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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/10/2019 12:00:30 AM EDT
I wasn't sure where else to post this so I'm putting in here. I am eventually wanting to get a Jon Boat for hunting duck and deer when I move back to Montana. I will primarily be using it on the Missouri River in November when the water is running really low. I know from experience that in many of these areas the water can be sometimes less than knee-deep which means that there is a high likelihood of bottoming out often. I was wanting to get a set up with a jet motor so that way I could go in low water but I am concerned about what kind of damage may occur from constantly bottoming out on gravel bars. What should I be looking for in a boat to minimize the effect of the beating it will likely take in this situation?
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USA
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Posted: 8/10/2019 12:29:02 AM EDT
[#1]
If your going to be in extra skinny water then go with a long tail mud motor.
I've duck hunted on lakes in Tx with my 14 ft flat bottom and 15hp out board. Trolling motor got me thru 1-2ft of water. Never needed the mud motor. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 12:29:41 AM EDT
[#2]
There's a huge difference between jon boats, and regular boats.
Growing up in the PNW with boats with a lot of freeboard, working in the south and seeing jon boats was... interesting. Get on craigslist and see what's for sale in the area you want to move to, to get an idea of what people use. Because if you buy a jon boat (the traditional low freeboard narrow, shallow cal water boat) and try to use it in Montana rivers, I don't think it'll work so hot. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 1:38:41 AM EDT
[#3]
You might look into Pro-Drive boats.
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WA, USA
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Posted: 8/10/2019 1:47:23 AM EDT
[#4]
Trust me, get the wider beam boat. The narrow ones get very tippy!
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Posted: 8/10/2019 1:49:43 AM EDT
[#5]
Agree ^^^^
An 18' 54" will be plenty stable. I would not go less than that. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/10/2019 5:29:20 AM EDT
[#6]
So the main concern of mine aside from shallow water is the rocky gravel river bed which will be a lot harder on a boat than sand or mud. To be honest I saw a lot of these kind of boats when I was living in alaska where rivers were frequently slow and shallow like late season Montana rivers with the exception that you could replace half the gravel with sand and mud and add in submerged logs for fun.
There isn't much in the way of submerged logs in the Missouri river around central Montana. If not a flat bottom John boat what style would yall reccomend? Also would you reccomend aluminum or other construction? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/10/2019 5:32:12 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
There's a huge difference between jon boats, and regular boats. Growing up in the PNW with boats with a lot of freeboard, working in the south and seeing jon boats was... interesting. Get on craigslist and see what's for sale in the area you want to move to, to get an idea of what people use. Because if you buy a jon boat (the traditional low freeboard narrow, shallow cal water boat) and try to use it in Montana rivers, I don't think it'll work so hot. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 5:48:25 AM EDT
[#8]
All welded, HD hull, and maybe a tunnel for the jet.
Around here the top of the line jet boats have UHDPE hull sheathing to slide off rocks. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 5:49:35 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CaptKirk:
Trust me, get the wider beam boat. The narrow ones get very tippy! |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 5:57:11 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m1garand__man: If not a flat bottom John boat what style would yall reccomend? Also would you reccomend aluminum or other construction? I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger.  Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard.  Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it.  The Jet Sled |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 6:25:42 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
A flat bottom boat would probably be fine, just not a "jon boat". I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger. https://www.princecraft.com/AttachmentImage.ashx?file=2019-Jon-Boat-Series.jpg&Size=47&UILanguageID=EN%201440w Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard. https://www.ifish.net/gallery/data/500/first_sled_trip.jpg Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXyaJmlvi-s |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 7:23:39 AM EDT
[#12]
All welded construction will serve you well. You are coming up on fall/winter which, imo, is the best time for buyers. Take your time and good luck.
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Posted: 8/10/2019 9:38:23 AM EDT
[#13]
i plan to buy one in the future. i plan on getting the widest one i can find, that has a seat and steering wheel. i had one without the steering wheel years ago, and sold it to my dad in florida, and we used it there for coastal fishing. worked great for that as well as it was so wide.
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Posted: 8/10/2019 9:59:04 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
A flat bottom boat would probably be fine, just not a "jon boat". I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger. https://www.princecraft.com/AttachmentImage.ashx?file=2019-Jon-Boat-Series.jpg&Size=47&UILanguageID=EN%201440w Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard. https://www.ifish.net/gallery/data/500/first_sled_trip.jpg Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXyaJmlvi-sOP, what is your budget? Have to start there. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 3:00:36 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TN-MadDog:
That jet sled set up is pretty nice but that is going to be a significant amount of $$$$ OP, what is your budget? Have to start there. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TN-MadDog:
Originally Posted By Madcap72:
A flat bottom boat would probably be fine, just not a "jon boat". I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger. https://www.princecraft.com/AttachmentImage.ashx?file=2019-Jon-Boat-Series.jpg&Size=47&UILanguageID=EN%201440w Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard. https://www.ifish.net/gallery/data/500/first_sled_trip.jpg Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXyaJmlvi-sOP, what is your budget? Have to start there. If I wasn't trying to get my project boat done and a bunch of old cars to work on I'd be all over this thing; 
20' 90 horse jet which is a little small, but it's a 60's rivet boat so that's fine, keeps from beating it up too much. $5700. Probably bigger than what the OP is looking for, but an example of what's out there for entry level stuff. |
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Posted: 8/10/2019 3:04:14 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By eracer:
That's pretty sweet! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By eracer:
Originally Posted By Madcap72:
A flat bottom boat would probably be fine, just not a "jon boat". I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger. https://www.princecraft.com/AttachmentImage.ashx?file=2019-Jon-Boat-Series.jpg&Size=47&UILanguageID=EN%201440w Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard. https://www.ifish.net/gallery/data/500/first_sled_trip.jpg Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXyaJmlvi-sHere's what I have, little 1970's smokercraft sled (Bought by my Grandfather), with a 25 horse 2 stroke. I couldn't even begin to calculate how many miles it's gone up and down this stretch of river over the last 45 years. (Mom driving) |
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NH, USA
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Posted: 8/11/2019 9:09:12 AM EDT
[#17]
See if you can find a bailey bridge boat, built for the Army Corps of engineers for vietnam . Mine is a 1959 (I'll try and post pictures )and used for fishing and waterfowl hunting. These boats are beasts and only draft 3-4" of water. They can be seen at ugliboats.com . It would be great to find one that is unmolested , just the hull, the sky is the limit on these boats.
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Posted: 8/11/2019 4:40:15 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
Just to clarify, none of those are mine. Here's what I have, little 1970's smokercraft sled (Bought by my Grandfather), with a 25 horse 2 stroke. I couldn't even begin to calculate how many miles it's gone up and down this stretch of river over the last 45 years. (Mom driving) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtRUES7yhdg
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Posted: 8/12/2019 9:58:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: akcaribouhunter]
[#19]
Sea Ark and Alweld make some really nice boats.
Can be had with flat/slight V bottom and with tunnel for both prop/jet. As others have said look into some of the Go-devil/mud type boats. |
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Posted: 8/12/2019 11:14:13 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By akcaribouhunter:
Sea Ark and Alweld make some really nice boats. Can be had with flat/slight V bottom and with tunnel for both prop/jet. As others have said look into some of the Go-devil/mud type boats. 
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Posted: 8/12/2019 11:18:15 PM EDT
[#21]
OP flat vs v consideration, v bottoms (or at least bows, since many small boats still have flat bottoms) are not as stable, don't have as much flor space, but take weather or wakes a little better, and if you ground them, are lighter and easier to back out.
Flat bows/ bottoms are more stable, have more floor space, but man... if you stick one, you are STUCK. It's a lot of surface area. The little v bow smokercraft alaskan we have is only 2' shorter than the sled, but it's a world of difference weight wise, and being able to just lift the motor, jump out, and push it back if you run too shallow. For really shallow stuff, there is the canoe, and when it gets REALLY shallow we just drag it along the sea grass.
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Posted: 8/12/2019 11:37:59 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By akcaribouhunter:
Sea Ark and Alweld make some really nice boats. Can be had with flat/slight V bottom and with tunnel for both prop/jet. As others have said look into some of the Go-devil/mud type boats. https://www.havocboats.com |
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Posted: 8/13/2019 9:03:01 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Warhawk:
This, also War Eagle boats. Havoc boats are made for exactly what you want to do. https://www.havocboats.com Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Warhawk:
Originally Posted By akcaribouhunter:
Sea Ark and Alweld make some really nice boats. Can be had with flat/slight V bottom and with tunnel for both prop/jet. As others have said look into some of the Go-devil/mud type boats. https://www.havocboats.com |
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IL, USA
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Posted: 8/13/2019 4:29:57 PM EDT
[#24]
I'd look for a used flat bottom (preferably with a coast guard front). For river use I would prefer something deeper than a Jon boat. Beware there are a bunch of them on craigslist advertised as "extra wide, extra deep" that aren't.
I know everyone says go welded. We've never had a welded jon boat but have had several riveted. The rivets have never given us any real trouble. If you are running around rocks buy a can of "Duralux" aluminum boat paint. Get the expensive stuff and touch up your dents and dinks at the beginning of the season. I'm currently running a 1976 riveted Monark. |
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Posted: 8/13/2019 8:07:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: sparkyD]
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lapidary:
I'd look for a used flat bottom (preferably with a coast guard front). For river use I would prefer something deeper than a Jon boat. Beware there are a bunch of them on craigslist advertised as "extra wide, extra deep" that aren't. I know everyone says go welded. We've never had a welded jon boat but have had several riveted. The rivets have never given us any real trouble. If you are running around rocks buy a can of "Duralux" aluminum boat paint. Get the expensive stuff and touch up your dents and dinks at the beginning of the season. I'm currently running a 1976 riveted Monark. |
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Posted: 8/13/2019 8:49:29 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lapidary:
I'd look for a used flat bottom (preferably with a coast guard front). For river use I would prefer something deeper than a Jon boat. Beware there are a bunch of them on craigslist advertised as "extra wide, extra deep" that aren't. I know everyone says go welded. We've never had a welded jon boat but have had several riveted. The rivets have never given us any real trouble. If you are running around rocks buy a can of "Duralux" aluminum boat paint. Get the expensive stuff and touch up your dents and dinks at the beginning of the season. I'm currently running a 1976 riveted Monark.  Throwing a 90 horse jet on the back and smashing wakes and rocks is a surefire way to wreck them LOL.Our little smokercraft has had two leaks in 45 years, and was easily sealed. |
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IL, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2019 11:28:25 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
Rivet boats are great if you're not overpowering them and beating them up. Throwing a 90 horse jet on the back and smashing wakes and rocks is a surefire way to wreck them LOL.Our little smokercraft has had two leaks in 45 years, and was easily sealed. |
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Posted: 8/30/2019 12:11:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: buck19delta]
[#28]
I decided i need a boat . I put my armalite 50 bmg , and bmg reloading gear up for sale / trade to finance a used john boat. Seeing a lot of decent stuff for around $3k. Im looking forward to getting back out on the water. Retired now, tons of time to fish, just no boat. Lol. Gonna fix that asap.
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Posted: 8/30/2019 7:05:14 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By buck19delta:
I decided i need a boat . I put my armalite 50 bmg , and bmg reloading gear up for sale / trade to finance a used john boat. Seeing a lot of decent stuff for around $3k. Im looking forward to getting back out on the water. Retired now, tons of time to fish, just no boat. Lol. Gonna fix that asap. |
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IL, USA
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Posted: 8/30/2019 10:13:38 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By buck19delta:
I decided i need a boat . I put my armalite 50 bmg , and bmg reloading gear up for sale / trade to finance a used john boat. Seeing a lot of decent stuff for around $3k. Im looking forward to getting back out on the water. Retired now, tons of time to fish, just no boat. Lol. Gonna fix that asap. |
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Posted: 8/30/2019 2:05:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: buck19delta]
[#31]
i might be trading a 50 bmg and reloading gear for this boat.. im trying anyway.
16' john boat with 35 hp 2 stroke johnson motor. i think it boat and motor are 1999 models.made offers on several 18 foot boats. and this 16' boat. the boat in the picture, the guy said hes interested in trading, but is in canada on a bear hunt, coming home tomorrow, so its a maybe for this one.. its a newer boat, with a newer engine, long and wide / stable, with a steering wheel, and seems in decent shape. iv had a very simular boat on the ohio river and it ran fine and was super stable. i REALLY want another one, something like this would be perfect for around here, and since im retired i would spend a lot of time in it, kids and grandkids would love it too. . if i sell the gun and reloading gear before i make a trade ill take the cash and buy one a lot like this.  Attached File |
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Posted: 8/30/2019 2:13:14 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sparkyD:
I think I’d keep the .50 cal fun and piece me a boat together starting with a used trailer. And then a good use 2cycle outboard. Then size the boat to what hp outboard I managed to snag. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sparkyD:
Originally Posted By buck19delta:
I decided i need a boat . I put my armalite 50 bmg , and bmg reloading gear up for sale / trade to finance a used john boat. Seeing a lot of decent stuff for around $3k. Im looking forward to getting back out on the water. Retired now, tons of time to fish, just no boat. Lol. Gonna fix that asap.  Attached FileHowever.. if i can get a decent trade going for the 50 bmg, for a complete boat set up that i like ill do it. it will save me a lot of work and running around. i only spent $2k for the armalite and full reloading set up, so i wont be losing any money... at least not as long as i dont get a lemon. iv had good luck at trading over the years though. |
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Posted: 8/30/2019 9:15:48 PM EDT
[#33]
Boats don't face potential AWB's in the next 5-20 years FWIW.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/14/2019 8:59:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: m1garand__man]
[#34]
I'd be looking for something under $4k with a trailer hopefully. Nothing fancy just serviceable and big enough for two people with packs and maybe two to four deer and with a big enough motor it can still get on step when it's got all of the above in it. It would also pull double duty to get into spots for duck hunting. I don't fish or have intrest in that so I don't need or want anything extra for that.
By the way, for those who asked, it will be used mostly in the Missouri river or on various lakes in Montana in October and November. My idea of a boat for deer hunting is basically like an ATV for the water. I'm just using it for transportation. |
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Posted: 9/14/2019 3:33:24 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m1garand__man:
I'd be looking for something under $4k with a trailer hopefully. Nothing fancy just serviceable and big enough for two people with packs and maybe two to four deer and with a big enough motor it can still get on step when it's got all of the above in it. It would also pull double duty to get into spots for duck hunting. I don't fish or have intrest in that so I don't need or want anything extra for that. By the way, for those who asked, it will be used mostly in the Missouri river or on various lakes in Montana in October and November. My idea of a boat for deer hunting is basically like an ATV for the water. I'm just using it for transportation.
Here's something around 4K that would fit the bill for what you're looking for. The 4K cap is really going to limit you for carrying all the weight you listed. https://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/boa/d/kent-1987-hewescraft-river-runner-18/6969023390.html Or weird stuff like this, some oddball welded boat; https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/boa/d/gresham-welded-river-sled/6969469797.html |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/14/2019 11:16:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: m1garand__man]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72:
Do you want it to be really fast, get good gas mileage so on and so forth.
Here's something around 4K that would fit the bill for what you're looking for. The 4K cap is really going to limit you for carrying all the weight you listed. https://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/boa/d/kent-1987-hewescraft-river-runner-18/6969023390.html Or weird stuff like this, some oddball welded boat; https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/boa/d/gresham-welded-river-sled/6969469797.html I like the second one. There are areas where I'm thinking of taking the boat where the water is knee deep in November with gravel river beds. You can just barely float a boat in that and it is often that the boat will get stuck on gravel bars and have to be pulled across if it has no motor. The last time I did that hunt it was in an aluminum row boat that had no motor because the place we rented it from wouldn't rent us a motor with the river so low. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 9:20:13 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m1garand__man: I guess getting on step while loaded isn't that important if it will require a heavy boat that's going to get stuck frequently in low water. I like the second one. There are areas where I'm thinking of taking the boat where the water is knee deep in November with gravel river beds. You can just barely float a boat in that and it is often that the boat will get stuck on gravel bars and have to be pulled across if it has no motor. The last time I did that hunt it was in an aluminum row boat that had no motor because the place we rented it from wouldn't rent us a motor with the river so low. 
Start with the bigger boat then search for a smaller one. Just don't get in a hurry unless you buy the bigger one new because you will use the big boat more than the little boat. Unless you have access to nice ponds to hope. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 10:34:41 AM EDT
[#38]
Xpress or War Eagle all weld with a 40HP tiller handle has served me well for years of tough duck hunting or fishing.
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Posted: 10/17/2019 10:32:27 AM EDT
[#39]
If running shallow with a jet is a priority get a wide tunnel hull with transom pods. This will allow you to mount the engine as high as possible. Remember jet engines are said to be 30% less efficient than a propped engine so they use a larger heavier engine to make the same rated HP. Because of this additional weight in the rear make sure you have it rigged with fuel tanks and batteries mounted forward so the rig will trim correctly.
We have a 1652 Weld-Craft w/50HP Johnrude T&T and factory transom pods and side console/live well. .100" gauge all welded, 18 feet long overall, 74" beam, 22" gunnels and 550 lbs Dry. Had it 6 years now, we love it! Perfect rig for Ocala NF. Good luck shopping, took me 5 months searching boat trader and CL to find mine for $3K. |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 3/29/2020 10:11:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ICEAGE]
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Madcap72: A flat bottom boat would probably be fine, just not a "jon boat". I.E. this is what I've always seen people call a jon boat. Narrow, low free-board. Not they used tiny people to make the boat look larger. [url]https://www.princecraft.com/AttachmentImage.ashx?file=2019-Jon-Boat-Series.jpg&Size=47&UILanguageID=EN%201440w[url] Vs what people call Sleds, or River sleds. Same flat bottom, same square bow, but wider and more freeboard. [url]https://www.ifish.net/gallery/data/500/first_sled_trip.jpg[url] Throw a jet on the back of a sled, and you have the ever popular jet sled. Note how much freeboard it has even with a couple dudes in it.  In Louisiana your 'jet sled' would be called a custom flat or something like that. One is all weld with a solid construction, people put bigger motors and they withstand hitting submerged obstacles 100x better then the traditional riveted flat boats like your other pic. We don't have rocks here but we have plenty of stumps and submerged logs. So the main question is. Are you going to be putting around with a 10HP at 5MPH. Or are you gonna be rolling with a 50HP+ doing 45+ [img]/images/smilies/smiley_abused.gif" /> For some strange reason Cajuns like a fast boat. As you might imagine, boating fatalities aren't exactly, uncommon. |
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