Are there any decent alternatives to the $800+ S&W 617 for a swing out/non side-gate .22 LR DA revolver?  Preferably in stainless, with a barrel length between 3" and 6", that might cost less than the S&W?  

I have a Ruger Wrangler, and am contemplating getting something just a little faster/easier to load/unload at the range, but the 617 is both impossible to find and extremely expensive, IMO.  Budget is currently about $500, can be stretched to $650, but less upfront cost allows me some room to personalize with grips, etc.  

I know of the Charter Arms Pathfinder 4", which seems to retail between $300-400.  I've only really heard about it on ARFCOM; the only person I know personally who has ever had one had a 2", which isn't what I want.  And Charter can be VERY hit or miss, from my recollection, so this would be a literal "shot in the dark".  But the price seems about right.

Then there's the Taurus 992 4" with it's dual cylinder, which seems to be anywhere from $500-600+ whenever it can be found.  I saw some of these a number of years ago, and they seemed innovative, but the .22 WMR cylinder pushes up the cost, especially in SS.

There's the Ruger GP100 and SP101, but they both seem to be $600-800+ when they exist, and the GP100 in .22 seems to have a ton of barrel.  The LCRx is a different option, but seems to be more of a backpacker than a range plinker, and prices seem to have gone from $400-500 to the $600+ range.

This morning I discovered the Rock Island AL22 4", but they're $600+ and I've never heard of them.  Plus the mechanism reminds me of a cross between Arminius/Rohm/Windicator pieces of garbage, and Charter Arms.

I recently bought a grail gun of mine, a 5" Uberti Schofield in .38, so I was also contemplating attempting to snag an H&R 999 Sportsman, but they're between $400-500, and are getting up in age.  Not to mention difficult to find in a mix of good enough timing/shootable shape, that isn't a $700 collector piece .

I know several companies make J-frame sized or snub nose options, I'm not interested in those.

So, any more thoughts or things I've missed?  Reviews, stories from folks who've owned them....?

Back in the day I had a High Standard Sentinel that worked well. Perhaps they are kicking around the used market? Just a thought.

While not stainless Taurus made a Model 96 in a six-inch barrel.
pistols2 015 by jhnstn1, on Flickr" />
Dan Wesson also made several .22 pistols.

Taurus 94, one of my favorites:

These were the sorts of informative posts I was hoping to receive .

While I prefer stainless (due to ease of using a lead remover cloth to clean), I'm not entirely averse to blued guns.  And I didn't know about the 96 being a model offering for Taurus, nor did I know the 94 could be obtained with the longer barrel; the only 94s I've seen were the 2" barrel versions, and those same thin clamshell grips didn't seem to do the trigger pull or balance any favors.

Didn't know this critter existed but, here you go.

Unless you live in a swamp or costal Alaska stainless is pretty much a solution to a nonexistent problem.
I as you might expect hate stainless and am very disappointed smith doesn’t make the 10 shot K frame in blue ( they actually did for a very short time) and also get rid of that silly heavy under lug while you are at it.

With some patience and searching a used S&W can be found in the $600 range and is a better choice than any you mention. Look for an old colt too while you are at it

My sweat is incredibly acidic as a result of biology; I bring my own swamp everywhere I go.    That, and stainless is much more wear resistant to lead cleaner cloths and solvents than is the blue finish on most Guns, and doubly so more than many matte finishes.  But if the gun never existed in stainless (such as with my Schofield, and with the H&R Sportsman 999 top break I'm considering), then blue will have to suffice.

But I also tend to hate full underlug, and much prefer half underlug, so I'll wholeheartedly agree with you on that one.

The last Colt 22 I saw was an officer's match target 10 years ago when I worked a counter.  The guy I sold it to said it wouldn't shoot worth two cents, so he sold it to a collector.  Not to say I wouldn't snap up something like a Cobra Target .22 if they made one .

I have both of the Charter 22LR offerings, 2" and 4".

The 4" was bought new locally for <$400 and has been great.

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The 2" was bought new over the internet <$400 and had to go back. Not for workmanship but because of apparently being a counter display gun. All of the chambers were damaged by the firing pin from people finger banging it. Customer service was no problem and fixed it right up.

When I contacted them I explained what was wrong and even though it wasn't a mfg defect they mailed a box with a shipping label to me. Turn around was only a month I think and that was last summer when plandemic clown world was in full swing.

The grips charter has on their site aren't bad but are cost effective and comfortable.

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I've read on another forum that they will make custom combinations of their offerings, 6 rnd 357 with a 3" barrel. They are ok by me.

Just because I can't recall (it's been a few years since I've played with Charter), is the trigger guard/grip frame on those models metal of some variety, or is it plastic like on some of the "lite" models?  Is the trigger on the 4" still a little "crunchy" feeling, even after being worked in?  How many rounds through the 4"?

Didn't know they might make custom one-offs, that's kind of neat.  Good to know they have responsive CS if needed.

lol, I didn't even notice till now that my 2" has a plastic lower end I don't think it was a pathfinder lite but who knows.

Pathfinder lite from the internet

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My 4" is not plastic and has a little more heft to it. I've had it for 10yrs, don't know if the plastic is a new thing or not.

The trigger isn't bad, is mostly smoothed out in both of them. Unloaded and pulling the trigger through double action you can see when the cyl lock engages and the effect on when the trigger pull increases before it breaks over releasing the hammer.

They are definitely less refined and smaller in size than a S&W 617 but the cheapest I have seen one of those was used at a gun show for $750 a few years ago.

I haven't really paid any attention to rnd count but well over 1k through the 4" and at least a 325 rnd box has been through the 2" so far since back from charter service.

I have an older three inch Pathfinder and absolutely love that thing.  I got on a Charter Arms kick a while back.  In my experience the older Bridgeport and Stratford guns are good to go.  In some ways I like them better than Smith J frames.  Can't speak to the current versions, but you seem to be having good luck with yours.

Could try to find a nice Dan Wesson. They made some 6-shot, swing out cylinder models in 22LR and 22WMF. Probably going to be up in the S&W range though.

They are built like tanks (based on their small frame, which is also used with 357 Mag), and are really nice shooters.

In addition, they have the interchangeable barrel system, so you can go from snubby up to a 15" barrel if you really wanted.

Only down-side is trying to find a nice one for a decent price.

Back in the mid-80s, I bought a 4 inch DW .22 that was double action only at a gun show. I had never seen a DA only revolver. It shot well but it just wasn't my cup of tea at the time. I would love to have it back. I didn't have a gunsmith at the time to check out the gun to see if it had been modified or if something in it was broken.

My Taurus 94 has been great for what I  paid.  

It's been very accurate and reliable.  It's about the right size, except for the grip.

The DA trigger is abysmal and can't be fixed (correct me if wrong).

Also, the grip's too small and can't be fixed either.  

But's it's OK.

I have a 4" stainless Taurus 94, I agree the double action is bad (extremely heavy) and there are occasional light strikes.  Single action is fine except the texture on the hammer is a bit aggressive and will chew up my thumb after a range session (usually hundreds rounds).  I have shot many bricks of ammo through it.  I don't remember the price but I want to say around $350 or $400 new back in 2007.

Colt has made numerous models over the decades but those are going to cost more.  Look for a used H&R or High Standard DA .22LR.

CD

Look for a H&R 999 in good shape. They are notorious about loosing cylinder timing but great until they do.

I really enjoy the ruger gp100. the sp101 8 shot .22 is nice, but currently unobtanium for under about $850. I've seen (and bought) used GP100s in the $550 range.

the older sentinels are solid, and tend to decent mechnical life.

H&R is iffy at best. for a field gun, one inf good shape is great, but for cases and cases of .22 shooting, not as durable.

I know nothing about taurus. There isn't an older german or any italian import I would take for the money.

I really really like the Ruger. (and I have a smith, but like the ruger better)

My dad had a High Standard Double Nine.

Nickel (shiny) with black grips.  Held 9 rounds.  Styled like a SAA/western revolver.

I stumbled into a 4" Charter Arms Pathfinder in SS for a price I could stomach that was in good shape (about $400), and tried not to think too hard about what they were selling for new before COVID.  But I figured SS is good, and with the way things are going, if I don't like it I'll be able to sell it for what I have in it.  And there's enough decent reports on them in this thread, so I figured I'd take a chance.

Even so, a lot of good information in this thread for everyone else to read too.  I know the 617 is the golden standard, but I can't be the only person who is refusing to pay their going rate.

I didn't realize the 999s were good until they suddenly weren't; not encouraging for putting a number of rounds through it as opposed to simply collecting.

It’s a bad time to be buying for sure. One thing I always try and keep in mind with things like this are that it’s a one time cost that will most likely last the rest of your life. A couple hundred bucks or more won’t be remembered a decade from now.


If you’re patient you can always just keep a eye out for a deal and if you get one sell the cheaper gun and go on about your business.

@Seven-Shooter

I pulled this pic from the link in your post.

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Those cylinder chambers are all damaged from dry firing like my 2" was. You will get light strike misfires and extraction will be difficult because of deformed chambers. It can more than likely be reamed out and saved but you will have to contact CS and send it in.

Well crap.

I kept your story in mind before my purchase, but from how they displayed on my screen before I purchased it, it seemed to be something that was intended to be there as a relief for the firing pin (a feature I've seen on some other rimfire revolvers before).

I guess this thread might include an update on Charter's customer service before too long ; hopefully my experience is the same as yours.

ETA:  there was a 17 on that site that had notable firing pin impressions all around the back of the cylinder face, completely out of time.  They wanted $700 for it

You can pull the gun part, it's like a Smith, and polish all of the parts just as you would a S&W.  You can get it smooth but by necessity the pull will always be heavier than a center fire. I've tried several combinations of springs and, like all rimfires I've messed with, in order to keep it reliable it has to be heavy.  Even small changes can give you occasional inconsistent light strikes.  The grips are another story as well, I've tried multiple grips on mine to try to get it to feel like a S&W J frame and it just never feels quite right.  

That said, I do like my old non-lugged 94 and it's accurate enough for what it is.  For a while I carried it as my backpacking gun and it put several critters in the pot or over the fire.  The only reason I quit carrying it was I wanted something with a bit more punch for two legged critters.

Everything is hard to find right now but that may give you the opportunity to set some more aside for when things loosen up a bit, which it will. As for costs, unless you go with a lesser thought of brand it is fairly moot. Years ago, the costs between Rugers and Smiths was a couple hundred but that's been over for a while. Even still, if the cost differences went back and referring to centerfires, the difference disappears when you consider that that's only a few boxes of decent ammunition. It's never really the cost of the firearm in the long run, it's feeding it. I have a 4" 617 but I have it as a companion/warm-up/practice revolver for a 4" 686 and 629. One I need to pick up is an M17 (which you can still get in the classic line) for a 70's era M27 and M29. After decades of collecting the best thing I can say is be patient and get the one you want. I know it sucks, probably more so if you see my state, I've been in that boat a few times but believe me, it'll work out.

JETA: Who the hell dry-fires a rimfire? I don't care what a manufacturer says, don't do that.

@RiverSwine45

A few days ago I asked them if there were plans to introduce their .22 Pathfinder with their new "black nitride" finish.  They just replied to me today, saying that they absolutely could do that as a special order, but that "it would take a very long time.  At the moment we are trying to catch up with our back orders", and then gave contact information for a dealer through whom they do their small special orders.  Just for giggles I replied a minute ago to see if it was possible to apply that finish to extant guns if they were sent in for other reasons, or if it's only for new build items; a nitrided SS .22LR revolver seems like it could be a neat item that would really survive wear.

Back to keeping my fingers crossed about my inbound example.

ETA: They said it would be $250 for a factory nitride job. Hmm.  Do I want to potentially have $650 invested in a factory one-off black-nitrided SS charter arms .22 revolver?  

It's funny how the captivating having one different from everyone else is. So hard to resist.

At the end of the day it will still be a charter though. Appriciate it for the low cost option it is. Maybe some grips like the professional ones come with.

I just picked up the charter a few minutes ago, and I am actually pleasantly surprised.  The mechanism feels relatively clean and mostly tight, even though some of the meeting services on the barrel casting aren't 100% flush or symmetric.

But for what I paid, I'm happy so far.  I will still likely email Charter to ask about the dimples in the chambers, but I'm hoping I'll be able to get to the range tomorrow morning to test it out first.  If it does what I want it to do, for $500 less than the S&W, I don't really care if the underlug meets the frame evenly on both sides of the flange, or if the top strap rib is indented 100% the same at the muzzle.  The top strap is centered on the frame, the finish is otherwise even.

Need to test it.  If it works fine, then I'm golden!  But if charter says the chamber dimples are bad, and they cover shipping both ways, then I'm golden as well.

You were right, my chambers made extraction so hard I had to smack the ejector rod with a hard object, and the casings exhibited scraping.  One smack popped the cylinder off its axis a bit, which isn't real encouraging.

Because it's a "certified" used gun I can contact them to see about a 100% refund and they cover shipping, or I can give the Charter warranty a shot.

Not real encouraging.  But I'm a little irked, and chatting with some buddies regarding a best outcome.  The fact that River's outcome was great after a trip back is encouraging, but at this point it's also tempting to scrape together a few hundred $$$ more and attempt an upgrade in manufacture.

ETA:  currently leaning more towards a factory refurb, if they'll do it & cover shipping.  Then I would have a functionally new firearm for closer to $400, rather than the $550ish they go for currently (or the $650-700 for a Taurus, or the damn near $1000 for a 617).  I could still reasonably get my money back out of it, rather than overpaying for a Taurus or a Smith.

Ya, I keep a couple screw drivers in my range bag. Light tapping the handle on the ejector rod got them out of mine.

Sucks man, I've been there.

I just bought a new S&W 627 pro series last week, $1099 delivered. Don't know if I would spend that much on a 22LR myself.

ETA
If you do have charter fix it, I'd call them guys up you got it from before you send it in and ask them to give up a little something for the effort.

Are the chambers smooth?  You could use a cleaning patch with a very small amount of something like Flitz to slowly and very lightly polish them.  I'm not a gunsmith so if you try this it's on you but I have done it with a Taurus .38 (I have a thing for cheap revolvers in sorry shape that I can practice/learn on).  Brownells sells cylinder polishing hones but the smallest they make is a .32.

I thought everyone knew about the Menck chamber iron tool for rimfires?

It makes quick work out of fixing rimfire chambers damaged by improper dry firing.

You could fix that Charter cylinder in less than fifteen minutes including cleaning the cylinder.

Good luck finding one though.  Is anyone else making them now?

Tandemkross chamber iron

While It shot impressively well and the chamber peening would be fixable with that bit, the cylinder coming loose was unsettling enough that I decided to return the Charter for a 100% refund.

As it so happens, they also had reasonable price on a used SP101 .22 that would've been about where I would've been into the charter if I had decided to get it nitrided, so that's about a wash on price.  And the SP101 will be a better trainer for some of my other items, due to 8 shot capacity and ability to accept a similar type of hogue checkered grip as my TRR8.  Plus, the better quality sight will be a plus.

So I owned a Charter for 2 days .  I might try one again in the future if/when prices aren't quite so nuts.  It is lighter than the competition by at least 10 ounces for the SS model, and the trigger was decent.

It sucks you got a bad one that someone didn't take care of. But at least you got to try it out and they are taking it back with no hassles.

The sp101 is a better gun, probably more durable too. The size, weight and cost vs the charter aren't really comparable though.

There are practically no revolvers available in my area right now to figure out what a deal is or isn't. I scrolled the gun broker and saw 1 sp101 for $800, a gp100 for $1k and the smith 610's were over $1200.

Weirdest panic ever.

I have some pretty nice Smith's, 4 N frames, 1 j frame and a couple Colts, python and a lawman. I don't mind paying for a nice revolver but for some reason I look at a charter and get all like, sorta want that

I really wanted it to work, but the cylinder coming loose was a very moment.  If I find another one in the future for a good price, I might try again; the light weight and accuracy for a DA SS .22 were surprising.

And I agree about the SP101; size, weight, cost, etc, aren't compatible.  But also like you, I checked GB and the rest of the internet, and there are no good condition .22 revolvers with sub 6" barrels to be had for anything less than absolute lunacy prices.  There was one SP101 that was available as a former range rental; the additional $100 was worth it to me to not have an abused, ragged out gun that would likely need to be sent back.

And I hear you on that last point--numerous S&Ws, numerous Rugers, a Kimber revolver, and yet I wanted the Charter arms to work out, enough so to buy a nice Walnut grip for it that has taken longer to ship than the 2 whole days I owned a charter .  But on the range, my $200 Ruger Wrangler performed similar in terms of accuracy, and was considerably superior in case extraction.    

Much better.  And the DA feels lighter than the Charter; wouldn't be surprised if this already has a Wolf spring kit installed.  Still intending to take it out this weekend to make sure it works properly.

The stock grip fits my hand, but I'll likely buy a bigger grip to match the one on my TRR8 so I can somewhat use this as a trainer.

I just got back from the range, and that SP101 shoots reliably and accurate enough to be fun.  Any issues were decidedly the fault of the ammo, and the cylinder didn't start to pop off if I had to apply a little more/higher end of average pressures to extract any casings.

I'm a happy camper

That being said, there's a lot of great information in this thread.  

I definitely learned that even though a number of older designs (some Iver Johnson, some old H&Rs, etc) may have those recesses at the edge of a rimfire chamber and be fine, that it might not be fine and indicate issues.  

Plus the chamber reamer to make it a non-issue anymore.  

Plus people's positive experiences with some non-S&W guns (charter, Taurus, H&R, and now Ruger), so that the default answer of 617 doesn't dominate the discussion.  And even pointing out some guns I didn't know existed, like that Rossi.  

That's a good looking revolver. Please post again when you get some grips on it.

I think the crane was probably damaged also, on the charter. It's just a small flange and screw that hold it in. The previous owner that hammered that cylinder to hell was probably beating that ejector rod until he decided to sell it.

And since you mentioned H&R, my 999 has been good to me. Was my father's.

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It's better at single action than double but still not terrible.

I was gonna suggest one of these too. I’ll be picking mine up soon.

I was gonna suggest one of these too. I’ll be picking mine up soon.

I forgot to update this thread (as requested) once I got the better grips on this SP101:



Hogue Cocobolo Wood Finger groove/checkered grips.  They make the SP101 feel more like a K-frame, and fill the hand so much better than the OEM rubber things.  And it closely matches the feel of my TRR8's wooden grips (which are also Hogue Cocobolo Finger Groove/Checkered Grips), so it'll be a fun trainer.  I will hopefully get the chance to take it out and shoot with those grips on it tomorrow morning.

Those wood hogues look pretty good. I lake the way the rubber ones feel, can't stand to look at them though.
I may have to buy something to put wood hogues on.

Edited for houges spells