Quoted: I have long held that Abilene is the epicenter of the asshole of the State of Texas.

That's odd...

Every time God give Texas an enema, he sticks the hose in Houston

Quoted: Quoted: I was just using those as examples, of coarse there are other cities with high crime in urban centers. There are many other cities where open carry shouldnt be allowed. Hmm... seems to me the high crime areas are exactly where we need law abiding citizens to have unlicensed open carry.

Yup.

Hey, Melvinator............ ain't po' peoples got any rights to pro-tec themselves?  

Though the moonbats would never call a spade a spade when it came to this one particular situation, that actually *is* racism, according to their wonky, modernist/progressive definitions.

Open carry (of handguns) everywhere but urban centers would disproportionately and adversely affect minorities and the "socioeconomically-disadvantaged" (I just came up with that one........ I think I should trademark it and give the liberal media fits!).

Quoted: <snip> Yep, can't agree more there. I plan on getting my CHL the day I turn 21 (Just a few months away.....) , but I'd open carry if I had a choice, except maybe at work. As to the longgun thing, I sit outside my apartment (in Midland) with my AK quite often, cleaning it and such, and noone's said anything to me, yet. -Storm

Maybe that's because you're in Midland, and everyone thinks you're just another random white supremacist with an AK.....................



Kidding.

Quoted: Quoted: there basic argument is "wild wild west". so how do you propose to keep the situation under control? Well, the first thing I would propose would be to look at other states with open carry (of handguns) and see how they keep their respective situations under control and skies from falling.

I am in the military and currently stationed in Nebraska.  We have open carry, but not CCW.  The problem though, is that you can't actually do it.  A buddy of mine called the Sherrif, and they said that there is no problem with it, but that basically if you open carry into a Target or a Wal-Mart, that they will get called, and they will probably get you for distrurbing the peace.  What a load of shit.  Whats the point of carrying if you leave it in the car with you everywhere you go?  

Not that I like the idea of walking around and getting looks and freaking out dumbass liberals either.  Be glad that you have CCW.  I would be the happiest motherfucker on the planet if I could carry concealed to protect my family, but unfortunately, I can't.  

But no, its not "wild wild west."  In fact, that is exactly what the liberals are saying here about us getting CCW.  So I guess according to the liberals in one state you can't have open carry because it will be the "wild west", but in another they say that you don't need CCW because we have open carry and that if we did have CCW it would be the "wild west."

What a crock of shit.  Its almost not worth it to open carry because you just bring even more attention on yourself, feel like you are doing something wrong and are paranoid about walking through the wrong door all the time, and feel like everyone is staring at you thinking that you think you are rambo or something just because you are fucking intelligent and man enough to care about protecting your own fucking family...anyway, sorry to rant...just thought I would let you know the situation with open carry in this state.

Quoted: Quoted: I have long held that Abilene is the epicenter of the asshole of the State of Texas.   That's odd... Every time God give Texas an enema, he sticks the hose in Houston

No conflict in our statements.  Like you said, H-town is just where He sticks the hose.  IIRC, it all comes out in Abilene, though.  It works similar to an oilfield blowout................

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: there basic argument is "wild wild west". so how do you propose to keep the situation under control? Well, the first thing I would propose would be to look at other states with open carry (of handguns) and see how they keep their respective situations under control and skies from falling. I am in the military and currently stationed in Nebraska.  We have open carry, but not CCW.  The problem though, is that you can't actually do it.  A buddy of mine called the Sherrif, and they said that there is no problem with it, but that basically if you open carry into a Target or a Wal-Mart, that they will get called, and they will probably get you for distrurbing the peace.  What a load of shit.  Whats the point of carrying if you leave it in the car with you everywhere you go?   Not that I like the idea of walking around and getting looks and freaking out dumbass liberals either.  Be glad that you have CCW.  I would be the happiest motherfucker on the planet if I could carry concealed to protect my family, but unfortunately, I can't.   But no, its not "wild wild west."  In fact, that is exactly what the liberals are saying here about us getting CCW.  So I guess according to the liberals in one state you can't have open carry because it will be the "wild west", but in another they say that you don't need CCW because we have open carry and that if we did have CCW it would be the "wild west." What a crock of shit.  Its almost not worth it to open carry because you just bring even more attention on yourself, feel like you are doing something wrong and are paranoid about walking through the wrong door all the time, and feel like everyone is staring at you thinking that you think you are rambo or something just because you are fucking intelligent and man enough to care about protecting your own fucking family...anyway, sorry to rant...just thought I would let you know the situation with open carry in this state.

Hey, rant away.  That's what my posts are here for.  

Seriously, thanks for sharing your experiences in an open carry state I often forget about (because I have also heard that you can't really use it, due essentially to the reasons you list).

To be completely honest, though, I specifically had in mind AZ, CO, and - to a lesser degree - VT when I made the statement.  I personally feel like intelligent (not to mention FREE!) individuals should have the choice/option to carry open and/or concealed.

The BGs would really flip, then.  Mebbe that's why the pols avoid "dual option carry" (I just made that one up, too!  Really on a roll tonight) like the fuckin' plague........... they don't want to isolate such a large voting bloc.

Quoted: So how do the Panthers get away with it (or do they just not do it in Texas)?

I do not know how they get away with it in Texas.  Perhaps defining a 'body' of people is a bit of a grey area.  A good example is when they staged a rally protesting outside the Repub convention in Houston back in '00.  They assaulted some old guy and then left.

Quoted: Quoted: So how do the Panthers get away with it (or do they just not do it in Texas)? I do not know how they get away with it in Texas.  Perhaps defining a 'body' of people is a bit of a grey area.  A good example is when they staged a rally protesting outside the Repub convention in Houston back in '00.  They assaulted some old guy and then left.

the news crews follow them.

Quoted: Quoted: So how do the Panthers get away with it (or do they just not do it in Texas)? I do not know how they get away with it in Texas.  Perhaps defining a 'body' of people is a bit of a grey area.  A good example is when they staged a rally protesting outside the Repub convention in Houston back in '00.  They assaulted some old guy and then left.

The problem might also be that the prohibition is in the Government Code rather than the Penal Code, and I don't know of anything in the Government Code attaching any penalties to the prohibition.  If there aren't any prescribed penalties, I don't see where the cops could do much more than order them to disperse (and then arrest them if they refused).  

Technically, isn't open carry legal if you're carrying under the "traveling" clause?  I don't see a requirement that the gun be concealed there.  Concealment is only required under the CHL law, which is a whole separate law.

Of course, the traveling clause is a whole nother gray area.

The traveling clause is not a gray area at all - case law has defined travelling in many different ways - so many ways in fact, that in the late 1800's the circuit court of appeals suggested that Texas actually define traveling or use the actual definition (to go from one place to another).  Using the original definition, even walking outside to the neightbor's house is considered travelling....

Quoted: Travelling is a DEFENSE to prosecution. TRG

Not anymore.  UCW does not apply to a person who is traveling.  read 46.15 (b) (3).

Stupid questions, txinvestigator...

UCW?  Unlicensed Concealed Weapon???

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Travelling is a DEFENSE to prosecution. TRG Not anymore.  UCW does not apply to a person who is traveling.  read 46.15 (b) (3). Post the code, I don't feel like googling it.   TRG

Lazy goof.........  



§46.15.  Nonapplicability.

    (b)  Section 46.02 does not apply to a person who:


    (3)  is traveling;

Quoted: Stupid questions, txinvestigator... UCW?  Unlicensed Concealed Weapon???

46.02 of the Penal Code is UCW, Unlawfully Carrying Weapons


§46.02.  Unlawful carrying weapons.

    (a)  A person commits an offense if he intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his person a handgun,
illegal knife, or club.

    (b)  Except as provided by Subsection (c), an offense under
this section is a Class A misdemeanor.

    (c)  An offense under this section is a felony of the third
degree if the offense is committed on any premises licensed or issued
a permit by this state for the sale of alcoholic beverages.

so all this talk and no one here starts the phone calls to the state reps?  why are we not calling the nra? less talk more action I say.

Quoted: so all this talk and no one here starts the phone calls to the state reps?  why are we not calling the nra? less talk more action I say.

9 posts?

Welcome to arfcom

What is this "...more action..." you speak of?

Okay, I'm confused.

I just  got my mother's SUV (Permanently) after my car was stolen and totaled.  I was kind of scared of hauling my weapons to the ranges once I got this car, because there really is no restricted way to haul the rifles, meaning it would be easy for someone in the back seat to grab one (or at least I figured a LEO would see it that way).  So even now I'm weary.  Should i be?  I carry them in unlocked cases unloaded.  But now from reading this, I can carry an AR or SKS loaded in the back seat on the floor?  That's nice if it's allowed, but I don't see how I would not go to jail if I was pulled over and they found it like that.  Can someone give me a somewhat definitive answer.

I was pulled over the other night coming back from night classes, (I never have guns when I'm going to campus, I know how serious that could be), but the officer pulled me out of the car, searched me and asked if I had weapons in the car.  What if I had?  What if I had been to the range that day and not unloaded them back into my closet at home?  Would he have been able to haul me in for having them in the back of my SUV?  I'm really confused on this.

thanks.

-mark

btw, I'm in Houston, harris county.

Hell, you can drive with a loaded AR on your lap and there isn't anything a LEO can do, other than make the situation "safe", but he must return your rifle to you with your ammo, and cannot charge you with anything relating to having the loaded rifle in the car (unless you are prohibitied from possessing firearms).

Quoted: Quoted: I think open carry should be allowed, but not in urban centers like dallas county, fort worth, houston, austin and san antonio. How is a rural part of Dallas any different from downtown Abilene?

Probably the best compromise would be to have the state pass a bill which allows open carry in the state (effectively nullifying the ancient anti-open-carry law), but which specifically allows for cities with a population greater than X to restrict open carry inside city limits if they deem it appropriate.  X should be calculated so that only the more prominent cities in the state even have a chance to do it (say, Houston, Dallas, Forth Worth, Austin, San Antonio, Corpus, El Paso).

As long as the list of cities that can ban open carry is short, it's easy for everyone to be informed.  If you allowed any municipality to ban em, we'd need a new 30.06-style sign posted at every road entrance to those cities or some crazy shit, because you'd never be able to keep track of which cities you could open carry in.

It would probably be just enough compromise that it would have a chance of passing.  Houston, Dallas, Austin, etc would immediately ban open carry inside the city if it wasn't already covered by some existing city law, but at least we'd be ok everywhere else in TX.

Quoted: Okay, I'm confused. I just  got my mother's SUV (Permanently) after my car was stolen and totaled.  I was kind of scared of hauling my weapons to the ranges once I got this car, because there really is no restricted way to haul the rifles, meaning it would be easy for someone in the back seat to grab one (or at least I figured a LEO would see it that way).  So even now I'm weary.  Should i be?  I carry them in unlocked cases unloaded.  But now from reading this, I can carry an AR or SKS loaded in the back seat on the floor?  That's nice if it's allowed, but I don't see how I would not go to jail if I was pulled over and they found it like that.  Can someone give me a somewhat definitive answer. I was pulled over the other night coming back from night classes, (I never have guns when I'm going to campus, I know how serious that could be), but the officer pulled me out of the car, searched me and asked if I had weapons in the car.  What if I had?  What if I had been to the range that day and not unloaded them back into my closet at home?  Would he have been able to haul me in for having them in the back of my SUV?  I'm really confused on this. thanks. -mark btw, I'm in Houston, harris county.

its a grey area, you can have long guns anywhere in your car, on your person, etc. It is even legal to have handguns in your car if you are traveling more than 2 counties, or are going to and from your land, or to an from the range. It's just stupid really. It is completely unenforceable. Who's to say that you aren't going to or from property, or range. The JBT can make your life miserable if he so chooses, but in the long run, they wont have a case. Most of the time they are fishing. Looking for an offense and thus PC. Then they can pretty much do as they please.
The best thing to do is just to tell them right of the bat that you have firearms in the trunk, back, etc.
If you are nice to them, most of the time they are nice to you. YMMV.

ETA: or just get a CHL and the issue of carrying any firearm in your car is moot.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think open carry should be allowed, but not in urban centers like dallas county, fort worth, houston, austin and san antonio. How is a rural part of Dallas any different from downtown Abilene?   Probably the best compromise would be to have the state pass a bill which allows open carry in the state (effectively nullifying the ancient anti-open-carry law), but which specifically allows for cities with a population greater than X to restrict open carry inside city limits if they deem it appropriate.  X should be calculated so that only the more prominent cities in the state even have a chance to do it (say, Houston, Dallas, Forth Worth, Austin, San Antonio, Corpus, El Paso). As long as the list of cities that can ban open carry is short, it's easy for everyone to be informed.  If you allowed any municipality to ban em, we'd need a new 30.06-style sign posted at every road entrance to those cities or some crazy shit, because you'd never be able to keep track of which cities you could open carry in. It would probably be just enough compromise that it would have a chance of passing.  Houston, Dallas, Austin, etc would immediately ban open carry inside the city if it wasn't already covered by some existing city law, but at least we'd be ok everywhere else in TX.

*Not* suggesting for a moment that I'd be "for" what you're proposing, but if it were to come to pass, I think a better way to do this would be for "The x largest cities in TX" as opposed to a # based on a certain level of population.  This way, the #s grow w/ the pop of TX, and it's a more difficult (i.e. moving) bar for cities to clear.  Many cites, given enough time, could hit 0.5 or 1.0 million ppl.

Quoted: Probably the best compromise would be to have the state pass a bill which allows open carry in the state (effectively nullifying the ancient anti-open-carry law), but which specifically allows for cities with a population greater than X to restrict open carry inside city limits if they deem it appropriate.

Uh, nope... totally against it.  State constitution reserves the regulation of firearms to the state legislature... in fact there are several fights ongoing where cities have posted 30.06 (no carry licensed concealed handguns) in buildings we, the taxpayers, own (library comes to mind). The fight is based on the violation of the constitution... that the CITY is attempting to regulate firearms.  In fact, my city has gotten away with banning "TOY" guns because they are NOT firearms.  I could walk around with my AR all day long (protected by state law), but sling an airsoft (without the orange muzzle cap) and I visit the city clink.

Such issues MUST be taken to a higher level to allow broader perspective and cooler minds to prevail.   Now, if the LEGISLATURE wrote it into the law with specific cities listed (sorta like: "except within the city limits of Dallas, Houston..."), and it passed, I'd be OK with it... but we dont want to give cities the CHOICE on this.  CHL was a step in the right direction... perhaps the next step *IS* dual option... followed then with vermont-style... but sadly we're talking DECADES here.