Here is the basic course outline:

"Precision Applications, LLC will be conducting a 2-day Basic Precision Rifle Course on June 12-13, 2021 at the Elk River Training Center in Pelham TN on their 1,000 yard range.

4626 SR 50
Pelham TN 37366

Both days will start at 0800hrs Central Standard Time and run until approximately 1700hrs CST. There will be a 1 hour lunch break each day.

Cost for the course is $600. Limited to 10 students.

DAY 1
Topics covered will include (but aren't limited to):
Selection, care and maintenance of the entire system (rifle, scope, rings, mounts, ammunition, bipod, cases, etc.). This includes a comprehensive disassembly and other Armorer's tips.
Marksmanship basics
Use of optics (including adjustments and all other functions)
Use of data book
Zeroing
CCB/CHB/HFB
We'll shoot to approximately 500 yards on Day 1.

DAY 2
Use of a mil- and MOA-based reticles for ranging unknown distance targets.
Use of hold-offs as compared to dialing dope.
We will pick up where we left off on Day 1, and continue out to 1,000 yards. I will be working with each shooter to fine tune their skills and fix any issues they have.

We will shoot in 2 relays, so one relay can learn the proper techniques that a Spotter needs to assist the Shooter. All students will shoot to 1,000 yards.

Gear list will include:
Rifle capable of 1MOA. Bolt actions and semi-automatics are both welcome
Quality optics. The following features are mandatory on the optic:
-Finger adjustable turrets with audible/tactile "clicks", MOA or mil are fine
-Ranging reticle, mil or MOA based are both acceptable
Ammunition, 200 rounds. Ammunition must be "match grade" from a reputable manufacturer, or known handloads of equal or better accuracy
Data book w/ calculator (any calculator that multiplies and divides will work. I highly recommend the Storm Tactical modular rite in the rain databooks)
Rifle-mounted bipod, or front rest
Rear bag(s) (optional)
Shooting mat (optional)
Minimum 5 "dummy" rounds
Spotting scope (optional)
Eye and ear protection
Clothes and footwear appropriate to the weather. If it rains, we train, as long as there is no thunder/lightning.
If you are military/LE, it is preferred that you use your duty gear, body armor and other ancillary equipment that you will use on duty. Train like you fight!

ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENTS:
1. Contact me prior to enrolling and let me know what rifle and optic you plan on using.

2. It is preferred that your rifle be fully assembled and sighted in with a recent 100 yard zero prior to the class. The zero must be done with the ammunition that you will be using in the class. I offer my services for free to any of my students who need assistance with any rifle or optics work, or zeroing, that they may need.

3. Ammunition must be "match grade" from a known manufacturer, or handloads that you have shot out of the rifle you are bringing to the class and are sure of their accuracy.

4. A bipod or ruck to shoot off, as well as a rear bag. For a bipod, I highly recommend the Harris BRM-S (6"-9", notched leg, swiveling). I have bipods and rear bags to loan during the course.

5. If you don't have some sort of adjustable cheekpiece, or cheekpad, I recommend one. The comb of your stock needs to be high enough that your cheek bone rests on it naturally when you have a perfect sight picture, not your jawbone or the middle of your cheek. Ask several of my former students and they'll tell you this makes a HUGE difference.

Please do not hesitate to contact me if you have any questions about any of your gear. I would rather sort the problems out ahead of time than have you show up at the class with gear that won't work, or that is set up wrong.

We have plenty of equipment, including rifles and optics, to loan or rent. Just let me know what you need.

If you are a LEO, contact me about POST credit.

Other than confirming 100yd zeroes, all targets will be reactive steel."

ETA:  This not my course; it came up in another unrelated thread here on Arfcom.


Questions and issues to follow.

If they so choose to participate:

@cmshoot
@LoneWolf545
@taliv
@arowneragain
@Scoobysmak
@garbageman

As promised, specific issues I have need of advice for:

Rifle capable of 1MOA. Bolt actions and semi-automatics are both welcome:  I *assume* a standard off the rack Ruger American Predator in .223 will suffice.  This is bolstered by the fact that Vortex shows this rifle in use with their 4-12x40 Tactical Diamondback rifle scope page.  (Actually mine is not standard:  I cut the barrel to ~19" (I hate long rifles).

Quality optics. The following features are mandatory on the optic:
-Finger adjustable turrets with audible/tactile "clicks", MOA or mil are fine
-Ranging reticle, mil or MOA based are both acceptable:  Current scope on the Predator is the Vortex Diamondback 3-9x40 scope with regular coin-adjustable scope.  If there is no way to modify a coin adjust to finger adjust = New Scope.  Recommendations for either?

Ammunition, 200 rounds. Ammunition must be "match grade" from a reputable manufacturer, or known handloads of equal or better accuracy:  I plan to use IMI 77 OTM; Yes/No/GTFO?

Data book w/ calculator (any calculator that multiplies and divides will work. I highly recommend the Storm Tactical modular rite in the rain databooks):  Recommendations for a data book (the Storm Tactical is $45, ouch!)?

Adjustable cheek piece:  I have a non-adjustable cheek piece*, bought specifically for this Ruger Predator, but it's too high .  Yep you guessed it:  Recommendations?

OK, the hard part:  Recommended sites where I could go and read up on the basics in the next ~6 months or so so I can best be prepared for this class?

Thanks for the help!

* If anyone wants it, LMK; assuming of course I can find it.  I have no idea where I got it from (I had to kill that Amazon account); hence I only know it's color: coyote tan.

I’ve taken Shep's course. You won’t need to go in with much knowledge other then how to use your scope and rifle. He will give you the information you need to get you to shoot out to 1000 yards. It will help if you go to snipers hide forum and read some of the basics they have on long distance shooting so you are familiar with some of the terms that will be used in the course.

You should fire your rifle with the ammunition  you intend on using over a chronograph and then plug your numbers into a ballistics app to confirm you are still supersonic at 1K.

Vortex Viper PST Gen 2. I like mils but get whatever makes you happy.  

Cheekrest you can go Bradley (kydex) or a soft stock pack.  Triad makes a great one.

Concentrate on the fundamentals. Get used to shooting prone.  Make sure the scope is mounted properly and you have good eye relief and your reticle is clear.  Show up shooting MOA or less at 100 yards off a bipod with a rear bag.

Here's where I'm at:

-I'm pretty limited to one-day classes. I just can't ever get away for 2 days.
-I switched brass on my precision rig. I have exactly 50 pieces of the brass I currently use now, and no way to get more on short notice, nor any way to get ammo. So I couldn't commit to anything until we see what reloading component availability looks like this Spring.

I wouldn’t recommend that rifle or optic for the course.  I’m not saying that it won’t do it, but shooting out to 1,000 yards with a 5.56 isn’t something that I recommend for a beginning shooter. Yes, I’ve had students do it, but it ain’t easy.

.308 and 6.5 Creedmoor are by far the two most common calibers used.  Anything else in that class will also work just fine; .243 Winchester, .260 Remington, 7mm-08, etc.  

Finger adjustable turrets are a must-have for the course.  

The Storm Tactical databook is the one that I recommend, but I have a databook that I can email you.  You can print it out, put it in a folder, and use that.  

I have rifles and optics that students can use in the course, but you’ll have to supply the ammo.  I may be able to assist with that.

I can also recommend optics and rifles, if I know your budget.

What do you use, have or need?  I'm swimming in it.

I figured the glass would have to be replaced, but I never considered the rifle.    That leaves my 1954 M70 Winchester in .308 or RA in 7mm-08.  I don't have any match ammo for either.  I really wanted to use that RA in .223.  

None of my scopes (Leopold and Vortex) have the tactical finger adjustable turrets.  Lets say the budget is $350:  Yes/No/GTFO?

This data book:  http://www.stormtactical.com/heavypapercoil.htm or the pocket-sized book?  http://www.stormtactical.com/pocket.htm

Why don’t you borrow a rig from me for the course?   I have several rifles I can loan, bolt guns and gas guns, all in .308, and all topped with either a Nightforce ATACR or NX8 series optic.  All of these rigs have been from 100-1,000+ yards on multiple occasions.  

I prefer the larger databook, but I’ve used the smaller and it works fine.  I can also email you a databook that you can print out.

The 7mm-08 is a very sensible long range cartridge. I bet ammo availability is better by the time this class happens.

Optics:
https://www.swfa.com/optics/riflescopes.html#brand=SWFA%20SS,Vortex%20Optics&scope_type=Tactical&scope_tube_diameter=30mm&magnification_by_group=Fixed,Mid%20Power%20Variable,High%20Power%20Variable&price_sale=129.00,420.00


Sometimes Vortex will have sales on their 6.5-20 scopes with turrets for $300-$400. That's a very sensible entry-level scope as 6.5x is low enough for most hunting scenarios and 20x is high enough for anything. I have shot to 1250 with 16x. Unless you have really high end glass I don't see a ton of advantage to going any higher than 16x on a precision rig.

You could do much worse than a fixed 10x or 16x SWFA.


ETA: didn't see the post above me until I submitted mine. Good advice there too, of course.

I agree with everyone that says to take a different caliber/rifle and scope.

You can get to 1000 with your current setup but it would be like taking a Mazda Miata to a road race against Corvettes.  If you are that good with taking that shot, then you wouldn't need the class.

The more I think about it, that might be the best choice.  My concern is writing checks for hardware and equipment just to take a course when all I really want to do is hit coyotes at 100-500 yards (about max I can see on my and my neighbor's property) - with the rifle and ammo I already use and like.

So the big question becomes:  How will two days at the airfield with your rifle translate when I get home to my rifle?  Secondary question is ammo, but that's just a check problem I'd imagine.

BTW, thanks for patience, help and patience - I appreciate it.

The skills and practice will translate over into nearly any optically equipped rifle you choose to use in the future.  The fundamentals of marksmanship will help you put the bullet where it needs to go, regardless of what rifle you end up using later.  You’ll know how to work your scope, obtain and record dope, maintain your system, and more.

The course is also an excellent opportunity to see what other students are using, and let you handle that sort of kit before you buy.

I hate to answer for cmshoot, because he's far more advanced than me.  But I strongly believe that taking a PRS class with a capable rifle/optic can greatly improve your abilities with any platform, at any range up to the one you practiced/learned at.

What you learn in that class will help you kill coyotes at 500 yards with your 5.56 gun.

This is a kind offer and a good idea.  If you show up with a budget scope that won't track properly, the course is ruined for you.

I feel it’s very important for beginning students to have solid equipment and quality ammo suited to the task.  That way, if we run into accuracy issues, we can rule out the equipment, and concentrate on the shooter.

That's what I'm thinking.

Took a shot at a moving coyote this morning down on the bottom of my hill.  GE measurement is right at 235 yards.  Am I correct in *assuming* that since GE measurements are - by definition - horizontal measurements, there's no need to do an angle calculation?

Bottom of my hill.  The coyote was moving right to left at the tree line just to the left of the Black Walnut in the left center of the pic.  I took this pic about a half hour before the shot.  The reason I was able to see the coyote was that my dog was down there a few minutes before chasing off two coyotes.  This one made the mistake of trying to sneak away via my lower field.  He jumped and arched at the shot, so perhaps there is a dead coyote down the hill; won't be able to get down there until the "snow" melts later today.

That's gorgeous. At 235 yards, at a moderate downhill angle, you would have probably hit very, very slightly high. Like half inch or less. If you held for a center hit he should be dead.

I may not have made it clear:  The 235 is the horizontal distance (or corrected range).  I don't know the LOS distance (or slope range as show below).  My point/question is that GE Distance = corrected range.

I'm basing my assumption on this chart:




ETA:  I got this chart off the Sniper's Hide "Getting started in Precision Rifle Shooting. (Guide)" thread:  https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/getting-started-in-precision-rifle-shooting-guide.6284387/

Yes. GE will give you the corrected range. I mean, generally, within a yard or two or five. I bet he's dead.

I'm not sure.  He was moving, I was moving, the shot went off with the crosshairs just above his head.  He jumped/arched, then took off like a scalded cat.  I saw a glimpse of him about 50 yards away running parallel with the property line, still running.  

Waiting on the little bit of snow to melt, then I'm going to take my coyote-hating dog down with me (the same one that was down there earlier chasing them off) and look for him.  I'll also call my downhill neighbor and see if he can find anything in case the coyote crossed over and went on his property.

I know it's hard to walk on the mushy snowy ground right now, but the more snow that's left, the easier it'll be to find blood.

I don’t believe this is a PRS class. The PRS classes are taught more for engaging competition barricades/scenarios. Some of the information is translatable, but this seems to be more of a basics class.


OP, do you even know how good the IMI shoots in your rifle? It sounds like you don’t have a lot of experience with it. I’ve seen it shoot 3/4moa in some rifles and well over 1moa in others. If taking the class, getting a loaner rifle and ammo would be the way to go. Having a mil/mil or Moa/Moa scope with adjustable turrets is really a necessity for precise long range shooting. Yes, you may can get by without it, but you’re requiring a lot more luck even when shooting at 500yds. Learning how to use a scope and ballistics is valuable knowledge that you could take away from the course.

I assumed that PRS meant Precision Rifle Shooting.

Most I've ever done was a DMR class.  I know what that means.

ITT I learn that I REALLY want to take a class from cmshoot.

I don’t teach folks to be competition shooters, although many of the skills and techniques are the same.  I’m more of a practical application guy.


I was calling this course Basic Precision Rifle about 10 years before the Precision Rifle Series was inaugurated.  I’m not going to change the name of the course now.  What matters is what is taught, not what it’s called.  I came up with the name to differentiate it from Sniper courses that I was teaching to actual Snipers, whether they were military or LE.

Like the course says, it’s my “Basic” class, and is intended for beginner’s.  It is by no means the only course that I offer in this genre......I offer several that would be considered Intermediate and Advanced.

Merlin, as I sell old rifle and pick up new ones, my stable of loaner rifles changes a bit.  Here’s what I have currently available.  I doubt these will go anywhere between now and the course, while I do have a few new rifles I’ve been eyeballing.  All of these are .308.

JP Enterprises LRP-07, 18”, topped with a Nightforce ATACR F1 4-16x42mm.  Stock is a Magpul PRS, so it’s fully adjustable.

Steyr SSG-69, 16.5”, topped with a Nightforce ATACR F1 4-16x42mm, and a SilencerCo Omega suppressor.

Custom Bergara 18” bolt action 18” in a PDC Custom side-folding chassis, topped with a Nightforce NX8 F1 4-32x50mm, and a SilencerCo Omega suppressor.  Also fully adjustable.

No joy.  No body, no hair, no blood, my dog didn't react at the shot location.  No vultures in the sky either - which is unusual around here, usually they're all over the place.

I'm still a coyote virgin.  

View from the target area:



[end of thread hijack]

I've had a couple sessions with it.  Regardless, I don't like the accuracy but I think it's mostly me; it's not much different than any other ammo.  Heartbeat jitter and possible flinch.

Another unknown to me until yesterday was having my rifle set up correctly.  I've been watching Ryan Cleckner videos (right wrong or indifferent) but he places more emphasis on getting the rifle and optic set up correctly than spending $$$ for more or different gear.  The good news is that puts spending $$$ on the back burner.

As I mentioned in my PM response:  +$7000 in optics alone for three rifles.  $350 for a new scope isn't gonna solve diddley-squat.




ETA: for clarity: it will *probably* be the bolt action.  But 'spect you'll have recommendations when we meet.

Thanks!

Key words that stood out for me.  My biggest concern with taking this class is wasting class time while I learn how to spell "shoot".

Red = Do you know a Dr. Fred Simons?  EE professor at FTU/UCF in the late 70's?  He used to say almost the exact same thing in the EE classes I took with him.  In +40 years I've never known anyone else to say it or anything else close to it.  

Thanks!

In theory, I understand what your saying.  Your comment about optics >>> rifle is exactly right, IMO.

In practice:  Largely irrelevant - until I know what I'm doing.  That means a class from a competent instructor - First.

The other reality:  A +$1000 scope simply isn't going to happen.  This is like buying +$500 competition 4x4 tires for my F-350 - so I can take the garbage into town once a week.  Remember:  coyotes at 200-400 yards or so; competition isn't on the menu.


Having said all that:  Give me some specifics on your recommended non-NAPA-type scopes.

Thanks!

I'm not planning on using what I have.  I plan to use what the course instructor will lend me.  See posts above by CM.

Your posts jogged my memory:  I could also use my Armalite AR10A4, I forgot about that rifle for some reason.  But, just like the RA .223 (and all my other rifles) it comes with a 3-9x40 regular coin-adjustable scope.

And I refuse to spend $$$ until I know WTF I'm doing.

You'll be really handicapped if your optic doesn't have finger adjustable turrets.

Agree.  But as stated before, my plan is to borrow an instructor-provided rifle with optic for the class, not use one of mine.

The alternative is to buy an optic for my rifle, take the class, kick myself for not buying the right optic - then buy a better optic (or live with a suboptimum optic).

Merlin, I sent you my email via PM.  Hit me up and we can go over options for you.

CM, I don't see it in my PMs as of right now.  

ETA:  Sent you a PM with my e-mail address.

Email sent.

Got it.  Looking for ammo.  :(

Right now, getting ammo is my biggest concern.  Prices right now are about 2/3s the cost of the class!!!!     And that's if you can find it.  

Here's what was recommended:

What you would need is .308 175grn match ammo.    Federal Gold Medal, Black Hills, IMI Razorcore, USGI surplus M118LR/XM118LR, etc.  Hornady 178grn, also.  Federal Gold Medal loads a 185grn Berger Juggernaut that is great stuff.

I'd be very interested in talking to you about a trade assuming you have something I can use.  PM sent.

Thanks,