User Panel
Saving from the archives. I need to go back and fix my old phuckitbucket links.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Originally Posted By AFCarbon15:
Saving from the archives. I need to go back and fix my old phuckitbucket links. View Quote |
|
|
Updated some of the Google docs.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Have my mill all set up and ready to go. DRO installed.
I have several end mills in my cart on EBay as recommended in these threads. Trying to determine whether to do the trigger and safety holes all the way through from one side or mill FCG pocket first and do those from both sides. Pretty good argument for each it seems. For those that drill all the way through, what size center starter bit are you using on the trigger pins? 1/8” and then follow with an 1/8” drill bit? Then step to 5/32 to finish? What about the safety? Does the bit chip the anodizing on the bottom side as it comes through? Good drill bit recommendations? Trying to get as much right as possible for the first try. Thanks |
|
|
I partially drill my pin holes and safety hole before I start milling and actually use them as a gauge while I am doing the milling, I pretty much know where I am by each time I open the pocket up to the holes. I have done the trigger hole, various ways over the last couple of years, I have drilled all the way through, I have waited until I am about 3/4 way done and I have done them after I have finished milling the pocket. The last one I did, I did after the pocket was done, I drilled at one end of the slot, moved to the other end of the slot and them moved the mill bed a small amount to open the hole up and touched up with a needle file before putting it together.
As far as chipping have not had that problem on any of the anodized lowers I have done. Have fun, don't get in a hurry and pay attention and you will do just fine. |
|
We are the People...!
|
I know it goes against most machining rules, but I drill from each side. Half way for the safety and a little over 100 thou deep for the hammer/trigger pins. And I do all of them with carbide end mills. Any real machinist would tell you 100 things wrong with the approach and how it should be done. But I've done enough within the limitations of my abilities and my equipment. I know what works best for me. After you've tried every way possible, you land on the method that yielded the best results with the highest percentage of success.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
What kind and size of mill bit are you using to bore from both sides?
|
|
|
I use a 5/32 for the pins and a 3/8 for the safety. Choke up tight for the pins, clear the chips a lot on the safety, go slow on both.
ETA, no starters, no pilots, just do it. 4 flute carbide for both. All though, I scored a deal on some 2 flute 3/8 carbide end mills and have tried those with great success. Again, I do all of this in a mini-mill. If you're limited to a drill press, you should NOT try this. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Thanks! I may try it both ways and see which works best for me. I’m using a bench type mini mill, but it’s a brute for a bench top.
Where are you all locating from to find center of the receiver? My side plates cover the receiver sides completely but I could Mill some notches to run the edge finder in to the receiver side. Other options to locate off; the inside of rear mag well or between front locate pins? If I run the edge finder onto the sides of the receiver will it mar the anodizing? Sorry, so many questions!! |
|
|
Originally Posted By larrys:
I could Mill some notches to run the edge finder in to the receiver side. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By larrys:
I could Mill some notches to run the edge finder in to the receiver side. Originally Posted By larrys:
If I run the edge finder onto the sides of the receiver will it mar the anodizing? There are pages and pages on thread after thread on 80%'ers. If it weren't for all the questions and answers we wouldn't have gotten this far. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
This thread is great. We're gonna do several at work in the next few weeks. We have an Enco with an X-Y DRO there. Should be fun.
|
|
.
|
I answer probably 15-20 emails a week based on this post. If anyone has docs or helpful pictures and would care to share, post them up or email them to me, I'll put them in the OP. You might be surprised how many people gain the will to jump into this endeavor with the right support.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Great Share OP. I too have been doing 80% for several years now. It's nice to go back and see stuff conveniently cataloged when you forget something. I noticed you used Photoshop. They gave up the ghost with changing their business model to not host images anymore for free. Try imgur.com I've been using it lately, but I tried posting on here in the Classifieds and it didn't work, maybe cause I'm a new member. idk. But non the less great post!!.
|
|
|
I have used postimage.org for quite a while now and it works great.
|
|
We are the People...!
|
You can upload images right from your computer now or copy/pasta the location from the web.
|
|
.
|
Like most of the guys here, years ago we went with photobucket. Worked great until they F'd us. Now all the archives threads suck. I have been going back to my open threads and replacing the photobucket crap. It's a slow process though.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Anyone take the time to drill undersize and ream to size for the FCG?
Just tossed another 80 in the mill and was thinking about it. Ive done a couple others and drilled the FCG with a 5/32 drill. And called it good. Haven't had an issue with any of those lowers. But thinking about reaming this one. Just to see if I could notice a difference. Judging by the quality of lower parts I've seen recently I'm think probably not. |
|
|
...believe in me, I'm with the High Command.
MO, USA
|
Originally Posted By sorionc:
Anyone take the time to drill undersize and ream to size for the FCG? Just tossed another 80 in the mill and was thinking about it. Ive done a couple others and drilled the FCG with a 5/32 drill. And called it good. Haven't had an issue with any of those lowers. But thinking about reaming this one. Just to see if I could notice a difference. Judging by the quality of lower parts I've seen recently I'm think probably not. View Quote Problem solved, I’ve standardized on this set up for all of my “80%” builds. |
"When trading bullets it is better to give than to receive" ___________________
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - George Orwell |
Originally Posted By PursuitSS: I definitely considered do that, but I figured a better and simpler way was use the correct size drill bit and install a Rise RA-140 drop in Trigger with KNS anti rotation/anti walk pins. Problem solved, I've standardized on this set up for all of my "80%" builds. View Quote |
|
|
I've drilled under sized and reamed to size. I didn't notice any better fit than stepping up the the correct size using quality bits. But, I've settled on using a short carbide end mill, choked up a little with only any inch or so hang out. I know it's not conventional, but I hit the holes from each side, no through hole. I do the holes first, then mill the pocket. I've evolved to this sequence by trial and error. Since, I've had great results and see no reason to change. YMMV.
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Fixed a few more photobucket links and saving from the archives. I think I'm all caught up on everyone's questions.
ETA: I can't read. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
I need to get some pictures up of my DRO setup. I'm still using the eBay cheapo's but I finally have TouchDRO running well enough that I haven't gone back to the old displays in about a year now.
ETA: Wrapped up a few projects in the shop today with enough spare time to clean up a little, so I took some pictures. Current Mini-mill Setup: Attached File Close-up of the Samsung tablet running TouchDRO Attached File The TouchDRO board in an acrylic enclosure I made Attached File All 3 Axis in one shot (the X axis is heavily guarded as it is the most open) Attached File Another angle of the "readout" board, being 8ga sheet metal, it makes a great project board holding plans, sketches and drawings with magnets. Attached File |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
I scored this Baldor gear motor. I think it's about as old as I am and never been used. I rigged it up as a power feed for my X axis. At the lowest speed, it doesn't have quite enough power to turn smoothly, but it still does better than I can by hand. Anything above the lowest speed is very smooth and makes the best cuts possible on my machine.
Control box Attached File My DIY drive engagement, it uses a 12pt sparkplug socket and a piece of delrin I machined to cradle the cog I attached to the socket. I didn't get the alignment perfect which I think is the main issue at low speeds. Some more tinkering when I find the time and it will be perfect, but as is, I'm very happy with it. Attached File |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
I bought the Easy-Jig Gen 2 jig and built my first 80% lower recently and it was easier than I could have imagined. I used a Ridgid router which I think I paid $100 for. The Easy-Jig Gen 2 is definitely built to last and was very well designed. The only issue I had was with the router but only because I didn't pay close enough attention when I was getting it all set up. There is a sleeve on the particular router I used which once you adjust your depth properly you are supposed to lock this sleeve in place and mine had too much slack in it leading to some chatter marks in my 80% lower. I eventually realized what was happening and corrected it but it was a little too late for my part. I would recommend buying the guides which are used when drilling the holes for your trigger group... they sell separately and I made the mistake of thinking that they were sold in sets which isn't correct apparently. So if you want one for each side of your jig like I wanted then make sure to order two! I was upset when my order came in only to realize I only got a single piece... I recommend buying two because it there is a little adjustment that must be done when installing them and if your going to make several lowers then it would save you a good bit of time if you only had to set them up once. Overall this new jig is the best thing since sliced bread and I can't wait to build more 80% lowers!
Picture 1 Picture 2 Picture 3 Picture 4 |
|
|
From the amount of IM's and emails I get about this thread and 80%'ers in general I get an idea of just how many are inspired to truly build their own ARs.
Build on gents, BUILD ON! |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Just hit 50k views. Damn the BRD is spreading!
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
...believe in me, I'm with the High Command.
MO, USA
|
As we get nearer to election time, I think we will see a huge increase in interest on finishing “80%” lowers.
|
"When trading bullets it is better to give than to receive" _____________________
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - George Orwell |
I too have the harbor freight mini-mill and am preparing it for motorized use hopefully full cnc later ( learn G-code ) but would love for you to post the arduino details of your setup.
I have been playing with the arduinos also and have been able to get the nema23 motors moving with a cnc driver shield and grbl with G-Code Sender application but would also like to run the machine manually and not have to use a computer to run the G-code sender app with a wired joystick shield as you have shown in your video you posted. Any details/wiring info you would like to share would be great. Still have to fab the two end plates/motor mounts for the x-axis and install the new ballscrews. This has been a fantastic thread to follow and was intrigued by the Touch DRO addition. Thanks and keep it alive!! |
|
|
Originally Posted By Nitrodog:
I too have the harbor freight mini-mill and am preparing it for motorized use hopefully full cnc later ( learn G-code ) but would love for you to post the arduino details of your setup. I have been playing with the arduinos also and have been able to get the nema23 motors moving with a cnc driver shield and grbl with G-Code Sender application but would also like to run the machine manually and not have to use a computer to run the G-code sender app with a wired joystick shield as you have shown in your video you posted. Any details/wiring info you would like to share would be great. Still have to fab the two end plates/motor mounts for the x-axis and install the new ballscrews. This has been a fantastic thread to follow and was intrigued by the Touch DRO addition. Thanks and keep it alive!! View Quote A side note, I often thought of semi-automated conversion to a manual mini-mill, but using Arduino/Raspberry Pi and cheap DRO's as feedback driven positioning instead of ball screws and encoded servo drives. Think basic operations codes like circles or corner rounding with a radius input. Maybe slotting, peck or chain drilling. Even engraving. Expandable of course. Similar to the CNC predecessors, but on cheap benchtop machines using embedded coding options. Possibilities are endless. My time however is not. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Originally Posted By AFCarbon15:
... I had absolutely zero experience when I started. View Quote Here's some data I've comprised that helps me through the process. This is by no means the end all be all of the process. I am no machinist. Mostly it just works for me.
This is my tool path for the FCG pocket. It is a slight variation of one I found somewhere online. The front take down pin is X zero, to locate, if I don't use a jig, I just put a 1/4" pin or drill bit in the hole and locate each side to calculate center. I usually use a jig though, which I drilled a hole at center of the pin off to the side so I can locate that hole. I'll post pictures later, it will make more sense. I center on the lower itself for Y, usually right in the middle of the FCG pocket area. The measurements are for the tool path of a 7/16 end mill. I've see variations for 3/8 and 1/4. But 7/16 seems to provide in the best radius. Perhaps others have more insight on other sizes. View Quote Excellent post. Thanks again. |
|
|
One of these days I’ll get to an 80
|
|
Originally Posted By Locke556:
A police state is a pretty sweet deal... For the police. |
This thread is a major inspiration.
I see a 5D Tactical jig in my near future... |
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Originally Posted By AFCarbon15: Climates like Virginia have lit fires under the asses of many. Fixed some photobucket links too. View Quote That and what they are trying to do here in PA by changing the classifications on 80% lowers. That is what has me interested. That and getting clone correct markings lol |
|
Instagram - @tactic_al & @classifieddefense
Classified Defense - www.classified-defense.com |
bumping to save from archives
|
|
NorCal LEO Offically Sanctioned Callsign: "Hold Fast"
"Shooting is like sex. I aint real good at it but I like to do it." ~Pangea |
...believe in me, I'm with the High Command.
MO, USA
|
This thread doesn’t go to the archives!
|
"When trading bullets it is better to give than to receive" _____________________
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - George Orwell |
Good bump.
Bumping is NOT necessary! |
|
|
Originally Posted By allensaldi: That and what they are trying to do here in PA by changing the classifications on 80% lowers. That is what has me interested. That and getting clone correct markings lol View Quote What's the status on CA lawsuit asking Fed judge to force ATF to word-smith yet again to make 80% illegal? |
|
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
Is clamping the trigger guard ears (with the bottom of the FCG area almost resting on the vice's top surface) sufficient for 80% Andersons, etc? I used to do that for 0% forgings, but I would cut the trigger guard slot last to save a lot of that material. My vise is obviously not very tall.
I noticed there's also a proof mark in the forging there, which is pretty prominent. Maybe grab the pistol grip boss instead and take 0.3" passes? Kharn |
|
|
Originally Posted By Kharn: Is clamping the trigger guard ears (with the bottom of the FCG area almost resting on the vice's top surface) sufficient for 80% Andersons, etc? I used to do that for 0% forgings, but I would cut the trigger guard slot last to save a lot of that material. My vise is obviously not very tall. I noticed there's also a proof mark in the forging there, which is pretty prominent. Maybe grab the pistol grip boss instead and take 0.3" passes? Kharn View Quote I made a few remedial fixtures for clamping near the trigger area. One thing about mini mills, is you can't take heavy cuts anyway, so your work holding doesn't always have to be the best. That said, I've have plenty of parts nearly ruined from coming loose. I'll try to get some pics of those fixtures. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
|
I have a 16" mill/drill from good ol' Enco, it's big enough to drill and tap a buffer tube. I forget the exact power rating, but it's either a 20amp or 220 circuit I had to run for it. My vice is just short. (That's what she said)
I guess I could clamp it horizontally to my 4" 90 degree block, and mill a piece of scrap to raise my parallels high enough to give it a level reference. Not like the FCG pocket needs 0.0005" precision. A billet lower with a curved integral trigger guard would be a bit tougher, maybe 3d print a short riser for it to sit on that references the pistol grip boss and the inside of the magazine well so the lower can't rotate relative to the riser. Kharn |
|
|
Anyone know which thread had some info on the different endmill bits for the 5D router jig? I had one saved in Amazon, but it's OOS & ones to specific sites I had bookmarked seem to have disappeared. I know there was a thread (or 2+) that mentions some, but damned if I can find them.
|
|
|
HTC-100-3312
https://www.the-carbide-end-mill-store.com/m5/100-3312--5-16-square-end-mill-stub-length-htc-100-3312-3-flute-gp-30.html Description: Carbide Square End Mill Stub Length, 5/16" x 1/2" x 2", 3 Flute, Uncoated, General Purpose, 30 Dimensions: DIA=5/16" FL=1/2" OAL=2" SHK=5/16" Brand: HTC Series: HTC100 General Purpose Diameter Information Cutter Diameter: 0.3125 5/16" Diameter Tolerance: +.000" -.002" OD Grind: Standard Shank Information Shank Diameter: 5/16" Shank Tolerance: +.0000" -.0005" Weldon Flats: None Length Information Flute Length: 1/2" Neck Length: N/A Over All Length: 2" Length Category: Stub Fluting Information Number of Flutes: 3 Helix Angle: 30° Flute Index: Constant Cut: Center Cutting Right Hand Spiral: Right Hand Coating and End Configuration Coating: Uncoated End Type: Single End Square Corner Radius: N/A Corner Chamfer or Taper per Side: N/A Materials Families: All (P, K, M, S, H, N) View Quote https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/5D-Tactical-Pro-jig-end-mill-service-life-/4-754315/ Those "should" work for the current "Gen3" 80% jig and the current Modulus jig that all use the same "ready mill" style adapter and general design of jig plates. If you are looking for the older style that were longer and thin: https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/I-found-a-source-for-specialty-end-mills-for-80-lower-Jigs/4-756796/ |
|
|
Originally Posted By Wangstang: HTC-100-3312 https://www.the-carbide-end-mill-store.com/m5/100-3312--5-16-square-end-mill-stub-length-htc-100-3312-3-flute-gp-30.html https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/I-found-a-source-for-specialty-end-mills-for-80-lower-Jigs/4-756796/ https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/5D-Tactical-Pro-jig-end-mill-service-life-/4-754315/ Those "should" work for the current "Gen3" 80% jig and the current Modulus jig that all use the same "ready mill" style adapter and general design of jig plates. View Quote Thanks! When I went to save one of those links I found out which folder I had them hidden in. |
|
|
Gents, I'm pulling the trigger on building my own but I'm really confused about tooling. if I buy a jig off of 80% Arms or 5D Tactical, do I need to buy their tooling as well? I get the feeling that their drill bits and end mills are cheap chinesium for inflated prices. Would it be easier to order from a place like Grainger or buy in person from a machine shop supply place? What exactly do I need to finish a mil-spec 80% lower?
|
|
|
Originally Posted By SailorAground: Gents, I'm pulling the trigger on building my own but I'm really confused about tooling. if I buy a jig off of 80% Arms or 5D Tactical, do I need to buy their tooling as well? I get the feeling that their drill bits and end mills are cheap chinesium for inflated prices. Would it be easier to order from a place like Grainger or buy in person from a machine shop supply place? What exactly do I need to finish a mil-spec 80% lower? View Quote I've been waiting for somebody with router jig experience to respond. While I can't speak directly to the router jig world, for milling machine tooling, I scour the internet. MSC, Grainger, ebay, amazon and many others. For what it's worth, I've had good and bad luck with import tooling. When it comes to machining, one can easily surpass the machine prices with tooling alone. |
|
A firearm is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have one, you'll probably never need one again. IG @jimstagramguns
|
Originally Posted By SailorAground: Gents, I'm pulling the trigger on building my own but I'm really confused about tooling. if I buy a jig off of 80% Arms or 5D Tactical, do I need to buy their tooling as well? I get the feeling that their drill bits and end mills are cheap chinesium for inflated prices. Would it be easier to order from a place like Grainger or buy in person from a machine shop supply place? What exactly do I need to finish a mil-spec 80% lower? View Quote If you buy the 80% Arms EZ Jig Gen 3 or the 5D Tactical Pro you will need to buy their end mill, or at least the holder, because they are proprietary. The drill bits you can supply your own. Most people say the bits that they supply are crap, even for Chinese made. |
|
|
Originally Posted By AFCarbon15: I've been waiting for somebody with router jig experience to respond. While I can't speak directly to the router jig world, for milling machine tooling, I scour the internet. MSC, Grainger, ebay, amazon and many others. For what it's worth, I've had good and bad luck with import tooling. When it comes to machining, one can easily surpass the machine prices with tooling alone. View Quote 5D works perfectly. The router with an end mill they send does great. I would suggest using a drill press for the drilling holes and not freehand. Billet receivers cut much easier than forged. The drill press gets long slivers of Al. |
|
"We were all focused on when technology would overcome human strengths, like intelligence and creativity. What nobody was watching for, and what has already happened is that technology has overcome human weaknesses, like addiction and tribalism."
|
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.