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Posted: 11/20/2018 10:14:52 PM EDT
I first learned to run a chainsaw when I was 12 years old. I was not instructed well so i had to figure it out kind of quick. Fortunately i learned to read the compression/ tension right away. Not much felling but enough to get the idea pretty quick. I never learned about wedges or the "proper" way to do things. I did, however, stay safe.

Fast forward many years and I developed a desire to add a packable axe to my survival gear. I knew a bit about felling trees and I had an old double bit I handled and sharpened myself.

What i wanted was a Gransfors Bruks Small Forest Axe, but the price was far too high. I couldn't justify paying over $150 for it no matter how beautiful it was.

At that point I decided on two things. I wanted to build my own analog to the SFA and I wanted to learn proper technique. That lead me to two things; the flea market and YouTube.

I watched technique, on both hafting and axe use.

I started buying axe heads and used the principles from the video "an axe to grind" to set up my edge profiles. I used the techniques I saw to handle the axe heads I bought.

Then I used the axes I built to safely fell small trees, limb them safely by copying safe techniques, then I learned to buck to length safely, then I learned to craft with an axe.

Ever present in my mind was the capability of the SFA. 1.5 lbs on a 19" haft weighing 2 lbs. You can't just buy a 19" handle easily. I built axes with lighter heads on 18" handles, the same weight head on 18", lighter heads on 20", heavier heads on 20". It just started to spiral on it's own.

After awhile it became a fun game to put together axes of almost every conceivable head weight and handle length. It wasn't long until I had lots of axes every bit the equal of the SFA. I had more capable axes. More over, I could compare almost every size and weight axe side by side.

All this mania lead me to seek out better techniques in all types of wood cutting. I started learning about wedging. I started learning about combining hand saws and wedges with axes. I started learning more about chainsaw techniques. I started learning about axes.

I can build and swing an axe. Hard won knowledge of countless hours immersing myself in every bit of info I could absorb and put into action.

This is why I don't criticize people who want to collect lots of knives, or packs, or stoves, or whatever gadget they fancy. I don't think the guy with experience with only one gun is necessarily the master of that gun. The guy with only on axe may be pretty good with it but he lacks the depth of experience to truly understand the incredible diversity available.

I was recently told that I am all about gear because I have lots of axes.

I can swing all but two of them completely ambidextrously and safely in all conditions. I would say I learned something. Wouldn't you?

My collection was inspired by a search for knowledge. That search for knowledge inspired more collecting and a greater search for knowledge. Yes I spent money but much less than the average Arfcommers gun collection.

I am not defending collecting as a survival technique, but a collection can be the source of education on a topic. You can learn something online. You can learn something from a good video. You can do it yourself and learn a lot in the process.

I finally bought my dream axe.....the saga continues.....
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:28:12 PM EDT
[#1]
The curse of searching for knowledge is an evil one that causes you to spend money. I have a small survival axe that will fit on a backpack. Will it fell a big tree no yet it is good enough to chop some limbs to be able to start a fire. I have watched a lot of old axe rehab shit and the old ones once the rust is gone seem better than the new ones you can buy. If you spend the time on them.
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:36:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The curse of searching for knowledge is an evil one that causes you to spend money. I have a small survival axe that will fit on a backpack. Will it fell a big tree no yet it is good enough to chop some limbs to be able to start a fire. I have watched a lot of old axe rehab shit and the old ones once the rust is gone seem better than the new ones you can buy. If you spend the time on them.
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You can do amazing things with a $5 flea market boy's axe head and a $12 link handle from the hardware. It's just sweat equity after that. Learning to use it effectively and safely is priceless.
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:42:44 PM EDT
[#3]
Ive got an axe I bought from SG 15 years ago, its great and use it all the time, its a green swedish made, id like to find another one.
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:47:04 PM EDT
[#4]
Beware of the man that only owns one rifle, he knows how to shoot it.
Link Posted: 11/20/2018 10:52:58 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Beware of the man that only owns one rifle, he knows how to shoot it.
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So you didn't notice I addressed that ridiculous notion in my post? I know dozens of men who have only one rifle and they all suck at shooting. Do you actually know anyone with just one rifle that can really shoot well? It's a silly saying.
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 12:19:15 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
This is why I don't criticize people who want to collect lots of knives, or packs, or stoves, or whatever gadget they fancy. I don't think the guy with experience with only one gun is necessarily the master of that gun. The guy with only on axe may be pretty good with it but he lacks the depth of experience to truly understand the incredible diversity available.

I was recently told that I am all about gear because I have lots of axes.

I am not defending collecting as a survival technique, but a collection can be the source of education on a topic. You can learn something online. You can learn something from a good video. You can do it yourself and learn a lot in the process.
View Quote
I'll state up front that I too grew up doing mostly log splitting with a maul or limbing with a lighter axe; I very much appreciate their value, but I am far from an expert.  Our hobbies (which often includes "collecting") can be a significant value if tempered with "trial and error" use, learning different techniques, and honing skills, training, and practicing.  I think it's a misconception to automatically assume the collector is simply just knowledgeable but lacks experience or practicality of whatever collection drives them.

I personally find your posts educational and instructive.  While I don't have the same passion for axes, I've learned a lot and despite my lower-prioritization of an axe in some situations/activities, I still agree they can be of significant value in trained, skilled, and experienced hands.  Guns are a similar analogy to the collection of axes; different manual of arms, different applications, different sighting systems, different ranges, different ergonomics.  Without hands on experience with various platforms and applications, a limited battery may help one excel on that singular or limited collection, but there is a wider educational experience when you broaden your experience and skill with different platforms.  Knowing (and learning) the limitations and capabilities of different "types" of a certain item is valuable experience that is quite limited if you're limited to just one (or a couple) different variations.  Sure, you can become an expert with that one rifle or one variation of an axe (or knife, etc.), but I also see that as a limitation to your knowledge, skill, and different technique applications.

Keep on chopping my friend...your introspection is a valuable insight for all the various kit associated with "survival applications".  The axe is one of many survival/work tools and it shouldn't be viewed as simply a singular, sharpened metal wedge attached to a wooden handle.

Quoted:
Beware of the man that only owns one rifle, IF he knows how to shoot it.
View Quote
Again, the same assumption, so I fixed it for you.  I too know many "hunters" with one rifle that simply suck at accurate shooting (and even hunting).  One must invest time, skill, discipline, and effort into mastering the one tool or the many tools.  That moniker only holds true if the individual dedicates himself to the craft and not simply the tool; the number of tools are inconsequential.  I will agree, there are many collectors who don't invest time and effort into mastering the tools they own, but the number is meaningless.  If you're willing to dedicate yourself to the craft, the variations of the tools used can be a valuable asset in your education, skill development, technique use, and understanding applications along with the limitations and capabilities of those variations.  It shouldn't simply be one or the other...

ROCK6
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 10:15:37 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'll state up front that I too grew up doing mostly log splitting with a maul or limbing with a lighter axe; I very much appreciate their value, but I am far from an expert.  Our hobbies (which often includes "collecting") can be a significant value if tempered with "trial and error" use, learning different techniques, and honing skills, training, and practicing.  I think it's a misconception to automatically assume the collector is simply just knowledgeable but lacks experience or practicality of whatever collection drives them.

I personally find your posts educational and instructive.  While I don't have the same passion for axes, I've learned a lot and despite my lower-prioritization of an axe in some situations/activities, I still agree they can be of significant value in trained, skilled, and experienced hands.  Guns are a similar analogy to the collection of axes; different manual of arms, different applications, different sighting systems, different ranges, different ergonomics.  Without hands on experience with various platforms and applications, a limited battery may help one excel on that singular or limited collection, but there is a wider educational experience when you broaden your experience and skill with different platforms.  Knowing (and learning) the limitations and capabilities of different "types" of a certain item is valuable experience that is quite limited if you're limited to just one (or a couple) different variations.  Sure, you can become an expert with that one rifle or one variation of an axe (or knife, etc.), but I also see that as a limitation to your knowledge, skill, and different technique applications.

Keep on chopping my friend...your introspection is a valuable insight for all the various kit associated with "survival applications".  The axe is one of many survival/work tools and it shouldn't be viewed as simply a singular, sharpened metal wedge attached to a wooden handle.

Again, the same assumption, so I fixed it for you.  I too know many "hunters" with one rifle that simply suck at accurate shooting (and even hunting).  One must invest time, skill, discipline, and effort into mastering the one tool or the many tools.  That moniker only holds true if the individual dedicates himself to the craft and not simply the tool; the number of tools are inconsequential.  I will agree, there are many collectors who don't invest time and effort into mastering the tools they own, but the number is meaningless.  If you're willing to dedicate yourself to the craft, the variations of the tools used can be a valuable asset in your education, skill development, technique use, and understanding applications along with the limitations and capabilities of those variations.  It shouldn't simply be one or the other...

ROCK6
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
This is why I don't criticize people who want to collect lots of knives, or packs, or stoves, or whatever gadget they fancy. I don't think the guy with experience with only one gun is necessarily the master of that gun. The guy with only on axe may be pretty good with it but he lacks the depth of experience to truly understand the incredible diversity available.

I was recently told that I am all about gear because I have lots of axes.

I am not defending collecting as a survival technique, but a collection can be the source of education on a topic. You can learn something online. You can learn something from a good video. You can do it yourself and learn a lot in the process.
I'll state up front that I too grew up doing mostly log splitting with a maul or limbing with a lighter axe; I very much appreciate their value, but I am far from an expert.  Our hobbies (which often includes "collecting") can be a significant value if tempered with "trial and error" use, learning different techniques, and honing skills, training, and practicing.  I think it's a misconception to automatically assume the collector is simply just knowledgeable but lacks experience or practicality of whatever collection drives them.

I personally find your posts educational and instructive.  While I don't have the same passion for axes, I've learned a lot and despite my lower-prioritization of an axe in some situations/activities, I still agree they can be of significant value in trained, skilled, and experienced hands.  Guns are a similar analogy to the collection of axes; different manual of arms, different applications, different sighting systems, different ranges, different ergonomics.  Without hands on experience with various platforms and applications, a limited battery may help one excel on that singular or limited collection, but there is a wider educational experience when you broaden your experience and skill with different platforms.  Knowing (and learning) the limitations and capabilities of different "types" of a certain item is valuable experience that is quite limited if you're limited to just one (or a couple) different variations.  Sure, you can become an expert with that one rifle or one variation of an axe (or knife, etc.), but I also see that as a limitation to your knowledge, skill, and different technique applications.

Keep on chopping my friend...your introspection is a valuable insight for all the various kit associated with "survival applications".  The axe is one of many survival/work tools and it shouldn't be viewed as simply a singular, sharpened metal wedge attached to a wooden handle.

Quoted:
Beware of the man that only owns one rifle, IF he knows how to shoot it.
Again, the same assumption, so I fixed it for you.  I too know many "hunters" with one rifle that simply suck at accurate shooting (and even hunting).  One must invest time, skill, discipline, and effort into mastering the one tool or the many tools.  That moniker only holds true if the individual dedicates himself to the craft and not simply the tool; the number of tools are inconsequential.  I will agree, there are many collectors who don't invest time and effort into mastering the tools they own, but the number is meaningless.  If you're willing to dedicate yourself to the craft, the variations of the tools used can be a valuable asset in your education, skill development, technique use, and understanding applications along with the limitations and capabilities of those variations.  It shouldn't simply be one or the other...

ROCK6
I totally forgot to mention the other related skills that I developed as part of my axe addiction.

I bought draw knives and spoke shaves to shape handles. I had to learn to sharpen them and use them in the process.

I learned about rasps and ferriers rasps and round rasps.

I learned a bunch more about wood chisels and sharpening them.

I ended up carving lots of handles and designed some that I sold for a while. I can make a handle for just about any of my tools from a rough piece of wood.

I bought and learned to sharpen and use antique frame saws. I have two working units that cut beautifully.

I bought and am in the process of rehabbing a few cross cut saws. I'll need my carving skills to make new handles for one of them.

There are plenty of new or improved skills I'm forgetting. They don't just come from collecting but also from mastery of the subject.

I totally forgot about learning to use the belt grinder to profile axe edges that lead to modifying Old Hickory knives and the beginnings of learning to grind knives.
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 8:38:58 PM EDT
[#8]
Do you have a blog or website where you've compiled your posts, lessons, tutorials, reviews, how to's, etc?  I've enjoyed them over the years, but never bookmarked them or filed them away and they slowly slip away into the archives.
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 8:43:07 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
Do you have a blog or website where you've compiled your posts, lessons, tutorials, reviews, how to's, etc?  I've enjoyed them over the years, but never bookmarked them or filed them away and they slowly slip away into the archives.
View Quote
Photobucket wiped out thousands of hours of work I posted here.
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 9:18:34 PM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:
I ended up carving lots of handles and designed some that I sold for a while. I can make a handle for just about any of my tools from a rough piece of wood.

I bought and learned to sharpen and use antique frame saws. I have two working units that cut beautifully.

There are plenty of new or improved skills I'm forgetting. They don't just come from collecting but also from mastery of the subject.

I totally forgot about learning to use the belt grinder to profile axe edges that lead to modifying Old Hickory knives and the beginnings of learning to grind knives.
View Quote
Absolutely agree with the ancillary skills often tied to our "hobbies".  I just wanted to highlight the lack of skill of replacing the handle of a pressed axe head...which is why you likely find so many in pawn shops and secondhand stores.  Improperly used axes end up with cracked handles, mistreated wood that cracks and splinters, etc.  I wanted to point this out as it's something I want to practice....if you can't replace a handle on a quality axe head, that axe head just becomes a very heavy ulu

Sharpening is an art as much as a skill, and the different grinds, bevel angles, etc. all significantly impact the effectiveness of the tool...and dull blades are far more dangerous than sharp blades!

ROCK6
Link Posted: 11/21/2018 9:57:53 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Absolutely agree with the ancillary skills often tied to our "hobbies".  I just wanted to highlight the lack of skill of replacing the handle of a pressed axe head...which is why you likely find so many in pawn shops and secondhand stores.  Improperly used axes end up with cracked handles, mistreated wood that cracks and splinters, etc.  I wanted to point this out as it's something I want to practice....if you can't replace a handle on a quality axe head, that axe head just becomes a very heavy ulu

Sharpening is an art as much as a skill, and the different grinds, bevel angles, etc. all significantly impact the effectiveness of the tool...and dull blades are far more dangerous than sharp blades!

ROCK6
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I ended up carving lots of handles and designed some that I sold for a while. I can make a handle for just about any of my tools from a rough piece of wood.

I bought and learned to sharpen and use antique frame saws. I have two working units that cut beautifully.

There are plenty of new or improved skills I'm forgetting. They don't just come from collecting but also from mastery of the subject.

I totally forgot about learning to use the belt grinder to profile axe edges that lead to modifying Old Hickory knives and the beginnings of learning to grind knives.
Absolutely agree with the ancillary skills often tied to our "hobbies".  I just wanted to highlight the lack of skill of replacing the handle of a pressed axe head...which is why you likely find so many in pawn shops and secondhand stores.  Improperly used axes end up with cracked handles, mistreated wood that cracks and splinters, etc.  I wanted to point this out as it's something I want to practice....if you can't replace a handle on a quality axe head, that axe head just becomes a very heavy ulu

Sharpening is an art as much as a skill, and the different grinds, bevel angles, etc. all significantly impact the effectiveness of the tool...and dull blades are far more dangerous than sharp blades!

ROCK6
Well said.
Link Posted: 11/24/2018 4:44:43 AM EDT
[#12]
Sounds like it would have cheaper to just have bought the GB SFA right off the bat!

Link Posted: 11/24/2018 9:42:39 AM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:
Sounds like it would have cheaper to just have bought the GB SFA right off the bat!

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But I learned so much more!
Link Posted: 11/25/2018 9:04:20 AM EDT
[#14]
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Quoted:
Sounds like it would have cheaper to just have bought the GB SFA right off the bat!

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Meh, I don't necessarily think so.  I have GB SFA, I like it, but it doesn't get used much.  I just haven't dedicated enough time to get proficient with it and maximize its potential...most of that is on me which I'll admit.  However, if I was avoiding that purchase by trying and using other axes, learning techniques, experimenting, and expanding my knowledge, I would likely appreciate it much more.  I always find "cheap" projects get far more testing and I learn much more since I'm less concerned about the cost or maybe even inadvertent abuse.  The GB SFA is a very capable tool, but I actually end up using saws more often

ROCK6
Link Posted: 11/25/2018 2:15:22 PM EDT
[#15]
I would just like to mention that finding some old axe heads at flea markets and garage sales is a great way to get started on learning about axes. I usually pay around $5. $12 for a hardware handle to start. Once you hang a few you should start to develop an idea of what you will use an axe for and start to want certain things.
Link Posted: 11/25/2018 2:23:06 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:

[snip]

My collection was inspired by a search for knowledge

[snap]
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This. This is the ultimate summarization. The same is true for me, I analyzed myself.
But many other reasons exist for other types of individuals (hoarding is another one for other types and it exists for vacuums of personality) and also, a man's inner visual taste (males are visual creatures)

Have gun - sorry, have fun!
Link Posted: 11/25/2018 3:54:51 PM EDT
[#17]
Lots of things that people get into go much further than intended, and teach lots more stuff than the person initially wanted... For example:

1.  Wife told me should try calligraphy to give me something to do, combat boredom, improve handwriting, etc.  So once started, I began to learn not only calligraphy, but learned about various types of pens, nibs (the little metal thing that dispenses ink on the end of the pen), types of paper, how papers are made and what various types are for, inks and how inks are made and what various types are for, and of course, pens in general.  I gave up calligraphy and went into writing letters to people all over the world in order to practice cursive penmanship.

2.  Guns, y'all know about what I speak without further elaboration.

3.  knife making.  I just wanted to make a knife...I didn't set out to learn about metallurgy, heat treating, leather working, sheath making, properties of various woods for handles, horns vs antlers for handles, making rivets, and on and on...

No different than OP's collecting of axes...
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