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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/18/2005 8:44:09 AM EDT
Please post if you have any.
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 9:10:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 2:37:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jnrifleworks:
www.jnrifleworks.com/images/afghanupper_b.jpg



how is the weight with the Krink on the end, is it pretty heavy or not too bad?
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 5:44:06 PM EDT
The KFH is about 5 ounces heavier than an A2.
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 9:29:07 PM EDT
I WANT A KRINK
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 4:31:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eye_spy:
I WANT A KRINK



Why? If you want 5 extra oz, tape some fishing weights on the end of your bbl.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 4:47:07 PM EDT
Is it worth it? Any Cons besides the weight? And what about any Pros?
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 6:18:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 6:26:36 PM EDT
im sorry, that is the uglies thing that anyone could hang off an AR, weather it functions or not.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 12:26:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
im sorry, that is the uglies thing that anyone could hang off an AR, weather it functions or not.



I don't know..... A Tacpoint and an Airsoft PAQ/2 is pretty ugly.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 3:22:15 AM EDT
I have to say that when I first heard about the properties of the Noveske KFH early this year, I was skeptical. It was difficult to believe that a non-NFA item (and therefore was not a moderator or sound suppressor) could do what was claimed. After spending a week with students each shooting nearly 2000 rounds each, two of which were equipped with the KFH, I was a believer.

There are a great many consumers that buy support gear and equipment based on aesthetics. How my gear looks in the mirror when posing with all my kit on is of little importance to me, as long as the gear works and is appropriate for the application. Certainly, the KFH adds weight, but so does everything else we hang off the gun.

The KFH is a fairly efficient flash suppressor (equal to the A2 in 16" applications, and greatly superior to the A2 for SBRs) and sends all the concussion and blast downrange. I don't have one on every one of my carbines, but I do have a couple. They are absolutely worth it and a great piece of kit.

Tim
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 4:32:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 4:33:58 PM EDT by M4arc]

Originally Posted By johndoexu:
Is it worth it? Any Cons besides the weight? And what about any Pros?



It redirects the sound and gas forward, away from the shooter. This makes a HUGE difference on SBRs because they are loud and send a lot of gas back in your face.


ETA: Sorry about repeating what Tim-L posted. I didn't read down far enough before I replied.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 4:36:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
im sorry, that is the uglies thing that anyone could hang off an AR, weather it functions or not.



Of the many criteria I use when I determine what to add to a weapon, that is not one of them.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 4:39:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STLRN:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
im sorry, that is the uglies thing that anyone could hang off an AR, weather it functions or not.



Of the many criteria I use when I determine what to add to a weapon, that is not one of them.



See, that's where you're going wrong; it's all about fashion man...get with the times!
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:02:55 PM EDT
That may very well be true, but I use my weapons as tools of the trade not as fashion accessories.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:04:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 5:04:38 PM EDT by TexasSIG]

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
im sorry, that is the uglies thing that anyone could hang off an AR, weather it functions or not.



Yeah, go for looks over function any time.

And the Airsoft forum is that way ------------>



You should change your username to "die-looking_good"
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:04:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STLRN:
That may very well be true, but I use my weapons as tools of the trade not as fashion accessories.



As long as you keep them "prettiful," you'll be ok around here
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:05:54 PM EDT
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:11:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 5:55:05 PM EDT by Hawkeye]

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



it's not for looks

It's THE most effective flash hider going for short barrels, bar none.
In addition it increases back pressure, making the 10.5"barrels and shorter function better
Also reduces the surrounding area muzzle blast by a TON, for your teammates sanity.

If you had a real gun and not an airsoft AR you'd understand.

It's OK, someday when your daddy gets a job you can buy some "real steel" and play with the men.

Yeah, I'm an asshole. Sue me. I also have a carbine that WORKS.

Link Posted: 8/20/2005 5:15:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 5:55:14 PM EDT by Hawkeye]

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



it's not for looks

It's THE most effective flash hider going for short barrels, bar none.
In addition it increases back pressure, making the 10.5"barrels and shorter function better
Also reduces the surrounding area muzzle blast by a TON, for your teammates sanity.

If you had a real gun and not an airsoft AR you'd understand.

It's OK, someday when your daddy gets a job you can buy some "real steel" and play with the men.

Yeah, I'm an asshole. Sue me. I also have a carbine that WORKS.




okey dokey.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:10:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 6:11:03 PM EDT by M4arc]

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



Are you familiar with Tim-L and his resume? Are you saying that you've tested the Noveske Krink and have found it to be a gimmick? What platform did you test it on? 10.5"? 14.5"? What was the configuration before you installed the Krink? I'm curious to find out how you have determined this to be a gimmick over the likes of Tim-L and several other "professionals".
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:13:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



Are you familiar with Tim-L and his resume? Are you saying that you've tested the Noveske Krink and have found it to be a gimmick? What platform did you test it on? 10.5"? 14.5"? What was the configuration before you installed the Krink? I'm curious to find out how you have determined this to be a gimmick over the likes of Tim-L and several other "professionals".



Nope not at all. So, i guess the military will be ordering a gazillion of them cuz they are so good. right? After all they are proven and tested and ARE the worlds greatest at whatever it is they do. There are none better, right?
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:17:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



Are you familiar with Tim-L and his resume? Are you saying that you've tested the Noveske Krink and have found it to be a gimmick? What platform did you test it on? 10.5"? 14.5"? What was the configuration before you installed the Krink? I'm curious to find out how you have determined this to be a gimmick over the likes of Tim-L and several other "professionals".



Nope not at all. So, i guess the military will be ordering a gazillion of them cuz they are so good. right? After all they are proven and tested and ARE the worlds greatest at whatever it is they do. There are none better, right?



I'm just trying to figure out how you came to the conclusion that the Noveske Krink is a gimmick. What testing or experience are you basing that statement on?
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:18:43 PM EDT
The military doesn't have a bunch of sub 14" barrel weapons anymore. When it did, they had 1) bad muzzle blast, hence blast modulator on the M177 and 2) many had to have the port opened up to work properly.

This one occasion that the Eastern Bloc was ahead of us and figured how to increase control muzzle blast and having the side benefit of increasing back pressure.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:22:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 6:25:06 PM EDT by die-tryin]

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

Originally Posted By M4arc:
Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



Are you familiar with Tim-L and his resume? Are you saying that you've tested the Noveske Krink and have found it to be a gimmick? What platform did you test it on? 10.5"? 14.5"? What was the configuration before you installed the Krink? I'm curious to find out how you have determined this to be a gimmick over the likes of Tim-L and several other "professionals".



Nope not at all. So, i guess the military will be ordering a gazillion of them cuz they are so good. right? After all they are proven and tested and ARE the worlds greatest at whatever it is they do. There are none better, right?



It was more or less a figure of speach. I dont like the looks of it. That is how I feel. Apparently my statement stepped on some toes, whatever. But when the mob mentality strikes ppl get pissed and say whatever. You ppl are acting like its the worlds greatest end all to Flash Supressors /Muzzle brakes. Thats the same way ppl act when a new gimmick is introduced. I read the tests, im sure it helps. I personally think there are other muzzle brakes that needed to be tested. They compared a closed flashhider to ones that are slotted on the sides. of course all the pressure is goin to go forward, it has no where else to go. , but I have used a Levang Linear Muzzle brake, I know it works and does the same things this does.

Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:28:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Ya'll can get bent, sorry if I dont like the looks of the worlds latest greatest gimmick.



Are you familiar with Tim-L and his resume? Are you saying that you've tested the Noveske Krink and have found it to be a gimmick? What platform did you test it on? 10.5"? 14.5"? What was the configuration before you installed the Krink? I'm curious to find out how you have determined this to be a gimmick over the likes of Tim-L and several other "professionals".



Nope not at all. So, i guess the military will be ordering a gazillion of them cuz they are so good. right? After all they are proven and tested and ARE the worlds greatest at whatever it is they do. There are none better, right?



I'm just trying to figure out how you came to the conclusion that the Noveske Krink is a gimmick. What testing or experience are you basing that statement on?



It was more or less a figure of speach. I dont like the looks of it. That is how I feel. Apparently my statement stepped on some toes, whatever. But when the mob mentality strikes ppl get pissed and say whatever. You ppl are acting like its the worlds greatest end all to Flash Supressors /Muzzle brakes. Thats the same way ppl act when a new gimmick is introduced. I read the tests, im sure it helps. I personally think there are other muzzle brakes that needed to be tested. They compared a closed flashhider to ones that are slotted on the sides. of course all the pressure is goin to go forward, it has no where else to go. I dont know how much it cost, but I have used a Levang Linear Muzzle brake, I know it works and does the same things thing does.



Ah, okay.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:33:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 6:34:47 PM EDT by TexasSIG]

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

It was more or less a figure of speach. I dont like the looks of it. That is how I feel. Apparently my statement stepped on some toes, whatever. But when the mob mentality strikes ppl get pissed and say whatever. You ppl are acting like its the worlds greatest end all to Flash Supressors /Muzzle brakes. Thats the same way ppl act when a new gimmick is introduced. I read the tests, im sure it helps. I personally think there are other muzzle brakes that needed to be tested. They compared a closed flashhider to ones that are slotted on the sides. of course all the pressure is goin to go forward, it has no where else to go. , but I have used a Levang Linear Muzzle brake, I know it works and does the same things this does.




it has nothing to to with mob mentality, but when you say you don't like a proven product
that does exactly what it was designed to do is bad because of looks, your
credibility is GONE.

This is not a toy, it's a tool for a specific purpose, SBRs of 11.5" or less.

There is a huge difference with a short barrelled rifle. These things have nasty muzzle flash
and blast up close. All the flash hiders and muzzle brakes on earth SUCK with SBRs.

In addition, SBRs with barrels less than 10.5 sometimes exhibit function problems
because there is not enough gas pressure to reliably cycle the weapon, especially in
full auto. The Krink solves that because it provides, in addition to flash hiding, some back
pressure because of an expansion chamber designed into the FH. This thing can
make HUGE differences in the reliability of short barreled weapons.

Also, there is a nasty muzzle blast associated with SBRs for the shooter and his teammates.
It is extremely disconcerting to be standing next to one of these things when fired,
especially in a closed environment. The Krink FH and it's cone force the muzzle blast
a LONG way in front of the muzzle, so standing beside one of these you experience
in practical use even LESS muzzzle blast than if you were next to a 20" AR.

That's HUGE for CQB. BIG DEAL here.

So, understand that this thing is way beyond gimmick, it's been in use on the AK
platform for many many years and now AR shooters have a chance to take advantage of this.

Now, for this particular thread and the guy asking about this on a 14.5, I have my doubts.

On a longer barrel, I don't see the real advantage. I moved mine over to a 16" AR
and I can't tell that it does anything at all, because th blast was already that much
further away.

But, in the right application, this is WAY beyong gimmick.

I would not recommend this for use on a barrel longer than 11.5, but at that length
and shorter, the difference is truly amazing.

So, it's no gimmick, but it's made for a specific purpose, and looks don't play into that.

This carbine here for example, this is a tool, it's not supposed to be cool looking

Link Posted: 8/20/2005 6:57:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 7:09:10 PM EDT by die-tryin]

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

It was more or less a figure of speach. I dont like the looks of it. That is how I feel. Apparently my statement stepped on some toes, whatever. But when the mob mentality strikes ppl get pissed and say whatever. You ppl are acting like its the worlds greatest end all to Flash Supressors /Muzzle brakes. Thats the same way ppl act when a new gimmick is introduced. I read the tests, im sure it helps. I personally think there are other muzzle brakes that needed to be tested. They compared a closed flashhider to ones that are slotted on the sides. of course all the pressure is goin to go forward, it has no where else to go. , but I have used a Levang Linear Muzzle brake, I know it works and does the same things this does.




it has nothing to to with mob mentality, but when you say you don't like a proven product
that does exactly what it was designed to do is bad because of looks, your
credibility is GONE.




Two words for ya PONTIAC AZTEC. It was proven to be effecient in cargo room , comfort and egonomics. It was ugly as hell and many voiced their opinon on it. Pontiac changed it. Credibility doesnt have anything to do with anything (other than of the designer of the thing) So your saying all millions of ppl that didnt like its looks lost credibility? on what level? It was an opinon, that is all. You guys took it upon yourself to attack me personally instead of stating facts *which I didnt need anyways, but atleast it was a worthwhile arguement. For the record, I did look at those three links that were provided. I read the info. I never said it wasnt effective, but I doubt its the end all to flashhiders. It WAS a mob mentality. The only credibility that is lost is in the ppl that did the attacking.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 7:08:18 PM EDT
Improvement or detraction from the functionality of a weapon should be the criteria for a part on a weapon . That is some of the problem with the current military, some of the 9999 mafia is more concerned with how an item looks vice how it performs.

If were issued a CQB upper vice an M4 I would want something like this brake/hider on my weapon. Not because of how it looks but how it has been reported to increase the reliability of the weapon.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 7:21:45 PM EDT
Hey guys,

The KFH is a specialized tool and most effective with the CQBR-type carbines. I have seen the KFH used on a 16" platform as well, and it's decent as a flash hider and still sends the blast forward. I think it's still viable on 16" guns, but the effect is not nearly as dramatic as on an SBR, which is where it shines.

TexasSIG mentioned the added backpressure the KFH provides to help the short guns cycle. Initial testing suggests this is the case, though I have not quantified how much additional back pressure it generates. The KFH does increase the gun's cyclic rate (all other things being equal) by approx 100-150 RPM. John Noveske has a special test gun with a modular gas system that allows him to change port diameters, which will help us see exactly how much effective back pressure the KFH generates.

The KFH is what it is. If you have a use for it, great. If not, no one can fault you for saving your money. I don't venture onto this forum often, but sometimes it seems that people buy their equipment based on criteria that revolves around how great it looks when they're all kitted up.

Stay safe,

Tim
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 7:22:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:

It was more or less a figure of speach. I dont like the looks of it. That is how I feel. Apparently my statement stepped on some toes, whatever. But when the mob mentality strikes ppl get pissed and say whatever. You ppl are acting like its the worlds greatest end all to Flash Supressors /Muzzle brakes. Thats the same way ppl act when a new gimmick is introduced. I read the tests, im sure it helps. I personally think there are other muzzle brakes that needed to be tested. They compared a closed flashhider to ones that are slotted on the sides. of course all the pressure is goin to go forward, it has no where else to go. , but I have used a Levang Linear Muzzle brake, I know it works and does the same things this does.




it has nothing to to with mob mentality, but when you say you don't like a proven product
that does exactly what it was designed to do is bad because of looks, your
credibility is GONE.

This is not a toy, it's a tool for a specific purpose, SBRs of 11.5" or less.

There is a huge difference with a short barrelled rifle. These things have nasty muzzle flash
and blast up close. All the flash hiders and muzzle brakes on earth SUCK with SBRs.

In addition, SBRs with barrels less than 10.5 sometimes exhibit function problems
because there is not enough gas pressure to reliably cycle the weapon, especially in
full auto. The Krink solves that because it provides, in addition to flash hiding, some back
pressure because of an expansion chamber designed into the FH. This thing can
make HUGE differences in the reliability of short barreled weapons.

Also, there is a nasty muzzle blast associated with SBRs for the shooter and his teammates.
It is extremely disconcerting to be standing next to one of these things when fired,
especially in a closed environment. The Krink FH and it's cone force the muzzle blast
a LONG way in front of the muzzle, so standing beside one of these you experience
in practical use even LESS muzzzle blast than if you were next to a 20" AR.

That's HUGE for CQB. BIG DEAL here.

So, understand that this thing is way beyond gimmick, it's been in use on the AK
platform for many many years and now AR shooters have a chance to take advantage of this.

Now, for this particular thread and the guy asking about this on a 14.5, I have my doubts.

On a longer barrel, I don't see the real advantage. I moved mine over to a 16" AR
and I can't tell that it does anything at all, because th blast was already that much
further away.

But, in the right application, this is WAY beyong gimmick.

I would not recommend this for use on a barrel longer than 11.5, but at that length
and shorter, the difference is truly amazing.

So, it's no gimmick, but it's made for a specific purpose, and looks don't play into that.

This carbine here for example, this is a tool, it's not supposed to be cool looking

homepage.mac.com/jayc67/sbr.jpg



Is that the one gun that you are proficient with?
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 7:33:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 7:35:47 PM EDT by TexasSIG]

Originally Posted By Riotgun:

Is that the one gun that you are proficient with?



Yes. I send several hundred rounds a month downrange with this one,
and I still contend that it makes a difference, and switching platforms around on
a whim is a bad idea tactically, but you guys have decided that somehow you can
move from gon to gun with no problems, and that's great.

I train with this weapon, and by that I mean I take classes from tactical entry
team leaders, well known instructors, etc. I believe it matters.

I don't agree with the philosophy that you can change weapons day to day.
If you think it's a good idea, knock yourself out.

I still contend that it's a recipe for disaster the one time you need it most.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 7:46:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TexasSIG:

Originally Posted By Riotgun:

Is that the one gun that you are proficient with?



Yes. I send several hundred rounds a month downrange with this one,
and I still contend that it makes a difference, and switching platforms around on
a whim is a bad idea tactically, but you guys have decided that somehow you can
move from gon to gun with no problems, and that's great.

I train with this weapon, and by that I mean I take classes from tactical entry
team leaders, well known instructors, etc. I believe it matters.

I don't agree with the philosophy that you can change weapons day to day.
If you think it's a good idea, knock yourself out.

I still contend that it's a recipe for disaster the one time you need it most.



Yeah, well, suppose that gun blows an extractor when TSHTF, and your only option if you want to remain armed is that you pick up a FAL or an AK or a Model 70 or a 10/22 or a TEC-9.

You're pretty much screwed, right?

Survivors are diversified. Casualties are specialized.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 8:49:59 PM EDT
Why the fuck is this thread turning into a pissing match. Keep the bullshit to PMs, and the thread to fact.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 12:56:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 4:51:35 PM EDT by RABIDFOX50]
>Deleted<

I removed my question about the Krink FS due to the thread drifting off target. Email sent to Denny's.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 8:34:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 8:34:51 AM EDT by Dissident]
From the reading Tim-L's posts and the right up in SWAT Magazine, sounds like the Krink is the cat's meow for SBRs. Being that I don't have an SBR, would putting one on a RRA Middy have any advantage? I like the thought of the reduced blast. Another of the benefits of the Krink is the fact that it causes back pressure thereby increasing reliability of SBRs. Would the back pressure cause problems with a Middy?
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 11:33:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By STLRN:
This one occasion that the Eastern Bloc was ahead of us and figured how to increase control muzzle blast and having the side benefit of increasing back pressure.


IIRC that's backwards, it was designed to increase back pressure for short barrel functioning, the muzzle blast control is a side benefit.
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 1:36:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Riotgun:

Yeah, well, suppose that gun blows an extractor when TSHTF, and your only option if you want to remain armed is that you pick up a FAL or an AK or a Model 70 or a 10/22 or a TEC-9.

You're pretty much screwed, right?

Survivors are diversified. Casualties are specialized.



No, you twist this around and misunderstand.

There is no way you can train to a high level of proficiency on several systems.
You can train to a level of FAMILIARITY with several, but HIGH PROFICIENCY
with one.

It's great to know how to operate all kinds of weapons, because you never know
what you will end up with. But in your training, if you are serious about it,
there will be one system that you spend more time on. If you are an AK person,
you will train with the AK 80% of the time and play with others whenever.

If you're an AR person, same thing.

If you are seriously worrying about SHTF or whatever, which would you rather have?

10 rifles of different makes, different calibers, and different spare parts or

10 of the same sytem, same maker, same spare parts, same ammo, only difference might be
barrel lengths or optics?

It's lots of fun to have different models of weapons, that's not what that other conversation
was about.

Having ONE weapon system that you know better than all others, that you go to without
having to think, and can operate without having to think because it is your "default"
mode, that's what you train to do. All armies and police departments train that
way for the same reason. It's only common sense, and arguing against
that by saying you should train to the same level on all your weapons means 2 things.

1) you have unlimited time and money to train to a high level of proficiency on all the weapons or
2) you train to a lower level of proficiency on several systems, with even your best performance
being less because you never developed a "default" behavior from switching around all the time.


Link Posted: 8/21/2005 1:38:29 PM EDT
This thread has gone off the reservation.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 11:12:10 AM EDT
In the FS test thread didn't the vortex and phantom flash suppressors function more than adequately on the 11.5" test rig? Not bashing the Krink as it has other desirable properties, just sayin'
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 11:29:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Skyssx:
In the FS test thread didn't the vortex and phantom flash suppressors function more than adequately on the 11.5" test rig? Not bashing the Krink as it has other desirable properties, just sayin'




So it becomes a personal preference and what you want the flash hider for.

From the operators point of view, the Krink reduces the flash a TON, so if you
want, as the shooter, to avoid flash then it's great because it pushes it so
much farther away from you.

If you are wanting a flash hider to reduce your flash signature to someone
on the muzzle end of things, then it doesn't work much different than an A2 or whatever.
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