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Posted: 8/12/2017 6:40:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Trikky74]
Hi,
So today was my first day, ever, shooting a bolt action .308. Previously I have used assorted handguns and carbines, this however was a big change from what I was used to. I am attaching some images of today along with what was happening, any advice you all could throw my way would be appreciated. I bought a Remington 700 sitting in a Bell and Carlson medalist stock w/magazine. It has a Harris bi-pod and a VIPER HS 2.5-10X44 scope. I shot today from prone at an outdoor range and I was having issues from the very beginning. I was having a problem getting a good position on the rifle without losing the sight picture. I'm pretty sure I was booger hooking the shit out of the rifle, my groups were absolutely atrocious. On the plus side, I am pretty happy all 15 rounds I sent downrange hit the target at all lol! The target was only set at 100 yards.  Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 8/12/2017 8:32:24 PM EDT
[#1]
It appears you need a good bench rest and get comfortable.
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Posted: 8/12/2017 9:42:10 PM EDT
[#2]
What bench-rest would you recommend? I'm thinking of going low-tech tomorrow and filling a sock with sand to put under the butt, see if that gets rid of the "wiggles".
Thanks for taking the time to reply! |
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Posted: 8/12/2017 10:03:22 PM EDT
[#3]
Absolutely use a rear bag and squeeze it with your off hand for minute elevation adjustments. Try to load the bipod (apply pressure) consistently.
For getting a cheek weld, place your chin on top of the stock and gradually drag your face down the stock until you get a good view through the scope, then freeze. Long term, get a foam pad like an Army sleeping pad and cut some shims out of it and tape it in place so that it positions your face perfectly for a good cheek weld without interfering with bolt throw. |
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Posted: 8/12/2017 10:25:18 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Skunkeye:
Absolutely use a rear bag and squeeze it with your off hand for minute elevation adjustments. Try to load the bipod (apply pressure) consistently. For getting a cheek weld, place your chin on top of the stock and gradually drag your face down the stock until you get a good view through the scope, then freeze. Long term, get a foam pad like an Army sleeping pad and cut some shims out of it and tape it in place so that it positions your face perfectly for a good cheek weld without interfering with bolt throw. I will try and make that happen tomorrow at the range. Thanks for the response! |
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Posted: 8/13/2017 8:32:57 AM EDT
[#5]
A good rear bag will help as will building up your cheek weld with either pad or getting a good stock pack, which I would recommend, but that said sounds like you need some instruction on the fundamentals of shooting a long range rifle. If you have no one local then take a look at Frank from Snipers Hide's videos. He has a good YouTube page and gives good info. With that beware of some other Youtube videos as some aren't as good and can actually pass on bad info.
https://www.youtube.com/user/SHLowlight/videos Also you need to check that the sight picture issue isn't due to an eye relief problem. Who mounted the scope? Some short things to work on: Position: Get directly behind the rifle with legs spread and heels down if possible. Body in line with rifle and not canted to one side or the other. Rifle into shoulder pocket which is actually the top third of recoil pad on the collarbone area. You should be relaxed and not propped up on elbows or using muscles. Cheek weld: Should be comfortable to lay face down on rifle and look through scope and that's where the padding and stock packs come in. Sight picture: Should be clear and no shadowing. You shouldn't have to crane your neck forward or pull it back to get this. If you do the scope needs to be readjusted Breathing: Breath normal and take the shot on the natural respiratory pause. Don't hold your breath or push it all the way out. Take the shot within 4-5 seconds of coming to natural respiratory pause or start over as holding breathe can mess with the eyes. Trigger press: you want the middle of the pad of the finger pressing straight back on the trigger. You should almost have a 90 degree bend in the trigger finger. Press straight back and keep it pressed back as you ride the recoil during follow through and then let finger off the trigger and work the bolt for next shot. Do not booger flick and jerk the trigger and have your finger flick right off as the shot is breaking. Those are just some quick basics and I am sure I forgot something but it's a sunday morning LOL Watch some of Frank's videos and it will help. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 8/13/2017 10:29:11 AM EDT
[#6]
Add adjustable cheek rest (Karsten type) so you can get a cheek weld. Find natural point of aim and use a rear bag like you've already been admonished. If you shoot from a bench pull the bipod and use sandbags to rest the front (even if you have to stack the bags on a block of something). Get a recoil pad like: https://ads.midwayusa.com/product/367156/past-mag-recoil-pad-shield-ambidextrous?cm_mmc=pf_ci_google-_-Shooting+-+Range+Accessories-_-PAST-_-367156&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIrITu37XU1QIVx4F-Ch10JQPwEAQYASABEgLUx_D_BwE It REALLY takes the bite out so you can focus on your trigger pull and follow through at a bench.
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Posted: 8/13/2017 3:23:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Rob01:
A good rear bag will help as will building up your cheek weld with either pad or getting a good stock pack, which I would recommend, but that said sounds like you need some instruction on the fundamentals of shooting a long range rifle. If you have no one local then take a look at Frank from Snipers Hide's videos. He has a good YouTube page and gives good info. With that beware of some other Youtube videos as some aren't as good and can actually pass on bad info. https://www.youtube.com/user/SHLowlight/videos Also you need to check that the sight picture issue isn't due to an eye relief problem. Who mounted the scope? Some short things to work on: Position: Get directly behind the rifle with legs spread and heels down if possible. Body in line with rifle and not canted to one side or the other. Rifle into shoulder pocket which is actually the top third of recoil pad on the collarbone area. You should be relaxed and not propped up on elbows or using muscles. Cheek weld: Should be comfortable to lay face down on rifle and look through scope and that's where the padding and stock packs come in. Sight picture: Should be clear and no shadowing. You shouldn't have to crane your neck forward or pull it back to get this. If you do the scope needs to be readjusted Breathing: Breath normal and take the shot on the natural respiratory pause. Don't hold your breath or push it all the way out. Take the shot within 4-5 seconds of coming to natural respiratory pause or start over as holding breathe can mess with the eyes. Trigger press: you want the middle of the pad of the finger pressing straight back on the trigger. You should almost have a 90 degree bend in the trigger finger. Press straight back and keep it pressed back as you ride the recoil during follow through and then let finger off the trigger and work the bolt for next shot. Do not booger flick and jerk the trigger and have your finger flick right off as the shot is breaking. Those are just some quick basics and I am sure I forgot something but it's a sunday morning LOL Watch some of Frank's videos and it will help. I purchased the rifle used, so the scope and everything else were already mounted. I will take a look at those videos before i head out to the range this afternoon, thanks again! |
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Posted: 8/13/2017 6:58:53 PM EDT
[#8]
I think I've found the issue, or at least part of it.
The rifle was used and I "assumed" it was zeroed to 100 yards. It wasn't. Plus, I need to relocate the scope to a spot that works for me, I can't maintain any sort of sight picture at 10x without damn near breaking my neck.  Attached FileAbove grouping is using best guesstimate with non dialed in scope.  Attached FileI seriously need to get this scope set for me and dialed in. |
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Posted: 8/14/2017 7:13:11 AM EDT
[#9]
Buy and read this book. https://ryancleckner.com/books/
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Posted: 8/14/2017 3:34:15 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironmaker:
Buy and read this book. https://ryancleckner.com/books/ |
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Posted: 8/15/2017 10:24:29 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trikky74:
Thank you Amazon Prime for the free kindle edition. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Trikky74:
Originally Posted By Ironmaker:
Buy and read this book. https://ryancleckner.com/books/ |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 8/25/2017 9:54:01 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironmaker:
Buy and read this book. https://ryancleckner.com/books/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/151865472X/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=151865472X&linkCode=as2&tag=cleckner0c-20&linkId=8873d110e1f194d7ea50751357122701 |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 2/12/2018 8:29:44 PM EDT
[#13]
Seems like you started down the right path when you mentioned having to move the scope, which is what I wanted to touch on after reading the whole thread. It sounds like you purchased the rifle, but didn't adjust it to you. I'd recommend loosening the scope rings where they interface with the scope itself, and having a friend helping, get as comfortable as you can behind the rifle, and having your friend move the scope either towards or away from you as needed until you are comfortable and have a good view down the scope, with no scope shadow. If you have a few levels, you can level the rifle, and ensure the scope is level too, or use a plumb line if you only have one level, then tighten the rings down.
Hope that both makes sense and helps. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 3/18/2018 12:00:13 AM EDT
[#14]
Also get some better ammo than PMC. Try some Federal Gold Medal Match 168 and 175. See what the gun likes. PMC isn't kb own as the most accurate ammo for groups.
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Posted: 5/22/2018 9:21:49 PM EDT
[#15]
You may have to move the scope forward or rearward to obtain better eye relief. A rear bunny eared bag will help a lot.
You fired full metal jacket ammo which is the worst as far as accuracy is concerned. Try Federal Gold Medal Match, Black Hills or Australian Outback ammo using Sierra 168 or 175 grain hpbt match bullets. Try shooting in the prone position with the bipod in the dirt. I put forward pressure on the rifle to load tension against the bipod. Trigger and breath control have to be consistent shot to shot. I firmly grip the rifle, but use very light trigger pressure increasing until it breaks. I concentrate on placing the center of my fingerprint swirl in the center if the trigger. Make sure you squeeze straight back. |
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