Title says most of it. I've been thinking about a 22br pretty seriously, but I don't really want to have to turn necks. I will, but I hate doing it. Would like to be able to hit 3900-4000fps fairly easily, for prairie dog shooting. So that means a 1:14 twist.

Which defiance action should I go with? I've read some conflicting info about being able (or not able) to put pre fit barrels on actions such as the Deviant, but I know the ruckus will work, and possibly the anti, and tenacity.

I would go with the 22-250AI but i've read the shoulder doesnt give much advantage over 22-250. I already have a factory 250, and it's boring. and then I thought about a swift, but meh, you can buy that caliber in the gun shop.

I think 90% of the time will be shooting it at the range. 100% suppressed... when I finally get my cans.

I would go 20 cal, but the damn wind blows it around too much.

Also thinking about the new mcmillan U-1. anyone have any experience with it?

Lets start with ..... what can you find brass for?

22PPC?

What can't you find brass for?


I dont really want to go down to a 30 grain bullet. I'd like to keep it 40 or above. Preferably 50-55 but that just isnt going to happen.

What about 22 Creedmoor? Think there's actually properly headstamped brass out there. I've seen a couple threads on Snipershide and people seem to like them.

243 Catbird

68-70 gr. bullet ................... 4100 f.p.s.
85 gr. bullet ........................ 3800 f.p.s.
95 gr. Nosler Partition ......... 3500 f.p.s.

Hey, you wanted unique

I will have to do a little research on this... How much freebore would one need for 40-55 grain bullets? I'm seeing a preferred prefit with 80... I was thinking more like .050.

hmmmm. basically a 6mm-284. I like it! Will also have to research this.

Man it’s really hard to beat the .22-250 and .220 swift for the criteria you laid out. But you’re going to heat up your suppressor really quickly with those two cartridges. I’m kinda wondering how many rounds you shoot without cooling before you suffer baffle damage?

The.223 AI will get you close but burn less powder. Therefore giving you a few more rounds between cooldown. If you decide to go something odd like a .22-08 or.22 bench rest you will still need to turn necks due to the resizing process.

The 6mm Creedmoore will probably be the most versatile within the prairie dog fun park. It will buck the wind yet still give you a wider range of bullets to choose from. It just won’t be quite as explosive as a .220 swift at close range.
I’m assuming the .22 Creedmoore is just a kissing cousin to the .22-250 with a different twist rate.

Now I’m curious as to what you will do here. There’s been years upon years of people sniping prairie dogs and the.22-250 and.223 have become the standard.

.204 ruger?

Well, I'm Planning to keep the barrel fairly cool, but if I get on a hot dumb dog town, that might go out the window. Not really worried about burning barrels up as they will be prefit (no gunsmith). I would also like to do the MOA all day challenge and such.

Which one though? I've basically narrowed it down to the Ruckus or Tenacity. I like that the ruckus has integral rail, but i like the price of tenacity.

Whichever one you can find in-stock in the configuration you need.  I'd probably just get the Tenacity to save some money if anyone has one in stock.  Defiance is massively backlogged and has been for a while, so if it's not in stock who knows when you'll get it.  As of a couple months ago, they were estimating 15-18 months.  I've been waiting for a Rebel in a fairly oddball configuration since November, 2021.

Anyone do business with Pucker Factor Precision in Wyoming? I just talked to a guy there that has one Tenacity in stock. alarm bells went off when he asked me if I did Venmo, and said credit card was fine but it would be "easier" on him to do Venmo...

I have not done business with them, but I have seen a business sign for them in Evanston. From the location of the sign I figured it was ran out of someone’s home.

I just bought a defiance anti from them 3 weeks ago.  Paid with card on their website and they shipped it the next day.  I would buy from them again

Thanks for posting! Hope I didn't kill your only post for the year. If it wasn't for you, i probably wouldn't have ordered.... now, to find a damn mcmillan in stock

Good luck! We’re waiting on pictures.🤠

In process of ordering a mcmillan stock... What bottom metal do I want? I'm not really even sure I would use a magazine of any kind.

I might consider Manners stocks if they were cheaper than Mcmillans. I like the look and feel of Mcmillans better.

I do like the look of the T4A. ok, I'll look into it.

excellent! I assume you are using the 22br norma spec chamber? What dies do you have? Redding type S?

OK, I'm confused on bottom metal... The dude i bought the action from says it is a wyatt's length BDL, and works with aics mags as well. That means what exactly?

If I wanted detachable mags, what would I need to buy? If I dont want detachable mags (Hinged floorplate) what do I need?

I am completely confused.

Now that Defiance has put their price increases into effect, if you don't already have the action waiting to be built, now would be the time to consider other actions that are now cheaper than Defiance, or the bump in price puts it in direct competition with actions from other manufacturers. Like someone else mentioned before, you can buy a Bighorn Origin and get a barrel for it( you can go prefit if you pick a more standard caliber but the same holds true for having a blank cut) for what a Tenacity now sells for. For your stated uses, there's nothing missing from the Origin that the Tenacity offers that makes up for that significant cost savings. I'd buy the origin and use the money saved on better optics or ammo/ reloading components.

Wyatts makes both blind magazines as well as extended length internal magazine boxes...So the second type works just like the factory internal does, it able to hold and feed the really long coal type loads  that are often built to maximize a cartridge.. They also sell bottom metal that removes all the stock internal box mag and replaces it with a new trigger guard/mag well that will hold the separate magazine..Wyatts is tops for extended internal mag box for  Rem 700 long action rifles.. It allows up to 4.00" coal ammo to mag feed from and internal mag..When it comes to removable magazines the longest I know of is the AICS type long action mags that are extended to 3.850" CIP, which allows them to feed  roughly a 3.720" long cartridges..They actually have 3 different long action magazine depths, you need to know what you  are wanting to do, and make sure the bottom metal and the mags are compatible and will give you the results you want..Most all of the chassis rifles use magazines, again, the length  the mag is made for is very important...My MPA BA chassis is able to adjust for all 3 with a simple bolt in tab to space everything right...Not all  do and its a real headache...
 I would run a Wyatts internal 4" if I ran a stock, with a chassis or stock running magazines, I would use accurate mag stuff as much as possible, right down to the fact they make 2 mags for 338LM and 300RUM cartridges..the rum mag will hold 338LM but the 338LM cannot hold rum cases without heavy modification..the LM case as is common for most all AICS type magazines..




https://wyattsoutdoor.com/product-category/internal-magazine-boxes/extended-length/page/2/

https://accurate-mag.com/product-category/magazines/

This is their typical kit, make sure it matches what you have..I would always go for the longer 3.850" CIP magazine or the 4" Wyatts internal box..They allow you to load as long as possible to maximize your cartridge...

These are RUM, both of these kits/mags are the same except the rum mag has the deep shoulder ridge moved forward to clear the shoulder..338/300 wm mags do not that ridge is right in the way of the shoulder..guys got around that by grinding out that ridge, which voided the warranty and allowed more flex in the side walls..

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This is all others, 338LM, 300wm, 30-06...and again they come in 3 lengths..

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Uhh, what about short action?

Too late. I bought the tenacity for 900 shipped...

It's a mess, even more screwy than long action..here is a decent report on it....

https://www.ronspomeroutdoors.com/blog/short-action-rifle-versus-long-action

I know most guys who want to load a short action longer, just chamber their cartridge in a long action rifle..I know defiant builds a medium length action between a short action 700 (2.80")and a long action 700(3.715")...I  assume someone is making a magazine for it...

I went and investigated it, yep blind DBM kit that fits the 3.2" XM as they call it medium action...Nobody makes a standalone AICS type magazine for it that I see...

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Defiance calls it the XM action.....Short action is Remington  model 7 action, medium action is Remington 700 short action, Xm is their intermediate action(3.2") and long is Remington 700 long action...The XM is available in all their actions as is the medium and long..the short model 7 action is not available in all their actions......

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The XM length is proprietary  to defiance, you can get it with internal box magazine or as bottom metal with external 10 rd magazine..they sell both setups....If one was running short action, their setup would give you quite a bit more freedom, for COAL, but its theirs alone, I don't see anyone else offering it...

Ah, ok sorry, thought you were asking how defiance determines them...

thanks for the replies guys. It's the Defiance medium (remington 700 short). I've pretty much decided on non detachable mags, so what hinged floorplate/box, follower should I use?

Thanks, ordered the bottom metal, action should be here Monday. Ordered a barrel this morning in 22BR. And since I would have had to wait for a manners stock anyway, Just sent in an order to McMillan.

I'm super excited to see the stock. Also cant wait to see the VCC profile barrel! Edit: It's gonna be a long boy @ 28".

Thanks for all the help guys... Now to find a 22br sizing die...I think I'm gonna hold off on ordering more stuff for a few weeks and let my bank account catch up again

I'm sure this is a dumb question but I wonder what Dead Air would say about putting a Nomad-L on it. Tried E-mailing them monday about it and havent heard anything. Also,
@Mageever (Spelled right?) Doesn't accept private messages...

Picked up my action

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sweet..

X2! Are you still going 1-14 twists? After having a 1-7 I wouldn’t look back.

No, SJA didn't have 1:14. I went with 1:8.

Well I got my trigger and bottom metal... Between this triggertech diamond and my old jewell hvrtsbr, I think I like my jewell better, but time will tell.

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Looking good. Now waiting on barrel and stock pics.

I've never shot with a Jewell only dry fired one a few times. Couple of the old timers I know love their Jewells and will never get rid of them. One of them had an AR trigger that I guess was hard to find and he said he'd never used anything that felt as good.

I think Jewel is the way to go if you’re using a really light weight trigger. But for a hunting weight trigger in the pound to pound and half range I can’t really tell a significant difference. But then again I got electrocuted and my right hand has some nerve damage and my index finger doesn’t have the feeling it once had. And it may be imaginary but my Jewel seems to have a different feel when you drop down to the tip of the trigger or ride up the trigger vs my Timiney or Rifle basic.