The Goal: The Ability to make Fast and Accurate Follow-up Shots

As some of you may have read in my other recent posts, I am looking to find what I consider an ideal 9mm. Ideal for me is a gun that allows me to put up accurate shots as quickly as possible. The key is recoil, or lack thereof. My FN Five-seveN is the master of quick and accurate fire. With 40% less recoil than 9mm, I can put up very fast and accurate follow-up shots with my Five-seveN loaded with any 5.7x28 ammo. That's why Five-seveN has been my main carry gun for four years. But I want to have an option in 9mm as well. Not any 9mm, but one that mimics the recoil of the Five-seveN.

Though I have been known to carry a Glock 19, CZ-P07, and recently a CZ-P10, I find my lightweight polymer guns, don't come close to the Five-seveN in the quick and accurate follow-up shot department. Yes I can shoot them accurately, and pretty quickly too. Just not as quick  as my Five-seveN.

Though there are other factors, the weight of the guns themselves have a lot to do with the amount of recoil a pistol generates. Since my lightweight Polymer 9mm are on the light side, for me to find a 9mm pistol that dampens more recoil, I needed to look toward heavier pistols in 9mm. Though not particularly familiar with the platform, 1911s in 9mm seemed a good place to start looking. Over the last few weeks I picked up three new production Colt 9mm pistols: A Colt Lightweight Commander in 9mm, a Colt Combat (Steel Frame) Commander, and a Colt Competition 9mm (series 70).

What I find most interesting about the Colt advertised weights for each pistol is how close they make the all steel Combat Commander and the alloy framed LW Commander seem in weight. They list the Steel Commander as 33 oz and the LW Commander as 29.4 ounces. Which is only 3.6 ozs difference. After buying the guns and weighing them myself, I found the difference in weight is actually 7.6 ounces (Steel 35.5 - LW 27.9 = 7.6); more than twice Colt’s published weights. That's a huge difference. I almost skipped the LW Commander altogether because I thought a 3.6 ounce difference did not justify buying it. In fact, such a small weight difference doesn’t even justify the existence of the LW Commander. I’m glad I was suspect of Colt’s advertised weights because I never would have bought the LW Commander had the published weights been correct.

(Here is a link to a larger discussion of the Colt published weights vs actual weights with pictures on scales etc: Colt Advertised Pistol Weights are Way Off!).


Fit and Finish of the Three Colt Pistols

I purchased the Lightweight Commander first. Though I was super impressed with the polished blue finish of the Commander slide and anodizing on the alloy frame, I initially thought the slide to frame fit was not very good. It appeared pretty loose to me and seemed rattle around a bit; at least more than I am used to with my other guns. I did some research on 1911 frame to slide fit and I learned it is good for the fit to not be too tight; this prevents dirt and grime from effecting reliability. A lot of 1911 race guns that are super tight, while they are capable of putting all rounds in one hole, they need to be cleaned after a few hundred rounds so dirt won’t jam up the slide and kill reliability. Frame and slide tightness is generally going to be inversely related to reliability.

A week later I picked up the other two 9mm Colts; the all steel Combat Commander, and the 9mm Government Competition 70 Series. The fit and finish was flawless! Beautiful mirror polished blue on the flats of the frames and slides of both guns. Just stunning. I noticed the slide to frame fit was just a touch loose, but NOT too loose at all.

It turns out the LW Commander that I initially thought was too loose, was no looser than these two all steel Colt pistols, simply, the steel slide on the alloy frame SOUNDS different when the slide moves side to side ever so slightly. Making it SOUND like it is loose. In reality, the slide on the LW Commander does NOT move side to side any more than the steel framed versions.


Overall I am super impressed with the fit and finish of these Colt pistols.






Ammo, Magazine Selection, and Reliability

Over the last three weeks I have run 968 rounds through these three pistols combined; over 300 rounds per pistol. Each pistol has run at least 2 mags or more of the following ammo:

- Federal 115gr Brass FMJ (100 round Value Packs Walmart)
- Winchester 115gr FMJ (Walmart White Box)
- Federal 124gr HST
- Federal 147gr HST
- Speer Gold Dot 147gr
- American Eagle 147gr Flat Point FMJ
- Browning 147gr FMJ
- Winchester Ranger T 147gr Bonded Hollow Points
- Remington Golden Saber 147gr Non-Bonded Hollow Points

I have used 3 different brands of 9mm 1911 magazines; the 9 round Colt Factory mags that came with the guns (2 per pistol), the 9 round Kimber factory mags, and the Wilson Combat 10 round mag.

Both the LW Commander and the Combat Commander devoured everything I have thrown at them. Any brand of ammo, Colt mag, Kimber mag, Wilson mag, slow-fire, rapid-fire, it doesn’t matter. They have been flawless and I trust these pistols 100% with my life.

The Colt Government Competition has been completely reliable as well, with two VERY minor exceptions. In the first range session when using the lightly loaded Federal 115gr Walmart Value-Pack ammo, the slide would not always lock back on the last round regardless of magazine used. The other issue, with Federal HST 124gr, after inserting a fresh full mag, on a couple of occasions when I would let the slide fly forward by hand, the first round would tip down and not chamber. Another pull and release on the slide would chamber the round. It only happened with the Colt mag and not the others. I am happy to report that after the first 120 rounds and two more range sessions, both of these issues have completely disappeared. Neither of which effected the actual shooting of the gun. This Colt has run 100% as well and I completely trust it.

So all three 9mm Colts have been 100% reliable in over 300 rounds each.


Shooting The Colts: Accuracy, Recoil and Speed of Follow-up Shots

Let’s start with accuracy and work our way back. All three of these 9mm Colts are superbly accurate. I currently own sixteen 9mm pistols and have owned and shot hundreds of 9mm pistols over the last 30 years. These three guns are some of the most accurate and easy to shoot 9mm service pistols (not compensated match pistols) I have come across.

I will let pictures do the talking here.


Colt LW Commander 10 rounds of Federal HST 124gr at 10 yards Offhand. Eight rounds passed through that little cluster in the center! Accurate enough for you?





Colt Combat Commander 9 rounds at 10 yards Offhand.





Colt Government Competition 9mm Series 70 9 rounds each group at 10 yards Offhand.






I say above that not only are these pistols accurate, but they are EASY to shoot as well. They are easy to shoot because of how well the 1911 design, ergonomics and weight mitigates recoil. The heavier models do this better than the lighter models. But even the LW Commander in 9mm has less perceived and actual recoil than any of my many polymer framed full size or compact 9mm pistols. Be it my Glock 17, Glock 19, CZ P-10, CZ –P07, the LW Commander has noticeably less recoil than all of them.

As far as the three Colt 9mms go, the full-sized Competition has virtually no recoil (like shooting a hot 22lr), the steel Combat commander has very light recoil, and the LW Commander has pretty pleasant recoil. Given this one would think I would shoot the full-sized Government Competition best. But I don’t, I shoot the steel Combat Commander best. Here’s why…

Whatever recoil the Government Competition 9mm has, is not like traditional recoil I am used to. The Commanders have muzzle flip like you find on most pistols, just less of it. The Government model has little to no muzzle flip in 9mm. Instead the recoil on the full-sized Colt kind of pushes back at you. The long heavy slide comes back after firing a round and pushes the pistol at you a little bit. It is more like the kind of recoil you experience when shooting a rifle. It is very mild with the Colt pistol compared to a rifle, but it is just not something I am used to. It is just different and something I need to get used to.

As a result I shoot the all steel Combat Commander the best. I am not talking about straight accuracy here. I am talking about managing recoil for fast and accurate follow-up shots. I can tear up a target really fast with this gun. I can do it with the other Colts as well, but I can really go at it with all steel Commander. It is my favorite of the three to shoot fast.

After all, this is what it is all about - Controlling recoil for fast and accurate follow-up shots. Which all of these 9mm Colts do superbly. Just to give you an idea of how well they control recoil, here are two groups shot rapid fire with the LIGHTWEIGT alloy-framed Commander, the lightest of these three Colts at 27.9 ounces unloaded and 34.8 ounces loaded.


RAPID FIRE - Colt LIGHTWEIGHT Commander Recoil Control – 8 Round Groups at 7 yards as fast as I could pull the trigger with Federal HST 147gr




I am very happy with the results. I shot a few rapid fire groups with the steel Commander as well. I thought I took pics, but can’t find them. One was basically a ragged hole, with a few rounds just outside of the ragged hole. I will get some pics next time I do the drill.

What I really need to do is run some Bill Drills with the Colts and Polymer framed pistols to see the actual differences in time and accuracy. My local indoor ranges do not allow you to shoot from a draw. So I have to wait until I can get out a few hours away to do these drills. But I will eventually get to it. But I have a very good idea of how they will turn out based on the improvised drills I have been doing at the indoor range.


The Triggers

It is important I devote a little space to the triggers here. Mostly because the traditional Single Action (SA) triggers on the Colt 1911s are much different than what I am used to with my striker-fired and DA/SA triggers on my other 9mm pistols.

Compared to the triggers on my other 9mm pistols, the triggers on the Colts are amazing! A little bit of slack before the trigger wall, a clean and crisp break, and a very short and tactile reset is the MO with the SA triggers on my three Colt examples. Especially on the Government Competition with the Series 70 trigger.

While there is the slightest bit of creep on both of the Commanders as you approach the trigger wall, there is no creep on the 70 Series; you take out the slack and you are right up against the trigger wall and it breaks very crisply and cleanly. I would NOT do a thing to the 70 Series trigger, it is perfect.

The only trigger on my other 9mms that comes close is the CZ P-10C. CZ did the best they could to emulate a 1911 SA trigger on the P-10C within the limitations of a striker-fired trigger system, and they’ve done a great job.

Many people think the FN Five-seveN is a striker-fired pistol. It is NOT. It is a single action pistol. There is a little hammer under the rear hood of the slide. While I like the trigger on the Five-seveN, it has a little more creep and it is a little heavier than the Colt 1911 SA triggers.


Five-seveN Single Action Trigger




The Single Action 1911 triggers are the ones to aspire to. While I would prefer not to have a manual safety on my handgun, I can live with it. It is not hard to incorporate switching it off into your training routine.


Concealed Carry

On most days if you were to pull up my shirt at 4 o’clock you would find an FN Five-seveN or a Glock 19 in an IWB holster. More recently a CZ P-10C. The last two weeks lifting my shirt would reveal a Colt LW Commander 9mm in a Tucker Gun Leather Cover-up Plus.

(See my review of the Tucker Gun Leather Cover-up Plus for my LW Commander here: Great Holster for My Colt Commander)

Though my loaded Colt LW Commander (34.9 ounces) is heavier than my loaded Five-seveN (27.9 ounces) and my Glock 19 (31.6 ounces), it is noticeably easier to conceal. The 1911 is a lot thinner than all of my double stacked polymer pistols. That thinness goes a long way when it comes to concealability. When I pull my shirt tight around my waist, or bend over with my double stacks, it is easy to see I am carrying a gun. With the Colt, not so much. With the grip length and overall height of all of these guns basically being equal, the 1911 Commander is a lot thinner and that slim profile makes concealing the gun much easier.






Initial Summary

I know have three 9mm pistols that I can control recoil with almost as well as my FN Five-seveN and can deliver very fast and very accurate fire on target with. While I can control recoil and deliver some pretty fast and accurate fire with my double stack 9mm pistols, I can do it faster and more accurately with the 1911 9mm Colt pistols I recently purchased. I have accomplished my goal and I am very happy about this.

I also love the fact that I was able to do it with an American made pistols that have stood the test of time better than any pistols ever made; one hundred and seven years and still going strong! As of 3 weeks I was not a 1911 guy. I am still not a traditional 45acp 1911 guy. I have no use for the extra recoil and lower capacity of the 45acp 1911s in a time when modern ammo erases the difference in terminal performance among service calibers. So I won’t be going that route any time soon, or probably ever.

Given my previous forays over the years with 45acp 1911 pistols from a number of makers, including Colt, where none of them ran reliably long enough to seriously consider for defense, I am very surprised things ended up here. But I am glad they did.

Though I initially started this quest with a Kimber Custom TLE II 9mm with a threaded barrel, which has performed perfectly and super accurately since I bought it 2 months ago, I decided not to continue down this road with Kimbers. Their extensive use of MIM parts and horrible finish, turned me off. So I decided to go with the polished blue finished Colts which only use 3 or 4 small MIM parts.

I have no doubt the Kimbers would have performed just as well as the Colts, but the finish would have left me wanting, and the MIM parts would have bugged me. So it would have been bittersweet.

I know MIM parts are found in my car and many of my other pistols. I also know the quality of MIM parts varies from manufacturer to manufacturer and supplier to supplier. I have read enough about issues with Kimber MIM parts to turn me off. But they shoot pretty damn well! If the finish and MIM parts on the Kimber don’t bug you, go for it. The same can be said of Springfield.

Yes I will keep the Kimber and shoot the hell out of it suppressed!

The Kimber 1911 9mm Threaded that kicked off this journey. Ultimately the dull poor wearing finish and abundance of MIM parts lead me to Colt.


Here is what the Kimber is capable of :)




Please let me know if any of you folks have any questions. Thanks for reading if you made it thus far!

Nice review! I'll have to see if Colt makes a 9mm 1911 with an ambi safety for lefties like me.

They do. But on the pricier versions. But you can buy the most basic 9mm Colt and install an ambi-safety for about $25.

Well done review OP.

Excellent review.

Thanks for taking the time to write this well done post.

Excellent write up, better than gun magazine.

No problem. After shooting, writing about shooting is my second favorite hobby!

I have made a lot of mistakes and wasted a lot of money in the 30 years I have been shooting...can't believe I am almost 50!@*! If I can help other shooting enthusiasts avoid the mistakes I've made, all the better! Though making mistakes and learning from them is half the fun. All part of the journey.

Are the front and rear grip checkered?

For all the parent company's faults, Colt has been making some very reliable well put together 1911s for the past decade. People have a right to bitch at some of the shit they put out in the past but the new one's tend to be pretty damn well screwed together.

I have over 30 1911's right now, the majority are Colt or USGI. I have one CC that I'm not real impressed with reliability wise, the rest run just fine. [I don't shoot my USGI one's much, I have a correct but visually snarfy one for that, that, other then breaking the tip off the extractor after an unknown round count, just runs and runs after a USGI replacement extractor was fitted.

Very nice write up.  Excellent hardware and pics and shooting.  You put a lot of time, money, effort and thought into this.  Impressive.  Thank you for sharing your experience with us.

Thank you for the evaluations. I have been considering a 9mm 1911.  I will consider your experiences as I move forward.

None of the fronts are checkered. Only the LW Commander has vertical lines/serrations.

OP HERE:

Based on the research I have done, which isn't a ton, it does seem Colt had some pretty spotty QC periods in the last 30 years. These dark periods seem to coincide with Bankruptcies/Chapter 11s.

It does seem despite whatever financial troubles Colt is currently having, they are putting out some solid guns and not using Customers as part of the QC process.

A great American Company with an incredible history, it would be a shame to see it go.

As others have stated, great write up.

My only contention with you OP.......

Well, I think you are making me spend more money.

Decided to check out the "Dark Side" and get a 9mm 1911. Colt of course.

Funny!

When you've had a chance to spend some time with the 9mm Colt, can you please let us know what you think? I would love to hear how the 9mm compares to shooting the 45acp from the perspective of 45acp 1911 guy. Thanks! Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Will do.

Just recently purchased a S&W M29 for my forthcoming birthday. And yes, the wife thinks it will be the last handgun for the year ( for her I'm sure she's thinking plural years)

So when I say this venture into another 1911 will cost me ( aside from the pistol) is just the tip of the iceberg.

Yep,already promised her a great Christmas & belated 35th anniversary gift.....

PS. I wish I was still "almost 50"

Thanks for creating this post, OP. I had the opportunity to shoot one of the 5" 9mm competition models this summer and it was indeed a sweet shooter. There's a part of me that always lusts for a LW Commander.

Solid review OP. Well written without any fluff: concise and to the point.

Would have been nice to see data, in order to help quantify some of the things you described. A shot timer could quantify actual total time and splits for a chosen/acceptable level of accuracy. And perhaps measuring some of those groups.

I’ve had a couple instances where I tested something, made initial observations such as “wow, gun A feels this way or that, surely I shoot gun B better!”  Only to find that when I measured it, the performance differences were negligible and/or indiscernible, so my choice came down to pleasure to shoot.

Again, great review, our forum is better for your time and effort

So much good info.

As an aside, I appreciate your FN comparisons.

OP HERE:

Absolutely, that's why I used the word "Initial Reflections" in the title of this post; it is definitely premature to make any final conclusions. I need to get to the outdoor range and spend the day. Problem is, it is a little tough right now. I run two businesses and it is my busy time of the year; time is at a premium for me. I also have a 3 year old daughter and lovely wife that get the majority of my free time; I love my hobby, but I love my girls more than anything in the world.

Unfortunately, the local indoor ranges don't allow the kind of shooting I need to do to to get the quantitative data I need. But I can get a pretty good idea of what is going on based on felt recoil, rapid fire and groupings. All 3 of the 9mm Colts tested here, even the LW Commander, have less recoil than my Glock 19, CZ P-10C, CZ P-07 and so on. This is basically what I am reporting here. I will definitely update this as I do more testing. I will also add any other observations that are useful, like daily carry observations, training to use the manual safety etc.

Thanks for the kind words. I love to share my shooting experiences with fellow enthusiasts. I know I have learned so much over the years reading these forums and I just want to contribute as a way of saying thanks for all those have helped me and continue to help me along my journey.

Happy Birthday! Enjoy that S&W 29. I have a nice little collection of S&W revolvers, mostly 357 mag & 38 Special. One of my all time favorite guns is my S&W Performance Center 586 L-Comp from 2007 that was heavily worked over by a very talented gunsmith.

Your wife sounds pretty reasonable :)  Fortunately I have a very cool wife as well. She's a beautiful lady, and quite a bit younger than me; surprisingly she is not particularly materialistic. So I don't have to do the quid-pro-quid thing; like a 1911 for a pair of Manolo Blahnik shoes. But I take very good care of her and our little girl. I am also able to make most of my firearm purchases through my business. One of my businesses is in the firearms industry, so it is justified. That's also how I get to squeeze in a range session or two a week, I do have to do some legitimate product testing. I try to schedule 4 hours a week of range time per week. Though that doesn't always work out :)

Excellent write up OP. Thanks for sharing this. I'm in the market for a 1911 in 9mm, was looking at the SA EMP4 CC, but since SA sold out the Illinois guns owners last year, have decided to look elsewhere. Your write up is helping me make up my mind on which manufacturer to go with.

OP HERE:

I went to the range yesterday for a different project, but I grabbed my only two Government size 9mm 1911s anyway. The Colt Competition and the Kimber Threaded 9mm Custom TLE II. I was curious to shoot them side by side and see if I could find any interesting differences.

Both of these guns are an absolute pleasure to shoot. They are both super accurate, and both have great sights. Being 50, my up-close vision is pretty poor. I see great at distance (20/15), but terribly at iron sight distance. I have a little bit of a hard time with the sights on the Colt. The rear sight is adjustable for elevation. In the position it is in, the top of the rear sight comes a couple of millimeters above the housing. The top of the housing and the top of the rear blade get blurry for me, and it causes me to struggle a little bit. I need to work it out.

(All groups below are 9 shots (a full 9-round 1911 9mm mag) at 8 to 10 yards)



The guns feel exactly the same in my hand. But the recoil is a little different between the two guns. First, I find Government-sized 9mm 1911s recoil very differently from the hi-cap 9mm polymer guns I am used to. The 9mm Government doesn't so much flip up when recoiling, it does a little, but the recoil is more pushing back towards you as the long heavy steel slide makes it way back on the frame. This push-back type of recoil seems even more pronounced on the Kimber than it does on the Colt. It's a little strange actually, with the Kimber it almost seems to happen in slow-motion and you can feel when the slide makes it to back and starts forward again. Though the Colt recoils the same way, it doesn't have this same slo-mo vibe. It's hard to explain, maybe if you try it yourself you will see/feel what I am seeing.

On a related note, the Polymer hi-cap guns and my two Colt Commander-sized 9mm 1911s recoil very similarly. The muzzle flips up a bit. The all steel Commander, being heavier, flips up a lot less than my Glock 19, CZ P-10C, etc. Even my LW Commander 9mm has less recoil than the polymer hi-caps. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I'm pretty certain I am able to shoot the 9mm Commanders quicker and more accurately than my polymer 9mms. My 9mm 1911 Commander groups are definitely tighter, and I suspect once I get the clock out, they will be faster as well.

Back to the two Government pistols, I seem to shoot them the same in terms of accuracy. Both of these guns shoot to my exact point of aim even with cheap Walmart Winchester White Box and Federal Brass. I can tell exactly where I am going to hit once I pull the trigger, I don't seem to be able to do that with my other handguns. Both of these guns are dead on target.

Shooting them quickly is a real treat as well given the very mild recoil. Below are the typical groups I was getting yesterday. I can shoot better groups with both of these guns and I have. It is not uncommon to get 4 or 5 of the 9 rounds in basically the same hole when my shooting is in the zen like zone, I find myself in every once in a while.

I shot just under a 100 rounds through each gun yesterday. The Kimber now has 630 rounds through it, and the Colt Competition 380 rounds. On a side note, I have not cleaned the Kimber in over 500 rounds. About 200 rounds have been suppressed, and I have NOT had a single malfunction of any kind. It has run flawlessly. Internally it barely looks dirty. For anyone who might be interested, the current round counts on my 9mm Colt Commanders is as follows: Combat Commander (all steel) 220 and my LW Commander 492. I even ran 36 rounds (4 mags) through my LW Commander yesterday because it was on my hip! It has been for 2 weeks. Since it was right there, I figured I might as well bust it out. I was amazed at the tiny groups I shot with it. One was just over an inch, one was 1.5", the other two were not much bigger.

Typical 9 round groups at 8 to 10 yards with my Kimber & Colt Government 9mm 1911s:

Kimber



Colt

OP HERE:

I hit the range for a few yesterday. I brought the Colt 9mm Competition and had my LW Commander IWB. I put 80 rounds through each. I wanted to do some rapid fire strings to see accuracy and speed.

Rapid-Fire means to things to me:
1) Pulling the trigger as fast as I can where I am more point shooting than aiming. It takes me 3 to 4 seconds to empty the 9 round mag. I rarely do this kind of shooting. Just every once and a while to check reliability.

2) After each shot I let the sights fall back on target and fire again. To empty the 9 round mag in this case takes me 6 to 7 seconds. This is what I'm talking about when I say rapid fire below, and in general.

Here are the first two groups I shot with the Colt Competition. The group on the right was a slow-fire aimed group. The one on the left was rapid-fire. The gun has such light recoil, the sights simply and quickly fall right back on the target. Obviously this is because the gun is VERY heavy! But it is such a joy to shoot. It is so smooth and once you get into a nice rhythm shooting quickly, you can't miss. Shooting was at 8 yards.

Rapid-Fire (left) vs Slow-Fire (right)



I shoot both the LW & Combat Commanders more accurately than I do the Government sized Competition. As mentioned in the post above, I suspect it has to do with the adjustable sight issue where the top of the rear blade gets fuzzy for my 50 year old eyes. With both of the Commanders my slow-fire groups are a ragged hole out to 10 yards. Same is true for my government sized Kimber 9mm. So I am certain it is the sights.

That said I decided to bring one of my heavier 9mm Polymer pistols, a CZ P-07, to see how my rapid-fire groups would compare to the LW Commander. So I shot some raid fire groups with both. There was no competition. Either I had to slow way down to make my Groups tighter with the CZ, or the groups were 6". I didn't eve bother to take a picture of the results with the CZ. I will do a more formal test with the LW Commander and a couple of Polymer pistols.

I'm reallyn happy with how well I am shotting the 9mm 1911s. So much so, that I have been carrying the LW Commander daily for a few weeks now. It carries and conceals noticeably better than my fatter double stack polymer guns. I will do a write up about that soon.

Rapid-Fire at 8 yards with the LW Commander