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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:14:53 PM EDT
What's the secret?
I have strong legs, I always have and have been able to move decent weight. But my legs are skinny. Like chicken skinny. And let's not even talk about my calves. So what's the secret? Over the past 30 plus years I've done every form of leg workout. Big weight, small weight, big reps, low reps. splits, days on, days off. More recently, I've been inundating myself with workout videos. You know, the ones that start with "If you want big legs, you have to do this.." Or "You've been training legs wrong your whole life." I kind of gave up a few months back and just continued with the 5x5s. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:27:12 PM EDT
[#1]
Genetics.
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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:23:47 PM EDT
[#2]
Genetics is probably the biggest factor.
I've got small legs and probably always will. I've found though making sure I focus on hamstrings a good bit has helped fill mine out a little more. I do quad stuff both leg days but one day is a little more quad dominant and one day more hamstring dominant. I feel stiff leg Deadlifts and Nordic Ham Curls the most as far as hamstring stimulus. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 2:04:37 PM EDT
[#3]
 The PERFECT LEG WORKOUT (The Science LIES!) |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 3:20:00 PM EDT
[#4]
It's pretty well accepted that calves are only going to be big if you've been blessed genetically.
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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:18:04 PM EDT
[#5]
When you say strong, give us some numbers. Are we talking 225 or 495++? What's your body weight and height?
I think most people stick with the posture that they can lift the strongest/best, which is a mistake. I think* that's the just of the video above, but that dude was way too annoying and long-winded. For example, if you can do 405xreps or whatever in your best stance, you should also try a lower weight and close stance with feet straight forward for example. Try some other stances too. Obviously some lifts with machines you don't want to create a rotational force, but for most lifts youre gtg. Width also is helped by deep movements, which is another part where people go wrong. That's why things like Bulgarians S/S are so effective. Yeah, it hurts more and you lift less going deep on a squat, but that's what helps muscle growth, even if it's an ego blow. Lastly for volume, even though it might be counter-intuitive, less weight and more reps (up to a point, like 10-12reps maybe, depending on your body) will build more volume than heavier and a lower weight. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:39:53 PM EDT
[#6]
Not currently, but squatting 450 at a bw of 160.
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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:50:40 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cooper1: Not currently, but squatting 450 at a bw of 160. 450 at 160 puts you into pretty darn strong. Did you ever try different stances or always the same stance? |
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USA
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Posted: 11/15/2023 10:26:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Cooper1]
[#8]
No. Always the same shoulder width. Bar as low on my back as possible. I'm about as flexible as a hockey stick.
That was a max, not working weight. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2023 6:50:47 AM EDT
[#9]
Mainly genetics but calves seem to like a lot higher reps than other body parts. I’m actually seeing growth with 4 x 20-30 reps.
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2023 9:12:31 AM EDT
[#10]
No one wants to hear this but squats aren’t the best exercise for hypertrophy of leg muscles. I’m strong on squats for my body weight as well and always believed in them.
My quads really started to grow when I started doing tons of super high volume leg extensions. Isolation movements work well for size. Lots of reps for lots of sets with high intensity to failure. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/16/2023 10:36:53 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lefty-weaver-g19: No one wants to hear this but squats aren’t the best exercise for hypertrophy of leg muscles. I’m strong on squats for my body weight as well and always believed in them. My quads really started to grow when I started doing tons of super high volume leg extensions. Isolation movements work well for size. Lots of reps for lots of sets with high intensity to failure. That's interesting. I always viewed ext/ curls as more rehab exercises. |
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2023 2:19:44 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cooper1: That's interesting. I always viewed ext/ curls as more rehab exercises. Watch all the top body builders... very few squats and tons of high rep sets of hamstring curls, leg extensions, and other isolations. IMO low rep sets of squats for strength and lots of high rep sets of isolations for growth is the way to go and what I’ve been doing lately. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/16/2023 3:20:48 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cooper1: No. Always the same shoulder width. Bar as low on my back as possible. I'm about as flexible as a hockey stick. That was a max, not working weight. If I were you I'd try adding close stance squats into your routine. I'll normally add them at the end of my normal squat sets (no real reason why at the end I guess), but whatever works for you. You will be doing a lot less weight, but I'll bet they'll grow your quads quite a bit. I know they have mine. They're uncomfortable at first, but you'll get used to it. Here's Arnold (size, not strength) doing what I'm talking about. Like lefty said, more reps for size. Into the 10-12-14-15 range for the squats.  Arnold and Ed Corney- Squats |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/17/2023 1:14:53 PM EDT
[#14]
I’d disagree with this, but EVERYTHING in fitness/health is debatable. IMO, squatting is the best mass builder for quads. I’ve always had decent size legs, not the strongest but good size legs. I struggled with leg size in my early 20’s until I became friends with a power lifter who WORSHIPPED squats. Since that day, I focused on squat technique and form and have maintained big legs. A$$ to GRASS
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/17/2023 2:21:17 PM EDT
[#15]
Squats will grow legs strength and size with higher reps and sets resulting in more size gains than lower rep sets.
Isolation leg movements done with extremely high reps and large numbers of total sets will result in more hypertrophy though. There are pro body builders who never do squats and have the largest quads and hams in the world. Dr Mike will also tell you squats aren’t even necessary for hypertrophy. |
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Posted: 11/18/2023 5:49:21 AM EDT
[#16]
I've got black guy calves, so does my dad, he's 20 years older than me.
I've played sports, hiked, hunted, worked outside my whole life and they are still just average. Training them for weeks at a time only gives me sore calves. My dad's are about 1" bigger than mine....so I figure in another 20 years of just continuing to walk a lot I should see some serious growth. |
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Posted: 11/18/2023 8:17:08 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lefty-weaver-g19: Squats will grow legs strength and size with higher reps and sets resulting in more size gains than lower rep sets. Isolation leg movements done with extremely high reps and large numbers of total sets will result in more hypertrophy though. There are pro body builders who never do squats and have the largest quads and hams in the world. Dr Mike will also tell you squats aren’t even necessary for hypertrophy. This. You need more volume OP. Your squats should be in that 4 X 8-12 reps. Leg extensions into that 10-12 rep range for 4 sets. You can mix in progressive overload and drop sets if you've got the energy. If your 1RM is 450, try the above at 315-335 and add plates as necessary. I love squats and deadlifts, but I'm using them to work my legs/core/back for overall strength. For size, I use isolation exercises. |
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Posted: 11/18/2023 8:17:59 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sitdwnandhngon: I've got black guy calves,. LOL. |
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Posted: 11/18/2023 8:23:00 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rob78: LOL. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rob78: Originally Posted By sitdwnandhngon: I've got black guy calves,. LOL. It's a joke, but not inaccurate. Very high insertions. I was always a decent sprinter and they've never petered out on me during any activity. |
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Posted: 11/18/2023 8:31:18 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sitdwnandhngon: It's a joke, but not inaccurate. Very high insertions. I was always a decent sprinter and they've never petered out on me during any activity. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sitdwnandhngon: Originally Posted By rob78: Originally Posted By sitdwnandhngon: I've got black guy calves,. LOL. It's a joke, but not inaccurate. Very high insertions. I was always a decent sprinter and they've never petered out on me during any activity. I've heard it before, just not seen it posted. Still funny cuz it's true. An old buddy of mine was a drummer. Massive calves. We biked a lot, mostly XC and some single track. My legs were smaller, but I'd crush him on uphill. |
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2023 9:10:15 AM EDT
[#21]
I like to keep squats in the 5-8 rep range for working sets with occasional heavy doubles. Leg extensions and hamstring curls I like to push in the 20 plus rep range for tons of sets. Even to the point of stopping for a second without getting up then forcing out a few more partial range reps to complete failure.
I also like giant sets occasionally for legs. Warm up with squats then get started... Squats 5-8 reps, then immediately jump to leg extensions 20 reps, then go straight to calves to failure, then over to hamstring curls 20 reps. Take a good 3 minute break then repeat the cycle. Major pump and inability to walk after a few rounds of that if you choose the weights correctly and have everything setup to go from one exercise straight to the next. I have my own weight room so this is easy to setup with no one else to be in the way. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/18/2023 9:41:36 AM EDT
[#22]
Thank you for the responses. I'm going to try some of the things mentioned.
I also really hate training legs, which is partly why I find 5x5 doable. This feeling of "Here comes 20 minutes of giant suck" always gets me. Lol. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2023 11:30:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: SWFLdude]
[#23]
Who are these pros that don’t squat? Yates?? But the truth is he did squat,now he’s pushing the new agenda it’s not necesssry….and let’s not leave out the fact the guy was on enough juice to make an ant look like a rat. And just like every other pro bodybuilder. So it’s not even an apples to apples comparison to argue squats aren’t the best when you’re talking average fitness person versus a bodybuilder.
I’ve competed and trained; and squats are a staple in my workouts. |
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2023 11:43:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: lefty-weaver-g19]
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SWFLdude: Who are these pros that don’t squat? Yates?? But the truth is he did squat,now he’s pushing the new agenda it’s not necesssry….and let’s not leave out the fact the guy was on enough juice to make an ant look like a rat. And just like every other pro bodybuilder. So it’s not even an apples to apples comparison to argue squats aren’t the best when you’re talking average fitness person versus a bodybuilder. I’ve competed and trained; and squats are a staple in my workouts. Very few pro body builders do a lot of squatting but they all do a ton of leg extensions, hamstring curls, and other isolations though. Dr mike will even tell you compounds aren’t necessary for hypertrophy. Not that he’s against compounds they are great but they aren’t necessary if hypertrophy is your goal. Take away the drugs and pro body builders at the Olympia level would still beat us in hypertrophy gains because their methods and diet discipline work. It’s not like you can do everything wrong and still look like them just because of drugs. I don’t think I’ve ever seen Nick Walker do squats although I’m sure he did at some point in his life. I’m not against squats I do them at least 2-3 times a week, but I didn’t gain much size until I started adding high volume isolation movements on top of squats. ETA: squats are the best at working the most muscles in a short period of time with a single movement. Compounds in general are best for that and building strength, but when it comes to hypertrophy high volume isolations work very well. I lift as well but I dont think you want pictures of me in my underwear I get enough shit for posting shirtless pictures lol. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2023 3:33:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Touché. Btw, didn’t mean to come off like I’m coming at you. I just get a little passionate about working out. Outside of guns it’s my only other hobby. 🥸
I almost take offense to people who degrade squats.😂 I know that’s not what you were doing but, IMO, there is no equal substitute for squats. I have hurt my back deadlifting in the past(that’s a whole other topic) and couldn’t squat for quite a while. I was scared to squat for almost a year, so I spent that whole time killing my legs with all kind of accessory work and lost about an inch of size on legs. Finally, I saw enough and started squatting again, don’t remember the time frame but it seemed like no time, the size came back. And again, I went through it in my early 20s and finally was taught HOW to squat. The results came. I can do 7-8 sets of squats and call it a day for legs and not be able to walk straight for 2 days, versus go in and do 5-6 different accessory exercises and feel like I could run a marathon the next morning. |
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IA, USA
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Posted: 11/20/2023 6:02:49 AM EDT
[#26]
Many different ways to do things. I'm 49 and still do squats 2-3 times a week. I believe they are important, but I started seeing size gains when I added in high volume isolation work after squats.
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/22/2023 12:12:26 AM EDT
[#27]
 Rio Olympics 2016 | 3 lifters @ 217kg Clean and Jerk | 85kg bw Which set of legs you want OP? White boy on the right, right? He don't give a fuck about aesthetics. You know what he did? An absolute FUCK TON of volume in movements that involved legs, at UNGODLY intensities, with the help of a SHIT LOAD of drugs. When nearly every movement you perform engages your legs, and your "assistance work" is squatting variations, (and you do lots of exotic drugs), you gonna get legs. |
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Posted: 11/22/2023 12:27:14 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SSeric02: Genetics. five minutes of research would reveal that FPNI |
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USA
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Posted: 11/28/2023 10:00:58 AM EDT
[#29]
You may just have to experiment, but:
A low-bar back squat with knees spread is going to be more hamstring/glute dominant. A high-bar back squat with knees closer, or a front-squat is going to engage more of the quads. Squats are good and a critical strength component, but different variations will focus more on the “aesthetic” muscles. If you want “big” legs for aesthetics, you’re going to want to engage the quads. Front squats, quad extensions, split squats, etc. If you want “strong” legs for maximum power, youre going to want to focus on your glutes and hamstrings. Low bar back squats, good mornings, and deadlifts. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/28/2023 11:37:26 AM EDT
[#30]
Thanks for all the advice. I think I'll stick with the strength training and not worry about size. I'm in my 50s so it's not like I'm going to be cruising the beach looking good. LOL.
The genetics thing makes sense. I have friends with bodybuilder legs that never workout. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 11/29/2023 8:23:39 PM EDT
[#31]
If you want better calves switch to zero drop, flexible shoes for your daily walking around, running, and unweighted hiking.
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Posted: 12/7/2023 2:00:14 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lefty-weaver-g19: Squats will grow legs strength and size with higher reps and sets resulting in more size gains than lower rep sets. Isolation leg movements done with extremely high reps and large numbers of total sets will result in more hypertrophy though. There are pro body builders who never do squats and have the largest quads and hams in the world. Dr Mike will also tell you squats aren’t even necessary for hypertrophy. They also inject a pharmacy every day |
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Posted: 12/7/2023 2:01:50 PM EDT
[#33]
Need a video of you squatting op. Not calling you out just want to see to see what advice would be prudent.
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