I've been toying with the idea of getting a small travel trailer to tow with my 2016 Grand Cherokee (7200lb rated), or the wife's 2014 Grand Cherokee (6200lb rated).  Went to a local dealer (Wilkins) and took a look at a few.  They have a lot of Coachmen and Jayco units.  I'm looking for something just for Wodstock and I (yes, the wife has an account here), but wouldn't be against something a little bigger if the price was right.  From the looking I've done, it seems that 17-22 feet is the size I'm looking for.  I'm most likely going to go used, to save quite a bit, and so far I've been researching the Coachmen Apex, Clipper, and the Keystone Bullet-Colt.

This is something we'd use for probably not much more than a week at a time (maybe 2 weeks once in a while), and we're not planning on using it in the dead of winter.  I've looked at the two types of construction (aluminum skin/wood frame and Azdel/Fiberglass skin/aluminum frame) and I'm leaning more towards the Azdel type.

Trying to stay less than 10 years old, and I'd go with a newer smaller unit over an older larger one if the price was the same.  I've seen used ones between $4000 and $12,000 depending on age, etc.  Any brands to avoid?  Construction type preferred?  I'm planning on keeping it for a long time, so it's something I'll do the maintenance on, and I'll make sure I stay on top of the little things before they cause issues.

I'd stay away from Jayco and Keystone. You need to sit in it during a heavy rain storm and check for leaks. Newer is better than older. Make sure you can keep it covered. Mice will always be an issue,,,have a plan. No slides in the smaller units is a good thing. A toy hauler will give you the flexibility of a slide WITHOUT the 100% chance of a malfunction. Tires will ABSOLUTELY need to be upgraded/replaced from factory issue. TRY and find one that has the black tank "flush" option. Generator is mandatory for dry camping whether it is in the trailer or in the vehicle. You'll need to buy NEW fresh water hoses and sewer hoses.

We have a Jayco 17' XFD. Tandem axle for
good towing & built in spares, sort of. Small
enough to be manageable on the road and
backing into camping spaces. With the 3
hybrid pull outs, the bed areas do not
encroach on your floor space. 3 season
camping only, so far. It does have a furnace,
but we haven't ever fired it up. Another plus
is that it's only 7' wide, so it doesn't hang out
past the tow vehicle, and you can see around
with standard side mirrors. We just have our
son, my wife & I so we use the extra bed area
for clothing & food storage, etc.

My brother hauls around a 31' tag along,
with a Ford dually & I have no desire to
pull something that big anywhere. Some-
thing bigger would be nice, but I don't
want to pull anything bigger.

I pull it with my 12 passenger Ford E-350
with no issues on the road.

Good luck.

John

Link to floor layout

Can't really help with the trailer in that size.  But I did just buy a 36' TT fro Wilkins last week.  Had a better than average experience there.  The only advice I can add is be sure you are well within your towing specs.  Know exactly what you can safely pull and don't expect that the salesperson will know/care if you will end up overweight.  Currently my biggest worry is no having enough truck for the trailer.  Might have to upgrade to something bigger and the wife will not be happy with me if I do.

If you are looking in Victor I can give you a name of our salesperson.  Really liked her.

It may be helpful to know what type of camping you intend to do.   Access to water and waste disposal can be a bigger issue than some people expect, depending on what you intend to do with it and how many people will be staying in it.   If the tanks are too small then you might filling/dumping more often than you want.

I started my search in a similar place that you seem to be in yours.   I wanted something on the smaller side that would be flexible and could serve multiple purposes.    I fell into a amazing deal on a used 16 foot cargo trailer (I paid less than 10% of its scrap value and it still has a lot of life left in it) and I started working on converting it.   What I found was that it was really too big for me to get it into the places that I wanted to go.

Then I started working on Plan B.   Plan B was a used teardrop trailer that I found a few hours away.    It was commercially built, simple in construction, entirely skinned in aluminum, completely insulated, and nearly perfect for what I wanted.   It measures 10 feet long, without the tongue.   Title lists the weight as 880 lbs but upgrades and add-ons have it weighing more than that now.   It tows like a dream.   It has an eight gallon water tank and no waste tank yet, I am planning on adding one.   It does not have a bathroom.   It has an air conditioner and heater (added) and sleeps two people VERY comfortably.   I can (and often do) park it in the garage.   Because it is so small and tows so well, I take it places and to events that I probably wouldn't take a camper otherwise.   I like to "camp" when I camp but since I am older I cannot comfortably sleep on the ground anymore.   I like to be outside and often go by myself.   I don't mind primitive camping so the lack of bathroom isn't an issue for me.   I have a pop-up shower tent and a portable propane water heater for a shower but I often use the facilities wherever I am parked.

As an example, my family has a three bedroom cabin up in Northern Michigan and the guys like to get together for deer hunting.   Some of the guys, including myself snore.    So I take the camper.   If the sleeping arrangements get crowded or if I think that snoring will become an issue then I sleep in the camper.   I run a cord to the cabin to run the heater (saves on the battery/generator) and I head outside to the camper when it is time to turn in.   I come back in when I get up in the AM and enjoy breakfast with every body else.

I had a buddy that was telling me how his long weekend was going to be crap because he had to go his significant other's (SO) cabin up near the Canada border.    They had an event planned, a bunch of people invited, and it was "way out" beyond cell service.   He is a private person and doesn't do well around strangers.  He was preparing to sleep in his truck.   I encouraged him to take the camper.    I figured it would be a similar arrangement.   Eat, visit with everyone, and then head out and sleep in the camper.    Weather wasn't the greatest.   They closed the Mackinaw bridge due to high winds an hour after they got across.   They called and gave an ETA before leaving cell service and then got lost on the two tracks that led to the cabin.   As they were driving around trying to find their way my buddies SO started to sweat about their situation.  He informed her they were fine, they had gas, some food, water, a generator, a place to sleep.   Worst case they park for the night, climb into the camper, and figure out where they were the next day.   Well the family missed them, sent out search party(s), and led them back to the cabin.   My buddy said that the camper was the talk of the weekend and everyone wanted to know more about it.   A number of times people said "that is an awesome little camper.   I have an XX footer that is just too big to bring on a trip like this."   It turns out that more people arrived than were invited and sleeping arrangements for some people were uncomfortable with some people sleeping on the floor with just a blanket.    One woman offered my buddy money to trade sleeping arrangements with her.   But my buddy and his SO had a great time.   He described it as "almost perfect."   After the first night (he left the heater on and got the cabin too warm) he slept better than he had in a long time.  His SO indicated that if they didn't have the camper then they wouldn't have been able to stay because the cabin was so overloaded.   He commented on how nice it was to be able to lock the camper when they left for the day and to know that their stuff (including weapons) wouldn't be messed with while they took off and did whatever.   And he said they got better gas mileage towing the camper than not towing the camper.   I interpret that as Highway/City mileage differences.   Anyway, you get the idea.

Knowing what I know now, if I started over, then I MIGHT try a mini toy hauler like Micro-Lite's Car-Go Lite but I wonder if the additional size would limit flexibility.

This ended up being longer than I expected when I started but hopefully the information helps.

2Hut8

I've mentioned it around here before.

We've been using a Palomini 132fd off-road (Forrest River) for a few years now and like it a lot.  It tows well aside from wind resistance.  I can tow it with the Bronco or F-250.  It tracks real nice and goes a lot of places off the beaten path.  Overall length is 16'.  There is real estate for 200+watts of solar on the roof and roof is load bearing.

My buddy has a RPOD 171 that is very similar.  We both camp off-grid almost exclusively.




Here is both rigs outside of Moab

Thanks for the input...

It's only for the two of us, and I'm not planning on towing it anywhere needing to use the OR2 height on the suspension of my WK2.  My Jeep has the 5.7 hemi, and has a max tow weight of 7200lbs.  We will use it for a week or so at a time, mostly in state parks.  The models that use Azdel interest me, as I'm learning more about that material.  Honestly, we may never use the black water tank, but having the ability to flush it does seem like a good feature.  One of the models I've been looking at is the Apex Nano 187RB.  Being able to access both sides of the bed without climbing over one another is a plus.  I don't want any slide outs, just seems like another point of failure.  Solar is optional, though they all seem wired for it (at least new ones).

I guess my main issue is price vs. construction type vs. year.  I'm trying to stay $10k or under, and I'm wondering how much I'm going to hate myself a few years down the road if I get a cheaper one that is aluminum skin/wood framed versus an Azdel skin/aluminum frame.  I kinda like the idea of having more of the unit resistant to water/mold/etc.

About the only time we may want to actually use the shower and toilet is maybe during the Dayton Hamvention in Ohio, but I think 95% of the use will be fresh and grey water only.  The idea for this is to have something that will replace those small camping cottages that have electricity and heat, no water.  Most of the time, they're booked way in advance, and it's difficult to get one (at least in PA).  We've tent camped before, and I used to tent camp all the time with the family when I was younger.

We bought a new Mallard M185 last year and have been very happy so far.  It's an 18' with bunks.  We had a 26' fifth wheel 15 yrs ago and decided to go small this time, because we mainly just sleep in it.

Pictures and brand name? What was the layout like? Thanks!

I will try to get that posted tonight.

2Hut8

Wife and I picked up an rpod this summer and are real happy with it.  I tow with a Jeep Wrangler 4door and have no problems.  
So far it’s been great.  Queen bed, larger shower, convection microwave and a 3 power fridge, makes the wife happy.

I'm also thinking about what maintenance I'll have to do 10 years down the road.  I'm planning on keeping this thing for a long time.  The usual washing/waxing, tires, bearings, brakes will be expected.  UV protectant on the roof if needed.

I guess it's a decision of how much I want to pay up front, for what level of quality.  My brain seems to be fighting me on anything that is wood framed.

Go here this is were you will learn a lot about RV'S

https://www.rv.net/forum/

I have a Wazat by Microlite.

Stock image is here:



Galley is in the back:



Sleeping area measure 54.00 x 75.00 and my mattress is 8" thick so I sleep quite well.

I need to take new pictures of mine.   I haven't update the pictures since I extended the tongue, added a tongue box, levelers, and built cabinets in the back.    I don't have the cabinets painted yet and I want to add "trim" around the cabinets with USB Charging/Accessory plugs and outlets in them.    The next step is to add cargo/roof racks so that I can attach an awning.   I have also been considering larger wheels on mine but that would be down the road.    Currently I don't have any issues going where I want to go.

Standard features on the Wazat include:   Doors and screen doors on both sides, 120/12 volt wiring, tongue jack, full size spare, fully insulated, and powered ceiling vent.

I keep mine pretty well stocked so once I decide to head out, I can be on the road in less than an hour.

Fiberglass would work well for what you are describing.

Used Casita 17
Used Scamp 16

They are the more common ones and can be found in your price range, but you have to pounce on it immediately or it will be sold, usually within hours or days of listing.

Edit: They may be too small for what you want, but for a week or two away, plus keeping one for many years....they are nice trailers.

Good topic.  My wife has finally said it's time to consider a smaller camper.  She's been looking hard at Flagstaff's E-Pro series, specifically their 19 model, which is a 20-foot camper.  She wants to keep it smaller and this is basically a "base-camp" type camper for just the two of us.  She likes the ability to add racks for the mountain bikes and kayak as well, and an off-road package (really just upgraded tires) to do some minor boondocking for some planned trips out west where we can go off-grid for a week or so.  We have about a year, so we're in research mode...

A lot of people we know say to go bigger, but that's all they do...RV camp.  We are way to active to sit in an RV camp, drink beer and watch soccer/football games (although we do like drinking beer and watching some games).  We are still biking, backpacking, and kayaking, so we aren't ready for the stagnant RV lifestyle for another decade or so  What we want is a little better shelter system than a tent to stretch our base-camp so we can still keep backpacking.  We see RV camps are simply an alternative to hotels, not a destination.  Additionally, I can upgrade our bug-out plan/system as well...

ROCK6

I think I may have decided on the Coachman Apex Nano 187RB.  Azdel/Aluminum construction, single axle, North-South queen bed, rear bathroom with separate shower and sink, 3800lbs loaded (about 3100 unloaded).  50 fresh, 30 grey, 30 black, 20lb propane tank.  2-door fridge/freezer, no counter space, but I can make a cutting board that fits over half the sink.  We will probably still do most of our cooking at the picnic table, anyway.

Anyone have any good/bad experiences with Coachman?

Take a look at the Livin Lite all aluminium camp trailers. If I was buying one, I'd definitely be talking to them.

I'm a little late to the party, but I'll chime in here: I work for a small family owner RV dealer who carries quite a few Coachmen products, and I can tell you that our experience has been almost universally positive. We have several Apexes on order because we liked the build and quality. We sell the bigger brother (Spirit) and have had tremendous luck with them. Feel free to shoot me any questions you have and I'll be happy to help.

Digging up an old thread...

We put a deposit down on a new 2020 Coachman Apex Nano 187RB.  It was the only one in the price range we were willing to pay ($15k) that had the layout and features we wanted.  We're getting it for $15,900.  Yea, a bit more, but here's why.  We're getting one of the last 2020 models and they weren't taking orders for any more 2020 models, as the 2021's are entering production now, which are more expensive.  They all seem to have the Summit package included now, and on top of that we're getting the Off Grid package which gives us two 20lb propane tanks, 100w solar panel & controller, water miser shower faucet, and it also includes the Outfitter package which includes off road tires, aluminum wheels, bike rack and toy lock.  Not sure on tank heaters, but we'll see.  The later '20 models have countersunk cook tops and sinks, with flush covers for both, upgraded faucets, extra towel hooks, bottle opener (!).  I'm hoping these tires are going to be a little better than the chinabombs they usually come with.  Probably still chinese tires, but maybe a little better.  Should be arriving at the dealer in a month or so, and we'll pick it up in the spring.

Already got the WD/SC hitch, Tekonsha P3 brake controller on order.  There's about 20 more things in my amazon cart that we'll need.  Been watching a bunch of "newbie" RV videos on YT, there sure are a bunch of them.

Oh, my max tongue weight is 720lbs, so I picked an 800lb hitch, tongue weight on the trailer is like 420lbs.  Did I do it right?

I looked at the e-pro, looks like it's under the Forest River umbrella, like Coachman.  E19FD?  I looked at those models, and decided the 187RB was the ticket.  About the same size as the ones you're looking at.  I really like the layout in this one, tank sizes, fridge size.  No place to mount a ladder, but that's not a big deal, $70 for a telescopic 12' ladder.  Ours is going to have the outfitter package and off-grid package, we'll see how well it all works.  I'm thinking we'll mostly park it at state parks, some with electric, some with full hookup, some with nothing.  We don't have plans to go any bigger than this, we want something with less things to maintain.  That's why we wanted no slides or tent beds.

Oh, tagging @Wodstock.  

Been looking at something similar for the wife, self and dog when I finally leave this forsaken country.

CD

Got a contact at Forest River thru a FB group, says ours should be built and thru inspections by the end of January, and to our dealer mid-late February.  

I'm learning that I have to lower my quality expectations if you're not buying an Airstream.  

Another vote for RPOD.  First pic was like 2 days after buying it, second is after I put better tires and a lift on it.

Looked at the rpods, the one we would have picked would be the rp192.  Probably would have been a couple thousand more than the Apex Nano 187RB that we're getting.  Similar construction, and it would be heavier than the Apex.  They both seem like decent rigs.

What's the best day of the week for one to be built?  

Well, it showed up at the dealer on Wednesday, we're going to the dealer tomorrow morning to check it out.  When the insurance agent emailed us a quote with all of our personal info in it, I got pissed.  

Sportsman brand. we have a 19' we're the kind that uses it for shelter and sleeping, most of our time is spent outside.

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Here is our 2012 13' Scamp. We tow it with my Wrangler or the wife's '19 Rav4
For just me, her and the GSD we love it. Two piece fiberglass construction
with minimal penetrations lends it to being very water tight. We plan to upgrade
to a heavier-duty axle and bigger tires to make it more trail friendly.
Badlands NP, SD two weeks ago. Fifty the dog.
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Curt Gowdy SP, WY 2019
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We have a 21 footer right now, and before that we had a 17 footer for about 5 years.  With two kids we needed bunks and a more realish bed.  My wife is at the trailer show today with one of her friends.  They have a 40 ft trailer and also only 2 kids.  My wife wants smaller when the kids are gone.  I want smaller now and the kids can have a tent.

Our Apex is back at the dealer for more warranty work.  The outriggers near the tires are too close, and the lugs on the tire caught one of them and bent it.  They're going to flip them around so the vertical portion is away from the tires in respect to the flat portion against the floor.  Should move them away about 1" and provide enough clearance.  Well, there's other issues they've gotta look at, too.  All cosmetic, but I'm gonna hold Coachmen to actually delivering a product that's not at least falling apart the first year.