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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:14:50 PM EDT
[#1]
I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous.
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:16:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:19:01 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dominion21: Thanks! Ukraine appears to have relied primarily on 2 types of drones (prior to us sending Switchblades + others): The famous Turkish Bayraktar, and various commercial quad-copters dropping the ironic Russian-invented “RKG-3” anti-tank hang grenade in modified form: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RKG-3_anti-tank_grenade No sane foot-solder wants to be within throwing distance of an enemy tank. And given good tactics & training, that should never happen. So this weapon was sort a suicide/last ditch / Hail-Mary way to fight off an enemy tank. Little regard for the lives of their own soldiers seems to be the Russian way. But for drone use against the lightly armored top of many armored vehicles , these things are great! Here is a cross sectioned display model: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5e/RKG-3_anti-tank_grenade_%28DOSAAF_Museum_in_Minsk%29.jpg/1536px-RKG-3_anti-tank_grenade_%28DOSAAF_Museum_in_Minsk%29.jpg The Ukrainians remove the rear section, and attach fins they print on their own 3D printers. Then hopefully there is little wind, and it is good night Ivan!  
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:20:32 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By outofbattery: This area I circled in green has had my curiosity for a while. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/56204/97A48E8D-BA5E-4D52-A014-0E02FE2B10EF_jpe-2386924.JPG It’s surrounded but has long been labeled as “contested” or ““strong partisan activity”. It would be interesting to know why and how Russia hasn’t pacified it and what the story has been. I've been wondering as well. Perhaps the area has no immediate value and few good roads so the Russians correctly decided to bypass it for now? |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:22:52 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Illegible_Signature: I've been wondering as well. Perhaps the area has no immediate value and few good roads so the Russians correctly decided to bypass it for now? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Illegible_Signature: Originally Posted By outofbattery: This area I circled in green has had my curiosity for a while. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/56204/97A48E8D-BA5E-4D52-A014-0E02FE2B10EF_jpe-2386924.JPG It's surrounded but has long been labeled as "contested" or ""strong partisan activity". It would be interesting to know why and how Russia hasn't pacified it and what the story has been. I've been wondering as well. Perhaps the area has no immediate value and few good roads so the Russians correctly decided to bypass it for now? |
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USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:23:13 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CS223: If I were driving down a tree lined road bordering a field pock marked by artillery strikes, I don't think I'd stick around. How about the dudes standing in front of the revetment watching their SAM burn? Presumably in the middle of an artillery barrage. No thanks! |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:24:30 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAD762: Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAD762: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:29:21 PM EDT
[#8]
@outofbattery
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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:33:24 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Originally Posted By JAD762: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. So... What? if this happens again the Russian government is going to say, "eh fuck it." This time then sell or give a stock of nuclear weapons to the Iranians and/or North Koreans just to stick it to the western world? |
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NY, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:35:03 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sentionaut: What is their official reason? I know they are slimy as fuck, but what is the spin? The woman seems to be fighting the narrative all the way... even the look on her face at times is one of disbelief as if she can't believe he would be so crazy as to speak such things. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:40:51 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: So... What? if this happens again the Russian government is going to say, "eh fuck it." This time then sell or give a stock of nuclear weapons to the Iranians and/or North Koreans just to stick it to the western world? No, they will sell them to us because we have the money. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:41:20 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: So... What? if this happens again the Russian government is going to say, "eh fuck it." This time then sell or give a stock of nuclear weapons to the Iranians and/or North Koreans just to stick it to the western world? Delivering such weapons would cause them to be included in the response. If they don’t do it themselves, they won’t have someone else do it. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:45:43 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: So... What? if this happens again the Russian government is going to say, "eh fuck it." This time then sell or give a stock of nuclear weapons to the Iranians and/or North Koreans just to stick it to the western world? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Hesperus: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Originally Posted By JAD762: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. So... What? if this happens again the Russian government is going to say, "eh fuck it." This time then sell or give a stock of nuclear weapons to the Iranians and/or North Koreans just to stick it to the western world? I recall several "incidents" where what might have been real nuclear material turned up on the open market already... So, "Same as every day Pinky?" and a resounding MEH! to that fud. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:49:03 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Originally Posted By JAD762: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. Eh. Russia's already collapsed once in my lifetime. The Soviet Union collapsed and the US had to pay for guards for Russian nuclear materials. And we had to hire their dirtbag rocket scientists at NASA to keep them from selling their services to the Norks and Iran. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 12:49:15 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Putin thinking everybody around him is an idiot and he is the only one smart enough to make these decisions? Yes. That definitely does sound plausible. And the worse the war goes for him, the more he will think he has to make the decisions himself. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By outofbattery: US intelligence apparently thinks Putin is inserting himself into operations at the level of a major or colonel. How hilarious would it be if Putin himself is the idiot who came up with the river crossing or who kept putting helicopters at Kherson airport because nobody could tell him why it was a bad idea? Putin thinking everybody around him is an idiot and he is the only one smart enough to make these decisions? Yes. That definitely does sound plausible. And the worse the war goes for him, the more he will think he has to make the decisions himself. Sounds a lot like our previous president |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:01:22 PM EDT
[#16]
MPS thread again
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:02:29 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By amannamedjed: Ditto. Thermopylae, Bastogne, Azov. What about Masada? |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:03:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: stgdz]
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cypher15: @outofbattery https://understandingwar.org/sites/default/files/Kherson%20and%20Mykolaiv%20Battle%20Map%20Draft%20May%2016%2C2022.png I don't understand why this area has been so quiet. Maybe just hold them up to they clear out the donbass and then UA moves towards Mariupol and cuts off the entire southern side of the Russian army. But that won't be till july-august |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:04:40 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:05:33 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. They would unquestionably nuke China for that. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:07:29 PM EDT
[#21]
Is Oblast like a district/county type of deal ?
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:10:38 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Swampgrass: Is Oblast like a district/county type of deal ? Essentially. Probably a bit more powerful, but not sovereign like a state. Those are Republics and such in the Russian speaking countries. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:10:47 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chokey:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/125040433641 |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:16:10 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. I think at this point what it will all come down to is finding out if anyone in a position of power has the balls to challenge Putin's authority. I'm not optimistic, I think Putin could keel over from a heart attack and many people would still be trying to carry out his orders. It's not like Russia hasn't had corpse-emperors before. Just look at the early 1980s. "How am I supposed to get anywhere with the Russians when they keep dying on me?" Probably my favorite Reagan quote. 
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:17:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: doc540]
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LoBrau: You made the accusation, which is quite similar to known Russian propaganda. If it is a legitimate issue, you can back it up with open source information. If it is not, please stop muddying the waters. Saying "I can't talk about it in public," after you talk about it in public, is a non starter. you nailed it when you said Eastern Europe is a security vipers' nest In the not too distant past Ukraine was a snake pit of criminal cartel E-crime activity. But I understand the knee-jerk, lynch mob mentality of "anything critical of Ukraine means you suckputinsdick". It's GD |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:17:30 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Essentially. Probably a bit more powerful, but not sovereign like a state. Those are Republics and such in the Russian speaking countries. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Originally Posted By Swampgrass: Is Oblast like a district/county type of deal ? Essentially. Probably a bit more powerful, but not sovereign like a state. Those are Republics and such in the Russian speaking countries. Thanks. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:18:03 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: Originally Posted By Chokey:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/125040433641 $10 (probably cheaper off of alibaba) shell, a reusable drone, and a leftover freebee grenade to reap casualties and sow unfettered terror amongst an invading force? Deal of the century. Truly enough to make an engineer or accountant proud. Peak bang for buck right there. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:19:58 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I’ve heard of Ukrainian E-crime but from everything I’ve seen it differs from Russian E-crime in that it is not state sponsored. Neither are "state sponsored" by the legal definition. Russia's "state" is a criminal cartel. In the not too distant past, Ukraine's E-crime was driven by criminal cartels who preyed upon American assets. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:20:17 PM EDT
[#29]
First strikes by Brimstone missiles on two tanks.
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:22:04 PM EDT
[#30]
The Finnish President is currently visiting Sweden, and formal applications to join will be done simultaneously tomorrow.
The Norwegian military sent a liaison officer to the Swedish MoD yesterday. Someone just needs to throw Erdogan something so he can placate his supporters. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:22:29 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: Originally Posted By Chokey:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/125040433641 Link to source for the grenades? 
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:22:49 PM EDT
[#32]
— BlueSauron\uD83D\uDC41? (@Blue_Sauron) May 17, 2022 |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:22:51 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: He's dying. One way or another, he will be dead soon. Sooner the better. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: Originally Posted By realwar: Putin Says Russia Has No Problem With Sweden or Finland  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcA_kSDIOfAHe's dying. One way or another, he will be dead soon. Sooner the better. There were some photos of Putin floating around after the 5/9 parade where it looked like he had no teeth (removed?) and he was not even wearing dentures. Had that collapsed jaw look Possibly some good photoshopping to give that embarrassing look, but if they were , they were very well done |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:23:45 PM EDT
[#34]
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:24:20 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Swampgrass: Is Oblast like a district/county type of deal ? like a prefecture or parish. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:32:28 PM EDT
[#36]
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:37:00 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Illegible_Signature: Should I relay this rather simplistic statement to my daughter with triplets? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Illegible_Signature: Originally Posted By ludder093: Originally Posted By mrrick: have you had to buy formula? I bet not. shits hard to find. that crazy bitch does have a good point on THAT Should I relay this rather simplistic statement to my daughter with triplets? Don’t talk to Bette Midler like that! |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:37:47 PM EDT
[#38]
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MN, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:41:28 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Stayed out on the road for a.lomg time there |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:41:34 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By doc540: Neither are "state sponsored" by the legal definition. Russia's "state" is a criminal cartel. In the not too distant past, Ukraine's E-crime was driven by criminal cartels who preyed upon American assets. Russia uses military and security cyber units to conduct criminal activities, and taxes criminal organizations in the mafia way also. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:41:46 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Or possibly a strategy to get the F-35 deal back on track. It was cancelled in 2019 but they are in talks now to get the deal back on track. Possibly it's just leverage to make sure the deal goes through this time. They have wanted Patriots, been denied them. That's what led to the S-400 purchase. They can also use this as leverage to dump the s-400s to Ukraine, get the Patriots, then the S-35s. I would imagine that's the real play here. I believe they have floated that idea already. Then who makes the first move? The Turks? Or the bidet regime? Are they smart enough to put that sort of deal out there? Is there anything in it for the bidet family? |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:42:39 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. What's happening now is better? What if there are only 2 options, russia is strong enough to attack neighbors just because they want to, or, russia is collapsed? The rest of the world needs to build their iron curtain for them. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:47:16 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Stayed out on the road for a.lomg time there They are fighting troops with little to no training, and no nco corps to guide them. There is a video here somewhere of a kid who graduated from an "elite" russian command school, who had no idea what was going on, and watched as his armor was blown up around him. No comms, no direction, their gun didn't work. Any kid playing world of tanks could have kicked his ass in real life, lol. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:47:18 PM EDT
[#44]
I have a question for people who would know. Is there value in slinging projectiles at the enemy even though it is well understood those projectiles will probably miss? I'm thinking of a small unit engaging the enemy. I would be tempted to get comfortable and hidden, and wait for a good target so that when I fire somebody is going down.
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:48:58 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: I have a question for people who would know. Is there value in slinging projectiles at the enemy even though it is well understood those projectiles will probably miss? I'm thinking of a small unit engaging the enemy. I would be tempted to get comfortable and hidden, and wait for a good target so that when I fire somebody is going down. Suppressive fire, harrashment fire, or reconnassiance by fire. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:53:20 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dagger41: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. I believe it's inevitable now. Russia has shown its ass and it isn't as pretty as they thought everybody should think. I bet even China is eyeing that country now and waiting to pounce. Nobody would jump in to save Russia either. Is China more competent/less corrupt though? I’m think not, their military contractors and leadership would have to be above the observable corruption within the nation, stuff like tofu dreg buildings falling apart, the largest gold rehypothication scam in history, cities bankrupting themselves just to temporarily meet insane quotas, the list of corruption of the CCP is very long, and that’s the stuff that’s made it to our ears. I doubt their military wouldn’t be less corrupt than Russia. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:56:37 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: What's happening now is better? What if there are only 2 options, russia is strong enough to attack neighbors just because they want to, or, russia is collapsed? The rest of the world needs to build their iron curtain for them. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: I don’t believe that the west wants Russia to collapse. That’s too dangerous. What's happening now is better? What if there are only 2 options, russia is strong enough to attack neighbors just because they want to, or, russia is collapsed? The rest of the world needs to build their iron curtain for them. A wounded Russia but still has it's full empire under control is the ideal situation. Let them spend decades on keeping their populace inline. Broken up we would probably see a strong man leader come back and try to rebuild the commie empire all over again. Yeah wounding them is the best bet. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:57:06 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Suppressive fire, harrashment fire, or reconnassiance by fire. I doubt the US military is going to take my totally inexperienced advice. Suppressive fire I get. But still seems like harassing them and reconnassianceing them would be done best by putting bullets in them. I expect a tank would find it quite bothersome for their driver to catch a bullet in the face from a dirtpile. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:58:11 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: I doubt the US military is going to take my totally inexperienced advice. Suppressive fire I get. But still seems like harassing them and reconnassianceing them would be done best by putting bullets in them. I expect a tank would find it quite bothersome for their driver to catch a bullet in the face from a dirtpile. |
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Posted: 5/17/2022 1:58:54 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gODZOOKIE: Thanks. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gODZOOKIE: Originally Posted By CPT_CAVEMAN: WP? Thanks. It’s not WP, it is magnesium. MZ-21 munition. |
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