.com/user/jbarchitect68/media/13_8_8_zps50e5ae84.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i432.photobucket.com/albums/qq43/jbarchitect68/13_8_8_zps50e5ae84.jpg</a> Please let me know what the final verdict is. Nice boom stick you got there by the way! 
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I've owned a POF. The biggest issues are the rail height and forearm thickness. Unless you want a jaw weld, you'll need extra low BUIS and optics mounts. If you want a co-witness setup, it can be a challenge to find low enough mounts to get everything lined up like a normal rail. LMT, LWRC, PWS, and Colt don't have any rail height or forearm thickness issues. The only other way to address the POF rail height issue is to get a stock with a cheek weld adjustment. This will limit your stock selection and increase your overall cost on an already pricey rifle.
My take on it is if I'm going to spend 2K or more on a gun, I don't want to shell out even more on special stocks, sights or mounts to address a design flaw with the rail height. The aforementioned manufactures are all approx the same price as POF and all have normal rails out of the box. |
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I haven’t had that problem. I have YHM buis and a RMR on a high block riser and my cheek is flat on stock. Did you have this problem with the old vltor stock? No, this was using a standard collapsible carbine stock on a non POF lower. The POF rail adds about 9/16ths of an inch to the standard rail height. I had standard height Troy BUIS on mine and just adjusted my head higher on the stock to compensate. |
| I am looking to get a POF also. I was at Cabales today looking at some. They only had the 14 inch version. I am looking for the 16 inch. One thing I noticed is the two receivers did not have a tight fit. It may not affect anything but for a gun that costs that much I kinda expect it to have a tight fit. Is that normal for all POF's or was the one I looked at an exception. |
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One thing I noticed is the two receivers did not have a tight fit. It may not affect anything but for a gun that costs that much I kinda expect it to have a tight fit. Is that normal for all POF's or was the one I looked at an exception. I don't think it was an exception. My 14.5" P-415 isn't tight but the fit is comparable to my Colt 6940. Has no affect on the accuracy... it's a laser. From what I've read on various forums the ones that are tight are the exceptions. |
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I have nothing but good things to say about POF. They have been reliable and good shooters.
The height above bore has not been an issue for me I have several. 9.25", 18" and 20" p-308. They are reliable and shoot well. The customer service has been great for me. 
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I've had two POF AR's. My first one was a 16" POF P308. I had some extractor issues that I got sorted out after a trip back to the factory. It was easily a sub MOA rifle at 100m. I wasn't a fan of the weight while trying to run in it in a heavy carbine course but most 308/762 carbines are 8.5lbs so not much can be done about that. I ended up selling it for a massive profit during the madness last year, wish I had hung on to it.
Now I have a P415 14.5" and I absolutely love it. A lot of people complain about the size of the forend and height of the rail but it doesn't bother me at all and I have average size hands. I considered the LWRC offerings as well but I didn't like their use of springs in the piston system or the fact that you have to remove the top of the forend rail in order to access it. Their fit and finish is about the same as POF and they do have amazingly small rails. POF uses arguably the best barrels in a piston AR, the billet lowers are very nice, the Timney-like triggers are outstanding. I think their bad CS is behind them now the problem no longer works there and the QC issues were years ago and are no longer relevant. I have ordered a few misc. parts from them for use in other builds and they have been nothing but helpful and quick to get the items out. Central Florida Gun and Tactical and AV Guns (also in Florida) both stock POF rifles and have outstanding prices. I'd recommend looking there before buying locally. OP, I am not sure what part of Texas you are in but if you are in the Dallas area you are more than welcome to shoot mine. I find myself in Central South Texas during the holidays, we have 5000+ acres down there so that's another option if you live south. Good luck with your decision and be safe. |
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Good rifles with quality parts, however, they are heavy, very over priced, and POF is notorious for terrible customer service. I would skip this brand and grab a KAC, Noveske, LaRue, BCM, or even a LWRC if you are dead set on a piston system. What he said. If your gonna spend that kind of coin, get an LWRC IC and call it a day. You will spend just a hair less and get a better quality rifle that weighs a LOT less. OR, just build a couple of lowers cheaply and buy a couple of AA uppers and then use the extra money that you saved on ammo. |
| All of the piston guns I've held and used was heavy. Pretty much all of them are or at least most of them as thats this common nature with a piston setup. I maybe wrong but I believe currently the most smallest and lightest piston gun on the market at the moment would have to be the LWRC IC. Very small diamter rail and light weight for a piston gun. I personally don't do any kind of courses, classes, or anything else along those lines but if you do then I can see where size and weight could be of a concern but other than they all of the mentioned brands would give you something nice to play with. |
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Damnit SC Texas! I knew I got into the wrong line of work. You have a lot of toys.. I need to call you for some advice as I'm gonna get me a can or three.
OP, bottom line, POF / Hogan platform is rock solid. It will drive tacks and is one of the most accurate if not the most accurate 223/5.56 platform of AR I have ever shot. That being said, it's expensive and heavy. If I was to do it all over again, I would have gotten the LWRC IC as it's light as hell. OR the Adams Arms EVO Light. The LWRC is a tad cheaper and the AA is a lot cheaper. All the aforementioned companies have their pluses and minuses, as AA sucks at returning e-mails. They make a great product and will stand by their products though. It's all in how much you want to dish out. I have owned the LWRC M6A2 and it was beautiful, but heavy. If your gonna be carrying this thing varmint hunting over long distance of having to hump this thing at all, your not gonna be happy. I had a Hogan for a patrol rifle. For argument's sake, the Hogan and the POF are born of the same platform and are pretty much the same. I had to hump that thing all day in a rifle class and was NOT a happy camper. Have you thought of the SCAR 16? The SCAR is my favorite platform. It's light, reliable, and lefty friendly. |
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My only AR is a pof p415, but I've shot a few.
I've got the 16" and it's a real tack driver I was shooting Pdogs today @ ~200-220yds using federal premium gold medal match 77gr SMK BTHP My rifle loves this ammo. For plinking the 62gr wolf works well. Funny story when I zeroed it my dad was of the mind that it should be zeroed at 25yds which would equate to a zero at 100yds which I later found out wasn't exactly right and I rezeroed at 50yds, but the first three shots off bags at 25yds WENT THROUGH THE SAME HOLE. It looked like 1 shot. We walked out to the target and my dad scratched his head and was like... "dang that thing groups tight". That was with a Zeiss Conquest Diavari 3-12x56, which I later took off, the objective was too large to get a height over bore I was happy with. Now I use a Nikon p223 3-9x40 BDC on a lower mount. Definitely not the Zeiss but a SUPERB scope for the money and the 40mm objective is perfect. The POF has the same rail height as the HK AR. If you want to use Irons, run low profiles. The height over bore isn't an issue, simply compensate by using a lower scope mount/rings. You'll end up with an optic that has same height over bore as a regular AR. 
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My only AR is a pof p415, but I've shot a few. I've got the 16" and it's a real tack driver I was shooting Pdogs today @ ~200-220yds using federal premium gold medal match 77gr SMK BTHP My rifle loves this ammo. For plinking the 62gr wolf works well. Funny story when I zeroed it my dad was of the mind that it should be zeroed at 25yds which would equate to a zero at 100yds which I later found out wasn't exactly right and I rezeroed at 50yds, but the first three shots off bags at 25yds WENT THROUGH THE SAME HOLE. It looked like 1 shot. We walked out to the target and my dad scratched his head and was like... "dang that thing groups tight". That was with a Zeiss Conquest Diavari 3-12x56, which I later took off, the objective was too large to get a height over bore I was happy with. Now I use a Nikon p223 3-9x40 BDC on a lower mount. Definitely not the Zeiss but a SUPERB scope for the money and the 40mm objective is perfect. The POF has the same rail height as the HK AR. If you want to use Irons, run low profiles. The height over bore isn't an issue, simply compensate by using a lower scope mount/rings. You'll end up with an optic that has same height over bore as a regular AR. <a href="http://imgur.com/nTi1pcU" target="_blank">http://i.imgur.com/nTi1pcU.jpg</a> Did your gun come with the new modular rail where you can remove some of the rail to make it lower. |
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Did your gun come with the new modular rail where you can remove some of the rail to make it lower. Quoted:
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My only AR is a pof p415, but I've shot a few. I've got the 16" and it's a real tack driver I was shooting Pdogs today @ ~200-220yds using federal premium gold medal match 77gr SMK BTHP My rifle loves this ammo. For plinking the 62gr wolf works well. Funny story when I zeroed it my dad was of the mind that it should be zeroed at 25yds which would equate to a zero at 100yds which I later found out wasn't exactly right and I rezeroed at 50yds, but the first three shots off bags at 25yds WENT THROUGH THE SAME HOLE. It looked like 1 shot. We walked out to the target and my dad scratched his head and was like... "dang that thing groups tight". That was with a Zeiss Conquest Diavari 3-12x56, which I later took off, the objective was too large to get a height over bore I was happy with. Now I use a Nikon p223 3-9x40 BDC on a lower mount. Definitely not the Zeiss but a SUPERB scope for the money and the 40mm objective is perfect. The POF has the same rail height as the HK AR. If you want to use Irons, run low profiles. The height over bore isn't an issue, simply compensate by using a lower scope mount/rings. You'll end up with an optic that has same height over bore as a regular AR. Did your gun come with the new modular rail where you can remove some of the rail to make it lower. I think you're confused as to how their new modular rail works. Take a closer look. |
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I think you're confused as to how their new modular rail works. Take a closer look. Quoted:
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Did your gun come with the new modular rail where you can remove some of the rail to make it lower. I think you're confused as to how their new modular rail works. Take a closer look. I was wondering this myself. |
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Good rifles with quality parts, however, they are heavy, very over priced, and POF is notorious for terrible customer service. I would skip this brand and grab a KAC, Noveske, LaRue, BCM, or even a LWRC if you are dead set on a piston system. Very over priced? A DD or BCM will run you $1400-$1600, a POF can be had at Rainierarms for $1870. |
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I've owned a POF. The biggest issues are the rail height and forearm thickness. Unless you want a jaw weld, you'll need extra low BUIS and optics mounts. If you want a co-witness setup, it can be a challenge to find low enough mounts to get everything lined up like a normal rail. LMT, LWRC, PWS, and Colt don't have any rail height or forearm thickness issues. The only other way to address the POF rail height issue is to get a stock with a cheek weld adjustment. This will limit your stock selection and increase your overall cost on an already pricey rifle. My take on it is if I'm going to spend 2K or more on a gun, I don't want to shell out even more on special stocks, sights or mounts to address a design flaw with the rail height. The aforementioned manufactures are all approx the same price as POF and all have normal rails out of the box. I have the same issue. The thing just sits in the safe because I hate the jaw weld. At 9.5" I'm not going to put a scope on it so going to low rings isn't really an option. I want to run an EOTec, like most of my other SBRs, but it just doesn't work for me. |
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I have the same issue. The thing just sits in the safe because I hate the jaw weld. At 9.5" I'm not going to put a scope on it so going to low rings isn't really an option. I want to run an EOTec, like most of my other SBRs, but it just doesn't work for me. Quoted:
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I've owned a POF. The biggest issues are the rail height and forearm thickness. Unless you want a jaw weld, you'll need extra low BUIS and optics mounts. If you want a co-witness setup, it can be a challenge to find low enough mounts to get everything lined up like a normal rail. LMT, LWRC, PWS, and Colt don't have any rail height or forearm thickness issues. The only other way to address the POF rail height issue is to get a stock with a cheek weld adjustment. This will limit your stock selection and increase your overall cost on an already pricey rifle. My take on it is if I'm going to spend 2K or more on a gun, I don't want to shell out even more on special stocks, sights or mounts to address a design flaw with the rail height. The aforementioned manufactures are all approx the same price as POF and all have normal rails out of the box. I have the same issue. The thing just sits in the safe because I hate the jaw weld. At 9.5" I'm not going to put a scope on it so going to low rings isn't really an option. I want to run an EOTec, like most of my other SBRs, but it just doesn't work for me. A Magpul CTR, considered one of the best and lightest weight stocks on the market, can be had for $70-85 depending on where you buy it. Then you can buy the Tacitcal RISR from LaRue for $135 and you have the perfect cheek weld for any higher rail height AR, that's the same price as an ugly LMT/Crane SOPMOD. There's always a solution for every problem, the rail height might be a detractor for some but the Timney trigger, Rock Creek barrel, ambi controls, fit/finish, NiB coating on the BCG, roller cam pin, and 0.5MOA accuracy are huge pluses that many other AR's can only dream of having from the factory. If accuracy, reliability, quality, and a ridiculously clean rifle at 500+ rounds are important to you then a POF is almost impossible to beat. |
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Ive had a 415 with a 14.5 inch barrel for several years now. I only have one real negative comment about it that ill get to In a moment. I use this rifle as a duty rifle for patrol and swat call outs. Ive shot thousands of rounds through it using all types of ammunition and have yet to have a single failure. Not one single failure using anything from steel case wolf, to milsurp, to match and anything in between. Other operators hate shooting next to it because the brake on it blows a lot to the people shooting to your left and right. However, this also allows the rifle to remain right on target. The trigger from the factory on mine was a geissele unit which breaks at about 4lbs. Love the trigger on it. If you want a rifle that you literally have to do nothing to except add your buis or optic than this is your rifle.
Now for the negative on this rifle. It is front heavy. The tactical rail that I have has plenty of realestate but adds to the heft and bulk. This became more of an issue when it was mandated that the rifles be secured in a vise looking hook within our patrol cars. The tac rail does not fit these clamping devices. Ive been in talks with POF about selling me just the new modular rail and they've said it will be available soon. This will cut down on the weight and the bulk but still allow for rails to be placed where needed. Some people talked about the customer service of POF with seemingly little personal experience to back up their thoughts. Heres mine: On a training week to camp Grayling two years ago I noticed that the little c-clamp that holds the dust cover pin in place fell off. It didn't cause any issues but I called up POF while I was there. I think it was a Tuesday. Thursday I called home and learned the part was waiting for me. POF had next day aired the part at no cost and without asking. Either the year before or the year after I was again at camp grayling and noticed the set screw the secures the ambi safety in place back out and was forever lost in the dirt. Called up POF customer service again and yet again the part was next day aired to my house. These are the only two parts "failures" I can speak of but both times was completely taken care of. 
The team added the 308 you see above and the first outing at 100 yards using 168gr hornady tap put up some pretty impressive 5 shot groups that were running about 1/2": 
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Love my POF P308 14.5" Its a laser. Customer service has been great. I have dealt directly with Cody and John and they have been great. Even sent me the correct spring and buffer for my UBR as they said they wanted the gun to run issue free.
I wouldn't trade my POF for any other gun. Best group so far at 100 yds is 0.52" with FGMM 168gr. As outfitted below gun weighs 10.6# http://i580.photobucket.com/albums/ss250/q9650/POFP308UBR1_zps50df3eec.jpg |
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This is a photo of my original 9.25" upper BCG, piston, op rod and gas plug.. It has around 10k-15k rounds through it. I still wipe the gunk off the parts.
Notice the peening around the edge of the piston? Still runs 100% 
The POF system has worked well for me. |
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I have a 308 and a 223 POF. Neither one has ever given me anything but 100% reliable service. either one feeds anything and while the 223 is a 7.5", its still plenty accurate out to a couple hundred yards. The 308 is a solid 1 MOA rifle. consistant with BH or FGMM out to 400 yards or better. (havent had much of a chance to go further)
Any piston rifle is going to be heavy when compared to a gas gun. I own LWRC's as well and they are the same weight and balance as my POF rifles. POF is top quality and reliability. Not as expensive as some others, but also not as cheap as some others. I think its a good price point for the rifle you get. I would not hesitate to buy another POF in 223 or 308. |
| I am planning on buying a POF model P415 16.5 inch barrel model number 00405. I have read the specs on the web site and did not see what the rifling was. IE 1/7 1/8 1/9. Does anyone know what it is? Also I have shopped at a few places and got an idea of prices. What is everyones opinion of a good price. I know that MSRP is 2319.99. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - POF Rifle quality (Page 1 of 2)
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