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Posted: 9/24/2015 9:20:54 PM EDT
| Can anyone tell me why the firing pin that came with my armalite had a spring or coil on it but then the cryptic coatings bolt firing pin has no spring on it? I know this is how its supposed to be but I just curious about the science behind why. |
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To prevent slam fires from hard use, fast shooting, light primers, etc etc.
Be careful using a different bolt in the Armalite. Make sure you're using the entire bcg and nor mixing parts. If mixing parts, double check head space. Armalite's chamber and bolt face depth is not the exact same as the LR308 stuff. |
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To prevent slam fires from hard use, fast shooting, light primers, etc etc. Be careful using a different bolt in the Armalite. Make sure you're using the entire bcg and nor mixing parts. If mixing parts, double check head space. Armalite's chamber and bolt face depth is not the exact same as the LR308 stuff. ^ This is extremely valuable advice. Can be dangerous if you do not follow. |
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^ This is extremely valuable advice. Can be dangerous if you do not follow. Quoted:
Quoted:
To prevent slam fires from hard use, fast shooting, light primers, etc etc. Be careful using a different bolt in the Armalite. Make sure you're using the entire bcg and nor mixing parts. If mixing parts, double check head space. Armalite's chamber and bolt face depth is not the exact same as the LR308 stuff. ^ This is extremely valuable advice. Can be dangerous if you do not follow. I ordered the entire group from cryptic instead of just the bolt so fortunately I'm covered there. I appreciate the help, pretty new to the AR world so I have a lot to learn still |
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If you have an ArmaLite Inc. BCG with the spring loaded firing pin, you can pretty much only go down from there when looking at BCG's. It's one of the best engineered and manufactured critical component groups on the market. You'll have to forgive my naivety, but what exactly makes it the best? The only reason I ordered the cryptic coatings bolt was because I wanted a different color than black and also being super easy to clean. |
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Quoted:
To prevent slam fires from hard use, fast shooting, light primers, etc etc. Be careful using a different bolt in the Armalite. Make sure you're using the entire bcg and nor mixing parts. If mixing parts, double check head space. Armalite's chamber and bolt face depth is not the exact same as the LR308 stuff. Why would shooting fast be mechanically different than shooting slow? Does it somehow change? |
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You'll have to forgive my naivety, but what exactly makes it the best? The only reason I ordered the cryptic coatings bolt was because I wanted a different color than black and also being super easy to clean. Quoted:
Quoted:
If you have an ArmaLite Inc. BCG with the spring loaded firing pin, you can pretty much only go down from there when looking at BCG's. It's one of the best engineered and manufactured critical component groups on the market. You'll have to forgive my naivety, but what exactly makes it the best? The only reason I ordered the cryptic coatings bolt was because I wanted a different color than black and also being super easy to clean. For starters, ArmaLite Inc. has a team of engineers and QC people that have been doing this since no later than 1996, so they have gone through all the vendor hiccups, finding out who is reliable, learning how to QC critical parts, understanding the specs and why they matter, customer service, etc. Then look at the actual design itself. They have a balanced lug design, where only 6 of the lugs are in contact with the barrel extension teeth under thrust. The sprung firing pin is an added, unique to ArmaLite Inc. feature that prevents slam fires, and also contributes to a longer firing pin life. Their gas rings are of a high quality, and their vents and critical bore diameters in the carrier are strictly adhered to in the manufacturing and QC process, along with the chrome lining of the carrier and key. I would not even consider replacing the ArmaLite BCG in an ArmaLite gun with one meant for the LR-308, because they are not really in the same class when it comes to specs, QC, engineering, etc. If you're looking at color of the BCG as a priority, I would suggest placing that concern at the very bottom of your list, and put reliability and longevity at the top. You can get the BCG Cerakoted on the area that is exposed to the ejection port if you really want a specific color, without lousing anything up on the guide rails or critical dims. |
| You learn something new everyday. I already have the new bolt so I guess I'll just test it out and see how I like it and just sell it if I'm not impressed. I don't plan on getting rid of my ArmaLite bolt so I could always swap it back in. Thank you for all your help |
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Why would shooting fast be mechanically different than shooting slow? Does it somehow change? Quoted:
Quoted:
To prevent slam fires from hard use, fast shooting, light primers, etc etc. Be careful using a different bolt in the Armalite. Make sure you're using the entire bcg and nor mixing parts. If mixing parts, double check head space. Armalite's chamber and bolt face depth is not the exact same as the LR308 stuff. Why would shooting fast be mechanically different than shooting slow? Does it somehow change? No it doesn't change operation, just added stress from sustained fire. Things heat up, the bcg recoil gets more violent with each shot if doing mag dumps and that sort of thing. Shooting slow, everything gets a chance to settle in a way. Rapid firing, things are constantly moving with no rest. The firing pun in AR15s and LR308 is floating, and during hard use, it's possible to get a slam fire, which is when the firing pin his the primer just from the inertia and momentum of the bcg and ignites the round. Spring loaded firing pin pretty much eliminates this possibility in all but the worst case scenarios. |
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I have the full armalite BCG as well as the full cryptic coatings BCG so as long as I don't interchange any parts between those, Ill be good to go, correct? Do you have a set of chamber gauges, GO and NO-GO? You can measure the bolt lug lengths and bolt face depth between the two, which will give you an idea if they are the same on those axes. They used to be several years ago. |
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^^^^ Listen to this guy.
It's possible you can have zero issues with the cryptic bcg. But it's also possible you'll have major issues. This large margin for bad things to happen is why you don't mix and match parts with Armalite. They have a very good design, that's held to strict QC processes. Any variable thrown in can/will cause problems. Just using that bcg in your factory Armalite rifle voids the warranty of they find out. They will then never fix anything that happens with your gun even it if doesn't stem from the bcg. Which may not sound fair, but you gotta look at it from Armalite's point of view. They can't warranty a rifle that someone used non Armalite parts in. That's not fair to Armalite. Personally, i would send the bcg back and buy a spare Armalite. You could then send the spare bcg off to get coated elsewhere. Or do like LRRP said and just cerakote the thing. This will give you a different look, and make it slightly easier to clean. That's really the ONLY thing that coated bcgs have over the standard phosphate, is the ease of cleaning. The friction coefficient and other crap offers no real advantage, doesn't increase reliability, or anything besides makes your gun "feel" like it's operating smoother. It's just easier to clean. I have a Youngs chrome bcg in one of my AR15s. It certainly does help with cleaning, but nothing else. After shooting alot, you're still gonna need to scrape carbon. I usually put 3-500rds throb my guns during a range session. After that amount, it doesn't matter what coating you have, carbon is going to get hard, and stick to whatever it can. However, that coatings still help with cleaning stuck on carbon. You still gotta scrape at it, but not as much or as hard. If you're only wanting it to look different, I'd say get over the looks and use the Armalite bcg. If your really want the benefits of easier cleaning, get a spare Armalite bcg and have it coated in something. But if you insist on sticking with the cryptic bcg, please have a good smith check head space, and be careful. Wouldn't want you to have an OOB discharge over this. |
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If you want it to look bling, send it to a Cerakote finisher and they can put whatever color you can imagine on that one portion that is visible through the port.
I wouldn't put H-Series on the guide rails though, unless it's going to be polished off, and then why bother. I personally polish the guide rails on some of my BCG's if they have really rough phosphate on the rails. Cerakote Microslick is something you can have applied to the BCG if you want easy clean up. The best advice is to just buy ammo and ignore these fads with NiB, TiN, polished this and oh look that. |
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LRRPF52, You have any feelings on AIM's 308 BCGs? (for this Aero M5 rifle I am piecing together) AIM and Aero get their bcgs from the same place, ToolCraft. Who also makes bcgs for numerous other parts companies. ToolCraft makes good stuff, but the problem is they are producing a very large number of these bcgs. When that happens, you'll get more bad stuff that slips through QC. Which is why i think it's a good idea to avoid anything made by ToolCraft at this time. There are plenty of better quality bcgs to pick from. Armalite, JP, RCA, LMT, hell even a DPMS bcg is ok. Usually have to replace the extractor for sure, sometimes the ejector and spring, and sometimes the firing pin. But it's hard to recommend anyone else at this time. All these parts companies are still very new compared to the competition. Their parts have not seen the abuse the others have simply because they haven't been around long enough. |
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If you want it to look bling, send it to a Cerakote finisher and they can put whatever color you can imagine on that one portion that is visible through the port. I wouldn't put H-Series on the guide rails though, unless it's going to be polished off, and then why bother. I personally polish the guide rails on some of my BCG's if they have really rough phosphate on the rails. Cerakote Microslick is something you can have applied to the BCG if you want easy clean up. The best advice is to just buy ammo and ignore these fads with NiB, TiN, polished this and oh look that. Wish I would've come on here before I bought it, all I had read were good reviews about it all over the internet. Looks like I'll be returning it then. I greatly appreciate all the info |
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Wish I would've come on here before I bought it, all I had read were good reviews about it all over the internet. Looks like I'll be returning it then. I greatly appreciate all the info Quoted:
Quoted:
If you want it to look bling, send it to a Cerakote finisher and they can put whatever color you can imagine on that one portion that is visible through the port. I wouldn't put H-Series on the guide rails though, unless it's going to be polished off, and then why bother. I personally polish the guide rails on some of my BCG's if they have really rough phosphate on the rails. Cerakote Microslick is something you can have applied to the BCG if you want easy clean up. The best advice is to just buy ammo and ignore these fads with NiB, TiN, polished this and oh look that. Wish I would've come on here before I bought it, all I had read were good reviews about it all over the internet. Looks like I'll be returning it then. I greatly appreciate all the info Its not necessarily a bad part, just not good for the Armalite. Don't beat yourself up over it, it happens all the time. The trick is to learn from the mistake. 
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For starters, ArmaLite Inc. has a team of engineers and QC people that have been doing this since no later than 1996, so they have gone through all the vendor hiccups, finding out who is reliable, learning how to QC critical parts, understanding the specs and why they matter, customer service, etc. Then look at the actual design itself. They have a balanced lug design, where only 6 of the lugs are in contact with the barrel extension teeth under thrust. The sprung firing pin is an added, unique to ArmaLite Inc. feature that prevents slam fires, and also contributes to a longer firing pin life. Their gas rings are of a high quality, and their vents and critical bore diameters in the carrier are strictly adhered to in the manufacturing and QC process, along with the chrome lining of the carrier and key. I would not even consider replacing the ArmaLite BCG in an ArmaLite gun with one meant for the LR-308, because they are not really in the same class when it comes to specs, QC, engineering, etc. If you're looking at color of the BCG as a priority, I would suggest placing that concern at the very bottom of your list, and put reliability and longevity at the top. You can get the BCG Cerakoted on the area that is exposed to the ejection port if you really want a specific color, without lousing anything up on the guide rails or critical dims. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you have an ArmaLite Inc. BCG with the spring loaded firing pin, you can pretty much only go down from there when looking at BCG's. It's one of the best engineered and manufactured critical component groups on the market. You'll have to forgive my naivety, but what exactly makes it the best? The only reason I ordered the cryptic coatings bolt was because I wanted a different color than black and also being super easy to clean. For starters, ArmaLite Inc. has a team of engineers and QC people that have been doing this since no later than 1996, so they have gone through all the vendor hiccups, finding out who is reliable, learning how to QC critical parts, understanding the specs and why they matter, customer service, etc. Then look at the actual design itself. They have a balanced lug design, where only 6 of the lugs are in contact with the barrel extension teeth under thrust. The sprung firing pin is an added, unique to ArmaLite Inc. feature that prevents slam fires, and also contributes to a longer firing pin life. Their gas rings are of a high quality, and their vents and critical bore diameters in the carrier are strictly adhered to in the manufacturing and QC process, along with the chrome lining of the carrier and key. I would not even consider replacing the ArmaLite BCG in an ArmaLite gun with one meant for the LR-308, because they are not really in the same class when it comes to specs, QC, engineering, etc. If you're looking at color of the BCG as a priority, I would suggest placing that concern at the very bottom of your list, and put reliability and longevity at the top. You can get the BCG Cerakoted on the area that is exposed to the ejection port if you really want a specific color, without lousing anything up on the guide rails or critical dims. They all turn black anyways 
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