AR Precision Testing (Page 5 of 8)
|
Originally Posted By sea2summit:
I'd second Grendel. Mine wants to play but it is suffering from bad glass right now, I've had a lot of groups that are really good but haven't shot it specifically for groups much. |
Chicken Farmer by choice hunter of shade tree's and hiding spots by nature.
|
Originally Posted By Lennyo3034:
Grendel is the more interesting one to me. Mainly because already have a 6.5 CM. I like my current 6.5creedmoor, but I’m interested in trying another version. Still torn between the LT UU or the Seekins SP10 builders kit. |
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge: I believe the 6.5 grendel will definitely be purchased. I’ve been wanting to try a 22grendel, so it would be a barrel and gas block swap to evaluate two grendels (assuming the bolt headspace with the second barrel). I like my current 6.5creedmoor, but I’m interested in trying another version. Still torn between the LT UU or the Seekins SP10 builders kit. |
Mentioned in a previous thread to bfoosh06 that I’d give the JB bore paste a try on the BCA barrel that wasn’t consistent. The bore definitely could use some TLC since it looks pretty rough from a basic “look through the bore”. The feed ramps, which I noted upon receipt, were pretty rough as well. I decided to take 15-20 minutes to try and clean them up a bit as well prior to re-assembling the upper.
 It would be great to get this barrel to shoot decent. In the past, it would shoot 3-4 rounds decently, then have 1-2 close to 1/2-1” away. |
While the Berger 85.5’s appeared similar in the BTO measurements as the 80 eld’s, the ogive position is much further away when loaded at the same COAL, resulting in noticeably more jump. This of course plays a factor when loading for a gas gun using standard AR mags. It will be interesting to see how they perform and what velocities they can achieve in the 224Valkyrie.
|
Tested the Berger 85.5’s two weekends ago, but the results were not very impressive. Perhaps it was the seating depth or the new brass or magazine I was using, but the groups were inconsistent to say the least. I didn’t have pressure issues at the upper charges (in my Rifles) and the groups did start to perform better at the top. The standard dev. were also sub 10fps once I went over 24.0grs. Unless these bullets can just deliver superb precision, I’m not sure they can beat out the 80 eld. It’s colder than when I first worked up the 80 eld load for the Rainier Arms barrel, and I think I need to add .1-.2grs of powder to get it back to shooting better.
 Note: The magnetospeed may have caused some of the fliers. Testing was primarily to see if I could get close to 2800fps, the target velocity to edge out the 80 eld’s.  Initial testing of the Hornady black 75’s.  
|
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Tested the Berger 85.5’s two weekends ago, but the results were not very impressive. Perhaps it was the seating depth or the new brass or magazine I was using, but the groups were inconsistent to say the least. I didn’t have pressure issues at the upper charges (in my Rifles) and the groups did start to perform better at the top. The standard dev. were also sub 10fps once I went over 24.0grs. Unless these bullets can just deliver superb precision, I’m not sure they can beat out the 80 eld. It’s colder than when I first worked up the 80 eld load for the Rainier Arms barrel, and I think I need to add .1-.2grs of powder to get it back to shooting better. https://i.imgur.com/nRL9r7X.jpg https://i.imgur.com/iBXSp0D.jpg Note: The magnetospeed may have caused some of the fliers. Testing was primarily to see if I could get close to 2800fps, the target velocity to edge out the 80 eld’s. https://i.imgur.com/ZLnKqSf.jpg Initial testing of the Hornady black 75’s. https://i.imgur.com/hXSwt57.jpg https://i.imgur.com/8H8KNrl.jpg |
Cincinnatus
|
Originally Posted By sea2summit: Holy crap J, I’d be asking for some money back from someone. I think the Berger’s will come around, but I’ll need to push them a bit harder and play with seating depth. The AE 75’s do pretty decent for 10$ a box. Two groups, one 5x (right) and one 6x (top) from the WOA. 
|
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Mentioned in a previous thread to bfoosh06 that I’d give the JB bore paste a try on the BCA barrel that wasn’t consistent. The bore definitely could use some TLC since it looks pretty rough from a basic “look through the bore”. The feed ramps, which I noted upon receipt, were pretty rough as well. I decided to take 15-20 minutes to try and clean them up a bit as well prior to re-assembling the upper. https://i.imgur.com/Vcjlojc.jpg https://i.imgur.com/XPxcWB1.jpg It would be great to get this barrel to shoot decent. In the past, it would shoot 3-4 rounds decently, then have 1-2 close to 1/2-1” away. Consistent, smooth gas tube / gas key interaction helps minimize fliers.... less chance of the janky , less then smooth consistent interaction altering everything else. I also suggest using a conical felt cone, and polish the gas keys entrance hole. While this won't be a magic solution .... it is part of the equation. |
*Hold on to your AR-15s. Their magic must be very powerful, or they wouldn’t want them.*
JAFOM.... Just another fat old man.
TOGC,IADC
JAFOM.... Just another fat old man.
TOGC,IADC
|
First, apologies for the infrequent updates, especially to those that have helped to support this endeavor. After moving in May and surgery in Oct., time for the range was limited in 2019. In addition, the ranges that I previously attended either weren’t open on the days I had available or were 3.5-6hr round trip depending on traffic. Hard to block off that amount of time. Last week I was able to join a club that’s only 45min from the house, so it’s much more convenient. In the past, I’d typically take several rifles at a time due to the travel, which didn’t serve my goals very well. Hopefully I’ll be able to get 2trips a month to the range and test 1-2rifles per trip. Testing of the Fulton Armory M110 Disclaimer: The owner of the barrel informed me that I should check/tighten the flash hider for this barrel since it was a newer build. I did a preliminary check and all seemed well, but when I arrived home, the FH could be removed by hand. Undoubtedly this had an effect. The FH will be secured in the future to show before and after results (saving the same lot of factory ammo). I’ll also test the barrel with suppressor to see if there’s any impact on the groups. While there was an issue with the muzzle device, the barrel shows promise (especially group 4). 
|
|
No groups from the weekend, but I did get out with my better half to shoot at distance. After being away from shooting for a bit, it felt good to have a chance to stretch out a few rifles.
Anyways, just a brief clip of a 224Valkyrie at 845-850yds. After letting my girlfriend shoot 2 strings of 5rds I decided to give it a go. Managed to go 5/5, but the impacts aren’t easy to see with mirage and the faint signature of a slow moving 90gr bullet. You can hear the faint sound of the first two, but background noise interferes with the rest. We also made repeatable hits on a 10” plate, but the video quality was terrible. 224VALKYRIE, WOA 22” RLG, 1:6.5t, FGMM 90 (1.4mil hold off) Raw vid....ignore the conversation  224valkyrie FGMM 90 850yds |
|
Fulton Armory .308
Apologies for the target...it was crumpled by a range patron. I made a scope adjustment following group #2 to ensure all rounds stayed on target. All rounds fired with a SAS Reaper Ti suppressor, Harris bi-pod and a small rear bag. The barrel is pretty consistent, but I’m not certain that the FGMM isn’t holding it back just a bit. It’s not uncommon to have 2-3rds in the same hole and then a few just outside. Averaged .84moa if discounting the called flier where I was “braked” by a shooter beside me on the top right target.  22” 6.5 Creedmoor, Ballistic Advantage H4350 and 140 eld’s and Hornady Factory 140eld. Mirage may have played a factor in groups 4 and 5. 
Two more groups of 5 following a cool down period. 
And arrived home to an ammo order for more testing. Hoping the IMI is the same as the LR-Mod 1 from the past. 
I’ll also have a Rainier Rock Creek heavy barrel to test in a few weeks. Picked it up off of the EE to evaluate a Rock barrel. 
|
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Fulton Armory .308 Apologies for the target...it was crumpled by a range patron. I made a scope adjustment following group #2 to ensure all rounds stayed on target. All rounds fired with a SAS Reaper Ti suppressor. The barrel is pretty consistent, but I’m not certain that the FGMM isn’t holding it back just a bit. It’s not uncommon to have 2-3rds in the same hole and then a few just outside. Averaged .84moa if discounting the called flier where I was “braked” by a shooter beside me on the top right target. https://i.imgur.com/m43jZS2.jpg 22” 6.5 Creedmoor, Ballistic Advantage H4350 and 140 eld’s and Hornady Factory 140eld. Mirage may have played a factor in groups 4 and 5. https://i.imgur.com/4axXw4W.jpg Two more groups of 5 following a cool down period. https://i.imgur.com/QuVZTxD.jpg And arrived home to an ammo order for more testing. Hoping the IMI is the same as the LR-Mod 1 from the past. https://i.imgur.com/8kJmnqe.jpg I’ll also have a Rainier Rock Creek heavy barrel to test in a few weeks. Picked it up off of the EE to evaluate a Rock barrel. https://i.imgur.com/yvxoxjU.jpg |
|
18” Rainier Match
Tested with ADI 69gr SMK and IMI 77gr Razorcore, Vortex PST II 5-25 Testing started with ADI and then transitioned to the IMI, which performed great for 4/5 shots in every group. 
Following the initial groups, I tried the ADI again with 2 groups of 5 for a 10rd group. While not an impressive 10 shot group, the individual 5 shot groups showed the precision that I’m used to with the ADI. Perhaps the previous groups fouled the barrel since it was clean to start the session.  In between the sessions with the RA match barrel, I decided to sight in the chrome lined Daniel Defense 16” w/ a Gen 1 PST 1-4. I never use 1-4 optics, so I didn’t have high hopes. I loaded up some ADI 69smks and started shooting at broken clay pigeon pieces on the berm. After a few shots, it appeared dialed in. After hitting 1, then the next and a third, I decided to try a quick 10rd group (seemed like less than a minute). I was expecting a 3-4” group, but it did better than I anticipated.  And while the ADI 69 is slow, it was consistent enough to make several hits on an 8 or 10” plate at 500yds from the DD 16” w/ the 1-4. After doing so I can see how a 4x optic could be used at that distance but also realize it’s not ideal. |
|
BCA.....freshly built up with a BCM upper receiver and Rainier (fortis) Night Rail.
Shot ok cold, but once it warmed up...it went to hell. There was a 7-10 minute break between groups 3-4. I may try one more thing with this barrel, then it’s going to be tossed/donated. Something definitely changes once it gets slightly warm. 
|
|
Originally Posted By sea2summit: Holy crap J, I’d be asking for some money back from someone. Between groups with the RA match, I tried a revised load of Berger 85.5’s in the WOA 224Valkyrie. They were a bit long for the mag so I single fed them. Looking forward to testing this charge again with a slightly modified seating depth. 24.1gr H4895, Starline Brass, Wolf SR, Berger 85.5, 1.753” BTO. 
|
|
Was supposed to be a 5x5, but there wasn’t much use in continuing after I pulled a shot while mentioning to another range patron that he was cross firing into my target. Need to get a second BA 6.5creed Barrel to see if they all shoot this well, but it’s a dependable rifle and it’s capable of some great groups for a gas gun. 
|
|
Precision is addictive. I really enjoy seeing the results from your testing. Thanks again for all your time and effort. |
*Hold on to your AR-15s. Their magic must be very powerful, or they wouldn’t want them.*
JAFOM.... Just another fat old man.
TOGC,IADC
JAFOM.... Just another fat old man.
TOGC,IADC
|
Just a heads up, but Rainier Arms is having a sale on their 224Valkyrie barrels. 224$, including the fluted versions. These are 1:7.5t, so not great for 90/95’s, but they do great with the 80’s.
Picked up a 24” +2 fluted to test the Berger 85.5’s and nuke the 80 eld’s. From what I understand, these won’t be available in the near future due to inconsistencies with factory ammo, but they may be revisited down the road (hopefully with a faster twist). But, if you’re a reloader, this is a smoking deal. |
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Just a heads up, but Rainier Arms is having a sale on their 224Valkyrie barrels. 224$, including the fluted versions. These are 1:7.5t, so not great for 90/95’s, but they do great with the 80’s. Picked up a 24” +2 fluted to test the Berger 85.5’s and nuke the 80 eld’s. From what I understand, these won’t be available in the near future due to inconsistencies with factory ammo, but they may be revisited down the road (hopefully with a faster twist). But, if you’re a reloader, this is a smoking deal. 
|
Chicken Farmer by choice hunter of shade tree's and hiding spots by nature.
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge:
Just a heads up, but Rainier Arms is having a sale on their 224Valkyrie barrels. 224$, including the fluted versions. These are 1:7.5t, so not great for 90/95’s, but they do great with the 80’s. Picked up a 24” +2 fluted to test the Berger 85.5’s and nuke the 80 eld’s. From what I understand, these won’t be available in the near future due to inconsistencies with factory ammo, but they may be revisited down the road (hopefully with a faster twist). But, if you’re a reloader, this is a smoking deal. I saw they recently re-released their "select" line of barrels as well. Price point around $170. Nice budget option i am guessing. They are about $40 less than the match ones that go for $209 |
|
More testing of the Berger 85.5’s in the WOA 22” 1:6.5t 224Valkyrie.
They prefer to be closer to the lands from what I can tell. A 20 thou jump was amazing previously but wouldn’t feed from a mag. I’ll be loading up more at 1.725BTO and testing to see what they can do. This is approximately a 50 thou jump in my barrel and feeds reliably from the ASC mags. I’ll also be going with Starline brass, as used previously. I was testing in 1x fired Federal brass from FGMM 90’s and AE75 during this outing, so there could have been variation in the brass. I was hoping to get a load that worked in throw away brass to run in matches where I wouldn’t be worried about losing it. .264 groups are from my better half. She wanted to run my 260 while I was testing. 
|
|
Originally Posted By sparkyD:
I think that's the custom bolt gun but not sure. 
Attached File |
Cincinnatus
|
Originally Posted By sea2summit: No, his customs do a touch better than that
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/326526/7F5C16CF-E2EC-4580-A927-43DC03112CBA_jpe-1294690.JPG 
|
|
Rainier Arms, Ultramatch 224Valkyrie 24” +2 gas I took the RA Ultramatch 224Valkyrie out last weekend and tried the load that I ran in the previous barrel, with some slight variation on the charge weight. A few of the loads showed some promise and gave me an idea of where I should focus my efforts.  Loaded up some of the 80 eld-m’s with 4 different charge weights and tested again today. No velocity data, but these should be in the 2940-2990fps range.   I had some Berger 85.5’s left over from the previous testing in the White Oak 22” 224Valkyrie, so I decided to give them a try, and I’m glad I did. I think with some additional load development, these could be a solid option as well.  Overall, I’m very pleased with how this barrel is shooting. |
|
Fulton Armory .m110 Tested with handloads to replicate FGMM 168’s. Initial loads were too hot. The second group showed the start of pressure signs so I stopped testing at that point. All of the other handloads were at that charge or slightly higher, so they were shelved till I can disassemble. Additional testing, if time with the upper allows, will be done with the first charge tested (middle) or lower. Note: Do not copy my loads. Follow safe reloading practices and work up to safe levels in your rifle. The cold bore shot was the impact outside of the cluster, if that matters to anyone. 
|
|
Bergara, 16” 1:10 Limited testing since I had let someone borrow the optic I was planning on using and they showed up late to the range. On top of that, the turret screws had been loosened and were slipping. Wasted a few shots getting it on paper and diagnosing the issue. Wouldn’t have been as big of an issue except I only had 1 box of FGMM with me. I’m really looking forward to seeing what this barrel will do. 
|
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge: Fulton Armory .m110 Tested with handloads to replicate FGMM 168’s. Initial loads were too hot. The second group showed the start of pressure signs so I stopped testing at that point. All of the other handloads were at that charge or slightly higher, so they were shelved till I can disassemble. Additional testing, if time with the upper allows, will be done with the first charge tested (middle) or lower. Note: Do not copy my loads. Follow safe reloading practices and work up to safe levels in your rifle. The cold bore shot was the impact outside of the cluster, if that matters to anyone. https://i.imgur.com/TPcQTEX.jpg Hmmm, looks pretty good. What pressure signs started appearing and what velocity where you at? |
Cincinnatus
|
Originally Posted By sea2summit: Hmmm, looks pretty good. What pressure signs started appearing and what velocity where you at? Not sure on velocity; didn’t have the magnetospeed hooked up. Guess I’m still in my old habit of trying to read a target to get a solid load. I’ll toss it in a range bag for the next trip. 1/5 of the 41.8’s had a slight ejector mark. 4/5 of the 42.0’s had an ejector mark and 1/5 had slight/minor flattening of the primer. The 42.0 also was demonstrating that it was outside of the node and was beginning to scatter. I knew that the 42.2’s, 42.3 and 42.4’s would continue to be over pressure, even if they started into the next node for this barrel. |
|
Question for those that view this thread. Would you rather see the Rainier Rock Creek 18” 223 or the 24” +2 WOA 224Valkyrie in the coming weeks? I’ve got the 223wylde built, but I’m considering stripping it down for the 224Valkyrie build. I’ve just received a case of the FGMM Berger 80.5’s and I’m curious what they’ll do. I realize not everyone is as thrilled with the 224Valkyrie as I have been, but I’ve had some great experiences with the cartridge. Spoiler alert: there will be some LaRue Tactical UU’s tested in the near future. |
|
Originally Posted By SuperJlarge: Question for those that view this thread. Would you rather see the Rainier Rock Creek 18” 223 or the 24” +2 WOA 224Valkyrie in the coming weeks? I’ve got the 223wylde built, but I’m considering stripping it down for the 224Valkyrie build. I’ve just received a case of the FGMM Berger 80.5’s and I’m curious what they’ll do. I realize not everyone is as thrilled with the 224Valkyrie as I have been, but I’ve had some great experiences with the cartridge. Spoiler alert: there will be some LaRue Tactical UU’s tested in the near future. Typical arfcom answer: both. Appreciate all your efforts and diligence in keeping this thread updated. |
Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast.
|
Originally Posted By sommere54: Typical arfcom answer: both. Appreciate all your efforts and diligence in keeping this thread updated. Originally Posted By sommere54: Originally Posted By SuperJlarge: Question for those that view this thread. Would you rather see the Rainier Rock Creek 18” 223 or the 24” +2 WOA 224Valkyrie in the coming weeks? I’ve got the 223wylde built, but I’m considering stripping it down for the 224Valkyrie build. I’ve just received a case of the FGMM Berger 80.5’s and I’m curious what they’ll do. I realize not everyone is as thrilled with the 224Valkyrie as I have been, but I’ve had some great experiences with the cartridge. Spoiler alert: there will be some LaRue Tactical UU’s tested in the near future. Typical arfcom answer: both. Appreciate all your efforts and diligence in keeping this thread updated. This. I'd say the 224v 1st, though. I have 2, both with LT matched barrels/bolts. They both seem to like Hornady Match 88 gr. |
Originally Posted By SecretSquirell: I'll stick my dick in a WorkSharp before I let you try to sharpen anything of mine.
NRA Benefactor Member
2nd Amendment Foundation Life Member
Madison Society Foundation Life Member
VCDL mamber
NRA Benefactor Member
2nd Amendment Foundation Life Member
Madison Society Foundation Life Member
VCDL mamber
|
Bergara .308 Barrel- Handloads w/ 168smk’s During seating, there were some cases where it was apparent that the neck tension wasn’t the same with some feeling noticeably lighter. The high round on the right target of 41.7 was likely due to me not shouldering the rifle properly. This typically results in a round going high in my experience. For future testing of this barrel and powder combination, I would try charges around 41.5-41.6gr or try to find a higher node (I tried 3 of the 42.0gr handloads and saw no pressure signs). While 41.7gr looks good, it’s too close to 41.8gr which had dismal results. 
|
|
224 Valkyrie 24”+2gas Rainier Ultramatch, 1:7.5t. I tried the FGMM 80.5’s yesterday and averaged .67moa across 20 shots. One group isn’t pictured. I then went to my club’s 500yd range and rang the 6 or 8” plate consistently, starting off with a first round hit using the approximate velocity listed on the box (2920fps used) and stacking the next 4 right on top of it. Overall, this looks like a great off the shelf option for the 224Valkyrie. IMO, this cartridge shines with 80-85gr bullet weights. You get great velocity with good BC. Just because a heavy 90 or 95gr bullet has a great BC doesn’t necessarily mean it’s the best long range option.  
|
AR Precision Testing (Page 5 of 8)
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.