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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:34:54 PM EDT
I'm new to middle TN and when I moved here late last year, there was a tornado that came through the Gallatin area in early December. The weather has also been very unsettled all spring so far.
My house has a crawl space. When I lived in PA, if there was a tornado threat, we would head to the basement. That's obviously not an option here. A lot of houses don't have basements around here and I accepted that and bought one with a crawl space. Now I see a lot of these "garage" storm shelters advertised. Worth it? Recommended company? Don't worry about it, just get into tub? What do yinz'all do in middle Tn or surrounding areas? |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:37:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Woodsman20]
[#1]
There is a hometown forum. More coming tonight
https://www.safesheds.com/smallfamilystormshelter.html |
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:39:44 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Woodsman20: There is a hometown forum. More coming tonight https://www.safesheds.com/smallfamilystormshelter.html Good point, I forget about that section. |
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:45:36 PM EDT
[#3]
First question? what do you think the max time you would spend in it?
If 30 mins for just a passing storm, or over night due to a serious storm popping up tornados randomly? Because that makes a serious difference. |
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:47:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JustinU235]
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By StaccatoC2: First question? what do you think the max time you would spend in it? If 30 mins for just a passing storm, or over night due to a serious storm popping up tornados randomly? Because that makes a serious difference. Definitely a passing storm situation for me. I don't envision camping in there for days on end. Like when that 'nado came near where I work, we all headed to the shelter as our phones alerted the warning and it passed by. Then we got out and went about our lives. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:48:06 PM EDT
[#5]
Originally Posted By JustinU235: I'm new to middle TN and when I moved here late last year, there was a tornado that came through the Gallatin area in early December. The weather has also been very unsettled all spring so far. My house has a crawl space. When I lived in PA, if there was a tornado threat, we would head to the basement. That's obviously not an option here. A lot of houses don't have basements around here and I accepted that and bought one with a crawl space. Now I see a lot of these "garage" storm shelters advertised. Worth it? Recommended company? Don't worry about it, just get into tub? What do yinz'all do in middle Tn or surrounding areas? Home Depot sell them and after the 3 tornadoes hit the NW GA/ SE Tennessee area about 10 years ago, the in ground ones (fiberglass or steel) became very popular. We are doing a site built one in our barndo we are building in N Hamilton County. |
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:49:54 PM EDT
[#6]
I go to the basement. My cousin had a nice reinforced concrete safe room built when he built his house. Uncle also has a basement. Wife's relatives have a storm house built into the side of a hill.
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2024 11:59:02 PM EDT
[#7]
Originally Posted By JustinU235: I'm new to middle TN and when I moved here late last year, there was a tornado that came through the Gallatin area in early December. The weather has also been very unsettled all spring so far. My house has a crawl space. When I lived in PA, if there was a tornado threat, we would head to the basement. That's obviously not an option here. A lot of houses don't have basements around here and I accepted that and bought one with a crawl space. Now I see a lot of these "garage" storm shelters advertised. Worth it? Recommended company? Don't worry about it, just get into tub? What do yinz'all do in middle Tn or surrounding areas? Just get in the Tub!!  Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:00:51 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. Thanks for grounding in reality. The hail hitting the ground today had me thinking about this and although I should have brought the flag in, I've been impressed with how well this flag pole is holding up in the weather (claimed rated to 100mph). From today,  |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:02:37 AM EDT
[#9]
Over time we learn when to pay attention to the weather guessers and sirens and when to just go out on the front porch and watch the storm go by. The weather guessers tend to make a huge deal out of every storm that comes through and while the sirens might be useful under some conditions in certain areas of the county I honestly think they are all on one switch. They can't just turn on the warning sirens in the affected areas, it's all or nothing.
If you do have to seek shelter and don't have any place better they recommend an area in the middle of your house away from doors or windows. In a bathroom tub is good but they are frequently exposed to the wind. An interior hallway covered with a mattress if you can do so might be good. We have a basement and if it ever gets to that point I have one corner that is below grade on two sides and I'm headed there. But in the 35 years we have lived here I've never seen the need to do so. Normally our storms are just some noise and wind that is over in a few minutes but if you have power turn on the TV and put it on one of the local weather stations (2, 4, or 5 in the Nashville area). If the storms are truly severe they will be running a continuous weather warning. I think they get a kick out of it so if they aren't there it's probably not anything to get worried about. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:04:11 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SACraig: Over time we learn when to pay attention to the weather guessers and sirens and when to just go out on the front porch and watch the storm go by. The weather guessers tend to make a huge deal out of every storm that comes through and while the sirens might be useful under some conditions in certain areas of the county I honestly think they are all on one switch. They can't just turn on the warning sirens in the affected areas, it's all or nothing. If you do have to seek shelter and don't have any place better they recommend an area in the middle of your house away from doors or windows. In a bathroom tub is good but they are frequently exposed to the wind. An interior hallway covered with a mattress if you can do so might be good. We have a basement and if it ever gets to that point I have one corner that is below grade on two sides and I'm headed there. But in the 35 years we have lived here I've never seen the need to do so. Normally our storms are just some noise and wind that is over in a few minutes but if you have power turn on the TV and put it on one of the local weather stations (2, 4, or 5 in the Nashville area). If the storms are truly severe they will be running a continuous weather warning. I think they get a kick out of it so if they aren't there it's probably not anything to get worried about. Thank you!  |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:05:30 AM EDT
[#11]
get in the inner most room.
keep shoes in there. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:05:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Southernman077]
[#12]
A coworker rode out an F4 tornado in her bathtub. It was one of those old heavy bastards. She woke up out in the yard. Another guy from my work tried to leave the house to get away. He and his entire family died. My cousin with the badass safe room videoed that big F4 that tore up Reelfoot Lake from his front porch.
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USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:05:56 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Thanks for grounding in reality. The hail hitting the ground today had me thinking about this and although I should have brought the flag in, I've been impressed with how well this flag pole is holding up in the weather (claimed rated to 100mph). From today, https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/70549/PXL_20240526_190741024-3224509.jpg Lawn/Flagpole look great! |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:07:16 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Lawn/Flagpole look great! Thank you! |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:08:03 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Southernman077: A coworker rode out an F4 tornado in her bathtub. It was one of those old heavy bastards. She woke up out in the yard. Another guy from my work tried to leave the house to get away. He and his entire family died. My cousin with the badass safe room videoed that big F4 that tore up Reelfoot Lake from his front porch. I would say my "inner most" room least exposed from windows and such is the hall bathroom with the big ass tub. That'll be my plan. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:12:23 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: I would say my "inner most" room least exposed from windows and such is the hall bathroom with the big ass tub. That'll be my plan. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Originally Posted By Southernman077: A coworker rode out an F4 tornado in her bathtub. It was one of those old heavy bastards. She woke up out in the yard. Another guy from my work tried to leave the house to get away. He and his entire family died. My cousin with the badass safe room videoed that big F4 that tore up Reelfoot Lake from his front porch. I would say my "inner most" room least exposed from windows and such is the hall bathroom with the big ass tub. That'll be my plan. My wife insists on wearing a helmet and safety glasses while in the basement hiding. I rode out an F2 on the bedroom floor in my underwear. 
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:13:33 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Finslayer83: get in the inner most room. keep shoes in there. Follow this advice. Middle TN is unpredictable On a good day. Keep a small bob/emergency type bag handy with a radio. The 2010 flood tought us a lot. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:18:36 AM EDT
[#18]
Honestly, those round pods that install in your garage are pretty cheap for peace of mind.
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:19:01 AM EDT
[#19]
 Rethink Storm Shelters Garage Shelter  How to Build a Storm Shelter | Ask This Old House |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:20:35 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Southernman077: My wife insists on wearing a helmet and safety glasses while in the basement hiding. I rode out an F2 on the bedroom floor in my underwear.
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:33:11 AM EDT
[#21]
I'm jaded as I surveyed catastrophic damage for years. I'm in middle TN with a crawl space and I'm like "meh, the shitter under the stairs is fine."
There are some walk-in type units you can bolt down to the slab in a garage if you really wanna go nuts. A brick facade on a house actually does wonders. I've been through neighborhoods where some houses were down to the slab and brick houses were still standing (no roofs, though). |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:45:17 AM EDT
[#22]
I've lived in Tennessee all my life and never had a storm shelter nor a basement.
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:52:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: JustinU235]
[#23]
Aaaaaand it's storming again. Thought we were done. I guess the guy earlier was right about more tonight.
Doesn't look bad though.  |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 12:53:44 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Aaaaaand it's storming again. Thought we were done. I guess the guy earlier was right about more tonight. 
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:03:44 AM EDT
[#25]
I have an above ground steel tornado shelter in my garage from these guys. Best investment I have made.
Iam sure someone local to you sells or installs a similar product. https://kentuckystormshelters.com/saferooms-pricing |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:15:30 AM EDT
[#26]
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:17:09 AM EDT
[#27]
Oops, messed up screenshot earlier. Looks like a spicy night.
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:18:56 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 21usernamechecksout: https://stormdefenseshelters.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/under-garage-storm-shelter-elite-series-demo.jpg https://i.ytimg.com/vi/wBG8AWY9KcI/maxresdefault.jpg When I see that, all I can think of is the house crumpling and me being slow baked in a fire. 
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USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:30:13 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Oops, messed up screenshot earlier. Looks like a spicy night. https://i.postimg.cc/9X6CygbS/Screenshot-20240527-001549.png The Local "News" stations love that Crap!! They just love to scream: "RoTatIons"!!! I don't even bother to watch the local news at all-I just "Listen for the Train coming" I haven't heard the Train yet in 16 Years. Just active weather. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:32:23 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 21usernamechecksout: https://stormdefenseshelters.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/under-garage-storm-shelter-elite-series-demo.jpg https://i.ytimg.com/vi/wBG8AWY9KcI/maxresdefault.jpg Why would anybody put a in ground shelter inside a house? A friend makes a good living selling concrete shelters |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 1:40:10 AM EDT
[#31]
If you're considering it, go ahead and do it.
Never thought I'd see a twister but it passed just around my house last year. Only one fatality in the county some how with all the destruction. There was one house that completely disappeared and they luckily had a storm shelter. Their old shelter was in the yard. They built the new one into the house. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 3:13:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Southernman077]
[#32]
We just had a radar indicated one pass over the house. I now have spent $100 for another weather radio for my son who just moved in across the road on property that I sold him because they wouldn't answer the phone. I was on the porch swing. I put shoes on, but no pants. I didn't see a tornado.
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MI, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 4:21:14 AM EDT
[#33]
Locals told me they never get hit by tornadoes - while standing in wake of an F5 .
It only takes one (and my family has owned property there for all but two).  |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 4:46:27 AM EDT
[#34]
Storming like hell here now with the power off and on. Wish we had one in this rental
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Posted: 5/27/2024 6:07:42 AM EDT
[#35]
I might want to make it so if everything collapses I could still get
out. Also for an F5 I would make it level with the ground. I have seen pics of an area one of those went through and it looked as if it was swept clean with a broom. Nothing above ground survived. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 7:05:15 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. Tell us why you carry a gun? You’ll be fine without one. |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:12:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: bigfignewton]
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. I've had a below ground in my garage and now have above ground in my new garage. Below ground can be difficult to get in and out of, especially if you have dogs with you, and getting old doesn't help either. Below ground can also feel more claustrophobic than above ground - at least to me. I live in Oklahoma and end up watching weather for several hours in the evening multiple times per year. Shelters provide some peace of mind because you have some place to go other than a bathtub. When you find out that some tornados are "pavement peelers", hiding in a bathtub or closet doesn't look so smart. I've heard meteorologists tell people that hiding in your house is not an option - if you don't have a shelter, you need to leave because your house is going to be completely gone. Heard that during the 1999 Moore, OK tornado. Like I said though, I'm in Oklahoma and I've seen unbelievable damage only a few miles away. I consider a shelter as money well spent. People who discourage you from keeping yourself safe only because it validates their decisions are not your friends. If you want to carry a gun, install a shelter, keep your car in good condition, etc., why would someone try to talk you out of that? |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:23:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Amped]
[#38]
About 15ish min from you I’m betting. We just go the laundry room if needed aka the lowest, most center room. Bring shoes, helmet, flash lights and a way to charge a phone.
Are you setup for backup power? Aka generator? A storm shelter onsite would be your best bet |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:24:53 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bully13: Why would anybody put a in ground shelter inside a house? A friend makes a good living selling concrete shelters Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bully13: Originally Posted By 21usernamechecksout: https://stormdefenseshelters.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/under-garage-storm-shelter-elite-series-demo.jpg https://i.ytimg.com/vi/wBG8AWY9KcI/maxresdefault.jpg Why would anybody put a in ground shelter inside a house? A friend makes a good living selling concrete shelters If I ever build again, I'm putting in a safe room. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:26:06 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigfignewton: I've had a below ground in my garage and now have above ground in my new garage. Below ground can be difficult to get in and out of, especially if you have dogs with you, and getting old doesn't help either. Below ground can also feel more claustrophobic than above ground - at least to me. I live in Oklahoma and end up watching weather for several hours in the evening multiple times per year. Shelters provide some peace of mind because you have some place to go other than a bathtub. When you find out that some tornados are "pavement peelers", hiding in a bathtub or closet doesn't look so smart. I've heard meteorologists tell people that hiding in your house is not an option - if you don't have a shelter, you need to leave because your house is going to be completely gone. Heard that during the 1999 Moore, OK tornado. Like I said though, I'm in Oklahoma and I've seen unbelievable damage only a few miles away. I consider a shelter as money well spent. People who discourage you from keeping yourself safe only because it validates their decisions are not your friends. If you want to carry a gun, install a shelter, keep your car in good condition, etc., why would someone try to talk you out of that? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bigfignewton: Originally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. I've had a below ground in my garage and now have above ground in my new garage. Below ground can be difficult to get in and out of, especially if you have dogs with you, and getting old doesn't help either. Below ground can also feel more claustrophobic than above ground - at least to me. I live in Oklahoma and end up watching weather for several hours in the evening multiple times per year. Shelters provide some peace of mind because you have some place to go other than a bathtub. When you find out that some tornados are "pavement peelers", hiding in a bathtub or closet doesn't look so smart. I've heard meteorologists tell people that hiding in your house is not an option - if you don't have a shelter, you need to leave because your house is going to be completely gone. Heard that during the 1999 Moore, OK tornado. Like I said though, I'm in Oklahoma and I've seen unbelievable damage only a few miles away. I consider a shelter as money well spent. People who discourage you from keeping yourself safe only because it validates their decisions are not your friends. If you want to carry a gun, install a shelter, keep your car in good condition, etc., why would someone try to talk you out of that? Absolutely. While chances are very slim of needing one, I’m very happy to be able to get into one of these within a few seconds. https://www.usstormshelters.com/Interior-Steel-Safe-Rooms.html |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:26:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Paulie771]
[#41]
I'm a born and bred local that's survived two tornadoes hitting our property through my life. I never thought about getting anything. Just ride it out in the most interior windowless room w/ a helmet (most tornado deaths are from massive head trauma) and some sturdy old boots (for stepping on debris afterwards). My wife, also born and bred here, has horrendous storm anxiety. We were finally able to financially afford an above ground shelter as we are on a slab (houses in our area do not have basements).
I used Valley Storm Shelters out of Huntsville. I’m in SW Rutherford county. Great experience. Highly recommend them. We went with the 5'x8' w/ a gun safe in the rear most 2' (my wife suggested the gun safe addition). They stated Texas A&M, evidently a leading tornado research school, has rated this design for EF5+ direct hit. We had it installed in December and this has been the most chill tornado season for us, ever. When a warning pops, we just migrate to the shelter and chill w/ some water, pull down lights, and some battery powered fans. Make sure to take a day trip down there to check out their show room of available options. They have a bunch. They are made to order so don't expect a fast process. Please excuse the chest freezer's lid. It was a hand-me-down from my mom and we've since cleaned it up.    |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:41:11 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Pics or it didn't happen. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JustinU235: Originally Posted By Southernman077: My wife insists on wearing a helmet and safety glasses while in the basement hiding. I rode out an F2 on the bedroom floor in my underwear. 
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:42:24 AM EDT
[#43]
The ignorance of some people in this thread is incredible.
Yes you should buy a storm shelter, you live in a tornado prone area. Just like you should wear a seatbelt, carry a gun, install smoke detectors, have carbon monoxide detectors, and have a weather alert radio. Better to have it and never need it, than need it and never have it. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:52:43 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By soncorn: Absolutely. While chances are very slim of needing one, I’m very happy to be able to get into one of these within a few seconds. https://www.usstormshelters.com/Interior-Steel-Safe-Rooms.html Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By soncorn: Originally Posted By bigfignewton: Originally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. I've had a below ground in my garage and now have above ground in my new garage. Below ground can be difficult to get in and out of, especially if you have dogs with you, and getting old doesn't help either. Below ground can also feel more claustrophobic than above ground - at least to me. I live in Oklahoma and end up watching weather for several hours in the evening multiple times per year. Shelters provide some peace of mind because you have some place to go other than a bathtub. When you find out that some tornados are "pavement peelers", hiding in a bathtub or closet doesn't look so smart. I've heard meteorologists tell people that hiding in your house is not an option - if you don't have a shelter, you need to leave because your house is going to be completely gone. Heard that during the 1999 Moore, OK tornado. Like I said though, I'm in Oklahoma and I've seen unbelievable damage only a few miles away. I consider a shelter as money well spent. People who discourage you from keeping yourself safe only because it validates their decisions are not your friends. If you want to carry a gun, install a shelter, keep your car in good condition, etc., why would someone try to talk you out of that? Absolutely. While chances are very slim of needing one, I’m very happy to be able to get into one of these within a few seconds. https://www.usstormshelters.com/Interior-Steel-Safe-Rooms.html Man, I wish I had known these existed. I would have put room in our house plan for the Mighty MiteIII. Doubles as a walk in gun safe. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:56:30 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Aspida1776: Home Depot sell them and after the 3 tornadoes hit the NW GA/ SE Tennessee area about 10 years ago, the in ground ones (fiberglass or steel) became very popular. We are doing a site built one in our barndo we are building in N Hamilton County. The neighbor behind me put an in-ground shelter in. It promptly filled with ground water. Then the company that built it went out of business. He had to pull the thing out of the ground. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 8:58:09 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Southernman077: I now have spent $100 for another weather radio Do those work better than phone apps... assuming the cell phone towers are working? |
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USA
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Posted: 5/27/2024 9:00:28 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZW17: The ignorance of some people in this thread is incredible. Yes you should buy a storm shelter, you live in a tornado prone area. Just like you should wear a seatbelt, carry a gun, install smoke detectors, have carbon monoxide detectors, and have a weather alert radio. Better to have it and never need it, than need it and never have it. No shit |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 9:02:03 AM EDT
[#48]
I built my own.
Please understand, I lived here all of my life and didn’t have such a luxury until a year ago. Is it nice? Yes. A necessity? No. If I really wanted one in your situation I’d get a small one bolted to/through the garage floor. Or have a hole excavated in my yard. The thing is, if it’s inside your garage, you’re more likely to go into it when you’re not certain of how bad the storm is. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 9:02:44 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rustypigeon: Do those work better than phone apps... assuming the cell phone towers are working? Yes. Every home should have a weather radio. |
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Posted: 5/27/2024 9:03:58 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Primecube: Originally Posted By JustinU235: I'm new to middle TN and when I moved here late last year, there was a tornado that came through the Gallatin area in early December. The weather has also been very unsettled all spring so far. My house has a crawl space. When I lived in PA, if there was a tornado threat, we would head to the basement. That's obviously not an option here. A lot of houses don't have basements around here and I accepted that and bought one with a crawl space. Now I see a lot of these "garage" storm shelters advertised. Worth it? Recommended company? Don't worry about it, just get into tub? What do yinz'all do in middle Tn or surrounding areas? Just get in the Tub!! Not nearly enough Fatalities to build "Storm Shelter" -- I've been here 16 years and not once have I gotten in my Safe Place. You'll be fine. Said by the guy who carries a pistol. Even though he's been in TN for 16 and never been assaulted. Smoothbrain logic. |
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