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Link Posted: 3/12/2024 8:28:18 AM EDT
[#1]
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Originally Posted By Mach:


@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
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Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


Have your Pituitary hormones been checked?

You can get different endocrine glands hormone levels low or high from a pituitary tumor because the pituitary produces the hormones that control the rest of the endocrine glands, ie Thyroid, Adrenal, ovaries, etc.

So if your TSH Thyroid Stimulating Hormone from the pituitary is low, your get low Thyroid hormone output. If your FSH,  Folicle Stimulating Hormone from the Pituitary is low, you get low Sex Hormones.

The only way to know about a pituitary tumor, 99.9% of the time a benign adenoma, is with a brain MR but low or high Pituitary produced hormones would point to that.

You simply can not get the body to produce normal levels of these pituitary hormones with drugs, you have to take the hormones or remove the tumor from the pituitary and hope it restores normal function.

The pituitary being compressed by the tumor can cause low hormone output and the tumor itself can produce unregulated / excess hormone output.
@Mach I had my labs rechecked last week and I asked her to check for pituitary and pineal gland function but she didn't. My blood count is normal now which is good news (my platelets were below 8000 after Covid) but my ferritin levels are still way to high and my thyroid hormones are extremely low. My CRP levels are extremely high. My iron is fine but my saturation is extremely low. I see my doctor next week. It's so weird that she won't check my pituitary function. When I was last checked in November my thyroid was very low so she raised it more than I have ever had it raised (75mcg T4 & 35 mcg T3 raised to 150 T4 & 50 T3) and now my T4 and T3 are lower than they were in November. My ferritin levels are higher than they were in November too (215 in November to 250 now.)

what's the old saying what doesn't kill you mutates and tries again?



@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.
Link Posted: 3/15/2024 6:37:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Mach] [#2]
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Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


Have your Pituitary hormones been checked?

You can get different endocrine glands hormone levels low or high from a pituitary tumor because the pituitary produces the hormones that control the rest of the endocrine glands, ie Thyroid, Adrenal, ovaries, etc.

So if your TSH Thyroid Stimulating Hormone from the pituitary is low, your get low Thyroid hormone output. If your FSH,  Folicle Stimulating Hormone from the Pituitary is low, you get low Sex Hormones.

The only way to know about a pituitary tumor, 99.9% of the time a benign adenoma, is with a brain MR but low or high Pituitary produced hormones would point to that.

You simply can not get the body to produce normal levels of these pituitary hormones with drugs, you have to take the hormones or remove the tumor from the pituitary and hope it restores normal function.

The pituitary being compressed by the tumor can cause low hormone output and the tumor itself can produce unregulated / excess hormone output.
@Mach I had my labs rechecked last week and I asked her to check for pituitary and pineal gland function but she didn't. My blood count is normal now which is good news (my platelets were below 8000 after Covid) but my ferritin levels are still way to high and my thyroid hormones are extremely low. My CRP levels are extremely high. My iron is fine but my saturation is extremely low. I see my doctor next week. It's so weird that she won't check my pituitary function. When I was last checked in November my thyroid was very low so she raised it more than I have ever had it raised (75mcg T4 & 35 mcg T3 raised to 150 T4 & 50 T3) and now my T4 and T3 are lower than they were in November. My ferritin levels are higher than they were in November too (215 in November to 250 now.)

what's the old saying what doesn't kill you mutates and tries again?



@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.


your doc is an endo and will not test your TSH when your thyroid function is abnormally low  and he gives you thyroid hormones and your levels go down further .

Has your doc said why he thinks checking your pituitary hormones are not a good idea?

Link Posted: 3/15/2024 11:55:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: darkd0r] [#3]
This is just an overview. Dr. McMillan believes it's real, but a cluster of causes that vary from person to person

Is Long Covid a Real Disease?


Edit: Ironic that the Ides of March was selected.
Link Posted: 3/16/2024 1:54:38 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:


your doc is an endo and will not test your TSH when your thyroid function is abnormally low  and he gives you thyroid hormones and your levels go down further .

Has your doc said why he thinks checking your pituitary hormones are not a good idea?

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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


Have your Pituitary hormones been checked?

You can get different endocrine glands hormone levels low or high from a pituitary tumor because the pituitary produces the hormones that control the rest of the endocrine glands, ie Thyroid, Adrenal, ovaries, etc.

So if your TSH Thyroid Stimulating Hormone from the pituitary is low, your get low Thyroid hormone output. If your FSH,  Folicle Stimulating Hormone from the Pituitary is low, you get low Sex Hormones.

The only way to know about a pituitary tumor, 99.9% of the time a benign adenoma, is with a brain MR but low or high Pituitary produced hormones would point to that.

You simply can not get the body to produce normal levels of these pituitary hormones with drugs, you have to take the hormones or remove the tumor from the pituitary and hope it restores normal function.

The pituitary being compressed by the tumor can cause low hormone output and the tumor itself can produce unregulated / excess hormone output.
@Mach I had my labs rechecked last week and I asked her to check for pituitary and pineal gland function but she didn't. My blood count is normal now which is good news (my platelets were below 8000 after Covid) but my ferritin levels are still way to high and my thyroid hormones are extremely low. My CRP levels are extremely high. My iron is fine but my saturation is extremely low. I see my doctor next week. It's so weird that she won't check my pituitary function. When I was last checked in November my thyroid was very low so she raised it more than I have ever had it raised (75mcg T4 & 35 mcg T3 raised to 150 T4 & 50 T3) and now my T4 and T3 are lower than they were in November. My ferritin levels are higher than they were in November too (215 in November to 250 now.)

what's the old saying what doesn't kill you mutates and tries again?



@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.


your doc is an endo and will not test your TSH when your thyroid function is abnormally low  and he gives you thyroid hormones and your levels go down further .

Has your doc said why he thinks checking your pituitary hormones are not a good idea?


my appointment is Tuesday and I have a lot of questions. It's weird that she didn't check my TSH. It's usually suppressed but I don't recall it not being checked before. I suspect she believes that my problem is long covid-but it's getting alarming how low my thyroid levels are. And how high my ferritin levels are. I'm curious to her explanation.
Link Posted: 3/17/2024 3:31:27 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:

my appointment is Tuesday and I have a lot of questions. It's weird that she didn't check my TSH. It's usually suppressed but I don't recall it not being checked before. I suspect she believes that my problem is long covid-but it's getting alarming how low my thyroid levels are. And how high my ferritin levels are. I'm curious to her explanation.
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Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


Have your Pituitary hormones been checked?

You can get different endocrine glands hormone levels low or high from a pituitary tumor because the pituitary produces the hormones that control the rest of the endocrine glands, ie Thyroid, Adrenal, ovaries, etc.

So if your TSH Thyroid Stimulating Hormone from the pituitary is low, your get low Thyroid hormone output. If your FSH,  Folicle Stimulating Hormone from the Pituitary is low, you get low Sex Hormones.

The only way to know about a pituitary tumor, 99.9% of the time a benign adenoma, is with a brain MR but low or high Pituitary produced hormones would point to that.

You simply can not get the body to produce normal levels of these pituitary hormones with drugs, you have to take the hormones or remove the tumor from the pituitary and hope it restores normal function.

The pituitary being compressed by the tumor can cause low hormone output and the tumor itself can produce unregulated / excess hormone output.
@Mach I had my labs rechecked last week and I asked her to check for pituitary and pineal gland function but she didn't. My blood count is normal now which is good news (my platelets were below 8000 after Covid) but my ferritin levels are still way to high and my thyroid hormones are extremely low. My CRP levels are extremely high. My iron is fine but my saturation is extremely low. I see my doctor next week. It's so weird that she won't check my pituitary function. When I was last checked in November my thyroid was very low so she raised it more than I have ever had it raised (75mcg T4 & 35 mcg T3 raised to 150 T4 & 50 T3) and now my T4 and T3 are lower than they were in November. My ferritin levels are higher than they were in November too (215 in November to 250 now.)

what's the old saying what doesn't kill you mutates and tries again?



@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.


your doc is an endo and will not test your TSH when your thyroid function is abnormally low  and he gives you thyroid hormones and your levels go down further .

Has your doc said why he thinks checking your pituitary hormones are not a good idea?


my appointment is Tuesday and I have a lot of questions. It's weird that she didn't check my TSH. It's usually suppressed but I don't recall it not being checked before. I suspect she believes that my problem is long covid-but it's getting alarming how low my thyroid levels are. And how high my ferritin levels are. I'm curious to her explanation.


If your TSH ( Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, which come from your pituitary gland ) is suppressed with low thyroid hormones I would think something is wrong. my understanding, after having and still having a pituitary tumor, that is a good indication to check for a pituitary tumor ( which are 99.99% benign ). if you were to have low thyroid hormones but high TSH it would mean the pituitary gland is trying to stimulate the thyroid but the thyroid is not responding.

If the thyroid hormones are low and the TSH ( from the pituitary is low ) it means the pituitary is not producing TSH to stimulate the thyroid like it should. next step is a full pituitary hormone screening and a brain MRI looking for a pituitary tumor.

there may be other things, I am not a doc just a guy that has a pituitary tumor and had surgery for it  and that is shat I remember being explained to me. Mine was snd is non-functioning meaning the tumor neither produces excess hormones nor suppresses hormones from the pituitary, usually by compressing it. my tumor was compressing the shit out of the pituitary but my pituitary shrugged it off. But they only got 1/2 of it in the surgery.
Link Posted: 3/17/2024 7:49:00 PM EDT
[#6]
Great news, everyone!

There's no such thing as Long Covid. These doctors say so:

https://nypost.com/2024/03/14/lifestyle/no-such-thing-as-long-covid-health-agency-says-in-shock-claim-unnecessary-fear/

Link Posted: 3/19/2024 11:03:50 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By arowneragain:
Great news, everyone!

There's no such thing as Long Covid. These doctors say so:

https://nypost.com/2024/03/14/lifestyle/no-such-thing-as-long-covid-health-agency-says-in-shock-claim-unnecessary-fear/

View Quote


well that article isnt completely wrong.

My neurologist calls what i have "Post Viral Syndrome" and says it caused Small Fiber Neuropathy both of which can be caused by any infection viral or bacterial and is kniwn to be caused by Covid, HSV, Flu, lyme, and even sometimes by a common cold, plus just about any infection. The immune system does most of the damage.

He also says he has patients with it that have not knowingly had any recent infection and it started several months after the covid shots and states other vaccines are known to cause it too but rarely.
Link Posted: 3/19/2024 10:13:10 PM EDT
[#8]
@Mach so my appointment today was disheartening. My heart and liver are not well. My endo is convinced that it's long covid and she is asking me to go on a heavy dose of magnesium (1000 mg), zinc and copper for 3 months. My thyroid isn't functioning at all and I'm at full strength. She says if it doesn't improve my next step is a hypatologist and cardiologist. She says that there are medications that can reduce the protein in my heart but that the side effects are not great. I am at a loss.  My TSH has been suppressed since I started T3 (in 2017) so she doesn't believe I can have a tumor. It's bad when you kind of prefer a tumor over a f-ing virus.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 9:01:50 AM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
@Mach so my appointment today was disheartening. My heart and liver are not well. My endo is convinced that it's long covid and she is asking me to go on a heavy dose of magnesium (1000 mg), zinc and copper for 3 months. My thyroid isn't functioning at all and I'm at full strength. She says if it doesn't improve my next step is a hypatologist and cardiologist. She says that there are medications that can reduce the protein in my heart but that the side effects are not great. I am at a loss.  My TSH has been suppressed since I started T3 (in 2017) so she doesn't believe I can have a tumor. It's bad when you kind of prefer a tumor over a f-ing virus.
View Quote


I hope somebody figures this out for you. Supplemental T3 does suppress TSH.

hormones are complicated. it is my understanding this is a good overview of thyroid hormone function, but skips the whole hormone transporter discussion. Notice that it says certain minerals and iodine are required to make thyroid hormones. Most people dont eat enough iodine unless they eat a lot of seafood including seaweed. Iodine is in iodized salt but with docs declaring salt is bad there has been an uptick in thyroid problems because of people cutting back on salt and therefore cutting back on iodine.

https://www.nursingcenter.com/ncblog/march-2018/t3-and-t4-–-what’s-the-difference

I dont understand not taking an MRI of the pituitary and thyroid  since your doc sounds stumped on what is going on.

Tumors of the pituitary can result in excess hormone because the tumor secrets unregulated hormone and that hormone will not be surpressed when it should be, but also a compressed pituitary gland from a large tumor can inhibit a % of a hormone due to compression of the gland tissue and the proper feedbacks can still cause suppression but the gland may not cause significant increases in affected hormones when it needs to because some of the hormone producing tissue has trauma.

I know what it is to have a condition where the docs are stumped. It sucks. I have found some symptom relief on my own through research and a very limited diet of raw veggie salads, and cold water seafood fish and shellfish along with seaweed and no sugar, little carbs but not keto, and some supplements and by chance viagra which increases blood flow  which the doc thinks is the mechanism.

but it only lasts as long as I dont cheat on the diet.

Dont give up. Research on your own, get a second opinion from  the best big city major teaching hospital endo that you can. When things get complicated and the standard stuff doesnt work you might consider getting looked at by someone at the top of their field .

I dont think it can hurt eating unprocessed sea weeds in salads, it is a staple in some countries. It would make sure you are getting enough iodine. I would also consider researching the minerals needed by the thyroid and take those. Seems like your endo wants you to try that but i would look at all of the minerals the thyroid needs and find what foods they are in, take those supplements she wants you to and eat the unprocessed foods the thyroid needs like sea weeds.


I hope you get this figured out soon. I know how worrying and frustrating it is.


Link Posted: 3/20/2024 10:08:47 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:


I hope somebody figures this out for you. Supplemental T3 does suppress TSH.

hormones are complicated. it is my understanding this is a good overview of thyroid hormone function, but skips the whole hormone transporter discussion. Notice that it says certain minerals and iodine are required to make thyroid hormones. Most people dont eat enough iodine unless they eat a lot of seafood including seaweed. Iodine is in iodized salt but with docs declaring salt is bad there has been an uptick in thyroid problems because of people cutting back on salt and therefore cutting back on iodine.

https://www.nursingcenter.com/ncblog/march-2018/t3-and-t4- -what's-the-difference

I dont understand not taking an MRI of the pituitary and thyroid  since your doc sounds stumped on what is going on.

Tumors of the pituitary can result in excess hormone because the tumor secrets unregulated hormone and that hormone will not be surpressed when it should be, but also a compressed pituitary gland from a large tumor can inhibit a % of a hormone due to compression of the gland tissue and the proper feedbacks can still cause suppression but the gland may not cause significant increases in affected hormones when it needs to because some of the hormone producing tissue has trauma.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:


I hope somebody figures this out for you. Supplemental T3 does suppress TSH.

hormones are complicated. it is my understanding this is a good overview of thyroid hormone function, but skips the whole hormone transporter discussion. Notice that it says certain minerals and iodine are required to make thyroid hormones. Most people dont eat enough iodine unless they eat a lot of seafood including seaweed. Iodine is in iodized salt but with docs declaring salt is bad there has been an uptick in thyroid problems because of people cutting back on salt and therefore cutting back on iodine.

https://www.nursingcenter.com/ncblog/march-2018/t3-and-t4- -what's-the-difference

I dont understand not taking an MRI of the pituitary and thyroid  since your doc sounds stumped on what is going on.

Tumors of the pituitary can result in excess hormone because the tumor secrets unregulated hormone and that hormone will not be surpressed when it should be, but also a compressed pituitary gland from a large tumor can inhibit a % of a hormone due to compression of the gland tissue and the proper feedbacks can still cause suppression but the gland may not cause significant increases in affected hormones when it needs to because some of the hormone producing tissue has trauma.

I know what it is to have a condition where the docs are stumped. It sucks. I have found some symptom relief on my own through research and a very limited diet of raw veggie salads, and cold water seafood fish and shellfish along with seaweed and no sugar, little carbs but not keto, and some supplements and by chance viagra which increases blood flow  which the doc thinks is the mechanism.

but it only lasts as long as I dont cheat on the diet.

Dont give up. Research on your own, get a second opinion from  the best big city major teaching hospital endo that you can. When things get complicated and the standard stuff doesnt work you might consider getting looked at by someone at the top of their field .

I dont think it can hurt eating unprocessed sea weeds in salads, it is a staple in some countries. It would make sure you are getting enough iodine. I would also consider researching the minerals needed by the thyroid and take those. Seems like your endo wants you to try that but i would look at all of the minerals the thyroid needs and find what foods they are in, take those supplements she wants you to and eat the unprocessed foods the thyroid needs like sea weeds.


I hope you get this figured out soon. I know how worrying and frustrating it is.


Thanks Mach, I will look into all of this. I do test for having good iodine levels but I don't think it would hurt to add some seaweed to my diet. Lol I'm a desert dweller-not sure where to find seaweed! When I was first treated for Hashimoto's I did take selenium and tested at appropriate levels about a year later. I can add that back. I know I need to figure out a way to detox my liver. I tried fasting for 10 days but it caused my protein levels to go up-which was so surprising. I'm slowly (though it seems quickly) since yesterday I have taken 400 mg of magnesium citrate and am due to take another 150 mgs. I'm expecting a date with the toilet quickly.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 12:39:58 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
@Mach so my appointment today was disheartening. My heart and liver are not well. My endo is convinced that it's long covid and she is asking me to go on a heavy dose of magnesium (1000 mg), zinc and copper for 3 months. My thyroid isn't functioning at all and I'm at full strength. She says if it doesn't improve my next step is a hypatologist and cardiologist. She says that there are medications that can reduce the protein in my heart but that the side effects are not great. I am at a loss.  My TSH has been suppressed since I started T3 (in 2017) so she doesn't believe I can have a tumor. It's bad when you kind of prefer a tumor over a f-ing virus.
View Quote
Here are a few supplements that are suppose to help liver.
They also have stuff to help hearts.

https://www.swansonvitamins.com/q?kw=liver%20health


Prayers out to all that suffer.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 5:35:25 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thanks Mach, I will look into all of this. I do test for having good iodine levels but I don't think it would hurt to add some seaweed to my diet. Lol I'm a desert dweller-not sure where to find seaweed! When I was first treated for Hashimoto's I did take selenium and tested at appropriate levels about a year later. I can add that back. I know I need to figure out a way to detox my liver. I tried fasting for 10 days but it caused my protein levels to go up-which was so surprising. I'm slowly (though it seems quickly) since yesterday I have taken 400 mg of magnesium citrate and am due to take another 150 mgs. I'm expecting a date with the toilet quickly.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


I hope somebody figures this out for you. Supplemental T3 does suppress TSH.

hormones are complicated. it is my understanding this is a good overview of thyroid hormone function, but skips the whole hormone transporter discussion. Notice that it says certain minerals and iodine are required to make thyroid hormones. Most people dont eat enough iodine unless they eat a lot of seafood including seaweed. Iodine is in iodized salt but with docs declaring salt is bad there has been an uptick in thyroid problems because of people cutting back on salt and therefore cutting back on iodine.

https://www.nursingcenter.com/ncblog/march-2018/t3-and-t4- -what's-the-difference

I dont understand not taking an MRI of the pituitary and thyroid  since your doc sounds stumped on what is going on.

Tumors of the pituitary can result in excess hormone because the tumor secrets unregulated hormone and that hormone will not be surpressed when it should be, but also a compressed pituitary gland from a large tumor can inhibit a % of a hormone due to compression of the gland tissue and the proper feedbacks can still cause suppression but the gland may not cause significant increases in affected hormones when it needs to because some of the hormone producing tissue has trauma.

I know what it is to have a condition where the docs are stumped. It sucks. I have found some symptom relief on my own through research and a very limited diet of raw veggie salads, and cold water seafood fish and shellfish along with seaweed and no sugar, little carbs but not keto, and some supplements and by chance viagra which increases blood flow  which the doc thinks is the mechanism.

but it only lasts as long as I dont cheat on the diet.

Dont give up. Research on your own, get a second opinion from  the best big city major teaching hospital endo that you can. When things get complicated and the standard stuff doesnt work you might consider getting looked at by someone at the top of their field .

I dont think it can hurt eating unprocessed sea weeds in salads, it is a staple in some countries. It would make sure you are getting enough iodine. I would also consider researching the minerals needed by the thyroid and take those. Seems like your endo wants you to try that but i would look at all of the minerals the thyroid needs and find what foods they are in, take those supplements she wants you to and eat the unprocessed foods the thyroid needs like sea weeds.


I hope you get this figured out soon. I know how worrying and frustrating it is.


Thanks Mach, I will look into all of this. I do test for having good iodine levels but I don't think it would hurt to add some seaweed to my diet. Lol I'm a desert dweller-not sure where to find seaweed! When I was first treated for Hashimoto's I did take selenium and tested at appropriate levels about a year later. I can add that back. I know I need to figure out a way to detox my liver. I tried fasting for 10 days but it caused my protein levels to go up-which was so surprising. I'm slowly (though it seems quickly) since yesterday I have taken 400 mg of magnesium citrate and am due to take another 150 mgs. I'm expecting a date with the toilet quickly.


there are magnesium compounds that are both more bio-available and cont cause gastro issues. Magnesium citrate is probably the worst. It is sold specifically as a laxative  

better ones are

magnesium L- Theonate
Magnesium Glycinate


magnesium compounds work as a laxative when they stay in the digestive system instead of being digested to get the magnesium

I make magnesium water with carbonated water ( unflavored seltzer ) and magnesium hydroxide ( it has to have nothing else in it,) the carbonization and magnesium  hydroxide produce a chemical reaction to produce uncarbonated  water  and magnesium bi-carbonate, which is very bio-available.  


https://drdavisinfinitehealth.com/2018/08/magnesium-water-updated-recipe/


If you do this, dont use milk of magnesia, it has ingredients that interfere with the chemical reaction. a type of bleach. I get my magnesium hydroxide from amazon, Bulk Suppliments. $20 for a lifetime supply in powder form.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 5:45:25 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:


there are magnesium compounds that are both more bio-available and cont cause gastro issues. Magnesium citrate is probably the worst. It is sold specifically as a laxative  

better ones are

magnesium L- Theonate
Magnesium Glycinate


magnesium compounds work as a laxative when they stay in the digestive system instead of being digested to get the magnesium

I make magnesium water with carbonated water ( unflavored seltzer ) and magnesium hydroxide ( it has to have nothing else in it,) the carbonization and magnesium  hydroxide produce a chemical reaction to produce uncarbonated  water  and magnesium bi-carbonate, which is very bio-available.  


https://drdavisinfinitehealth.com/2018/08/magnesium-water-updated-recipe/


If you do this, dont use milk of magnesia, it has ingredients that interfere with the chemical reaction. a type of bleach. I get my magnesium hydroxide from amazon, Bulk Suppliments. $20 for a lifetime supply in powder form.
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Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


I hope somebody figures this out for you. Supplemental T3 does suppress TSH.

hormones are complicated. it is my understanding this is a good overview of thyroid hormone function, but skips the whole hormone transporter discussion. Notice that it says certain minerals and iodine are required to make thyroid hormones. Most people dont eat enough iodine unless they eat a lot of seafood including seaweed. Iodine is in iodized salt but with docs declaring salt is bad there has been an uptick in thyroid problems because of people cutting back on salt and therefore cutting back on iodine.

https://www.nursingcenter.com/ncblog/march-2018/t3-and-t4- -what's-the-difference

I dont understand not taking an MRI of the pituitary and thyroid  since your doc sounds stumped on what is going on.

Tumors of the pituitary can result in excess hormone because the tumor secrets unregulated hormone and that hormone will not be surpressed when it should be, but also a compressed pituitary gland from a large tumor can inhibit a % of a hormone due to compression of the gland tissue and the proper feedbacks can still cause suppression but the gland may not cause significant increases in affected hormones when it needs to because some of the hormone producing tissue has trauma.

I know what it is to have a condition where the docs are stumped. It sucks. I have found some symptom relief on my own through research and a very limited diet of raw veggie salads, and cold water seafood fish and shellfish along with seaweed and no sugar, little carbs but not keto, and some supplements and by chance viagra which increases blood flow  which the doc thinks is the mechanism.

but it only lasts as long as I dont cheat on the diet.

Dont give up. Research on your own, get a second opinion from  the best big city major teaching hospital endo that you can. When things get complicated and the standard stuff doesnt work you might consider getting looked at by someone at the top of their field .

I dont think it can hurt eating unprocessed sea weeds in salads, it is a staple in some countries. It would make sure you are getting enough iodine. I would also consider researching the minerals needed by the thyroid and take those. Seems like your endo wants you to try that but i would look at all of the minerals the thyroid needs and find what foods they are in, take those supplements she wants you to and eat the unprocessed foods the thyroid needs like sea weeds.


I hope you get this figured out soon. I know how worrying and frustrating it is.


Thanks Mach, I will look into all of this. I do test for having good iodine levels but I don't think it would hurt to add some seaweed to my diet. Lol I'm a desert dweller-not sure where to find seaweed! When I was first treated for Hashimoto's I did take selenium and tested at appropriate levels about a year later. I can add that back. I know I need to figure out a way to detox my liver. I tried fasting for 10 days but it caused my protein levels to go up-which was so surprising. I'm slowly (though it seems quickly) since yesterday I have taken 400 mg of magnesium citrate and am due to take another 150 mgs. I'm expecting a date with the toilet quickly.


there are magnesium compounds that are both more bio-available and cont cause gastro issues. Magnesium citrate is probably the worst. It is sold specifically as a laxative  

better ones are

magnesium L- Theonate
Magnesium Glycinate


magnesium compounds work as a laxative when they stay in the digestive system instead of being digested to get the magnesium

I make magnesium water with carbonated water ( unflavored seltzer ) and magnesium hydroxide ( it has to have nothing else in it,) the carbonization and magnesium  hydroxide produce a chemical reaction to produce uncarbonated  water  and magnesium bi-carbonate, which is very bio-available.  


https://drdavisinfinitehealth.com/2018/08/magnesium-water-updated-recipe/


If you do this, dont use milk of magnesia, it has ingredients that interfere with the chemical reaction. a type of bleach. I get my magnesium hydroxide from amazon, Bulk Suppliments. $20 for a lifetime supply in powder form.
Thank you, I actually was taking Magnesium L-Theonate prior to yesterday believing that it would help with the conversion of T4 to T3. She switched me to Magnesium Citrate for the laxative effect. I have been on Linezz which she prescribed as an off label antiviral and bowel stimulant. It was ripping up my stomach so I have stopped it (it also didn't do anything to my long Covid markets). Her theory is to super dose more gut and hopefully it will kick the liver into detox. It seems Wild fetched. Our liver should be regenerating and detoxing naturally. I thought fasting would be beneficial but it made my Covid markers worse. Long story short I don't think any of the thyroid hormones I'm consuming is really entering the liver. Well that's not true, I would be dead if none was. I would have a heart attack otherwise. I will check out the other forms of magnesium though. Thanks again.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 6:40:26 PM EDT
[#14]
You can easily become acclimatized to moderate (500mg to 2000mg) doses of magnesium citrate without a significant laxative effect by working up to it, and spreading it out over the day.
Link Posted: 3/20/2024 9:19:14 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thank you, I actually was taking Magnesium L-Theonate prior to yesterday believing that it would help with the conversion of T4 to T3. She switched me to Magnesium Citrate for the laxative effect. I have been on Linezz which she prescribed as an off label antiviral and bowel stimulant. It was ripping up my stomach so I have stopped it (it also didn't do anything to my long Covid markets). Her theory is to super dose more gut and hopefully it will kick the liver into detox. It seems Wild fetched. Our liver should be regenerating and detoxing naturally. I thought fasting would be beneficial but it made my Covid markers worse. Long story short I don't think any of the thyroid hormones I'm consuming is really entering the liver. Well that's not true, I would be dead if none was. I would have a heart attack otherwise. I will check out the other forms of magnesium though. Thanks again.
View Quote

There's always Phillips' Milk of Magnesia.  Label says magnesium hydroxide.
Link Posted: 3/21/2024 7:18:45 AM EDT
[#16]
what are the Long Covid markers?

I have not heard of these before.
Link Posted: 3/21/2024 9:36:43 AM EDT
[#17]
Link Posted: 3/21/2024 12:22:39 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


thanks but I dont do X
Link Posted: 4/8/2024 1:22:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: LibertyShip] [#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:

my appointment is Tuesday and I have a lot of questions. It's weird that she didn't check my TSH. It's usually suppressed but I don't recall it not being checked before. I suspect she believes that my problem is long covid-but it's getting alarming how low my thyroid levels are. And how high my ferritin levels are. I'm curious to her explanation.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By Mach:


Have your Pituitary hormones been checked?

You can get different endocrine glands hormone levels low or high from a pituitary tumor because the pituitary produces the hormones that control the rest of the endocrine glands, ie Thyroid, Adrenal, ovaries, etc.

So if your TSH Thyroid Stimulating Hormone from the pituitary is low, your get low Thyroid hormone output. If your FSH,  Folicle Stimulating Hormone from the Pituitary is low, you get low Sex Hormones.

The only way to know about a pituitary tumor, 99.9% of the time a benign adenoma, is with a brain MR but low or high Pituitary produced hormones would point to that.

You simply can not get the body to produce normal levels of these pituitary hormones with drugs, you have to take the hormones or remove the tumor from the pituitary and hope it restores normal function.

The pituitary being compressed by the tumor can cause low hormone output and the tumor itself can produce unregulated / excess hormone output.
@Mach I had my labs rechecked last week and I asked her to check for pituitary and pineal gland function but she didn't. My blood count is normal now which is good news (my platelets were below 8000 after Covid) but my ferritin levels are still way to high and my thyroid hormones are extremely low. My CRP levels are extremely high. My iron is fine but my saturation is extremely low. I see my doctor next week. It's so weird that she won't check my pituitary function. When I was last checked in November my thyroid was very low so she raised it more than I have ever had it raised (75mcg T4 & 35 mcg T3 raised to 150 T4 & 50 T3) and now my T4 and T3 are lower than they were in November. My ferritin levels are higher than they were in November too (215 in November to 250 now.)

what's the old saying what doesn't kill you mutates and tries again?



@QueenDeNile

I hope you get it straightened out.  I am not a doctor, but if you are dealing with your primary doctor maybe you instead need to see an endocrinologist. 2 endocrine systems producing low hormones to me means go see an endocrinologist.

I have found that primary care docs are there to send you to a specialist.  Not treat you for anything more than ordinary stuff. I would ask for a referral to an endocrinologist due to the hormone issues.
Thanks Mach, my doctor is an endocrinologist. I agree pcp has limitations.


your doc is an endo and will not test your TSH when your thyroid function is abnormally low  and he gives you thyroid hormones and your levels go down further .

Has your doc said why he thinks checking your pituitary hormones are not a good idea?


my appointment is Tuesday and I have a lot of questions. It's weird that she didn't check my TSH. It's usually suppressed but I don't recall it not being checked before. I suspect she believes that my problem is long covid-but it's getting alarming how low my thyroid levels are. And how high my ferritin levels are. I'm curious to her explanation.



Queendenile,

Try Bluebonnet's Buffered, Chelated Magnesium.

But more importantly, if you don't understand Iodine vis-à-vis Thyroid and everything else, read this:

https://www.drbrownstein.com/shop/p/iodine-why-you-need-it-why-you-cant-live-without-it

Doctors are SO clueless about Iodine, thyroid, and even the meaning of the tests they give!


@QueenDeNile






Link Posted: 4/17/2024 12:42:54 PM EDT
[#20]
For whatever it's worth, I saw no improvement from the nicotine patches. I think I'm officially discontinuing them.

I've noticed, though, as warmer weather is here: my headaches are MUCH worse if I let myself dehydrate even a little bit. So I'm being extra aware of hydration.

Also - my kids were digging around in a drawer and dug out the TENS unit I used when my back was hurt a few years ago. I was about to throw it away when it hit me to google 'tens for headache'.

Trying that now. Costs nothing. I'll give it a week and see if it helps.

Link Posted: 4/17/2024 1:44:04 PM EDT
[#21]
Both low iron and high iron can cause headaches ( as well as a bunch of other symptoms) . Increased hepcidin levels also can cause headaches ... I would check into spirulina as a chelation therapy . The extra nutrients wouldn't hurt anything either . It wouldn't be entirely specific to covid either as the tick born diseases can also raise hepcidin levels. Just an aspect I've been looking at since the iron anemia studies on some covid cases came out a few months ago .
Link Posted: 4/17/2024 4:39:56 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By LibertyShip:



Queendenile,

Try Bluebonnet's Buffered, Chelated Magnesium.

But more importantly, if you don't understand Iodine vis- -vis Thyroid and everything else, read this:

https://www.drbrownstein.com/shop/p/iodine-why-you-need-it-why-you-cant-live-without-it

Doctors are SO clueless about Iodine, thyroid, and even the meaning of the tests they give!


@QueenDeNile






View Quote
Thanks I'll read this. My ferritin levels are about 800 times it should be-would iodine affect this? I had a dental appointment today and my dentist told me that my thyroid is enlarged and hard. It's so strange to have physicians say there's nothing wrong with me but my dentist was concerned enough to take notes and compare the size of my thyroid.
Link Posted: 4/17/2024 5:52:26 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thanks I'll read this. My ferritin levels are about 800 times it should be-would iodine affect this? I had a dental appointment today and my dentist told me that my thyroid is enlarged and hard. It's so strange to have physicians say there's nothing wrong with me but my dentist was concerned enough to take notes and compare the size of my thyroid.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Originally Posted By LibertyShip:



Queendenile,

Try Bluebonnet's Buffered, Chelated Magnesium.

But more importantly, if you don't understand Iodine vis- -vis Thyroid and everything else, read this:

https://www.drbrownstein.com/shop/p/iodine-why-you-need-it-why-you-cant-live-without-it




Doctors are SO clueless about Iodine, thyroid, and even the meaning of the tests they give!


@QueenDeNile






Thanks I'll read this. My ferritin levels are about 800 times it should be-would iodine affect this? I had a dental appointment today and my dentist told me that my thyroid is enlarged and hard. It's so strange to have physicians say there's nothing wrong with me but my dentist was concerned enough to take notes and compare the size of my thyroid.



When you are low on Iodine, your thyroid often gets bigger in an attempt to capture more Iodine.  Iodine is a Halogen, like Bromide and Flouride.  The thyroid, "thirsty" for Iodine will also load up on the next best thing, usually Bromide.

Brownstein explains all this, irrc, very well in his book.  And there are other resources and books.  I don't recall discussions about ferratin in this context, but I wasn't looking for it.  Quick search shows that high ferratin can be caused by thyrotoxicosis, which is a malfunction thyroid with, apparantly, a lot of possible causes.  But based on my studies, the first and easiest thing to look at would be the Iodine stuff.


Link Posted: 4/17/2024 6:33:02 PM EDT
[#24]
hepcidin can regulate ferritin levels, and can even directly increase them. Hepcidin levels increase linearly with increasing ferritin levels. Hepcidin locks up iron ...iron deficiency ....low thyroid function .
Link Posted: 4/30/2024 8:18:47 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mach:


well that article isnt completely wrong.

My neurologist calls what i have "Post Viral Syndrome" and says it caused Small Fiber Neuropathy both of which can be caused by any infection viral or bacterial and is kniwn to be caused by Covid, HSV, Flu, lyme, and even sometimes by a common cold, plus just about any infection. The immune system does most of the damage.
View Quote



For the last several weeks I have been looking at New Daily Persistent Headache.

It can be caused by a wide range of viral infections. I think it's at least possible that I have this, because of Covid, and in the absence of any understanding of Covid, have just assumed it was caused specifically by Covid, not just that Covid triggered it in a way that other viruses also could have done.

*shrug*

Who knows?

Link Posted: 4/30/2024 10:09:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thanks I'll read this. My ferritin levels are about 800 times it should be-would iodine affect this? I had a dental appointment today and my dentist told me that my thyroid is enlarged and hard. It's so strange to have physicians say there's nothing wrong with me but my dentist was concerned enough to take notes and compare the size of my thyroid.
View Quote
How to Diagnose Low Iodine
Iodine deficiencies are likely to cause a lot of other symptoms before you start looking like you swallowed a mango.

You might have overt symptoms. You may have trouble staying lean, which might be a direct result of thyroid inefficiency. You might have mysterious fatigue. You may suffer from unexplained autoimmune diseases, dry skin, or suffer from constipation or depression.

Other possible symptoms include:

   Increased sensitivity to cold
   Weight gain
   Muscle weakness
   Elevated cholesterol levels
   Slowed heart rate
   Thinning hair
   Puffy face
   Pain or stiffness in muscle and joints
   Bad memory
   Heavier periods in menstruating women
   Heart disease
   Peripheral neuropathy

A malfunctioning thyroid, courtesy of a lack of iodine, might also play a role in various forms of cancer, including breast cancer.

It used to be that taking your temperature first thing in the morning was a semi-reliable way to diagnose thyroid function. If you ran too cool (significantly less than the "normal" 98.6 degrees), there was a good chance you had hypothyroidism.

Unfortunately, the 98.6 degrees number is based on the studies of one guy, a German doctor named Carl Wunderlich. Old Carl stuck a thermometer in the armpits of around 25,000 people and found that the average was 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit. And we've been stuck with that number ever since.

The actual number is now closer to 97.5 to 97.9 degrees Fahrenheit, probably because of lower rates of infection and inflammation (Tuberculosis, syphilis, chronic gum disease, and other inflammatory conditions ran rampant in Wunderlich's day).

More importantly, human body temperature varies among individuals, so taking your body temp to evaluate thyroid function and iodine status is no longer very reliable.

That leaves us with conventional laboratory testing. The following three tests provide a reasonably accurate diagnosis:

   A 24-hour urine test where you collect your entire urine output over a 24-hour period in jugs and have them analyzed for iodine content.
   A hair iodine test.
   A serum thyroglobulin test, which reversely correlates with iodine levels.

If all that's too daunting, or your doctor is close-minded or, more likely, dismissive, you can just assume you have low iodine and start treating it on your own.

Link Posted: 4/30/2024 10:26:35 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TheRealSundance:
How to Diagnose Low Iodine
Iodine deficiencies are likely to cause a lot of other symptoms before you start looking like you swallowed a mango.

You might have overt symptoms. You may have trouble staying lean, which might be a direct result of thyroid inefficiency. You might have mysterious fatigue. You may suffer from unexplained autoimmune diseases, dry skin, or suffer from constipation or depression.

Other possible symptoms include:

   Increased sensitivity to cold
   Weight gain
   Muscle weakness
   Elevated cholesterol levels
   Slowed heart rate
   Thinning hair
   Puffy face
   Pain or stiffness in muscle and joints
   Bad memory
   Heavier periods in menstruating women
   Heart disease
   Peripheral neuropathy

A malfunctioning thyroid, courtesy of a lack of iodine, might also play a role in various forms of cancer, including breast cancer.

It used to be that taking your temperature first thing in the morning was a semi-reliable way to diagnose thyroid function. If you ran too cool (significantly less than the "normal" 98.6 degrees), there was a good chance you had hypothyroidism.

Unfortunately, the 98.6 degrees number is based on the studies of one guy, a German doctor named Carl Wunderlich. Old Carl stuck a thermometer in the armpits of around 25,000 people and found that the average was 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit. And we've been stuck with that number ever since.

The actual number is now closer to 97.5 to 97.9 degrees Fahrenheit, probably because of lower rates of infection and inflammation (Tuberculosis, syphilis, chronic gum disease, and other inflammatory conditions ran rampant in Wunderlich's day).

More importantly, human body temperature varies among individuals, so taking your body temp to evaluate thyroid function and iodine status is no longer very reliable.

That leaves us with conventional laboratory testing. The following three tests provide a reasonably accurate diagnosis:

   A 24-hour urine test where you collect your entire urine output over a 24-hour period in jugs and have them analyzed for iodine content.
   A hair iodine test.
   A serum thyroglobulin test, which reversely correlates with iodine levels.

If all that's too daunting, or your doctor is close-minded or, more likely, dismissive, you can just assume you have low iodine and start treating it on your own.

View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TheRealSundance:
Originally Posted By QueenDeNile:
Thanks I'll read this. My ferritin levels are about 800 times it should be-would iodine affect this? I had a dental appointment today and my dentist told me that my thyroid is enlarged and hard. It's so strange to have physicians say there's nothing wrong with me but my dentist was concerned enough to take notes and compare the size of my thyroid.
How to Diagnose Low Iodine
Iodine deficiencies are likely to cause a lot of other symptoms before you start looking like you swallowed a mango.

You might have overt symptoms. You may have trouble staying lean, which might be a direct result of thyroid inefficiency. You might have mysterious fatigue. You may suffer from unexplained autoimmune diseases, dry skin, or suffer from constipation or depression.

Other possible symptoms include:

   Increased sensitivity to cold
   Weight gain
   Muscle weakness
   Elevated cholesterol levels
   Slowed heart rate
   Thinning hair
   Puffy face
   Pain or stiffness in muscle and joints
   Bad memory
   Heavier periods in menstruating women
   Heart disease
   Peripheral neuropathy

A malfunctioning thyroid, courtesy of a lack of iodine, might also play a role in various forms of cancer, including breast cancer.

It used to be that taking your temperature first thing in the morning was a semi-reliable way to diagnose thyroid function. If you ran too cool (significantly less than the "normal" 98.6 degrees), there was a good chance you had hypothyroidism.

Unfortunately, the 98.6 degrees number is based on the studies of one guy, a German doctor named Carl Wunderlich. Old Carl stuck a thermometer in the armpits of around 25,000 people and found that the average was 98.6 degrees Fahrenheit. And we've been stuck with that number ever since.

The actual number is now closer to 97.5 to 97.9 degrees Fahrenheit, probably because of lower rates of infection and inflammation (Tuberculosis, syphilis, chronic gum disease, and other inflammatory conditions ran rampant in Wunderlich's day).

More importantly, human body temperature varies among individuals, so taking your body temp to evaluate thyroid function and iodine status is no longer very reliable.

That leaves us with conventional laboratory testing. The following three tests provide a reasonably accurate diagnosis:

   A 24-hour urine test where you collect your entire urine output over a 24-hour period in jugs and have them analyzed for iodine content.
   A hair iodine test.
   A serum thyroglobulin test, which reversely correlates with iodine levels.

If all that's too daunting, or your doctor is close-minded or, more likely, dismissive, you can just assume you have low iodine and start treating it on your own.

Thank you, I read Brownsteins book and assumed that I'm low in iodine. I have been supplementing for about a week now. I did get tested yesterday. I do feel slightly less fatigued. I think my thyroid is smaller too. I have an ultrasound tomorrow. I had one in February and I had a cyst that my doctor wasn't concerned about. I think it's pointing me on the right direction.
Link Posted: 5/8/2024 8:17:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Here is another video from John Campbell.  Nothing ground-breaking, but more MSM reports about "vaccine" injuries, which is good in that more people will be aware of reality.  I would like to add that many of us are following this thread and continuing to pray for you, but have no news to help you.


Link Posted: 5/18/2024 7:40:32 PM EDT
[#29]
Another video, which I found interesting.  ~16:00 - 30:00 is discussing treatment of long covid/long viral/fatigue syndrome.

Ivermectin after vaccine injury
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