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Posted: 8/10/2005 11:10:55 AM EDT
its been awhile since I last checked into this but the last time I did check Colt was the primary contractor for the US military in the AR15. The last time I checked the Colt AR15 was standard issue, as of now is Bushmaster getting any contracts from the US military? Are Bushmasters being used in Iraq?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:17:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:17:48 AM EDT
Bushmaster rifles are in widespread use by civilian security contractors in the sandbox.

As far as Bushy mil weapons go (particularly the mysterious Bushy M4 from Desert Storm One), I'll happily mail $5.00 to the first person who can produce an NSN for a select fire Bushmaster currently deployed or in DoD inventory.

Oh yeah, the Bushmaster chain gun doesn't count-different company.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:21:47 AM EDT
1. go here www.defenselink.mil/search/

2. Click on contracts

3. enter "Bushmaster"

4. click Search

You'll find all the Bushmaster military contracts
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:26:44 AM EDT
No document found matching Bushmaster.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:29:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Hylton:
No document found matching Bushmaster.



exactly
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:34:05 AM EDT

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:34:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 11:36:40 AM EDT by Hylton]
so what’s the problem with Bushmaster being standard in the US military, I have a brother in the USMC and he hands down prefers his civilian Bushmaster over his issued Colt. And from testimonials Bushmaster makes a better firearm. When you buy a Colt you pay for the name, can someone argue Colt over Bushmaster with facts and how Colts so much better and superb over a Bushmaster?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:41:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 11:49:17 AM EDT by repub18]

Originally Posted By Hylton:
so what’s the problem with Bushmaster being standard in the US military, I have a brother in the USMC and he hands down prefers his civilian Bushmaster over his issued Colt. And from testimonials Bushmaster makes a better firearm. When you buy a Colt you pay for the name, can someone argue Colt over Bushmaster with facts and how Colts so much better and superb over a Bushmaster?




Between your airsoft , ammuntition law thread and your feeding problum with your clips and now this, you need search and please read before you post anymore.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:44:05 AM EDT
and what would you suggest I search for in the millions of threads here?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:48:47 AM EDT
These guys just got a big contract. Anybody heard of them before?

Colt Defense, LLC, Hartford, Conn., was awarded Aug. 4, 2005, a $52,509,192 firm-fixed-price contract to procure 50,881 M4 Carbines. Work will be performed at Colt’s Hartford facilities and is to be completed by Sept. 30, 2006. The U.S. Army Tank-automotive and Armaments Command Rock Island at Rock Island, Ill., is the contracting activity. Army Public Affairs can be reached at (703) 692-2000. (W52H09-04-D-086)
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:50:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 11:51:29 AM EDT by SWO_daddy]

Originally Posted By Hylton:
so what’s the problem with Bushmaster being standard in the US military, I have a brother in the USMC and he hands down prefers his civilian Bushmaster over his issued Colt. And from testimonials Bushmaster makes a better firearm. When you buy a Colt you pay for the name, can someone argue Colt over Bushmaster with facts and how Colts so much better and superb over a Bushmaster?



Bushmaster has either declined to bid on military contracts, or has been found not to meet the standards.

BTW, Fabrique Nationale Herstal's US subsidiary, FNH USA, has the main current contract to produce M16A2 and M16A4 rifles for the Government. While Colt may be have a smaller contract for M16s, and is the only contractor for M4 carbines, you cannot say that Colt is standard issue.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:50:23 AM EDT
Oh and just to answer your question..

The answer is Quality Control and MP testing.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 11:58:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 11:58:54 AM EDT by Hylton]

Oh and just to answer your question..

The answer is Quality Control and MP testing.





OK
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 12:00:38 PM EDT
I'd be willing to buy a Colt M4 type, if they didn't consider me an unworthy peon and not sell to me...

Haven't found one in the EE yet.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 12:08:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 12:12:23 PM EDT by TriggerFish]

Originally Posted By Hylton:
...I did check Colt was the primary contractor for the US military in the AR15. The last time I checked the Colt AR15 was standard issue...


Now this is going waaaay back. Late 50s - early 60s?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 12:14:18 PM EDT
This is my first post and I will be brief as I do not wish to add to much fuel to the fire to this already lengthy debate.

1st and foremost I have never had a problem with my personal Colt AR6520 which I use on the job or with any of the old Colt M16 A1s that are military surplus that our team uses as perimiter guns.

That being said...I got a deal at a local gun store for a Bushmaster Superlight this spring and picked it up. After having it for a few weeks...with no problems at the range mind you...I gave the rifle...yes gave it...to my best friend.

Why you ask, because...being a geeky SWAT guy I examined every inch of the Bushmaster and found the fit and finish to not be as nice as my Colt....sorry...point blank...that is it. I didn't see the Bushmaster as replacing my Gov't Carbine as my long rifle that I am going to depend upon for my life.

The Bushmaster now leads a happy life at the local range and under my buddies bed...a great personal rifle...
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 12:21:46 PM EDT

I examined every inch of the Bushmaster and found the fit and finish to not be as nice as my Colt


Both have matte finish right?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 12:21:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Hylton:
its been awhile since I last checked into this but the last time I did check Colt was the primary contractor for the US military in the AR15. The last time I checked the Colt AR15 was standard issue, as of now is Bushmaster getting any contracts from the US military? Are Bushmasters being used in Iraq?



that would be the M4 in todays acronyms - but no harm no foul.

and for those others who say you pay for the name............ you do pay a bit more on average for a Colt - but not much, and generally equal to the additional work/quality parts that go into them

and the guberment doesn't pay extra for 'names.'

They buy what will work best, and offer the best offensive and defensive weapon for over a million of our fighters.......... and that answer was Colt. (and FN)



Link Posted: 8/10/2005 1:53:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 1:53:43 PM EDT by Stickman]

Originally Posted By tick398:
This is my first post and I will be brief as I do not wish to add to much fuel to the fire to this already lengthy debate.

1st and foremost I have never had a problem with my personal Colt AR6520 which I use on the job or with any of the old Colt M16 A1s that are military surplus that our team uses as perimiter guns.

That being said...I got a deal at a local gun store for a Bushmaster Superlight this spring and picked it up. After having it for a few weeks...with no problems at the range mind you...I gave the rifle...yes gave it...to my best friend.

Why you ask, because...being a geeky SWAT guy I examined every inch of the Bushmaster and found the fit and finish to not be as nice as my Colt....sorry...point blank...that is it. I didn't see the Bushmaster as replacing my Gov't Carbine as my long rifle that I am going to depend upon for my life.

The Bushmaster now leads a happy life at the local range and under my buddies bed...a great personal rifle...



You got rid of a $700 weapon because you didn't like the finish? It was a weapon that you bought and picked out, and your team weapon is prettier? WTF Over.

Sorry, I've spent to much time in, on and around too many different teams to buy it. Sure, guys want the newest coolest toys, but crying over finishes? No, just about anything else you could have listed would have been more believable.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 1:59:47 PM EDT
amen
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 2:00:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stickman:

Originally Posted By tick398:
This is my first post and I will be brief as I do not wish to add to much fuel to the fire to this already lengthy debate.

1st and foremost I have never had a problem with my personal Colt AR6520 which I use on the job or with any of the old Colt M16 A1s that are military surplus that our team uses as perimiter guns.

That being said...I got a deal at a local gun store for a Bushmaster Superlight this spring and picked it up. After having it for a few weeks...with no problems at the range mind you...I gave the rifle...yes gave it...to my best friend.

Why you ask, because...being a geeky SWAT guy I examined every inch of the Bushmaster and found the fit and finish to not be as nice as my Colt....sorry...point blank...that is it. I didn't see the Bushmaster as replacing my Gov't Carbine as my long rifle that I am going to depend upon for my life.

The Bushmaster now leads a happy life at the local range and under my buddies bed...a great personal rifle...



You got rid of a $700 weapon because you didn't like the finish? It was a weapon that you bought and picked out, and your team weapon is prettier? WTF Over.

Sorry, I've spent to much time in, on and around too many different teams to buy it. Sure, guys want the newest coolest toys, but crying over finishes? No, just about anything else you could have listed would have been more believable.



+1
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 3:50:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Clayfish:

Originally Posted By Hylton:
No document found matching Bushmaster.



exactly



at least 2 ARFCOM'rs get it.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 3:59:41 PM EDT
How the hell is the government paying nearly $1100 for each M4? Can't these idiots negociate bulk pricing?
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 4:00:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By tick398:
This is my first post and I will be brief as I do not wish to add to much fuel to the fire to this already lengthy debate.

1st and foremost I have never had a problem with my personal Colt AR6520 which I use on the job or with any of the old Colt M16 A1s that are military surplus that our team uses as perimiter guns.

That being said...I got a deal at a local gun store for a Bushmaster Superlight this spring and picked it up. After having it for a few weeks...with no problems at the range mind you...I gave the rifle...yes gave it...to my best friend.

Why you ask, because...being a geeky SWAT guy I examined every inch of the Bushmaster and found the fit and finish to not be as nice as my Colt....sorry...point blank...that is it. I didn't see the Bushmaster as replacing my Gov't Carbine as my long rifle that I am going to depend upon for my life.

The Bushmaster now leads a happy life at the local range and under my buddies bed...a great personal rifle...



I have owned both colt and bushmaster and beleive the colt is junk, I gave the colt to my dad and Love the bushmaster. I do not htink colt really cares about quality. sorry about the hijack
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 4:03:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 4:06:48 PM EDT by AROKIE]

Originally Posted By Hylton:
its been awhile since I last checked into this but the last time I did check Colt was the primary contractor for the US military in the AR15. The last time I checked the Colt AR15 was standard issue, as of now is Bushmaster getting any contracts from the US military? Are Bushmasters being used in Iraq?



FN is the provider for the m-16's for the military. as the guys said above colt is not standard issue. they provide the m-4s FN herstal has the contract for m16's.

please research the difference between an ar-15 and the m-16 and the models used by the military.

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 7:48:09 PM EDT
I can confirm that the military DID purchase some Bushmasters. As a weapons specialist in SBU-20, 89-94, we recieved a shipment of M4A2's just before I left for Desert Shield/Storm. About half of the shipment was Colt, half Bushmaster. Interestingly, the Bushmasters came with Colt mags. As I recall the Bushmasters worked as well as any other M16.
The high prices listed for military weapons are typically due to the fact that the military specs packages, with spare parts, accessories and sometimes even factory support included in the price.You'd have to look up the individual spec to be sure.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:17:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By nsw:
I can confirm that the military DID purchase some Bushmasters. As a weapons specialist in SBU-20, 89-94, we recieved a shipment of M4A2's just before I left for Desert Shield/Storm.



What's an M4A2??
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:24:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By billclo:
I'd be willing to buy a Colt M4 type, if they didn't consider me an unworthy peon and not sell to me...

Haven't found one in the EE yet.



Dude, what are you talking about? I bought mine over the EE a few weeks ago. I ALWAYS see 6920s for sale there, in fact I just took a peek and saw at least three on the first page.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:31:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sic_ness:

Originally Posted By nsw:
I can confirm that the military DID purchase some Bushmasters. As a weapons specialist in SBU-20, 89-94, we recieved a shipment of M4A2's just before I left for Desert Shield/Storm.



What's an M4A2??




Im thinking he's talking about an M4 Carbine with a Non-Removable Carry Handle, but it's still Full Auto, so thats where I'm thinking he got the M4A2, or it could be the actual name, im not sure, im betting he'll get around to telling us sooner or later.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:39:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 3:07:57 AM EDT by KingC]
.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:47:08 PM EDT

I have owned both colt and bushmaster and beleive the colt is junk, I gave the colt to my dad and Love the bushmaster. I do not htink colt really cares about quality. sorry about the hijack




BUSHMASTER ALL THE WAY, like I said before, when you buy a Colt you pay an extra $400 for the little horse and name on the side
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 8:59:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 9:06:21 PM EDT by Ekie]

Originally Posted By AROKIE:

FN is the provider for the m-16's for the military. as the guys said above colt is not standard issue. they provide the m-4s FN herstal has the contract for m16's.




FNMI and Colt's both manufacture M16A4's:



The Colt's M4 is standard A, and has been since 1995, and close to 400,000 have been delivered, and entire infantry divisions are equipt with Colt's M4 Carbines. If that is not "standard" then what is?

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:03:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 10:39:53 PM EDT by _DR]

Originally Posted By CJan_NH:


Oh yeah, the Bushmaster chain gun doesn't count-different company.



Correct.
The M242 25mm "Bushmaster" Chain Gun is manufactured by McDonnell Douglas.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:05:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 11:01:15 PM EDT by _DR]
post deleted.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:11:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 9:12:39 PM EDT by Hylton]
That picture makes me want to cry, there should be a number to call for neglect, I couldn’t imagine my pretty Bushmaster M4 being half that dirty, she gets a bath every day so she can stay nice and beautiful
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:12:38 PM EDT

Both have matte finish right?



I think this question says everything we need to know about this clown.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:15:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 9:17:48 PM EDT by Hylton]
Wasn’t a question, it was sarcasm, by the way names John

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:19:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 9:24:04 PM EDT by CJan_NH]

Originally Posted By billclo:
I'd be willing to buy a Colt M4 type, if they didn't consider me an unworthy peon and not sell to me...

Haven't found one in the EE yet.


Apparently Colt didn't get the memo from the membership of ar15.com that stated Colt isn't selling to civilians. Colt has produced thousands of LEO weapons that have been sold to civilians since the sunset and will continue to do so.

Anyone who wants a factory LEO Colt merely has to "pony up" and buy one. There are no hoops to jump through or no extra headaches.

Here, buy all you want: Knesek Guns
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 9:24:46 PM EDT

Apparently Colt didn't get the memo from the membership of ar15.com states that Colt isn't selling to civilians. Colt has sold thousands of LEO weapons to civilians since the sunset and will continue to do so.

Anyone who wants a factory LEO Colt merely has to "pony up" and buy one. There are no hoops to jump through or no extra headaches.

Here, buy all you want: Knesek Guns




Just bought my LEO/GOV M4/A3 Bushmaster from KnesekGuns
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 10:01:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/10/2005 10:06:51 PM EDT by repub18]

Originally Posted By Hylton:

I have owned both colt and bushmaster and beleive the colt is junk, I gave the colt to my dad and Love the bushmaster. I do not htink colt really cares about quality. sorry about the hijack




BUSHMASTER ALL THE WAY, like I said before, when you buy a Colt you pay an extra $400 for the little horse and name on the side






yep, that is all you are paying for.

The only reason why they are $400 more is because of demand right now. During the AWB Colt 6920's could be had for around $900-1000.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 10:08:21 PM EDT
I really don't care about who has the contract with the MILITARY.. as long as they make good rifles that is all it matter.

for Me I take Bushmaster.. save some buck for some other thing.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 12:10:20 PM EDT
I have seen what I believe to be a bushmaster M4 type upper reciever on an M16 lower in bosnia in 1999 or so. It was in the hands of navy dudes.

No feed ramps, fixed carry handle, small handguards... it's been a few years, but at the time I was pretty sure that's what I was looking at. I didn't take pictures.

Link Posted: 8/11/2005 4:06:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 4:11:20 PM EDT
I dont know about the military part, but I know tons of private security and LEO that trust their life to bushmaster products. They make a good weapon
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 4:52:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 5:09:17 PM EDT by _DR]
That question was answered quite early in the thread. That answer was no, the US military has never had a contract for rifles with BFI, not that anyone could prove beyond hearsay.
Not saying that all anecdotal accounts are false, or that provisional acquisition of BFI rifles never occured, but there is no documentation to prove any such contract ever existed.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 5:13:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 5:19:28 PM EDT by dport]
NM already covered.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:41:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AROKIE:


FN is the provider for the m-16's for the military. as the guys said above colt is not standard issue. they provide the m-4s FN herstal has the contract for m16's.

please research the difference between an ar-15 and the m-16 and the models used by the military.




I don't know why people post when they don't have a clue what they are talking about.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:43:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 6:44:32 PM EDT by scottryan]

Originally Posted By Coronado:

Originally Posted By sic_ness:

Originally Posted By nsw:
I can confirm that the military DID purchase some Bushmasters. As a weapons specialist in SBU-20, 89-94, we recieved a shipment of M4A2's just before I left for Desert Shield/Storm.



What's an M4A2??




Im thinking he's talking about an M4 Carbine with a Non-Removable Carry Handle, but it's still Full Auto, so thats where I'm thinking he got the M4A2, or it could be the actual name, im not sure, im betting he'll get around to telling us sooner or later.



Look, two more people who don't know what they are talking about.

The M4 is semi and burst

The M4A1 is semi and full and all are flattops.

The M4 can either have a fixed handle (very early XM4) or flattop.

A M4A2 doesn't exist.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:46:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By scottryan:

The M4 is semi and burst

The M4A1 is semi and full and all are flattops.

The M4 can either have a fixed handle (very early XM4) or flattop.


I seem to remember the Navy having a M727 carbine. It looks like an M4, but doesn't have the fun switch. IIRC, it was originally meant for EOD. I have no idea who built it, but if I had to guess, I'd say they have ponies on them.

Why no fun switch? I have no idea.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 6:49:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 6:50:51 PM EDT by scottryan]

Originally Posted By AROKIE:


FN is the provider for the m-16's for the military. as the guys said above colt is not standard issue. they provide the m-4s FN herstal has the contract for m16's.

please research the difference between an ar-15 and the m-16 and the models used by the military.




And you need to research the difference between an AR-15 and an M-16, oh wait!, there is none because there is no one AR-15. The AR-15 is a family of weapons in which the M-16 is apart of.

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