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Posted: 3/28/2024 9:53:25 AM EDT
All that matters about the recent maritime disaster in Baltimore is already well known with one exception: the root cause. What could cause an engineering casualty of that magnitude? I'm no marine engineer, but I am an engineer, and curiosity is killing this cat.
MV Dali had one big ass 2-stroke diesel engine and no less than four massive generators. And go... |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 9:58:03 AM EDT
[#1]
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: All that matters about the recent maritime disaster in Baltimore is already well known with one exception: the root cause. What could cause an engineering casualty of that magnitude? I'm no marine engineer, but I am an engineer, and curiosity is killing this cat. MV Dali had one big ass 2-stroke diesel engine and no less than four massive generators. And go... Tag |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:01:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Blstr89]
[#2]
Dirty fuel.
Ships lose power a lot more often than you think, they just don’t usually take down a bridge when it happens. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:02:04 AM EDT
[#3]
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:05:21 AM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: All that matters about the recent maritime disaster in Baltimore is already well known with one exception: the root cause. What could cause an engineering casualty of that magnitude? I'm no marine engineer, but I am an engineer, and curiosity is killing this cat. MV Dali had one big ass 2-stroke diesel engine and no less than four massive generators. And go... same thoughts as you.. My hope is that even in the best laid plans things break and shit happens and it was just an accident that now forces some new triple system redundancy....but my bet is on someone bypassed/didn't service/disregarded/overrode/etc the one thing that was designed to prevent this from happening. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:05:34 AM EDT
[#5]
Imagine if the root cause is found to be bad fuel, and the ship took on fuel while in port.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:06:23 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Blstr89: Dirty fuel. Ships lose power a lot more often than you think, they just don't usually take down a bridge when it happens. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:10:08 AM EDT
[#7]
Usually the values on my mower.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:10:24 AM EDT
[#8]
Why is this an engineering failure?
Were the twin towers an engineering failure? 
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:11:18 AM EDT
[#9]
It’s the maritime equivalent of a ‘79 Peterbilt breaking a neglected tie rod and slamming into an overpass. An old boat did an old boat thing. The resultant allision exceeded the bridge’s design parameters.
From an engineering or failure analysis perspective this is fascinating stuff. For the rest of us, ehhh, it’s another Tuesday on the high seas. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:11:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: aa777888-2]
[#10]
Don't all these large vessels use "fuel polishing" systems? These are more than just filters. They are multiple filters with redundant safeguards against clogs, etc.
It's not an engineering failure per se (although it might be). It's more likely a maintenance and/or operational failure. It's not an old ship, it was completed in 2015, which is practically brand new in the world of cargo ships. |
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CT, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:11:35 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mojo_Jojo: Imagine if the root cause is found to be bad fuel, and the ship took on fuel while in port. It will be this or poor fuel system maintenance. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:12:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Morlawn66]
[#12]
Not to shift this thread but the design of the Bridge Piers is total shit . The ship's bow impacted the Truss portion above water and took it out, it had NO mass to resist impact and had no protection supplied by Dolphins .
Probably posted this in the wrong thread . |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:12:24 AM EDT
[#13]
The 5G nanobots in the harbor pilots clot shot were hacked taking over his nervous system forcing him to ram into the bridge.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:12:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Dolomite]
[#14]
LEAN operating budget.
ETA - the netflix fiction series Zero Zero Zero has an awesome segment that deals with operations on a heavily automated foreign crewed shipping vessel - episodes 2 - 3 iirc. It is worth rewatching. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:13:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: redfish86]
[#15]
It was racism, pure and simple.
Trump will be indicted for it any day now. Edit: Dammit, this answer is better than mine Originally Posted By 7empest: The 5G nanobots in the harbor pilots clot shot were hacked taking over his nervous system forcing him to ram into the bridge. |
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FM, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:13:17 AM EDT
[#16]
If sorry fuel caused this, and bad fuel caused the jet crash in Naples, what in the hell is going on with that sector?!?
They need to get their shit together. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:15:39 AM EDT
[#17]
Lack of proper maintenance.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:17:04 AM EDT
[#18]
Unstoppable force hit an immovable object
that 1977 MD graft built bridge was going to fail in 10 years anyway |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:18:19 AM EDT
[#19]
Curious about the route those ships take getting to the port. I’ve looked at it on Google Earth and it appears that the shipping lane is under that bridge.
But that ship appears too tall to go under it at any point. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:19:30 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Blstr89: Dirty fuel. Ships lose power a lot more often than you think, they just don't usually take down a bridge when it happens. I think we need a definition of dirty more precise than greater or lesser dirty. Is the cut off, "won't pass rat carcasses?" |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:19:31 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KoolOperator: Why is this an engineering failure? Were the twin towers an engineering failure? The boat stopped working. That's the engineering failure OP is referring to. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:19:46 AM EDT
[#22]
I'm a bit disappointed that the conspiracy tards have already moved on from direct energy weapons as the cause for everything.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:20:10 AM EDT
[#23]
And to add to the discussion about fuel, the engine is diesel, but the fuel they run in those ships is called bunker fuel.
Very cheap and very dirty fuel. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:23:19 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SuperX925: Curious about the route those ships take getting to the port. I’ve looked at it on Google Earth and it appears that the shipping lane is under that bridge. But that ship appears too tall to go under it at any point. I was thinking the same thing 
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:27:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: ZuoZongtang]
[#25]
One abject failure was protocol. Should have dropped anchor the second power went out.
How come the captain’s name hasn’t been released? Why isn’t he up in front of congress? Was any of the crew detained or arrested? How about maintenance records? Too many unanswered questions. I find it striking that from the first second this happened. It was called by all news Media outlets a Bridge collapse. Not a ship hitting a bridge. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:29:15 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SuperX925: And to add to the discussion about fuel, the engine is diesel, but the fuel they run in those ships is called bunker fuel. Very cheap and very dirty fuel. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:30:50 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Morlawn66: Not to shift this thread but the design of the Bridge Piers is total shit . The ship's bow impacted the Truss portion above water and took it out, it had NO mass to resist impact and had no protection supplied by Dolphins . Probably posted this in the wrong thread . |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:34:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: LowBeta]
[#28]
I'm going with incompetent watch standing, grossly inadequate training, and failure to maintain minimum physical plant standards.
tldr: it was most likely a decision that lead to the failure. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:34:59 AM EDT
[#29]
Coming from a power plant, I'm shocked that a vessel that size doesn't have battery backup for critical systems, such as steering and navigation. I'm also ignorant to the abilities of a vessel that size, so maybe there is no steering without thrust?
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USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:38:01 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By webtaz99: Lack of proper maintenance. Who is responsible for that? Obviously the company, but more specifically is it the crew? Do they hire port side people to do inspections? Does anyone in the port authority assess seaworthiness? What's the role of the captain on maintenance? Somebody let this ship get underway when it wasn't ready, I'm wondering who all has responsibility for maintenance and who gives it a thumbs up to sail. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:38:02 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HDLS: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/ezgif_com-optimize-3-3170806.gif I suppose I’ll be called a pansy for saying this but an “IN” gif of an incident where 6 people died seems kind of fucked up |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:38:07 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BillythePoet: Coming from a power plant, I'm shocked that a vessel that size doesn't have battery backup for critical systems, such as steering and navigation. I'm also ignorant to the abilities of a vessel that size, so maybe there is no steering without thrust? If it has a propeller and a rudder, the rudder works, for better or worse, regardless of whether the propeller is turning. Contrast that with something like a JetSki where the impeller assembly essentially vectors the thrust to turn. Lose power and it will always go in a straight line, whether you want it to or not. I almost killed someone 20 years ago while learning that fact the hard way. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:41:49 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sirbordsalot311: I suppose I’ll be called a pansy for saying this but an “IN” gif of an incident where 6 people died seems kind of fucked up Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sirbordsalot311: Originally Posted By HDLS: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/ezgif_com-optimize-3-3170806.gif I suppose I’ll be called a pansy for saying this but an “IN” gif of an incident where 6 people died seems kind of fucked up Agreed. Really bad idea. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:42:12 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By webtaz99: Lack of proper maintenance. I'm going with this. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:44:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: highstepper]
[#35]
Prolly bad fuel or poor maintenance…
However… Could it have been a hack? A hostile state actor couldn’t plan a more convenient way to cripple one of our busiest ports IF, it indeed was a hack. Just a thought… |
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MT, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:46:16 AM EDT
[#36]
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: All that matters about the recent maritime disaster in Baltimore is already well known with one exception: the root cause. What could cause an engineering casualty of that magnitude? I'm no marine engineer, but I am an engineer, and curiosity is killing this cat. MV Dali had one big ass 2-stroke diesel engine and no less than four massive generators. And go... |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:47:47 AM EDT
[#37]
Most likely dirty fuel.
But mains and generators should have different running tanks. Poor maintenance and training probably played a big factor. |
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WI, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:48:14 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By KoolOperator: Why is this an engineering failure? Were the twin towers an engineering failure? "Engineering" in the context used here refers to the mechanical systems on a ship, not design "Engineering". |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:48:18 AM EDT
[#39]
Nobody should have a ship of that large a capacity!
Container ships have gotten lots bigger since that bridge was built. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:49:55 AM EDT
[#40]
I think it was all part of Trump's dastardy plan to destroy democracy and take over the world.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:50:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7empest]
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By highstepper: Prolly bad fuel or poor maintenance… However… Could it have been a hack? A hostile state actor couldn’t plan a more convenient way to cripple one of our busiest ports via a hack. Just a thought… Or aliens. Maybe even hyper-intelligent tomatoes.  Just a thought..... |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:51:06 AM EDT
[#42]
In the video you can see all the lights on the vessel go off, come back on, and then go off again just a few seconds before the bridge strike.
Going to guess it ends up being some type of electrical system failure that inhibited the pilot’s ability to control the ship. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:51:19 AM EDT
[#43]
@goatboy can we please get a bridge sub forum?
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:51:56 AM EDT
[#44]
Two of my buddies did some type of barge recovery operations out in Cali for a long time. They said it pretty much happens all the time. Mostly from fuel or improper fuel changeover. I mean the loss of power happens all the time, not the bridge hitting part.
They said they keep fuel samples and obviously there is fuel in the ship still, so they should be able to figure it out whether it was incompetence or shitty fuel pretty easily. I don't know shit myself, just relaying their thoughts. |
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WI, USA
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:52:07 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By flyhack72: If sorry fuel caused this, and bad fuel caused the jet crash in Naples, what in the hell is going on with that sector?!? They need to get their shit together. That jet flew from OH to FL and crashed on approach. Unlikely that it was bad fuel. Posters in that thread showed how the engine shutdowns could have been accidentally engaged. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:52:11 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SuperX925: And to add to the discussion about fuel, the engine is diesel, but the fuel they run in those ships is called bunker fuel. Very cheap and very dirty fuel. The Heavy Fuel Oil is intended for use on open ocean. The ship should have been burning distillate while maneuvering from pier to sea. Having said that, there’s a process to follow when shifting fuel types underway and deviating from the process can put your lights out. If a company wanted to save a few dollars, maybe they tried changing from distillate to HFO early? Distillates are things like MGO, #2 diesel, etc. |
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:53:49 AM EDT
[#47]
Indian maintenance crew.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:55:05 AM EDT
[#48]
I wonder what the extent of repairs had to be made when it stern hit the dock in Antwerp in 2016. You can bet all of the logs are being peeled thru with extreme scrutiny. Any discrepancies should result in jail time and fines.
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:55:19 AM EDT
[#49]
Is everything run off the ship's main engines? Propulsion, lighting, refrigeration of the containers, etc.?
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Posted: 3/28/2024 10:56:33 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 7empest: The 5G nanobots in the harbor pilots clot shot were hacked taking over his nervous system forcing him to ram into the bridge. 
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