Foxtrot08 makes an oil thread! (Page 156 of 160)
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Originally Posted By brass: Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? Motor vehicle fuels and lubricants, as well as industrial uses, are largely inflexible. markets. If a car is designed to run on gasoline, or a truck on diesel, the ability to substitute something else is very limited, and the substitutes, like adding alcohol to gasoline or cooking oil instead of diesel, have their own costs and risks. So a 10% reduction really, really hurts. If you are a furniture maker and all of a sudden, you can't get chestnut or walnut, you can substitute oak or maple, using the same tooling and probably the same finishes. If you are cooking and you can't get pinto beans you can substitute kidney beans or black beans. But a motor oil or fuel is not so easily substituted, and a 10% reduction means when the music stops, 10% of the market doesn't have a chair. And this is before considering its a global market and even if the supply is there, the price is going to rise to match world market conditions, and more of our production will go overseas. |
Why not (\/) (;,,;) (\/) Zoidberg?
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Originally Posted By 4FishLimit: Pretty much this…now that she’s seen the price increases and a few stories have hit the news cycle she’s more on board with stocking up vs. earlier this year. At the very least I’m trying to shield us from the price hikes for the next couple of years. Originally Posted By 4FishLimit: Originally Posted By AK-12: Originally Posted By M855Bukkake: Ignore the handful of turbo-normies doubting you. Their voices are amplified because the rest of us are busy inventorying our oil forts and running burn rate estimates instead of talking shit. Thank you for the heads up, I'm better off for it. No kidding. 4 months ago I was just an autist stockpiling motor oil to my wife. Now I'm an oracle who prepared for something she had no idea was coming.  Pretty much this…now that she’s seen the price increases and a few stories have hit the news cycle she’s more on board with stocking up vs. earlier this year. At the very least I’m trying to shield us from the price hikes for the next couple of years. It wasn’t really the price hikes that concerned me. Realistically speaking, even $40-$50 more per 5,000 mile OCI isn’t particularly onerous What concerned me about Foxtrot08’s heads up, was availability, and reformulations. How easy is it going to be, to find the 0w16 and 0w20 for the vehicles that use it, in the coming months? Will what’s available be as good as what WAS available (because as mentioned numerous times in this thread, the refineries not only produced Grp3 basestocks, they also produced a lot of the additives used in formulations, some of which according to Fox, are now becoming difficult for formulators to source). As already postulated earlier in this thread, I’d be pretty leery of buying any used vehicles a year or two from now. |
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Originally Posted By fxntime: in the 70's, between no anti siphon valves and high fuel prices, gas theft was VERY common. It's when locking gas caps came into popularity. ''Locking'' gas cap covers don't do shit against fuel theft but the anti siphon valves are a PITA enough that drilling a hole thru the HDPE tank itself is easy as hell. Ask me how I know.   Happened a couple years ago. Unfortunately I expect it to become very common. |
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: It wasn’t really the price hikes that concerned me. Realistically speaking, even $40-$50 more per 5,000 mile OCI isn’t particularly onerous What concerned me about Foxtrot08’s heads up, was availability, and reformulations. How easy is it going to be, to find the 0w16 and 0w20 for the vehicles that use it, in the coming months? Will what’s available be as good as what WAS available (because as mentioned numerous times in this thread, the refineries not only produced Grp3 basestocks, they also produced a lot of the additives used in formulations, some of which according to Fox, are now becoming difficult for formulators to source). As already postulated earlier in this thread, I’d be pretty leery of buying any used vehicles a year or two from now. Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By 4FishLimit: Originally Posted By AK-12: Originally Posted By M855Bukkake: Ignore the handful of turbo-normies doubting you. Their voices are amplified because the rest of us are busy inventorying our oil forts and running burn rate estimates instead of talking shit. Thank you for the heads up, I'm better off for it. No kidding. 4 months ago I was just an autist stockpiling motor oil to my wife. Now I'm an oracle who prepared for something she had no idea was coming. Pretty much this…now that she’s seen the price increases and a few stories have hit the news cycle she’s more on board with stocking up vs. earlier this year. At the very least I’m trying to shield us from the price hikes for the next couple of years. It wasn’t really the price hikes that concerned me. Realistically speaking, even $40-$50 more per 5,000 mile OCI isn’t particularly onerous What concerned me about Foxtrot08’s heads up, was availability, and reformulations. How easy is it going to be, to find the 0w16 and 0w20 for the vehicles that use it, in the coming months? Will what’s available be as good as what WAS available (because as mentioned numerous times in this thread, the refineries not only produced Grp3 basestocks, they also produced a lot of the additives used in formulations, some of which according to Fox, are now becoming difficult for formulators to source). As already postulated earlier in this thread, I’d be pretty leery of buying any used vehicles a year or two from now. The upside is, someone like me is going to know how these formulations are doing fairly quickly. (The new formulas.) And as I’ve proven here, gotten made fun of in real life, etc. I’m going to post my rather, unapologetic opinions on them, here. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
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Originally Posted By Rick-OShay: Motor vehicle fuels and lubricants, as well as industrial uses, are largely inflexible. markets. If a car is designed to run on gasoline, or a truck on diesel, the ability to substitute something else is very limited, and the substitutes, like adding alcohol to gasoline or cooking oil instead of diesel, have their own costs and risks. So a 10% reduction really, really hurts. If you are a furniture maker and all of a sudden, you can't get chestnut or walnut, you can substitute oak or maple, using the same tooling and probably the same finishes. If you are cooking and you can't get pinto beans you can substitute kidney beans or black beans. But a motor oil or fuel is not so easily substituted, and a 10% reduction means when the music stops, 10% of the market doesn't have a chair. And this is before considering its a global market and even if the supply is there, the price is going to rise to match world market conditions, and more of our production will go overseas. Originally Posted By Rick-OShay: Originally Posted By brass: Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? Motor vehicle fuels and lubricants, as well as industrial uses, are largely inflexible. markets. If a car is designed to run on gasoline, or a truck on diesel, the ability to substitute something else is very limited, and the substitutes, like adding alcohol to gasoline or cooking oil instead of diesel, have their own costs and risks. So a 10% reduction really, really hurts. If you are a furniture maker and all of a sudden, you can't get chestnut or walnut, you can substitute oak or maple, using the same tooling and probably the same finishes. If you are cooking and you can't get pinto beans you can substitute kidney beans or black beans. But a motor oil or fuel is not so easily substituted, and a 10% reduction means when the music stops, 10% of the market doesn't have a chair. And this is before considering its a global market and even if the supply is there, the price is going to rise to match world market conditions, and more of our production will go overseas. I think that people who have followed the entire mess understand the lubricants market pretty well due to the fact that the refineries that handled a lot of it were in the ME and damaged and shut down which especially affect the group 3 synthetics. The gasoline price increases part of it, not so much. Diesel and jet fuel price increases are somewhat understandable but not to the extent we are seeing now. |
Liberals are a curious mix of communism and fascism, they want to destroy you but want to use your own money to do it.
I'm getting down to the last box, the others have all been destroyed...
I'm getting down to the last box, the others have all been destroyed...
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. I'm a retard, please help me understand a little bit so I can try to help my retard friends understand as well. Oil companies produce oil and refine it into fuels in the US. Oil companies sell fuel/products globally because they can and having a global market allows them to sell for higher prices when the other oil producing countries have issues keeping up with supply, which results in higher domestic prices as well. I guess the tldr questions I have are; Is there anything short of government controlled refining and distribution that could keep "our" domestic oil and products in the US, and is it the same oil companies refining and selling oil and fuel globally, so there's no incentive to keep prices in the US lower? |
"Freedom is a messy business." - LaRue_Tactical
I am a sack of blood, held together by un-tanned leather. . .
I am a sack of blood, held together by un-tanned leather. . .
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: In the short term is not going to get better. So I’d bite the bullet and get what you need. The medium term is going to be what happens with export controls. But again, there’s a bunch of political nuances with export controls. We have a lot of agreements where we export finished product and they import crude. Particularly with Mexico and Canada. We would flat out kill the Euro economy. And we would probably send the Chinese economy into overdrive as they’d be able to charge almost anything for fuel globally. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By RTX: Regarding diesel prices, I get the impression you expect them to continue to go up. So...the question to top off, or wait? What would Foxtrot do? In the short term is not going to get better. So I’d bite the bullet and get what you need. The medium term is going to be what happens with export controls. But again, there’s a bunch of political nuances with export controls. We have a lot of agreements where we export finished product and they import crude. Particularly with Mexico and Canada. We would flat out kill the Euro economy. And we would probably send the Chinese economy into overdrive as they’d be able to charge almost anything for fuel globally. Thank you, I'll take that advice and bite the bullet. Hopefully I can get it done before the next 40-60 cent jump. While I'm not happy about the price, I actually feel sorry for distributors, like yourself, and even moreso for the smaller ones like I do business with. The credit load has to keep them up at night. End users riding them longer, some going out of business - takes a good banker to keep those smaller distributors going. |
| If you want some cheap synthetic in 0w20 Sam’s in your area may have Castrol GTX high mileage for $13.17/6qt. I have 3 boxes waiting for me to pickup tomorrow. I have more than enough fluids for my vehicles but I’m getting this to use in my wife’s Niece’s vehicle if she doesn’t cook the engine running around with almost zero coolant in her overflow. If she does cook it I’ll use it in my beater. |
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Originally Posted By heavy260: If you want some cheap synthetic in 0w20 Sam’s in your area may have Castrol GTX high mileage for $13.17/6qt. I have 3 boxes waiting for me to pickup tomorrow. I have more than enough fluids for my vehicles but I’m getting this to use in my wife’s Niece’s vehicle if she doesn’t cook the engine running around with almost zero coolant in her overflow. If she does cook it I’ll use it in my beater. Dang...that's cheap alright. |
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: The upside is, someone like me is going to know how these formulations are doing fairly quickly. (The new formulas.) And as I’ve proven here, gotten made fun of in real life, etc. I’m going to post my rather, unapologetic opinions on them, here. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By 4FishLimit: Originally Posted By AK-12: Originally Posted By M855Bukkake: Ignore the handful of turbo-normies doubting you. Their voices are amplified because the rest of us are busy inventorying our oil forts and running burn rate estimates instead of talking shit. Thank you for the heads up, I'm better off for it. No kidding. 4 months ago I was just an autist stockpiling motor oil to my wife. Now I'm an oracle who prepared for something she had no idea was coming. Pretty much this…now that she’s seen the price increases and a few stories have hit the news cycle she’s more on board with stocking up vs. earlier this year. At the very least I’m trying to shield us from the price hikes for the next couple of years. It wasn’t really the price hikes that concerned me. Realistically speaking, even $40-$50 more per 5,000 mile OCI isn’t particularly onerous What concerned me about Foxtrot08’s heads up, was availability, and reformulations. How easy is it going to be, to find the 0w16 and 0w20 for the vehicles that use it, in the coming months? Will what’s available be as good as what WAS available (because as mentioned numerous times in this thread, the refineries not only produced Grp3 basestocks, they also produced a lot of the additives used in formulations, some of which according to Fox, are now becoming difficult for formulators to source). As already postulated earlier in this thread, I’d be pretty leery of buying any used vehicles a year or two from now. The upside is, someone like me is going to know how these formulations are doing fairly quickly. (The new formulas.) And as I’ve proven here, gotten made fun of in real life, etc. I’m going to post my rather, unapologetic opinions on them, here. And we’re all extremely grateful for the info. |
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Originally Posted By DFARM: I'm a retard, please help me understand a little bit so I can try to help my retard friends understand as well. Oil companies produce oil and refine it into fuels in the US. Oil companies sell fuel/products globally because they can and having a global market allows them to sell for higher prices when the other oil producing countries have issues keeping up with supply, which results in higher domestic prices as well. I guess the tldr questions I have are; Is there anything short of government controlled refining and distribution that could keep "our" domestic oil and products in the US, and is it the same oil companies refining and selling oil and fuel globally, so there's no incentive to keep prices in the US lower? Originally Posted By DFARM: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. I'm a retard, please help me understand a little bit so I can try to help my retard friends understand as well. Oil companies produce oil and refine it into fuels in the US. Oil companies sell fuel/products globally because they can and having a global market allows them to sell for higher prices when the other oil producing countries have issues keeping up with supply, which results in higher domestic prices as well. I guess the tldr questions I have are; Is there anything short of government controlled refining and distribution that could keep "our" domestic oil and products in the US, and is it the same oil companies refining and selling oil and fuel globally, so there's no incentive to keep prices in the US lower? One factor is that the US refineries aren’t really setup to refine the US produced crude. I’m not in the oil industry, but just reading in this thread and elsewhere, most US crude production is what’s called light sweet crude. It gets exported, because it’s worth more (I think). US refineries are setup to refine what’s called heavy sour crude, which is imported (because it’s cheaper). The refineries are then exporting a good portion of the refined products, because they’re getting paid more by the foreign countries with supply issues. Apparently, according to the folks in this thread who ARE on the industry, switching our refineries from heavy sour, to light sweet, isn’t just a simple/quick process.  Therein lies the rub. To build or convert a refinery in the US takes time AND money. But are companies willing to invest that time and money, if situations could change before the refineries come online, and the potential profit margins disappear, leaving them in the hole? |
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Therein lies the rub. To build or convert a refinery in the US takes time AND money. But are companies willing to invest that time and money, if situations could change before the refineries come online, and the potential profit margins disappear, leaving them in the hole? |
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Originally Posted By Minerk: Political climate in US does not / will not support building refineries. We have allowed our politicians, lefties, and greenies to paint us in to this corner. Originally Posted By Minerk: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Therein lies the rub. To build or convert a refinery in the US takes time AND money. But are companies willing to invest that time and money, if situations could change before the refineries come online, and the potential profit margins disappear, leaving them in the hole? The fact that Line 5’s rebuild / repair is so highly controversial is a sign of what the future looks like. If line 5 goes down, I’m just going to move. Idk where yet. But I’m out. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Nobody Expects the 16th Ammendment
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: The fact that Line 5’s rebuild / repair is so highly controversial is a sign of what the future looks like. If line 5 goes down, I’m just going to move. Idk where yet. But I’m out. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By Minerk: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Therein lies the rub. To build or convert a refinery in the US takes time AND money. But are companies willing to invest that time and money, if situations could change before the refineries come online, and the potential profit margins disappear, leaving them in the hole? The fact that Line 5’s rebuild / repair is so highly controversial is a sign of what the future looks like. If line 5 goes down, I’m just going to move. Idk where yet. But I’m out. There have been zero consequences for the people responsible for decades of fearmongering and completely nonsense energy & economic policies in this country. And many have profited from their promotion of these policies. You cannot have a real economy and hamstring yourself in regards to resource extraction & refining, producing & supplying abundant cheap energy, and turning raw materials into manufactured goods. We are facing the extreme danger of finding out how fake is our financialized, service-based economy. |
Equality is not in the natural order of things, and the crusade to make everyone equal in every respect (except before the law) is certain to have disastrous consequences. - Murray Rothbard
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. |
The person who complains most, and is the most critical of others has the most to hide.
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
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Originally Posted By brass: Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: The fact that Line 5’s rebuild / repair is so highly controversial is a sign of what the future looks like. If line 5 goes down, I’m just going to move. Idk where yet. But I’m out. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By Minerk: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Therein lies the rub. To build or convert a refinery in the US takes time AND money. But are companies willing to invest that time and money, if situations could change before the refineries come online, and the potential profit margins disappear, leaving them in the hole? The fact that Line 5’s rebuild / repair is so highly controversial is a sign of what the future looks like. If line 5 goes down, I’m just going to move. Idk where yet. But I’m out. It's more the owner of line 5 isn't trusted to properly repair it and maintain it because past history has shown they can and will cut corners to save a buck. And Indians are doing Indian things like they always do. |
Liberals are a curious mix of communism and fascism, they want to destroy you but want to use your own money to do it.
I'm getting down to the last box, the others have all been destroyed...
I'm getting down to the last box, the others have all been destroyed...
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/148484/IMG_0573-3828307.png Get cubed bro! I don’t want to have to explain to my wife 3 purchases of “Lube cubes”
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Please remember to tell your kids and grandchildren about the cool Bro know as @fastblueR6!!
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Originally Posted By xd341: With the current events of canada looking for EU membership....that would be one hell of a lever. Who knows what the big plan is here, if there is one even, but Trump is very aware of global energy flows and economics. 
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? |
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. |
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. |
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” |
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: The upside is, someone like me is going to know how these formulations are doing fairly quickly. (The new formulas.) And as I’ve proven here, gotten made fun of in real life, etc. I’m going to post my rather, unapologetic opinions on them, here. Excellent |
David Mamet said almost two decades ago: In order for modern leftists and progressives to continue advancing a radical and extreme political ideology, they must pretend not to know things.
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Originally Posted By mitsuman47: Agreed. Thanks again, Fox. Originally Posted By mitsuman47: Originally Posted By RTX: This is why it's so important to keep this thread open and going. A lot of us benefit from it daily. Thanks for sharing with us.  Hear. |
I love a good double entendre.
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Originally Posted By boolzi: Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By boolzi: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By Shooter66: Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. |
| Fox I need DEF expert advice. My new generator arrives in a couple weeks. It is a Cat C15- 500KW at .8PF. It will have a 4,800 g diesel and 40 gallon DEF tank. Can or do you sell any treatment for DEF fluid? I run mine 30-45/wk, and 1.25 hours / month under load. Reading horror stories of DEF bunking up systems. Generator sits outside in a weather proof enclosure, temp swings and limited use. My other generators in MW range are Tier 2. Am I worrying for nothing? Or??? |
I survived the cockpocalypse of 11/21/2012.
Bacon grease, the Muslim approved .mil lubricant.
Bacon grease, the Muslim approved .mil lubricant.
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By boolzi: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By Shooter66: Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. I’m not sure if those numbers completely jive, but it’s close enough. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
|
Originally Posted By zoe17: Fox I need DEF expert advice. My new generator arrives in a couple weeks. It is a Cat C15- 500KW at .8PF. It will have a 4,800 g diesel and 40 gallon DEF tank. Can or do you sell any treatment for DEF fluid? I run mine 30-45/wk, and 1.25 hours / month under load. Reading horror stories of DEF bunking up systems. Generator sits outside in a weather proof enclosure, temp swings and limited use. My other generators in MW range are Tier 2. Am I worrying for nothing? Or??? Unfortunately there nothing officially approved by the API or any OEM on a def life extender. Otherwise it would probably be in everything. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
|
Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: I’m not sure if those numbers completely jive, but it’s close enough. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By boolzi: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By Shooter66: Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. I’m not sure if those numbers completely jive, but it’s close enough. I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). |
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Originally Posted By zoe17: Fox I need DEF expert advice. My new generator arrives in a couple weeks. It is a Cat C15- 500KW at .8PF. It will have a 4,800 g diesel and 40 gallon DEF tank. Can or do you sell any treatment for DEF fluid? I run mine 30-45/wk, and 1.25 hours / month under load. Reading horror stories of DEF bunking up systems. Generator sits outside in a weather proof enclosure, temp swings and limited use. My other generators in MW range are Tier 2. Am I worrying for nothing? Or??? Delete the DEF system 
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). I saw this posted in the export ban thread where similar questions came up in regards to refining. The issue is more complex than that when you look at how each of the different regions of the country get their crude supplies and fuel. It’s not a one answer fits all situation. https://shalemag.com/us-refinery-shale-myth/ |
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: We make the majority of our refined products here. ... So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. Question, which might be slightly out of your wheelhouse. I wanted to ask here vs. the export control thread because of signal to noise ratio, and maybe more SMEs in the GASOLINE line of business of petrochemicals vs. lubricants. How much do all the various blends of gas stipulated by the States contribute to the cost? Let's say the gov decides to MANDATE the entire US to 1 blend of gasoline (let's say hypothetically 89 octane for a middle ground approach so all cars run reasonably well on it) instead of prohibiting exports of gasoline. Would that help at all? I guess this is really an economies of scale question for the refineries.... How much added cost to switch out blends, distribute those blends, downtime to swap over the lines of the blinds contribute to cost, if at all? |
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Originally Posted By zoe17: Fox I need DEF expert advice. My new generator arrives in a couple weeks. It is a Cat C15- 500KW at .8PF. It will have a 4,800 g diesel and 40 gallon DEF tank. Can or do you sell any treatment for DEF fluid? I run mine 30-45/wk, and 1.25 hours / month under load. Reading horror stories of DEF bunking up systems. Generator sits outside in a weather proof enclosure, temp swings and limited use. My other generators in MW range are Tier 2. Am I worrying for nothing? Or??? Delete that sucker. I'm all for clean air, but an infrequent use item is a bad choice for DEF. |
If you want to view paradise, simply look around and view it.
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Originally Posted By bluemax_1: I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By boolzi: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By Shooter66: Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. I’m not sure if those numbers completely jive, but it’s close enough. I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). We do not have the refinery capacity to make everything we use. We have the refinery capacity for 18.4m bpd. We use 20-21m bpd. So we have around a 3m bpd deficit. That would be spread to about all major products. |
Direction, not intention, determines destination.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
Integrity is the essence of everything successful.
| I went to pick up my order from the Toyota dealer today and the oil part of it was not there. I asked the internet parts guy about it and he confirmed that yes, all oil orders have been cancelled. I stopped by Sam's Club on the way home and picked up a couple of cases of Mobil 1 0W20 so I'm set for the next 2 years. |
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Originally Posted By Shooter66: I saw this posted in the export ban thread where similar questions came up in regards to refining. The issue is more complex than that when you look at how each of the different regions of the country get their crude supplies and fuel. It’s not a one answer fits all situation. https://shalemag.com/us-refinery-shale-myth/ Originally Posted By Shooter66: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). I saw this posted in the export ban thread where similar questions came up in regards to refining. The issue is more complex than that when you look at how each of the different regions of the country get their crude supplies and fuel. It’s not a one answer fits all situation. https://shalemag.com/us-refinery-shale-myth/ Thanks! That really clarified things. |
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Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: We do not have the refinery capacity to make everything we use. We have the refinery capacity for 18.4m bpd. We use 20-21m bpd. So we have around a 3m bpd deficit. That would be spread to about all major products. Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By boolzi: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By bluemax_1: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Originally Posted By brass: Originally Posted By Foxtrot08: Pay walled but: https://www.wsj.com/business/energy-oil/oil-executives-say-the-great-fuel-crisis-is-here-b6b32030 TL;DR: Chevron CEO Mike Wirth says the fuel crisis oil executives warned would follow a prolonged closure of the Strait of Hormuz has now officially arrived, with the mechanisms that mitigated price and supply risk having "largely now played out" and the system holding nowhere near the buffers it had when the war began, as Trump officials continue to claim the disruption is temporary, per WSJ. Wirth says he has not spoken to Trump since August 3, when Trump attacked him on Truth Social for not crediting the administration and demanded oil companies bring retail prices "DOWN, NOW!" I said in March, I didn’t want to be right. This would be much easier for me to just eat crow and look like an idiot on the Internet. Here's where I'm confused, especially with domestic wells and wells in South America and in the gulf of America. We only get 2-4% of our liquid oil from sources that use Strait of Hormuz. The 8% of oil used is mostly for plastics and cracking out specific parts for the rest to go into"reprocessing." (with brand new oil? How does that work @Foxtrot07 So less than 10% impact on America's fuel and diesel supply yet prices climbed by over $1/gallon for fuel and even more for diesel. Something this picture isn't making sense and id a bit fuzzy but not sure hwy. Is some converted to LONG before shipment and that's why the gallons don't mean "Gallons"? As numbers I saw yesterday, we are exporting 1.7m bpd of diesel fuel, another 350,000 of jet fuel/kerosene, around 2m of the different types of gasolines. Currently, we are being the world’s gas station and there’s not a lot of competition right now. Manchu65 sort of touched on this. US refiners, right now globally have almost no competition. Europe especially, but other regions too, are paying basically whatever price, because they need fuel. So the refiners are just exporting everything possible. Their input costs are staying low, because of what you mentioned - domestic crude, south / Central America crude, Canadian crude. But, the spread between crude and finished products is climbing because of that export demand. There’s just no competition for refined products. Essentially all the Middle East refined products are offline. All the Russian products are offline. Net exporters, it really leaves the U.S. and South Korea as the two big suppliers, with the U.S. being much much larger. Now as for reprocessing. That’s called hydrocracking. You put oil under heat and pressure, this will change the hydrocarbon chains. Making them more uniform. So you can make more usable products out of a barrel of oil. Instead of making a lot of asphalts, or bunker fuels. We can make more gasoline and diesel fuel out of that same barrel with hydrocracking. Ok, Is South America still making most of our gas out of our oil? Like we're outsourcing that to keep the envirowhacks happy so we pump the oil in the US, put it in a boat, send it to South America for the messy refinery then it's sent back as components and we work on it more. Can the US turn something "junky" like Pennsylvania waxy oil into stable fuel and oil, or do they like the Texas kind of oil for that? I know they come from different places, and gas isn't made in the US much directly but not sure how globalized we've stuck ourselves into a corner with it to claim the "globalized economy" badge. We make the majority of our refined products here. The north eastern states and the west coast import a significant amount of fuel. But that’s because of their politics and lack of pipelines. In the Midwest, we use a lot Canadian crude and Ohio / WV / Pa crude. Ergon in WV, Marathon canton, marathon KY all work off more local crude supplies. You also have ARG Bradford Pa, and United Refinery in that same hauling region. For the last fully reported month, June 2026, we imported around 1m bpd. We use around 9.2m bpd now. So we definitely do not import the majority of our gas. Hawaii, CA, then as I said - NY / Maine / CT / etc. that aren’t connected to pipelines heavily, are reliant on more imports than the Midwest, south east, south west and such. @Foxtrot08 Did I misunderstand what I’ve read? Is the majority of diesel and gasoline sold in the US, refined in the US from US crude? Yeah I must have. But yes, the majority of gasoline refined in the U.S. is sold in the U.S. Missed part of the question. The gas refined in the US, is refined from US drilled crude? I first heard/read somewhere years ago, that the gas sold in the US was refined in US refineries from imported heavy sour crude. Looks like 40% is imported. “Where US gas and diesel actually come from Refined in the US: almost all of it. Imported finished gasoline is about 1–2% of what we burn — roughly 60–180 thousand barrels a day against 8.9 million a day of consumption. On diesel we're a net exporter. Made from US crude: about 6 barrels in 10. US production runs around 13.8 million barrels a day, but refineries take in about 17.2 million. The gap is imports, mostly Canada, some Mexico. Why we export our own crude and import theirs: Gulf Coast refineries were built for heavy, sour crude and that equipment is already paid for. Shale gives us light, sweet crude those units don't run well. So the light goes overseas to refineries built for it, and Canadian heavy comes down the pipe. It's a fittings mismatch, not a shortage Source: US Energy Information Administration (eia.gov).” Originally Posted By Shooter66: Blending of heavy and sweet crude is a thing. At least on the gulf coast they can refine our sweet crude if they want to but they can get a better mix of products and run more efficiently with some heavy stuff in the mix. Thanks. So about 60% of gas sold in the US is refined from US crude, and ~40% from imported crude. I’m not sure if those numbers completely jive, but it’s close enough. I was trying to get a better grasp of a question I think some people are asking (without being aware of that factor), which is; If the US stopped exporting US crude, do we even have the ability to refine all the fuel we need/use from US crude? Or is that approximate 60% refined from US crude, near the limits of what we can refine from our light sweet crude? (i.e. if we stopped exporting our crude, would we still need to import heavy sour crude to be able to produce all the fuel we use in the US because we don’t have enough refining capacity to make 100% from US crude?). We do not have the refinery capacity to make everything we use. We have the refinery capacity for 18.4m bpd. We use 20-21m bpd. So we have around a 3m bpd deficit. That would be spread to about all major products. Thanks. So basically the isolationist mentality isn’t feasible unless people support the “more pain, questionable gain” train. |
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