I have been following this thread for a couple of weeks now and have tried the search function, so nobody flame me for asking questions.  
    I am completely new to the ar world and am planning on buying my first within the next couple of weeks.  Do you guys think it is worht my while to try and find a used gun.  I dont have allot of money so im trying to do this as cheaply as possible.  I dont need all the fancy stuff yet, so just a basic gun will do me just fine.  I have decided i want a flat top (A3-4), and mostlikely a bushmaster, but i dont want to rule out any other brands.  Where would be a good place to start looking for used guns.  I have checked out the local gun shops, but to tell you the truth i dont know what to look for when i am holding a used gun.  If i do go used what would be a good price for a A3 16" gun.  If i go new what do you thihnk would be my best bet.  So basicaly any kind of info would be great.  Thanks

check out the EE lots of good deals to be had in there. you may also want to consider stag and RRA

+1 for the EE that is about the best place to pick up anything.

Quoted: check out the EE lots of good deals to be had in there. you may also want to consider stag and RRA

I'd definitely check out the Equipment Exchange here on the site, if you want to find a used gun.

Keep in mind that everything other than the lower receiver can be shipped directly to you, without having to go through a gun shop.

If you want to save a few bucks, you could look for a complete lower reciever locally (or find one from one of the dealers here, and buy it and have it shipped to a local dealer - who then transfers it to you for a fee - usually about $25-$40) and then buy a complete used upper in the Equipment Exchange, or buy a new complete upper from a place like Del-Ton or Model 1 Sales (both have web-pages online) that have pretty cheap uppers.

i guess just make sure its pre ban and stick with either colt, RRA, bushmaster, or armalite. i dont think theses brands lose there value so you might just look into buy new. other than that id say stay far away from knock off accessoires that look cool i.e. optics/rails cuz from my expierence i wasted alot of money when i should have just waited to get the real deal

If you beat the bushes you could probably find something for around 600 bucks.

Thanks for the replies.  I am willing to pay no more than 800 bucks right now, but would like to stay in the 6-700 range.  Why are the pre ban lowers in such high demand, and what does ffl stand for.  
Ill ask some more questions as i come up with them. Thanks

FFL = federal firearms license, ie... your dealer

Quoted: Thanks for the replies.  I am willing to pay no more than 800 bucks right now, but would like to stay in the 6-700 range.  Why are the pre ban lowers in such high demand, and what does ffl stand for.   Ill ask some more questions as i come up with them. Thanks

Pre-ban refers to the former gun law that banned particular features of AR-series rifles, like collapsible stocks and flash supressors.  Some individual states still have them, but the federal law is gone.  So if oregon doesn't have a law like that, you can just ignore it - and make sure you get an upper with a real flash supressor, and not some muzzle brake or compensator.

Check in the Northwest/Oregon hometown forum as well - where people can answer specific questions about your local laws.

What dose the flash supressor actualy do. I mean i can take a guess from the name, but how does it work.  There is one gun at my local gun shop that has a Bush lower with a 20" upper. The barrel says NATO on it, but i dont remember anything else.  It is a ban gun in that it doesnt have any supressor, and it is the A2 style with the non removeable handle.  They are asking 639 for it.  What do you guys think?  
They also have an early colt with the triangle front hand guard, and a 20" barrel.  I dint look much at that one because I thought newer ones would be better.  They are asking 499 for that.  Is this one worth looking into?

Quoted: What dose the flash supressor actualy do. I mean i can take a guess from the name, but how does it work.

They DO work, and reduce flash considerably (especially on the shorter rifles) - but depending on what you use the rifle for, it may not be that big a deal.  If you are planning to scope a rifle and shoot at target at 100 - 600 yards, then a flash supressor doesn't really matter.

If you have lots of uses for a rifle, and get a shorter barrel - like a 16" AR - then the flash supressor is useful if you ever shoot at night, because it reduces the flash that is visible (and distracting) to you, the shooter.

There is one gun at my local gun shop that has a Bush lower with a 20" upper. The barrel says NATO on it, but i dont remember anything else.  It is a ban gun in that it doesnt have any supressor, and it is the A2 style with the non removeable handle.  They are asking 639 for it.  What do you guys think?

That's a reaonably good deal, if a true factory Bushmaster.

Part of the issue with buying used AR's is that someone could just have bought a stripped Bushmaster Lower, and the put a much lwoer quality upper on it, and built up the lower with cheaper parts.  A Bushmaster barrel would usually say B MP 5.56 NATO on it (inidcating a likely Bushmaster complete upper).  Even then, it can be hard to judge how used a barrel is - but most people do not really shoot their ARs that much, so the odds are good that it's probably not too worn.

If you wanted to put a flash supressor on a bare barrel, it's not a big deal - you ship the upper to ADCO, and he thread it for you for about $65, and then you screw on an $8 flash supressor.

However - the A2 style with the fixed handle may be a bigger deal down the road.  A lot of people like the flexibility of the flat-top, because it allows them to put optics on it later - either scopes for longer-range shooting, or a variety of red-dot sights, like Aimpoints and EOTechs and stuff like that.  The flat-top simply gives you more options down the road, and unlike a flash supressor, is harder and more time-consuming to switch out later.

They also have an early colt with the triangle front hand guard, and a 20" barrel.  I dint look much at that one because I thought newer ones would be better.  They are asking 499 for that.  Is this one worth looking into?

A complete Colt rifle, or just the upper?  If it's a complete colt rifle - and says Colt on the side of the lower - for $500, then it's a huge steal and you should run down there tomorrow morning and buy it immediately.  If nothing else, you could sell it here for considerably more than that to any number of people

Seriously - if I walked into a gun store and saw an early Colt for $500, I would buy it IMMEDIATELY, without hesitation.

If it is a true colt i think i missed out on that deal, because it is at  a gun show right now, so if anybody else knows that then im sure they will snatch it up. Gosh I wish I would have paid more attention to it now.  Even if it isnt a colt, is 500 bucks still a good deal for any kind of AR?

Quoted: If it is a true colt i think i missed out on that deal, because it is at  a gun show right now, so if anybody else knows that then im sure they will snatch it up. Gosh I wish I would have paid more attention to it now.  Even if it isnt a colt, is 500 bucks still a good deal for any kind of AR?

$500 is a good deal for a DECENT AR--any crap AR is still worth crap

if its a franken built AR, make sure they use good parts...

Generally, the brands that you can count on are: Armalite, Bushmaster, Colt, Rock River Arms, as well as "smaller" brands like CMMG, CMT, LMT, the new Bravo Company rifles, and many other small outfits. (Olympic and DPMS may also be in there, but some people seem to not like them - the only ones Ive ever seen worked fine)

For a new AR, by a quality manufacturer, you should probably expect to pay roughly between $750 and $1000 for a basic AR-15, depending on configuration.  Searching around various dealer - like advertisers and industry partners here can give you a much more detailed idea of what things cost.



So in terms of used AR's, if they are well taken care of, you often pay anywhere between $600 and $800.  Colts tend to have slightly higher resale values - and the "pre-ban" rifles (manufacture before 1994) tend to sometimes be a little pricier, simply because people in states that still have state bans might want them, thus driving the price up a little.

But again - you ALWAYS want to be careful of some asshole selling you cheaper generic parts on a Colt, Bushmaster (or whatever) receiver and trying to tell you that the entire rifle is made from that company.  So there is always a little more "security" and peace of mind buying a new factory rifle form a reputable dealer.

An early Colt can often sell for as much as $1000, and probably at least $700-$800 simply because more people collect them, and like the Colt brand

For a well-maintained AR from a decent brand, $500 is always a good price.

Unless the gun dealer doesn't know much about ARs, the Colt you saw was probably a mil-surplus Colt upper on a generic lower.  The local gunshow here has a guy with a Colt upper on a Superior lower, full M16A1 furniture, for $600 or so, and it hasn't moved in months.  

Another vote for:

1)  Buy a complete upper on the www.ar15.com Equipment Exchange
2)  Buy a complete lower from a reputable company.  This can usually be had for about $150 or so (if you buy without the stock, and pick up a used stock and buffer assembly off the EE), plus shipping to your local FFL Dealer, and probably $20 fee to your dealer for receiving the shipment for you and filling out the paperwork.

I've seen some cool uppers go on the EE for $375 and up, but maybe a bit more for something like what you're looking for.  Just keep your eyes on the "Used AR Parts" section of the EE for a week or two and see what pops up.  Make sure that it's a _complete_ upper, i.e. that it includes the bolt/carrier/charging-handle.  

In the meantime, find a good deal on a lower and buy that separately.  Everything besides the lower can be mailed to you directly, as stated above.

You shouldn't have any trouble putting together something in your budget, plus the fun of hunting for just the right parts to get what you want.

    -MV

Well the hunt is on i guess. I will keep my eye out for a complete gun as well.  Putting one together does sound like more fun.  I must say there is allot of abreviations for stuff, and its going to take some time memorizing what they are. So if i bought a complete upper and a complete lower all i will need is just a stock right?  

Quoted: Well the hunt is on i guess. I will keep my eye out for a complete gun as well.  Putting one together does sound like more fun.  I must say there is allot of abreviations for stuff, and its going to take some time memorizing what they are. So if i bought a complete upper and a complete lower all i will need is just a stock right?

no if you buy a complete upper and a complete lower you will need nothing else, hence the term complete

Quoted: Quoted: Well the hunt is on i guess. I will keep my eye out for a complete gun as well.  Putting one together does sound like more fun.  I must say there is allot of abreviations for stuff, and its going to take some time memorizing what they are. So if i bought a complete upper and a complete lower all i will need is just a stock right?   no if you buy a complete upper and a complete lower you will need nothing else, hence the term complete

Except pin them together


By the way, welcome to the board

How hard is it to swap out barrels?  Also if i got a A2 upper and wanted to convert it later to an A3 upper, is all ihave to change is the stripped upper reciever. Wouldnt all my existing stuff work in it, or are bolts not interchangable?  

Complete Stag lower for $225 HERE, Complete Stag M4 Upper for $440 HERE, push the pins in and you have a very good, brand new rifle with no questionable history for $665

Thanks,  I think i might have to go this route.   Seems thier RRA stuff is even cheaper.  What would you guys go with RRA or Stag?
Thanks.  I have learned so much in the past couple of days. I havnt quite figured out what CAR stands for.

Quoted: Thanks,  I think i might have to go this route.   Seems their RRA stuff is even cheaper.  What would you guys go with RRA or Stag? Thanks.  I have learned so much in the past couple of days. I havnt quite figured out what CAR stands for.

Do it the arfcom way get both seriously get which ever one you like the most both are top quality and you will be very pleased
CAR = carbine

i have a RRA and am very pleased with it

Quoted: Thanks,  I think i might have to go this route.   Seems thier RRA stuff is even cheaper.  What would you guys go with RRA or Stag?

IMO you can't go wrong with either. RRA has more brand recognition, which could factor in for a little extra on the price you could get for it if you were forced to sell.

CAR usually refers to carbine, i.e.16" barrels (or shorter if you have the Uncle Sam tax stamp for a short barrel rifle) as opposed to 18"+ barrels