User Panel
Posted: 12/1/2018 3:31:30 PM EDT
This is near me https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law/breaking-small-plane-crashes-kennesaw-state-university-campus/42lnl68qAiyflt0SWqEgII/
Not only does it appear he ran out of fuel. He is at the wrong airport |
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From what I have witnessed, they rely way too much on the gizmos on the panel and not their training.
One guy I know told me he doesn't worry about fuel, because the automation will tell him when he needs to stop! All he does is sump the tanks and makes sure fuel is in them. Yes, this dude is an idiot and will one day be a statistic. |
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They are this generations bonanza. Cool airplanes, but tend to attract people with lots of money that don't want to spend the time on actually learning how to be good and safe pilots.
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A lot of the ones that I've met do not seem to express much technical interest in aviation. "Hangar flying", whether it's in person at the airport or online in forums, is critically important.
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Quoted:
The Cirrus is one of those aircraft that just kills people. View Quote The Cirrus, like the AR15, doesn't kill anyone. Its the person using it that kills people. In the case of the Cirrus, its attitude and arrogance on the pilot's part. |
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Poor airmanship isn't more common in the Cirrus type than any other GA aircraft.
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Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than the sea, it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
Should be a placard on every aircraft glare shield. |
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Quoted:
Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than the sea, it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect." Should be a placard on every aircraft glare shield. View Quote But these idiots will continue to act as if they are doing everything just fine and the aircraft will do the rest. They probably never read the POH and have only a vague idea of the systems. The Cirrus isn't a 172, but you'd have a hard time telling these guys. |
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Quoted: The plane isn't usually responsible, Cirrus has replaced the Bonanza at attracting wealthy incompetent aviators. View Quote |
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Quoted:
That's like saying the AR15 is one of those guns that kills people. The Cirrus, like the AR15, doesn't kill anyone. Its the person using it that kills people. In the case of the Cirrus, its attitude and arrogance on the pilot's part. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
The Cirrus is one of those aircraft that just kills people. The Cirrus, like the AR15, doesn't kill anyone. Its the person using it that kills people. In the case of the Cirrus, its attitude and arrogance on the pilot's part. stats you'll find the 172 is at the top for accident rates. Does that make it more dangerous? I know the population and use differences, I'm just throwing out what could be a generalization based upon partial facts. For complete disclosure, I own and fly a SR22. It is a great plane. I don't want for any other plane other than maybe the SF50. I decided on the SR22 after much research and evaluation. Ultimately, the option of having the CAPS, accessibility to Cirrus support in a matter of minutes if needed, and performance with fixed gear made up my mind. I have known a lot of guys that have had nothing good to say about the plastic planes until they have flown in one. |
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I agree with Morgan.
Cirrus goes out of its' way to assure pilot/owners are instructed in safe operations. Still you just can't away from the horse to water attitudes. A smart guy can answer all the questions right and walk out continuing his unsafe attitude! When I give checkouts and insurance rides, I always brief the client on things I noticed even if not related. I also make notes about them and have passed along to the insurance company serious issues. Always comes back to the pilot, with maintenance and weather competing for 2nd place |
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Quoted: Agreed. That is the problem in any plane, not just the Cirrus. The worst combination is ignorance and arrogance. If you look at accident stats you'll find the 172 is at the top for accident rates. Does that make it more dangerous? I know the population and use differences, I'm just throwing out what could be a generalization based upon partial facts. For complete disclosure, I own and fly a SR22. It is a great plane. I don't want for any other plane other than maybe the SF50. I decided on the SR22 after much research and evaluation. Ultimately, the option of having the CAPS, accessibility to Cirrus support in a matter of minutes if needed, and performance with fixed gear made up my mind. I have known a lot of guys that have had nothing good to say about the plastic planes until they have flown in one. View Quote |
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Quoted: Are you a doctor by chance? View Quote |
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I cant see mention of a Cirrus without mentioning this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOqQtB2Pux4 |
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Cessna 150>Cessna 182>Cessna 210> B36TC was my progression over the years. I took flying SERIOUSLY along with the weather and truly understanding the do/do nots of all the aircraft I flew. But then I`m a pilot and not an airplane manipulator.
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Quoted: No. I get where you're going and agree with your above comment. A SR22 is not the plane in which you should learn to fly. It is too easy to rely on the systems and just manage the airplane instead of flying it. I learned in a Beech Sierra. I probably wouldn't recommend learning to fly in a complex either, but it does make other planes seem a bit easier. View Quote |
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Quoted: No. I get where you're going and agree with your above comment. A SR22 is not the plane in which you should learn to fly. It is too easy to rely on the systems and just manage the airplane instead of flying it. I learned in a Beech Sierra. I probably wouldn't recommend learning to fly in a complex either, but it does make other planes seem a bit easier. View Quote |
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It used to take a combination of luck and skill to survive being a retard.
Now it just takes luck and money but the luck tends to run out before the money does. |
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Accident Case Study: In Too Deep |
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Quoted:
A friend once told me that Cirrus pilots get themselves into trouble because of the blue handle. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Quoted:
I cant see mention of a Cirrus without mentioning this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOqQtB2Pux4 View Quote |
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Quoted: I have heard (not sure if true, and not to sound rude to our Cirrus pilots) that in accidents where the chute is not pulled that the propellant charge for the chute can ignite the fuel in crash landings and trigger a post-impact fire. View Quote These are all 'what-if's' based on wild conjecture with no basis in fact! |
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any of you guys been in a Spin in a Cirrus? Let me know if you live.
I know, well knew 3 pilots as they are now dead, for some reason or another were not able to recover from a Spin in a Cirrus due to low altitude of the spin occurring, Chute didn't save any of them, 2 of the impacts showed the engine was at max RPM or close to it, other was with the engine at idle during impact with the Autopilot stuck in a left descending turn, the student on this one survived, was laid up for a few weeks in the hospital, but lived, Made me wonder why they didn't pull the circuit breaker on the AP, instead of trying to fight the AP for 20 minutes till impact. Safe plane as long as your not in a spin condition. I'm not saying Ban the Plane, i'm just saying i won't get in one. |
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Quoted:
any of you guys been in a Spin in a Cirrus? Let me know if you live. I know, well knew 3 pilots as they are now dead, for some reason or another were not able to recover from a Spin in a Cirrus due to low altitude of the spin occurring, Chute didn't save any of them, 2 of the impacts showed the engine was at max RPM or close to it, other was with the engine at idle during impact with the Autopilot stuck in a left descending turn, the student on this one survived, was laid up for a few weeks in the hospital, but lived, Made me wonder why they didn't pull the circuit breaker on the AP, instead of trying to fight the AP for 20 minutes till impact. Safe plane as long as your not in a spin condition. I'm not saying Ban the Plane, i'm just saying i won't get in one. View Quote Likewise, EVERY aircraft has stall/spin accidents. A pilots failure to recover or even to get themselves into that condition has nothing to do with a fault in the aircraft. Certification allows the manufacture to demonstrate recovery from a 1 turn spin and placard the aircraft SPINS PROHIBITED. |
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Quoted: Be nice if you actually would cite/link the NTSB findings on these... There are certification limits on how much is required for a pilot to override an auto pilot. Likewise, EVERY aircraft has stall/spin accidents. A pilots failure to recover or even to get themselves into that condition has nothing to do with a fault in the aircraft. Certification allows the manufacture to demonstrate recovery from a 1 turn spin and placard the aircraft SPINS PROHIBITED. View Quote I just read these reports after years of these incidents happening. Very tragic and personal since i knew these pilots. i don't even know if i want to post links to them. if you want you can search yourself, I only got as far as the Fox Field incident, saw that Pilot just a few hours before he died. Here is a link to 371 items for the Cirrus. NTSB for Cirrus Aircraft Enjoy at your own leisure. |
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Quoted:
But this wing design on this plane does tend to kill people. I just read these reports after years of these incidents happening. Very tragic and personal since i knew these pilots. i don't even know if i want to post links to them. if you want you can search yourself, I only got as far as the Fox Field incident, saw that Pilot just a few hours before he died. Here is a link to 371 items for the Cirrus. NTSB for Cirrus Aircraft Enjoy at your own leisure. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted: Be nice if you actually would cite/link the NTSB findings on these... There are certification limits on how much is required for a pilot to override an auto pilot. Likewise, EVERY aircraft has stall/spin accidents. A pilots failure to recover or even to get themselves into that condition has nothing to do with a fault in the aircraft. Certification allows the manufacture to demonstrate recovery from a 1 turn spin and placard the aircraft SPINS PROHIBITED. I just read these reports after years of these incidents happening. Very tragic and personal since i knew these pilots. i don't even know if i want to post links to them. if you want you can search yourself, I only got as far as the Fox Field incident, saw that Pilot just a few hours before he died. Here is a link to 371 items for the Cirrus. NTSB for Cirrus Aircraft Enjoy at your own leisure. Additionally, the CFI had marijuana detected in his lungs, urine and liver. Also, the pilot under instruction was on anti depressants. I'm still not sure why people attack the Cirrus planes. Search the NTSB database for A36 and 172 accidents. Comments about the wing design are typically made by people that have not flown the plane. It has great slow flight control and maneuverability. I have flown my SR22 to full stall and recovery numerous times. I have not had it in a spin, never been close. The CSIP that did my transition training was a test pilot for Cirrus, he said recovering from spins is no more of an issue with a Cirrus than any other plane. Cirrus just recommends deploying the CAPS if you enter a spin because of the loss of altitude associated with a full spin and because the CAPS is available. Replacing the airplane is cheaper/easier than dealing with injuries and deaths for insurance companies. |
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I looked at least at the first 20 accidents. That spanned a period of 4 years. Of those 20, 14 were fatal and 6 non-fatal. The usual culprits were in there with a couple of unknowns.
Contrast that with Beech A36. Also 8 years/20 accidents. ALL fatal! Now that is pretty shaky ground to draw conclusions with. Cirrus only took 1/2 the time to rack up the same number of accidents. Fatals were pretty close, 6 more for the A36. But many of the Cirrus accidents were training with students or low time transitions. There is not a fleet of A36's out there being used as primary trainers. If I were teaching in Cirrus I would make sure I have a though understanding of its' characteristics and would insist my customers did too. Approach distractions and out of position approaches would be high on the list as well. |
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