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Posted: 5/27/2021 10:19:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/27/2021 12:28:23 PM EDT by Rossi]
Have you guys seen this one?


https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/not-aware-of-the-washington-state-long-4983092/

It apparently mandates that employees buy their own long-term care insurance or be taxed on the payroll.   There's no limit on the tax.  Everything from salary, bonuses, etc. would be taxed to fund this stuff.


ETA: This thing is really bad.  More hands in our pockets, courtesy of the local commies.  Here's more info/

https://www.dwt.com/blogs/employment-labor-and-benefits/2021/03/washington-long-term-care-act

https://www.coldstream.com/blog/2021/04/26/new-washington-state-long-term-care-act/


Link Posted: 5/27/2021 12:56:22 PM EDT
Sounds like an income tax to me
Link Posted: 5/27/2021 3:06:22 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Kubota3430:
Sounds like an income tax to me
View Quote


An insurance agent described it as a money-grabbing act, since it makes difficult to get the payments (payer only vested after 10 years, and must be WA resident, among other things).

So, yeah
Link Posted: 5/27/2021 5:50:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/27/2021 5:58:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2021 10:29:54 PM EDT by Master_Blaster]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Rossi:


An insurance agent described it as a money-grabbing act, since it makes difficult to get the payments (payer only vested after 10 years, and must be WA resident, among other things).

So, yeah
View Quote


It is. The actual payments - if you qualify to receive them - are only ~$100/day, which is inadequate to cover contemporary long term care. Keep in mind, your income will have to be at poverty rates to even qualify. Besides, we all know that the revenue will be spent on pet issues as soon as it hits the coffers anyways.

I'm working with my agent on a long term insurance plan involving investments with actual returns as opposed to theoretical, qualified stipends. Everyone should be taking charge of planning for their long term care needs anyway, so
Link Posted: 5/27/2021 10:55:40 PM EDT
You can't opt out until October when ESD is going to publish the opt-out procedure (not that I trust those clowns that managed to lose a billion to Nigerians).

So there's nothing you can really do at this point.
Link Posted: 5/27/2021 11:22:43 PM EDT
At least it's easy to opt out. Just buy a policy for a month and then cancel it. Or just sign the paper saying you are already covered by another policy
Link Posted: 5/28/2021 9:27:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/28/2021 9:27:52 AM EDT by Rossi]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:


It is. The actual payments - if you qualify to receive them - are only ~$100/day, which is inadequate to cover contemporary long term care. Keep in mind, your income will have to be at poverty rates to even qualify. Besides, we all know that the revenue will be spent pet issues as soon as it hits the coffers anyways.

I'm working with my agent on a long term insurance plan involving investments with actual returns as opposed to theoretical, qualified stipends. Everyone should be taking charge of planning for their long term care needs anyway, so
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Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By Rossi:


An insurance agent described it as a money-grabbing act, since it makes difficult to get the payments (payer only vested after 10 years, and must be WA resident, among other things).

So, yeah


It is. The actual payments - if you qualify to receive them - are only ~$100/day, which is inadequate to cover contemporary long term care. Keep in mind, your income will have to be at poverty rates to even qualify. Besides, we all know that the revenue will be spent pet issues as soon as it hits the coffers anyways.

I'm working with my agent on a long term insurance plan involving investments with actual returns as opposed to theoretical, qualified stipends. Everyone should be taking charge of planning for their long term care needs anyway, so



How does this work, and is it worth for retired folks?   Both my wife and I are less than 10 years from retirement.  Therefore, right now considering the opt-out process, since we would never see any of the money being robbed from us.

Another insurance agent said that the purpose of this bill is to fund the State's Medicaid program, which is close to bankrupt.  The hurdles and limitations to pay any premiums is intentional, so the State can do whatever with the "insurance" funds.  

That old saying about socialism only working until it runs out of other people's money confirmed once more.

Link Posted: 5/30/2021 10:42:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/31/2021 2:19:26 AM EDT by Master_Blaster]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Rossi:



How does this work, and is it worth for retired folks?   Both my wife and I are less than 10 years from retirement.  Therefore, right now considering the opt-out process, since we would never see any of the money being robbed from us.

Another insurance agent said that the purpose of this bill is to fund the State's Medicaid program, which is close to bankrupt.  The hurdles and limitations to pay any premiums is intentional, so the State can do whatever with the "insurance" funds.  

That old saying about socialism only working until it runs out of other people's money confirmed once more.

View Quote


I forgot to include that, besides having to be at a certain age & income level to qualify, it's also restricted to WA residents. So, if you move out of state when you retire, then you get nothing for having paid into it, even if you would otherwise qualify.

It's not designed to help residents. It's just another revenue stream for the state govt. The payouts are restricted to a statistical % of state residents by design, & are insufficient in any case.
Link Posted: 5/31/2021 2:18:57 AM EDT
Is this something we as Washingtonians will get to vote down? Since we sure as shit didn’t vote for it.
Link Posted: 5/31/2021 7:21:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/1/2021 12:12:00 AM EDT by Master_Blaster]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 2T2_Crash:
Is this something we as Washingtonians will get to vote down? Since we sure as shit didn’t vote for it.
View Quote


Don't know, but I'm sure there will be effort to suppress/sabotage any initiative efforts. Ironically, it actually does create a legitimate motive to square away some form of insurance/investment for long term care, which people have a tendency to just avoid addressing altogether. I'm working on a plan that involves coverage, but with an investment component with provisions to use funds more generally, rather than being restricted solely to healthcare coverage.
Link Posted: 6/8/2021 3:12:44 PM EDT
Is there anyone that is mounting a legal challenge to this bill?

Anyone?  Tim Eyman would be a good candidate to lead a challenge to this and an initiative to roll it back.
Link Posted: 6/10/2021 10:19:45 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Redcat:
Is there anyone that is mounting a legal challenge to this bill?

Anyone?  Tim Eyman would be a good candidate to lead a challenge to this and an initiative to roll it back.
View Quote



With the "elections" around here and how the votes are "counted", plus the state's supreme court, this has no chance to be overthrown.

For folks currently working, it's relatively easy to opt out.  However, anyone starting in 2022 or moving into the state next year will be prey to it.

As already said, it's just a way the state robbers found to implement income tax, since most of the people being robbed will never collect any benefits out of it, and the money will simply disappear into other stuff.





Link Posted: 6/11/2021 2:07:05 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Redcat:
Is there anyone that is mounting a legal challenge to this bill?

Anyone?  Tim Eyman would be a good candidate to lead a challenge to this and an initiative to roll it back.
View Quote

Please not Tim Eyman. Anything he touches is dead on arrival
Link Posted: 6/12/2021 2:59:20 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Redcat:
Is there anyone that is mounting a legal challenge to this bill?

Anyone?  Tim Eyman would be a good candidate to lead a challenge to this and an initiative to roll it back.
View Quote

I believe Tim Eyman has barred from participating in an political activities in Washington State. Todd Ferguson took care of that.
Link Posted: 6/12/2021 8:56:49 AM EDT
Kali North at it again.
No end in sight.
Link Posted: 6/15/2021 3:19:25 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eac223:

I believe Tim Eyman has barred from participating in an political activities in Washington State. Todd Ferguson took care of that.
View Quote


Exactly how is that even legal?
Link Posted: 6/16/2021 2:10:21 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:


Exactly how is that even legal?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By eac223:

I believe Tim Eyman has barred from participating in an political activities in Washington State. Todd Ferguson took care of that.


Exactly how is that even legal?

You're going to have to Google it to find out what king of gymnastics they had to do to pull that of. I don't fully understand it myself. I just know they did it.
Link Posted: 6/17/2021 9:13:29 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eac223:

You're going to have to Google it to find out what king of gymnastics they had to do to pull that of. I don't fully understand it myself. I just know they did it.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By eac223:
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By eac223:

I believe Tim Eyman has barred from participating in an political activities in Washington State. Todd Ferguson took care of that.


Exactly how is that even legal?

You're going to have to Google it to find out what king of gymnastics they had to do to pull that of. I don't fully understand it myself. I just know they did it.

His dumbass deserved it anyway
Link Posted: 6/18/2021 8:48:17 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By majorcollins:

His dumbass deserved it anyway
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By majorcollins:
Originally Posted By eac223:
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By eac223:

I believe Tim Eyman has barred from participating in an political activities in Washington State. Todd Ferguson took care of that.


Exactly how is that even legal?

You're going to have to Google it to find out what king of gymnastics they had to do to pull that of. I don't fully understand it myself. I just know they did it.

His dumbass deserved it anyway



Why is he bad?  The stuff I read about him shows him fighting against the rampant taxes in WA State.  It's not a surprise that the corrupts want him out.  However, what bad thing did he do?


Link Posted: 6/22/2021 6:52:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/22/2021 6:54:32 PM EDT by Boatswain]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Rossi:



Why is he bad?  The stuff I read about him shows him fighting against the rampant taxes in WA State.  It's not a surprise that the corrupts want him out.  However, what bad thing did he do?


View Quote


He paid himself hundreds of thousands of dollars from his campaign, and also pocketed a $300k kickback from a firm he hired. That's just the two I can remember, there are lots more.

He managed to violate pretty much every campaign finance law and admitted to a bunch of them. I'm not saying others don't do the same thing, but Eyman took it to a whole new level and thought he could just tell the court to get lost for twenty years. He thought wrong.

The court verdict has 30 pages of his shenanigans detailed.
Link Posted: 6/26/2021 4:47:19 PM EDT
Can anyone recommend an insurance agent for long term care insurance? Everett - Seattle - Tacoma area.
Link Posted: 6/29/2021 1:09:02 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TigerForce:
Can anyone recommend an insurance agent for long term care insurance? Everett - Seattle - Tacoma area.
View Quote


I’ve been looking too.  Haven’t found one yet but talked to a insurance broker.  They said they are learning about the new law and coming up with a marketing package.  

The tax is uncapped so the more you make, the more you pay. If you are over $100k per year, it would be financially prudent to opt out and purchase an alternate LTC plan privately.
Link Posted: 6/29/2021 9:36:06 AM EDT
It appears that some companies are no longer offering this type of insurance in WA or limiting age groups.  The scam is set.


Link Posted: 6/29/2021 5:40:54 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shadows:


I’ve been looking too.  Haven’t found one yet but talked to a insurance broker.  They said they are learning about the new law and coming up with a marketing package.  

The tax is uncapped so the more you make, the more you pay. If you are over $100k per year, it would be financially prudent to opt out and purchase an alternate LTC plan privately.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shadows:
Originally Posted By TigerForce:
Can anyone recommend an insurance agent for long term care insurance? Everett - Seattle - Tacoma area.


I’ve been looking too.  Haven’t found one yet but talked to a insurance broker.  They said they are learning about the new law and coming up with a marketing package.  

The tax is uncapped so the more you make, the more you pay. If you are over $100k per year, it would be financially prudent to opt out and purchase an alternate LTC plan privately.


My Farmer's agent is setting us up. PM & I'll send contact info. She's all over it.

Here's a snip from an email I received from my rep, Ron Muzzall, concerning it:


...

This past session we had quite a few bad bills. Being in the minority, we had little chance of stopping the onslaught of policies that drive up the cost of government or shirk our responsibility to provide oversight of state agencies run amok. However, we did have some bipartisan wins. That includes an amendment I sponsored to extend the opt-out period to the long-term care payroll tax adopted in 2019.

This long-term care payroll tax was passed in 2019 as HB 1087, the Long Term Care Trust Act, requiring that everyone participate in a long-term care program by deducting a 0.58% payroll tax to fund it. This tax rate is likely to fluctuate as the costs and participation become more clear.

A significant problem with this program is that the benefits are negligible to the employee relative to how much they’ll be paying, especially for younger workers. In fact, the cost to taxpayers will return a maximum benefit of just over $36,000 per individual. That doesn’t cover much for people needing access to long term care services. Also, the benefits are not portable, meaning you must retire within the state to use them.

Fortunately, the Legislature provided a fix to allow people to opt-out. I was proud to sponsor the amendment that extended the date to get an exemption. You can apply for one by attesting that you have a qualifying long-term care insurance purchased before November 1, 2021. You must apply through the Employment Security Department (ESD).

Of course, it’s a challenge for government to do anything simply; the opt-out provisions are somewhat restrictive. For example, younger workers under 18 cannot apply for the exemption, and military spouses are not automatically exempt, though active-duty military are considered federal employees, so their pay is exempt. Getting one of these plans can take some time, so if you are wanting to take advantage of this option by purchasing your own plan, the time to act is now!

One important thing to keep in mind is that a lot of the implementation of this opt-out is up in the air. There are some hard questions that I know people want answers to now, but unfortunately, it’s a bit of a waiting game. ESD is in the process of formulating these rules.
Link Posted: 6/29/2021 8:08:02 PM EDT
This whole thing is fucked up.
So if .mil get exemption for being federal employees does that mean every Fed employee is exempt? My wife wirks for the FAA.
What about folks like me not currently working, I guess we are just fucked when we rejoin the work force?
Link Posted: 6/29/2021 10:22:17 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:


My Farmer's agent is setting us up. PM & I'll send contact info. She's all over it.

Here's a snip from an email I received from my rep, Ron Muzzall, concerning it:

View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By shadows:
Originally Posted By TigerForce:
Can anyone recommend an insurance agent for long term care insurance? Everett - Seattle - Tacoma area.


I’ve been looking too.  Haven’t found one yet but talked to a insurance broker.  They said they are learning about the new law and coming up with a marketing package.  

The tax is uncapped so the more you make, the more you pay. If you are over $100k per year, it would be financially prudent to opt out and purchase an alternate LTC plan privately.


My Farmer's agent is setting us up. PM & I'll send contact info. She's all over it.

Here's a snip from an email I received from my rep, Ron Muzzall, concerning it:


...

This past session we had quite a few bad bills. Being in the minority, we had little chance of stopping the onslaught of policies that drive up the cost of government or shirk our responsibility to provide oversight of state agencies run amok. However, we did have some bipartisan wins. That includes an amendment I sponsored to extend the opt-out period to the long-term care payroll tax adopted in 2019.

This long-term care payroll tax was passed in 2019 as HB 1087, the Long Term Care Trust Act, requiring that everyone participate in a long-term care program by deducting a 0.58% payroll tax to fund it. This tax rate is likely to fluctuate as the costs and participation become more clear.

A significant problem with this program is that the benefits are negligible to the employee relative to how much they’ll be paying, especially for younger workers. In fact, the cost to taxpayers will return a maximum benefit of just over $36,000 per individual. That doesn’t cover much for people needing access to long term care services. Also, the benefits are not portable, meaning you must retire within the state to use them.

Fortunately, the Legislature provided a fix to allow people to opt-out. I was proud to sponsor the amendment that extended the date to get an exemption. You can apply for one by attesting that you have a qualifying long-term care insurance purchased before November 1, 2021. You must apply through the Employment Security Department (ESD).

Of course, it’s a challenge for government to do anything simply; the opt-out provisions are somewhat restrictive. For example, younger workers under 18 cannot apply for the exemption, and military spouses are not automatically exempt, though active-duty military are considered federal employees, so their pay is exempt. Getting one of these plans can take some time, so if you are wanting to take advantage of this option by purchasing your own plan, the time to act is now!

One important thing to keep in mind is that a lot of the implementation of this opt-out is up in the air. There are some hard questions that I know people want answers to now, but unfortunately, it’s a bit of a waiting game. ESD is in the process of formulating these rules.

Sounds like no proof is needed. You just have to attest that you have your own policy
Link Posted: 6/29/2021 11:57:45 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By majorcollins:

Sounds like no proof is needed. You just have to attest that you have your own policy
View Quote


This is what my financial advisor and I both determined.
Link Posted: 6/30/2021 10:29:12 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By majorcollins:

Sounds like no proof is needed. You just have to attest that you have your own policy
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By majorcollins:
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:
Originally Posted By shadows:
Originally Posted By TigerForce:
Can anyone recommend an insurance agent for long term care insurance? Everett - Seattle - Tacoma area.


I’ve been looking too.  Haven’t found one yet but talked to a insurance broker.  They said they are learning about the new law and coming up with a marketing package.  

The tax is uncapped so the more you make, the more you pay. If you are over $100k per year, it would be financially prudent to opt out and purchase an alternate LTC plan privately.


My Farmer's agent is setting us up. PM & I'll send contact info. She's all over it.

Here's a snip from an email I received from my rep, Ron Muzzall, concerning it:


...

This past session we had quite a few bad bills. Being in the minority, we had little chance of stopping the onslaught of policies that drive up the cost of government or shirk our responsibility to provide oversight of state agencies run amok. However, we did have some bipartisan wins. That includes an amendment I sponsored to extend the opt-out period to the long-term care payroll tax adopted in 2019.

This long-term care payroll tax was passed in 2019 as HB 1087, the Long Term Care Trust Act, requiring that everyone participate in a long-term care program by deducting a 0.58% payroll tax to fund it. This tax rate is likely to fluctuate as the costs and participation become more clear.

A significant problem with this program is that the benefits are negligible to the employee relative to how much they’ll be paying, especially for younger workers. In fact, the cost to taxpayers will return a maximum benefit of just over $36,000 per individual. That doesn’t cover much for people needing access to long term care services. Also, the benefits are not portable, meaning you must retire within the state to use them.

Fortunately, the Legislature provided a fix to allow people to opt-out. I was proud to sponsor the amendment that extended the date to get an exemption. You can apply for one by attesting that you have a qualifying long-term care insurance purchased before November 1, 2021. You must apply through the Employment Security Department (ESD).

Of course, it’s a challenge for government to do anything simply; the opt-out provisions are somewhat restrictive. For example, younger workers under 18 cannot apply for the exemption, and military spouses are not automatically exempt, though active-duty military are considered federal employees, so their pay is exempt. Getting one of these plans can take some time, so if you are wanting to take advantage of this option by purchasing your own plan, the time to act is now!

One important thing to keep in mind is that a lot of the implementation of this opt-out is up in the air. There are some hard questions that I know people want answers to now, but unfortunately, it’s a bit of a waiting game. ESD is in the process of formulating these rules.

Sounds like no proof is needed. You just have to attest that you have your own policy


Don't know, but I can't see the D legislature sitting easy knowing you are keeping your money that they'd counted on spending.

In any event, the investment set up this plan is offering is appealing & the returns, even conservatively estimated, make for a sound post tax investment plan. I'm heavily invested in pre-tax category holdings, & some of the tax exemptions available for post tax plans like this make it worth pursuing for the long term.
Link Posted: 7/1/2021 11:01:24 PM EDT
As I understand it, it does not affect Federal employees???  Ha ha. Fuck you Jay fuck you hard, fuck you without lubrication
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