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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/16/2005 12:20:50 PM EDT
other than about $200?
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 2:04:14 PM EDT
do a little reading here

the dealers here have better pricing and its barely more in cost, maybe $50-60



Link Posted: 8/16/2005 2:34:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 2:35:17 PM EDT by KnobCreek]
Assuming you mean a difference between the ARMS SIR and any other rail system, the answer is yes there is a difference. However, how functional the difference makes is questionable. I have an ARMS SIR, Daniel Defense 12, Knights RAS, PRI Carbon Rifle and Yankee Hill Machine light rails systems on various uppers. The PRI is functionally the most unique. The YHM works just as well as the others for mounting optics and or a fore-end rail, and it's about half the price.

Now, these comments do not include my view on the conversational "cool factor" or appearance preferences. Those are all yours to decide.

Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 5:35:13 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 6:04:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Troy:
Portions of many ARMS rails lack the required number of cross-slots, and some don't have the required "neck" height to meet Mil-Std 1913 specs. These deviations were intentional by ARMS, and in some cases are forced by the design in question (the side and bottom SIR rails, for example).

-Troy



Interesting. Good stuff
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 9:09:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Troy:
Portions of many ARMS rails lack the required number of cross-slots, and some don't have the required "neck" height to meet Mil-Std 1913 specs. These deviations were intentional by ARMS, and in some cases are forced by the design in question (the side and bottom SIR rails, for example).

-Troy



As stated, the Arms rails and also Yankee Hill (tho i've read they "fixed" it) are not Mil-Std. or mil spec. This is something that you should take into consideration because some accessories / vertical grips, like the Knights and Tango Down, will not fit properly (unless you do a little shaving and / or a lot of pounding).
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 9:15:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eye_spy:
As stated, the Arms rails and also Yankee Hill (tho i've read they "fixed" it) are not Mil-Std. or mil spec. This is something that you should take into consideration because some accessories / vertical grips, like the Knights and Tango Down, will not fit properly (unless you do a little shaving and / or a lot of pounding).



Since when do KAC ("Knights") vertical grips not fit SIR rails without "a little shaving and / or a lot of pounding"?


Chris
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 9:57:13 PM EDT
However you may view The SIR, The Folks at A.R.M.S. sell a BUNCH of them to the Military. They are rigid and repeatable.. Most all accessories work. Many accessories are designed to fit the S.I.R. due to its military use. I personally like mine. Its a 18" midlength 6.8 with a PRI barrel and an A.R.M.S. 58M. The scope is a Cabela's Alaskan guide 30MM 4-12 x 52. Camoflage by Kat-Kamo.
www.superiorarms.com/id30.htm

Leo Williams
Superior Arms
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 10:10:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 10:12:59 PM EDT by eye_spy]

Originally Posted By mrcr0603:

Originally Posted By eye_spy:
As stated, the Arms rails and also Yankee Hill (tho i've read they "fixed" it) are not Mil-Std. or mil spec. This is something that you should take into consideration because some accessories / vertical grips, like the Knights and Tango Down, will not fit properly (unless you do a little shaving and / or a lot of pounding).



Since when do KAC ("Knights") vertical grips not fit SIR rails without "a little shaving and / or a lot of pounding"?


Chris



Chris,

I currently have a Knights VG on an ARMS rail. Yes, the did eventually fit. But only after a few careful pounding with a closed fist. They were initially very tight.

The "shavings" were done / experienced by other members of this board. I recall a member who posted pictures and related his experience on how he eventually made his Tango Down VG fit his ARMS by shaving / filing off some of the VG.

I know though that the newer extended ARMS bottom rails are now Mil-Spec.

Thats just my experience and from what I have read.

Rene


[ETA: Toolman, don't get me wrong ... I do love my ARMS! ]
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 3:32:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By eye_spy:
Chris,

I currently have a Knights VG on an ARMS rail. Yes, the did eventually fit. But only after a few careful pounding with a closed fist. They were initially very tight.

The "shavings" were done / experienced by other members of this board. I recall a member who posted pictures and related his experience on how he eventually made his Tango Down VG fit his ARMS by shaving / filing off some of the VG.

I know though that the newer extended ARMS bottom rails are now Mil-Spec.

Thats just my experience and from what I have read.

Rene



My #45C and #51 were both purchased when they first came to market years ago, and my KAC grips fit on them with no problems.

If you're including what's on the internet, then I'd have to say that your KAC/SIR problem is the first I've noticed.

About TD/SIR .... I've posted pictures of that, what I consider minor work that is not the issue that some would want it to be.


Chris
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 12:35:42 PM EDT
All the A.R.M.S. SIR 6:00 rails we have seen have a slot of material removed down the middle, lengthwise.

This allows the KAC grip to slip back and forth under moderate force, as the locking nub of the grip has nowhere to engage.

This was by design, to allow their grip only (if possible) to fit.
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 12:54:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Toolman_556:
However you may view The SIR, The Folks at A.R.M.S. sell a BUNCH of them to the Military. They are rigid and repeatable.. Most all accessories work. Many accessories are designed to fit the S.I.R. due to its military use. I personally like mine. Its a 18" midlength 6.8 with a PRI barrel and an A.R.M.S. 58M. The scope is a Cabela's Alaskan guide 30MM 4-12 x 52. Camoflage by Kat-Kamo.
www.superiorarms.com/id30.htm

Leo Williams
Superior Arms



**-- Smoke and Mirrors -- **

ARMS does not sell a bunch to the military and I have not met one Operator or Man in the Community that has a SIR systems. Ill even quote what they tell me "Bit Cluncky and way to many F&*n parts".

There maybe indivduals buying them on there own or small non-operational Units buying them. This is the smoke screen that ARMs like to create, if one Operator buys it, them its a "Contracted Item". Everyday that moves along ARMs is losing more and more busniess to smaller companys like Larue, Samson, and Troy. These guys are good Americons.
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 2:08:16 PM EDT
I dont like ARMS SIR because it raises the optic height which makes magnified optics a bitch, its too heavy and too bulky. Oh yeah, its expensive too.



Oh wait you must use an ARMS 40 with it... I bet there are some other reasons I dont like it.
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 2:14:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tactical_Operator:

Originally Posted By Toolman_556:
However you may view The SIR, The Folks at A.R.M.S. sell a BUNCH of them to the Military. They are rigid and repeatable.. Most all accessories work. Many accessories are designed to fit the S.I.R. due to its military use. I personally like mine. Its a 18" midlength 6.8 with a PRI barrel and an A.R.M.S. 58M. The scope is a Cabela's Alaskan guide 30MM 4-12 x 52. Camoflage by Kat-Kamo.
www.superiorarms.com/id30.htm

Leo Williams
Superior Arms



**-- Smoke and Mirrors -- **

ARMS does not sell a bunch to the military and I have not met one Operator or Man in the Community that has a SIR systems. Ill even quote what they tell me "Bit Cluncky and way to many F&*n parts".

There maybe indivduals buying them on there own or small non-operational Units buying them. This is the smoke screen that ARMs like to create, if one Operator buys it, them its a "Contracted Item". Everyday that moves along ARMs is losing more and more busniess to smaller companys like Larue, Samson, and Troy. These guys are good Americons.



While I do not like the ARMS SIR rails sytem, it is true that they did recieve a contract with the military a short time ago. There is a topic about it somewhere that also names KAC and Daniel Defense IIRC.
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 2:34:58 PM EDT
I am very fimilar with that Contract.

1- If Comany A did not make a congressional complant he would have never been approved on that list.

2- the award is for ALL threee vendors

3- The contract also states that they can get 1 (one) Unit up to Quantity XX (form any of the three vendors)

so eaily broken down, they can buy 100,000 KAC 25,000 DD and 1 ARMs, or Visa V. The fact of the matter is real operators in harms way will NOT carry a ARMs SIR !
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 12:03:27 PM EDT
Just like what I posted, and you re-capped, ARMS did receive a contract along with DD and KAC. There is no specific number, and neither me or you can probably come up with that figure. That was not my point though. Like I said, I am far from an ARMS cheerleader, but it is undeniable that they did in fact receive an official contract.

With that said, I prefer Mil-Spec 1913 rails, and standard sights. I also do not like the idea of having a plastic bottom rail. That is just my opinion though. I'll take a Larue myself.
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 1:16:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DevL:

Oh wait you must use an ARMS 40 with it... I bet there are some other reasons I dont like it.



Actually the YHM flip up sight works fine with it.
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