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Posted: 1/23/2020 6:25:15 PM EDT
[#1]
1) Yes
2) No |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 6:30:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1) Yes 2) No So the 230 grain HPs are a better stopper than the 200s and 185s etc. |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 6:31:40 PM EDT
[#3]
Meh.. I prefer the 200 grainers...
Shoot what your gun likes and is accurate with.. |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 6:32:14 PM EDT
[#4]
230gr Federal HST is accurate, reliable, affordable, available and will 100% do the job.... If you put them in the right place...
Training and practice is far more important than picking the perfect round. |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 6:44:50 PM EDT
[#5]
Shoot what works best in your gun. Mine like 230 HST.
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Posted: 1/23/2020 8:01:02 PM EDT
[#6]
It takes some speed to make bullets expand. The heavier the bullet the slower it is and the less likely it is to expand reliably. However all other bullets wish they were .45 s and try so hard to expand enough to get there, while 45 ball ammo has ended many a fight. And anything that penetrates enough to counter heavy clothing and objects will over penetrate soft tissue so what is behind the target matters.
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Posted: 1/23/2020 8:01:40 PM EDT
[#7]
I like thumpers. Prefer 230 gr HST or Gold Dots.
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Posted: 1/23/2020 8:06:35 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It takes some speed to make bullets expand. The heavier the bullet the slower it is and the less likely it is to expand reliably. However all other bullets wish they were .45 s and try so hard to expand enough to get there, while 45 ball ammo has ended many a fight. And anything that penetrates enough to counter heavy clothing and objects will over penetrate soft tissue so what is behind the target matters. That being said, since it's a 45, it already makes a big hole. However, if it expands, a .70 hole would be even more devastating. |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 11:06:40 PM EDT
[#9]
Low velocity can be remedied within reason with appropriate bullet design, as modern .45 JHPs do. If your hollowpoints do not expand reliably, ditch them and find one that does.
230 gr +P HST has the most desirable terminal performance of any .45 ACP loading I've read up on thus far, with approx 0.8" average expansion and ~14 inches of penetration recorded from 2013. The latest generation of HST may have slightly better performance. |
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Posted: 1/23/2020 11:25:11 PM EDT
[#10]
Gun manufacturers/makers, for the most part design their 45acps around the 230g bullet. That doesn't mean 200 won't generally function. I just prefer the extra meat ("thumpers").
eta, I understand that the 185 was designed with the womens in mind. 
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Posted: 1/23/2020 11:31:44 PM EDT
[#11]
Underwood 230 +p JHP's.
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Posted: 1/24/2020 9:19:37 AM EDT
[#12]
200 gr GD +P.
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Posted: 1/24/2020 9:20:09 AM EDT
[#13]
200 gr GD +P.
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Posted: 1/24/2020 1:42:18 PM EDT
[#14]
I used to shoot a lot of hard cast lead bullets a Friend and I cast. In 45 ACP I really liked the HG 68 mold which was a 200 grain Lead SWC and was very accurate. This bullet functioned well in our 1911’s, provided very good accuracy and better terminal performance than round nose bullets. At that time my carry load was the CCI/Speer 200 grain JHP (Flying Ash Tray). Today I’d probably carry 200 or 230 grain Gold Dot or HST depending on price and availability as long as they functioned 100%.
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Posted: 1/24/2020 4:04:46 PM EDT
[#15]
I think the bullet design is more important than the weight.
Other than the HST, it seems that bullet design in the 45 have been a little stagnant. I guess 45 being "pretty darn good" already let manufacturers to focus on the 9mm. |
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Posted: 1/24/2020 5:45:47 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gun manufacturers/makers, for the most part design their 45acps around the 230g bullet. That doesn't mean 200 won't generally function. I just prefer the extra meat ("thumpers"). eta, I understand that the 185 was designed with the womens in mind. From lucky gunner: 
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Posted: 1/24/2020 6:08:39 PM EDT
[#17]
230gr. Hits closest to POA at my home-defense distance. HST or Gold Dots.
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Posted: 1/24/2020 6:17:13 PM EDT
[#18]
10mm is the best weight
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Posted: 1/24/2020 7:29:53 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the bullet design is more important than the weight. Other than the HST, it seems that bullet design in the 45 have been a little stagnant. I guess 45 being "pretty darn good" already let manufacturers to focus on the 9mm. Ranger-Ts are also a pretty good option, though a bit below HST imo. |
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Posted: 1/24/2020 8:19:56 PM EDT
[#20]
I have some 230 grain Remington Golden Sabers I'm wanting to load up.
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Posted: 1/25/2020 9:14:04 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Remington golden sabers in 185gr +p have really good performance in gel. From lucky gunner: https://cdn-secure.luckygunner.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/geltest/860/84685be6e7e8e0c9fc33dd4acf295614.jpg |
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Posted: 1/25/2020 10:20:00 AM EDT
[#22]
I normally run 230gr, but I do run 200gr in my glock 30. I figure with the short barrel, it may need a slightly lighter and faster bullet to get expansion.
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Posted: 1/25/2020 12:47:51 PM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Is it 230 grains or are the lighter ones more effective? For bipeds 230 might work better. For large quadrupeds, the .45 ACP is not the best choice, though it has worked well at times. |
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Posted: 1/26/2020 7:54:16 AM EDT
[#24]
I carry 230 gr. Gold Dots in mine. I have tried the Federal 230 Gr. HST and that is about equal to the gold dot in performance. Also a great round.
If you want a round that has a bit less recoil, the Hornady 185 gr. Critical Defense is also a good round. The reasoning behind the 230 rounds is if it expands fine, if not it works like 230 gr. Hardball. |
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Posted: 1/28/2020 9:10:22 PM EDT
[#25]
Favorite round for defensive use is a 230gr HST in either regular or +P flavors. That said, I'm growing quite fond of hand loads with 185gr XTPs pushed at 1,100fps. Obviously not for personal defense, but they're an awful lot of fun to shoot.
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Posted: 1/28/2020 10:15:09 PM EDT
[#26]
No, and no. 255gr slugs exist
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Posted: 1/29/2020 9:38:57 AM EDT
[#27]
For personnel defense I like 230 grain HST, but I do like shooting the 185 grain loads for fun. Basically mimics a .40 S&W.
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Posted: 1/29/2020 2:03:31 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Favorite round for defensive use is a 230gr HST in either regular or +P flavors. That said, I'm growing quite fond of hand loads with 185gr XTPs pushed at 1,100fps. Obviously not for personal defense, but they're an awful lot of fun to shoot. *I walking around with a Dan Wesson 45 loaded with 230 Ball so I have no room to talk 
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Posted: 1/30/2020 9:08:55 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What's wrong with 185gr XTP at 1100 for personal defense? That actually sounds pretty good. Also the 200 XTP at 1050... But I have no experience with either so I'm asking. *I walking around with a Dan Wesson 45 loaded with 230 Ball so I have no room to talk Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Favorite round for defensive use is a 230gr HST in either regular or +P flavors. That said, I'm growing quite fond of hand loads with 185gr XTPs pushed at 1,100fps. Obviously not for personal defense, but they're an awful lot of fun to shoot. *I walking around with a Dan Wesson 45 loaded with 230 Ball so I have no room to talk I'd have absolutely no worries about that load being extremely devastating, and in limited testing it has shown to be. It's nice to have a hard hitting but flat shooting option in .45. |
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Posted: 1/31/2020 11:25:48 AM EDT
[#30]
I prefer the 230 grain weight but there are a lot of good loads in different weights in 45 ACP that work well. I like the 230 grain weight because you can practice with 230 grain FMJ.
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Posted: 2/15/2020 11:46:54 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thars my concern, the heavy bullets slow speed and not expanding. That being said, since it's a 45, it already makes a big hole. . If the bullet design was identical, then yes, the lighter one would expand better. Nobody does that, the heavier bullet allows the manufacturer to engineer a more robust design that expands across a larger velocity range. |
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Posted: 4/12/2020 10:28:38 AM EDT
[#32]
Put any of them in the right place and they all will make a violent felon rethink the choices he made throughout his life, just saying...
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Posted: 4/18/2020 11:08:26 PM EDT
[#33]
Per gel tests the 230gr seems to do best. Manufacturers seem to have figured out the trick to making subsonic rounds perform well.
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Posted: 4/19/2020 1:57:16 AM EDT
[#34]
My opinion is, no one shot in the chest with a .45 caliber bullet ever pulled a set of calipers out of his pocket to see how big the entrance hole was. Worry less about choosing the perfect bullet and more about putting what you're shooting where it should go. I prefer heavy bullets and could give a shit less whether or not they expand. Tonights supper was compliments of a whitetail buck that was killed last December with a non-expanding .45 caliber pistol bullet.
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Posted: 4/19/2020 5:47:26 PM EDT
[#35]
I shoot 255 gr swc, over a nice snort of bullseye. Killed a few deer with them too, never took a step either, drt
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Posted: 4/23/2020 9:28:20 AM EDT
[#36]
I have always used 230gr, couple times I have tried 185-200gr without much luck, now I just stick with the old standby.
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Posted: 4/23/2020 12:04:28 PM EDT
[#37]
All that trick bullet design that took 9mm from whipping boy to top of the heap also works for .45. A 230 gr HST is hard to beat.
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Posted: 4/23/2020 4:12:59 PM EDT
[#38]
Personally I load a, roughly, 200gr lead keith style semi wadcutter over bullseye. Or a, again roughly, 230 LRN again over bullseye. I'm not one who likes to keep trying different loads. I find one that works and stick with it.
No worrying about leading if you use a hard alloy and keep the pressures within reason. Magic bullets aren't necessary. Proper bullet placement is. The solution to this is practice, practice practice. Then go out and practice some more. |
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Posted: 4/23/2020 10:26:43 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 200 gr GD +P. https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Self_Defense_Ammo_FAQ/DocGKRData/45_200grGDHP.htm |
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Posted: 4/24/2020 1:39:01 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Personally I load a, roughly, 200gr lead keith style semi wadcutter over bullseye. Or a, again roughly, 230 LRN again over bullseye. I'm not one who likes to keep trying different loads. I find one that works and stick with it. No worrying about leading if you use a hard alloy and keep the pressures within reason. Magic bullets aren't necessary. Proper bullet placement is. The solution to this is practice, practice practice. Then go out and practice some more. I agree. With the smaller calibers like 9mm, 38Spl etc, you REALLY benefit from the best, modern JHP. But for the 45, you can get "good enough" with good old solid bullets. |
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Posted: 4/25/2020 12:13:08 PM EDT
[#41]
In 45 the 230 gr HST is best.
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Posted: 4/25/2020 12:27:47 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 230gr Federal HST is accurate, reliable, affordable, available and will 100% do the job.... If you put them in the right place... Training and practice is far more important than picking the perfect round. ^^^^^^ |
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Posted: 5/6/2020 12:43:17 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Italianstallion: That was easy. So the 230 grain HPs are a better stopper than the 200s and 185s etc. Nominally a half ounce of lead. It does not have to move all that fast to do serious damage. |
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Posted: 5/7/2020 9:12:05 PM EDT
[#44]
230 rangers for me since I have a bunch but I like HST too. The only bullets that I carried that was less than 230 was the CCI 200 grain flying ashtray back in the day.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 11:00:40 PM EDT
[#45]
For competition: 200 grain SWC (H&G #68)
For self defense: 230 HP (Gold Dot, HST, Ranger-T) |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 11:24:55 PM EDT
[#46]
Simple, stagger your loads. 1- 230 gr; then 1- 200 gr; then 1- 185 gr; and repeat. You have covered all your bases. Or go 2 of each and follow up with a couple of 255 gr hardcast.
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Posted: 5/9/2020 10:51:51 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By renegade509: Remington golden sabers in 185gr +p have really good performance in gel. From lucky gunner: https://cdn-secure.luckygunner.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/geltest/860/84685be6e7e8e0c9fc33dd4acf295614.jpg Probably time to quite referencing tests done using Clear Gel. Results from @5Pins and others indicate dramatic differences in both penetration and expansion in synthetic vs organic gel. |
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Posted: 5/9/2020 4:19:57 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Melvin_Johnson: Probably time to quite referencing tests done using Clear Gel. Results from @5Pins and others indicate dramatic differences in both penetration and expansion in synthetic vs organic gel. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Melvin_Johnson: Originally Posted By renegade509: Remington golden sabers in 185gr +p have really good performance in gel. From lucky gunner: https://cdn-secure.luckygunner.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/geltest/860/84685be6e7e8e0c9fc33dd4acf295614.jpg Probably time to quite referencing tests done using Clear Gel. Results from @5Pins and others indicate dramatic differences in both penetration and expansion in synthetic vs organic gel. Gel is only useful for comparing the performance of loads. Not predicting how they will behave in bodies that are far from uniform. Of course hitting someone in the breast bone with 230 gr of lead that stops is going to put a world of hurt on them. Sort of like a nice punch to the chest. It can easily disrupt the heart. Precordial thump. While it can sometimes restore operation of a heart under the right circumstance, it can also disrupt the heart under the wrong circumstances. |
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Posted: 5/10/2020 7:06:03 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Melvin_Johnson: Probably time to quite referencing tests done using Clear Gel. Results from @5Pins and others indicate dramatic differences in both penetration and expansion in synthetic vs organic gel. It's been known that clear gel and organic gel don't' agree with each other. In my limited testing so far clear gel seems to show more penetration and less expansion when compared to organic gel. I plan to continue shooting organic and clear gel for now and see if that trend continues, I suspect it will. Tomorrow I'm going to shoot some Underwood .45 ACP 200gr in both. |
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Posted: 5/10/2020 8:14:11 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NVGdude: For competition: 200 grain SWC (H&G #68) For self defense: 230 HP (Gold Dot, HST, Ranger-T) Came here to post the same thing. The LSWC leaves perfectly round holes in paper. Would only add Golden Sabers to the list. Local LE shop used to have great deals on Golden Sabers. Shot them in a variety of 1911s and other .45s. Never had a problem. |
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