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Posted: 10/2/2005 5:57:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/5/2005 5:25:43 AM EDT by MauserMark]
Ok, the problem has been identified.

Originally I thought this was a wolf .223 round lodged in behind an already shot bullet, or casing, but after taking a double look it is one of my 5.45x39 rounds that were in another bag being used by my AK74.

Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:02:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:03:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 6:04:05 PM EDT by QUIB]
First thing I would do if the bullet is now pushed back into the case is to pour some oil down the barrel. This should ruin the powder so the round can not accidentally go off. The oil might also help loosen up the round so tapping it with a rod will dislodge it.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:03:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HiramRanger:
cleaning rod down the barrel and tap it out. If it hasn't cooked off by now, I doubt it will.



tried, bent 2 rods so far. Put another in and tap it with a hammer?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:05:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:

Originally Posted By HiramRanger:
cleaning rod down the barrel and tap it out. If it hasn't cooked off by now, I doubt it will.



tried, bent 2 rods so far. Put another in and tap it with a hammer?



Are you using a GI rod?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:10:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:12:33 PM EDT
How the hell would that happen? I'm just curious?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:15:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:
How the hell would that happen? I'm just curious?



Wolf


Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:16:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:
How the hell would that happen? I'm just curious?



you got me.

still no luck, now my last bore rod is stuck permanently with the bullet it seems.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:16:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 6:25:27 PM EDT by MauserMark]

Originally Posted By Troy:
Use a wooden dowel and a rubber mallet. If you don't have a rubber mallet, BUY ONE. This isn't something that you can afford to do unsafely! Keep your muzzle pointed in a safe direction, don't get in the way of the bore, and wear eye protection.

Also get a chamber brush and a rod so you can clean out your chamber properly.

-Troy



do they sell dowel rods less than .223 diameter?

my last rod, which is bent all the way down (part out of the barrel) and beating with a rubber mallot doesn't seem to budge this thing. I'm really starting to get scared that the chamber might be damaged. For the life of me I can't see how a live round was only pushed in this far and was stuck, or possibly was this live round pushed onto a spent round still in the chamber?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:42:56 PM EDT
Be very careful.

I would measure-off the distance inside your bore to insure you don't have a hidden bullet, jammed ahead of the visible round.

I saw this before where a second round couldn't feed, because a bullet squibbed just past the chamber, allowing a second round to get jammed just behind it (exactly like your photo).

A stuck-round happened to me, not too long ago. I bend two brass cleaning-rods before I used a 3/16" drill-rod (available at ACE Hardware) to hammer it out from the muzzle-end. Seemed to take forever....but it came out.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:50:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mfingar:


A stuck-round happened to me, not too long ago. I bend two brass cleaning-rods before I used a 3/16" drill-rod (available at ACE Hardware) to hammer it out from the muzzle-end. Seemed to take forever....but it came out.




thanks, I'll go get one tomorrow.

I'm scared there's damage to the bore or chamber, now one piece of my cleaning rod is permanently stuck, and I'm not sure if that will come out.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:51:05 PM EDT
Damn that sucks. If it was me I'd try to find something that dissolves that plastic coating they put on Wolf ammo. Try acetone, paint thinner, kerosene, whatever. If you find something that dissolves it, soak your upper in it. Just a wild ass guess though.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 6:53:09 PM EDT
I wish I had some suggestions, but I am tagging for outcome.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:04:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 7:05:01 PM EDT by BOHICA_Beast]
The same situation happened with a friend of mine who decided to shoot some of the dented and obviously misshappen ammo that was in a bulk .223/5.56 purchase. The cartridge in question was fed behind a first bullet jammed in the chamber.

We tried everything, ruining two rods and splintering three dowels in the process, before breaking down and ordering a case puller from Brownells. Brownells link

(It was a bit of an expensive lesson for my friend, but at least he learned what NOT to feed his rifle.)
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:06:59 PM EDT
This here is the perfect reason that you don't use WOLF ammo.

I'm doing some checking on how to disolve the laqure , but the laqure on the WOLF rounds melted while shooting and it cooled off to quickly and now its stuck.



Pat
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:10:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HarryStone:
Damn that sucks. If it was me I'd try to find something that dissolves that plastic coating they put on Wolf ammo. Try acetone, paint thinner, kerosene, whatever. If you find something that dissolves it, soak your upper in it. Just a wild ass guess though.



Thats a good idea!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:11:35 PM EDT
I'm not sure of the new polymer Wolf stuff, but the old lacquer coating would melt in a hot chamber and as it cooled it would 'bond' itself to the lacquer residue left behind from previous rounds if the rifle got hot enough. Could happen too if the residue was allowed to build up without cleaning it all out and after enough rounds cause sticking rounds, maybe even to the point of staying stuck. I would try putting paint thinner down the barrel overnight to try and loosen it.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:13:17 PM EDT
The same damn thing happened to me, actually... A wolf round would just absolutely NOT come out, and the extraction arm wouldn't let go either. NO AMOUNT of tapping (went through 4 rods!) would get it loose.

I finally hammered out the bolt, and with it the stuck round.

I also now have 700 rounds of wolf sitting around that I will absolutely NOT be firing.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:15:23 PM EDT
Have you tried a broken case extractor?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:21:05 PM EDT
This sux, Sorry I'm no help, But I would like to know the outcome. Good luck MauserMark
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:22:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 7:23:45 PM EDT by MauserMark]

Originally Posted By booker3557:
Have you tried a broken case extractor?



no I don't have one, and my biggest problem now seems to be the bottom half of my cleaning rod which is permanently stuck in the bore. I'm not sure if I poured paint thinner, it would get pass (what I'm guessing is) the mushroomed end of the cleaning rod, which probably swallowed the first stuck bullet.

I'm more scared that the casing, stuck bullet ahead of the live round and mushroomed cleaning rod haven't damaged the bore and chamber.

btw, when you guys mean bullet, you mean projectile fired out of the casing right? Is it possible one was fired and didn't leave the bore? Or are you talking about a spent casing that never was extracted, and then pushed further down the bore?
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:23:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mrraley:
This here is the perfect reason that you don't use WOLF ammo.

I'm doing some checking on how to disolve the laqure , but the laqure on the WOLF rounds melted while shooting and it cooled off to quickly and now its stuck.



Pat



+1
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:29:53 PM EDT
I guess I'll order the case puller from brownells, get the rear round out, then worry about pushing the cleaning rod through, will keep this updated, for learning purposes.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:36:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:37:17 PM EDT
had the same thing happen on a dr200 with some reloads. tapped round into case, and poured out the powder then proceded to pound out of chamber with heavy rod.

it sucked., I was sweating, especially after the range guy left me alone in the room and offered advise from the other side of the door.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:46:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:

Originally Posted By booker3557:
Have you tried a broken case extractor?



no I don't have one, and my biggest problem now seems to be the bottom half of my cleaning rod which is permanently stuck in the bore. I'm not sure if I poured paint thinner, it would get pass (what I'm guessing is) the mushroomed end of the cleaning rod, which probably swallowed the first stuck bullet.

I'm more scared that the casing, stuck bullet ahead of the live round and mushroomed cleaning rod haven't damaged the bore and chamber.

btw, when you guys mean bullet, you mean projectile fired out of the casing right? Is it possible one was fired and didn't leave the bore? Or are you talking about a spent casing that never was extracted, and then pushed further down the bore?



The chrome lining is really, really tough (think of the incredible pressure it stands up to at the range!!). You migh want to oil-soak it overnight (muzzle up) and try some more tomorrow.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:53:58 PM EDT
Out of a hunch I decided to look at the rim of the casing again. I had almost forgot that I had a bag of AK74 wolf ammo next too it.

my friend, unknowingly loaded a 5.45x39 round into the chamber. So it's safe to say there isn't a round ahead of it, just a wedged 5.45x39 round. I'm kinda pissed, and I already told him I'm holding him liable if the bore is damaged, because I clearly layed out for him what was .223 and what was for the AK74.

not sure if this makes my problem worse or better.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 7:57:21 PM EDT
Be CAREFUL and always point the muzzle to a safe point (away from you and others). Take your time, don't get too crazy with it. If the barrel is damaged, you can buy another one. There's NO replacing you!!!

BE SAFE and good luck!!!

Keep us posted.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:00:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
Out of a hunch I decided to look at the rim of the casing again. I had almost forgot that I had a bag of AK74 wolf ammo next too it.

my friend, unknowingly loaded a 5.45x39 round into the chamber. So it's safe to say there isn't a round ahead of it, just a wedged 5.45x39 round. I'm kinda pissed, and I already told him I'm holding him liable if the bore is damaged, because I clearly layed out for him what was .223 and what was for the AK74.

not sure if this makes my problem worse or better.



EEEEK!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:06:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SabreCat:
The same damn thing happened to me, actually... A wolf round would just absolutely NOT come out, and the extraction arm wouldn't let go either. NO AMOUNT of tapping (went through 4 rods!) would get it loose.

I finally hammered out the bolt, and with it the stuck round.

I also now have 700 rounds of wolf sitting around that I will absolutely NOT be firing.



Dude I will take that 700 rounds off of your hands for like 50 bucks. Seriously.

Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:06:23 PM EDT
Easy to blame the ammo until it is discovered it is "operator error".
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:08:27 PM EDT
I would soak the barrel with WD40 to ruin the powder so it doesnt ignite.... then work on that sucka
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:11:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
Out of a hunch I decided to look at the rim of the casing again. I had almost forgot that I had a bag of AK74 wolf ammo next too it.

my friend, unknowingly loaded a 5.45x39 round into the chamber. So it's safe to say there isn't a round ahead of it, just a wedged 5.45x39 round. I'm kinda pissed, and I already told him I'm holding him liable if the bore is damaged, because I clearly layed out for him what was .223 and what was for the AK74.

not sure if this makes my problem worse or better.




holy crap batman!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:13:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 8:14:07 PM EDT by TXAGGIECCL]
Sounds like your "buddy" jammed on the forward assist some when the bolt didn't close...

Just chambering a 5.45 round by hitting the bolt release would not cause it to be that stuck in the chamber...but hammering it home with the forward assist very well might!

Good Luck & I'll 5th the rec of trying to kill the round with oil/WD-40.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:17:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 8:40:55 PM EDT by BOHICA_Beast]
Okay... This confirms it. We both should never, ever let our friends handle our firearms unsupervised.

Edit: Hopefully there is a 5.45x39 case puller (or at least a compatible one for that round's rim dimensions) out there. It is always preferrable to work from the breech end.

Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:17:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eklikwhoa:

Originally Posted By MauserMark:
Out of a hunch I decided to look at the rim of the casing again. I had almost forgot that I had a bag of AK74 wolf ammo next too it.

my friend, unknowingly loaded a 5.45x39 round into the chamber. So it's safe to say there isn't a round ahead of it, just a wedged 5.45x39 round. I'm kinda pissed, and I already told him I'm holding him liable if the bore is damaged, because I clearly layed out for him what was .223 and what was for the AK74.

not sure if this makes my problem worse or better.




holy crap batman!!!!!!!


+1 That sucks
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:20:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By booker3557:
Have you tried a broken case extractor?



Those only work on broken cases such as when the head gets extracted but the rest of the case doesnt. They're like dummy rounds thet wedge into what's left of the case in the chamer and yank it out.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:23:41 PM EDT
For what it's worth, Methyl Ethyl Ketone, (M.E.K.) will dissolve lacquer residue. It's very very flammable, so I wouldn't use it when the round is stuck in there, (could turn into a bomb), but if you're just trying to remove the residue it will work great. Don't get it on any painted parts, they won't be that way for long. You can buy this at plastic supply houses.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:23:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By K9Copper:
Easy to blame the ammo until it is discovered it is "operator error".


Reguardless of human error, Wolf still sucks.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:32:47 PM EDT
That is majorly shitty. Good luck.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:34:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By K9Copper:
Easy to blame the ammo until it is discovered it is "operator error".




NO! NO! It has to be the Wolf. It caused my wife to leave and my dog to run away!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:35:29 PM EDT
same thing happened to me.
a 5.45 ak74 round made its way into my ar15 chamber.
I NEVER got it out,
had to replace the barrel.
If i remember correctly, i had to remove the buttstock to get the bolt out, then replaced the barrel.
I even brought it to a gunsmith, and he couldnt get it out.
the barrel is still in my safe with a note on it.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:35:38 PM EDT
Wow, I wonder if you should remove the barrel to get a better grip from BEHIND the round. Good luck.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:36:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BaNo:

Originally Posted By K9Copper:
Easy to blame the ammo until it is discovered it is "operator error".


Reguardless of human error, Wolf still sucks.



Whatever, I've never had a problem with Wolf. I've fired thousands and thousands of rounds of Wolf through my carbine with no issues.

I'm tired of reading "wolf sucks" on here. Thats nice, don't use it then. Take your opinions and shove 'em up your ass so we don't have to look at them. When you have something beyond mere opinion as to WHY it sucks, then speak up.

This is operator error.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 8:57:23 PM EDT
wrap some wire around the rim at the back of casing.

spool the wire out the back of the receiver.

wrap the wire around large dowel.

tap dowel with hammer to pull the round out.
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 9:04:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BaNo:

Originally Posted By K9Copper:
Easy to blame the ammo until it is discovered it is "operator error".


Reguardless of human error, Wolf still sucks.



Don't you have something better to do?


Wolf is fine.

WIZZO
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 9:05:36 PM EDT
[Family Guy]Wolf ammo murdered my father and raped my mother![/Family Guy]
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 9:15:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/2/2005 9:15:51 PM EDT by TXAGGIECCL]
I guess it really pissed some folks off that some of us don't use XM193 or Q3131A for all range sessions.
My M4's love the 55 & 62gr Wolf Polycoat, and at less than $2 per box shipped for my last order, well...you can suck it!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 9:18:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By QUIB:
First thing I would do if the bullet is now pushed back into the case is to pour some oil down the barrel. This should ruin the powder so the round can not accidentally go off. The oil might also help loosen up the round so tapping it with a rod will dislodge it.



+!1!
Link Posted: 10/2/2005 9:20:00 PM EDT
for a while i used wolf old laquer coated and new polymer coated and never had any issues with it.


as long as you clean the chamber after so many rounds than you are ok

the only reason i stopped using wolf is because its not accurate, stinks and shits all over.
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