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Posted: 2/5/2024 5:51:17 PM EDT
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Posted: 2/5/2024 5:55:04 PM EDT
[#1]
Only reason a lot of people are remotely interested in EVs is for their automatic driving capabilities. If gas or hybrid cars can get that going for them I wouldn't even think about EVs for the rest of my life.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 5:56:42 PM EDT
[#2]
buT Ev's ArE thE fUturE¡
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Posted: 2/5/2024 5:59:48 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: buT Ev's ArE thE fUturE¡ Imagine if you were selling your Tesla Model 3 and Hertz just shit 20,000 of them all over the used market. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:05:31 PM EDT
[#4]
I don't get the hate, but what do I know?
9 year old Chevy Volt that gets 50K+ miles from a set of tires. If the battery is holding less charge after 9 years, it isn't noticeable. At Covid peak, I could have sold it for $4K less than I paid for it 7 years before. Still very reliable, only significant repair to date was a new A/C compressor. Very happy with it. Much more than I've been with my chevy and ford pickups. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:08:04 PM EDT
[#5]
Nobody wants them.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:10:02 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the hate, but what do I know? 9 year old Chevy Volt that gets 50K+ miles from a set of tires. If the battery is holding less charge after 9 years, it isn't noticeable. At Covid peak, I could have sold it for $4K less than I paid for it 7 years before. Still very reliable, only significant repair to date was a new A/C compressor. Very happy with it. Much more than I've been with my chevy and ford pickups. I think most hate is that EVs are synonymous with "tech fan boi" and therefore stupid. Honestly, I hate EVs for the same reason I hate many high-end cars and minivans. Too many gadgets, not enough emphasis on driving experience. Tech bro cars are for people that dont really like driving. I like the connected experience of a manual transmission, why the hell would I want Auto-drive? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:12:49 PM EDT
[#7]
Funny timing, because a guy pulled into work with a Lighting just today.
Ya like it? “It’s not bad, but I’m gonna be stuck with it forever.” Why? “I got it delivered last year, and I paid a bit of a premium for it…….” Ouch. “Yeah.” |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:14:00 PM EDT
[#8]
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:15:53 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think most hate is that EVs are synonymous with "tech fan boi" and therefore stupid. Honestly, I hate EVs for the same reason I hate many high-end cars and minivans. Too many gadgets, not enough emphasis on driving experience. Tech bro cars are for people that dont really like driving. I like the connected experience of a manual transmission, why the hell would I want Auto-drive? Im upset I cant find roll up windows, and manual anymore why in the world would I ever want more tech? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:16:09 PM EDT
[#10]
Unless you’re buying something rare, yes, vehicles depreciate a shit ton. This is nothing new. Especially the German ones.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:17:45 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the hate, but what do I know? 9 year old Chevy Volt that gets 50K+ miles from a set of tires. If the battery is holding less charge after 9 years, it isn't noticeable. At Covid peak, I could have sold it for $4K less than I paid for it 7 years before. Still very reliable, only significant repair to date was a new A/C compressor. Very happy with it. Much more than I've been with my chevy and ford pickups. Something like that would be great for running into town. I almost wish I had kept the Honda hybrid I inherited, but a niece needed a college car. The battery pack died right before the warranty was up and Honda gave up a new one. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:18:21 PM EDT
[#12]
The depreciation on used cordless tools is huge too. You'll lose 50% just buying it and walking out the door.
Why would battery powered cars be any different? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:19:22 PM EDT
[#13]
I'll buy an EV when and if I decide to, not when .gov tells me I have to.
Same with vaccines, btw. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:20:23 PM EDT
[#14]
One friend has a Ludicrous Tesla Model S the other a Model X.
Both paid WELL OVER 115k. Two year depreciation is in the neighborhood of 50k. OUCH! |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:20:35 PM EDT
[#15]
A co-worker bought a 2021 Porsche Taycan, paid around $165k, it delivered 10/21. He check around 11/23 about trading it in, it was valued around 62k. He basically lost $100k on the car and only put 20k miles on it.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:23:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:30:31 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nobody wants them. I bet you can't even store them in a car museum. If that battery goes bad you could lose your museum. The battery has to go out of the car. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:30:51 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use. Do you trade them in when you buy a new one ? If so, you would want to get something for it. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:33:08 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Imagine if you were selling your Tesla Model 3 and Hertz just shit 20,000 of them all over the used market. It may be worse. Hertz was going to buy 60,000 or more EVs (best recollection). I don't know if they bought all those but they are stopping their Polestar EV purchases. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:34:08 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A co-worker bought a 2021 Porsche Taycan, paid around $165k, it delivered 10/21. He check around 11/23 about trading it in, it was valued around 62k. He basically lost $100k on the car and only put 20k miles on it. He changes cars every two years? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:35:31 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'll buy an EV when and if I decide to, not when .gov tells me I have to. Same with vaccines, btw. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:36:41 PM EDT
[#22]
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:38:56 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Unless you’re buying something rare, yes, vehicles depreciate a shit ton. This is nothing new. Especially the German ones. With EVs it's worse. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:40:47 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think most hate is that EVs are synonymous with "tech fan boi" and therefore stupid. Mostly the hate is because it's being forced on the market. EVs are a massive mal-investment, one being driven by government. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:44:14 PM EDT
[#25]
Brother-in-law has a Honda hybrid. He has had it 10 years. Can't really tell if the battery is declining - it still works the same. He got rear ended about 3 years ago - insurance essentially paid him more for the damage than he purchased the vehicle for new. Damage was cosmetic, he is still driving it. He wants a pure EV, but has not bit the bullet yet. He did rent a Model 3 and loved it.
that said, at the end of the day, he gets about 60mph. My TDI gets over 40 but drives like a sports car. Too bad the US outlawed TDI's... Mine was in the final 1/2 year of production. No def, no real problems - but damn unreliable. Little crap keeps breaking. It is driving fine now - but was limping for 6 months before that due to a bad wheel speed sensor. Now the sensor is totally failed and it is running fine again. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:45:41 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use. Would you pay 5k for a rifle you knew was only going to be worth 1k in two years ? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:48:59 PM EDT
[#27]
In a couple years when my current vehicle is paid off and after I'm married, we may have need of a second vehicle. A used EV could fit the bill, as the wifey will probably only need to drive a few miles from home to do errands. The current vehicle (CR-V hybrid) can do road trips and haul the fam.
Seeing Hertz dump a lot of Tesla Model 3s would have maybe had me look at buying one cheap. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:49:20 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:“It’s not bad, but I’m gonna be stuck with it forever.” Buyers remorse was only a theory until EVs started getting mandated. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:51:29 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mostly the hate is because it's being forced on the market. EVs are a massive mal-investment, one being driven by government. But which government?  The German, Swedish, and Japanese ones? 
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:52:25 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But which government? The German, Swedish, and Japanese ones? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:53:54 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Only reason a lot of people are remotely interested in EVs is for their automatic driving capabilities. If gas or hybrid cars can get that going for them I wouldn't even think about EVs for the rest of my life. This. I just want to be drive to work by a robot car. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:53:54 PM EDT
[#32]
I'm laughing at the people who paid $65k for the Model Y back in 2022 when wife and I are picking ours up for $39k on Friday
 It's not an investment, it's a tool, and for our situation it was the right fit. Replacing my clapped out 22 year old rust bucket truck. We looked at CRV's, Rav4's, Edge, and Tiguan and we liked the Model Y the best. The storage space put the others to shame. They were all comparable in price. We needed efficiency with 60 mile round trip commute and plenty of storage for growing family. We'll keep it till it has 200k like we do all our cars, unless this burns our house down before that And screw the enviroweenies  Thinking of getting a vanity plate that says COALPWR / GOTCOAL / COALKWH / USESGAS or something like that to trigger the greenies.  |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:54:28 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the hate, but what do I know? 9 year old Chevy Volt that gets 50K+ miles from a set of tires. If the battery is holding less charge after 9 years, it isn't noticeable. At Covid peak, I could have sold it for $4K less than I paid for it 7 years before. Still very reliable, only significant repair to date was a new A/C compressor. Very happy with it. Much more than I've been with my chevy and ford pickups. VERY similar for me... I bought a 2017 Volt at the bottom of the market in '21, complete with 0% for 72mo incentive for CPO (the only incentive). At peak COVID prices, KBB had it at 40% MORE than I paid. Now that prices have dropped, it's only showing a few grand more than I paid despite the extra miles and years |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:54:39 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think most hate is that EVs are synonymous with "tech fan boi" and therefore stupid. Honestly, I hate EVs for the same reason I hate many high-end cars and minivans. Too many gadgets, not enough emphasis on driving experience. Tech bro cars are for people that dont really like driving. I like the connected experience of a manual transmission, why the hell would I want Auto-drive? I agree with your thoughts. It seems like a LOT of the accolades that are presented related to EV's tend to be for the more "feature rich" models. Often, the features most touted have NOTHING to do with the actual propulsion system of the vehicle, and more with accessories and other secondary features. I have suspected this, particularly of the Tesla fans on GD. The Tesla is an impressive EV, at least in comparison to its competitors in the EV field. However, what seems to be the biggest draw to the Tesla among the GD crowd is all the secondary features of the vehicle. The average Tesla owner is TOTALLY enamored with all the "automated" features that a Tesla offers. I have said this in other threads mentioning Tesla products: the Tesla brand is a "tour-de-force" on what one can do with electricity in an automobile. While that is impressive, it also is just ASKING for trouble with some of the stupid features Tesla has imbedded in some of their vehicles. A case in point: a friend of mine has a Tesla Model X. That vehicle features a push-button electric glove box latch system. My friend thinks this is almost as cool as sex. Of course, I can hardly wait until that fucking latch decides it's done being electrically actuated. And before the Tesla fans all say I am FOS, think about all the electric window regulators that shit the bed in cars nowadays. That glove compartment is built of the same basic technology. It CAN and WILL fail, given enough time. Why Tesla feels to embed this foo-foo shit in their cars is beyond me, but it sure sinks the hook into the techno-geeks out there. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:55:31 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: buT Ev's ArE thE fUturE¡ Yep. They were once the future a a long time ago. And still suck in relation to their contemporary ICE vehicle for the same exact reasons they did back then. 
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:56:24 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use. Good for you. You won't suffer from EV depreciation but it will be a rude awakening when it's time to replace the battery pack. Plus, how long will EV makers support the firmware and software of their vehicles before they declare EOL life like Microsoft does? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 6:56:31 PM EDT
[#37]
The used market will be a big problem for electrics. Especially once they are over 100k miles. The people willing to pay high prices for one will buy new and high mileage the battery replacement cost on the horizon will make them very unattractive. Especially considering high mileage used buyers don't often have somewhere to plug them in. With resale and trade in being dog shit people won't want to get another one. I think it will stay a niche luxury market dominated by Tesla
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:04:33 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But which government? The German, Swedish, and Japanese ones? Why yes, they coordinate to push EVs. I didn't know Japan was pushing it as well. It's also being pushed in Australia, UK, and Canada. Some of the best EV hate is produced in Australia. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:05:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Im working on an EV right now. I actually think they are pretty cool.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:07:07 PM EDT
[#40]
I think it is pretty reasonable to buy a vehicle and expect it to last at last 20 years without needing repairs that cost more than the vehicle is worth to fix. So I don't think EVs are very reasonable.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:09:18 PM EDT
[#41]
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:09:43 PM EDT
[#42]
My work commute is 92 miles each way. I only drive in half the time and I’m remote the other. My employer has fast chargers for employees. I drive a Nissan Rogue, but when I have to cycle that out in a few years, you can bet your ass I’m buying a model 3. It will save me cash on fuel. I have an 80 Amp line pulled already for a charging station at my house. Not having to stop for gas is gonna be the best part. The only reason I’m gonna stop between work and the house is if I have to piss or to hit the ABC store. My truck is still Ice and so is my wifes Jeep and my daughters car. One Tractor and excavator run on diesel. The other tractor is Gas. Cars are like hammers. Or guns. They are just tools and if you get all wound up about it, hating on somebody else's choice of what to carry or not to carry then you are a fool.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:12:06 PM EDT
[#43]
If you are concerned about resale value buying an EV is dumb.
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:14:48 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Would you pay 5k for a rifle you knew was only going to be worth 1k in two years ? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use. Would you pay 5k for a rifle you knew was only going to be worth 1k in two years ? Does the rifle come with free ammo? Do the magazines get topped off automatically while I’m at work? |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:15:19 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the hate, but what do I know? Two states have already legislated a complete ban on the sale of ICE vehicles by 2030. The federal government has been pushing manufacturers to make EVs instead of ICE vehicles, jacking with the free market with taxpayer funded subsidies. They (the "green" commies) are trying to ram them down our throats. That is why I hate EVs, other than the fact I don't want another thing I have plug in and wait for it to charge. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:16:34 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would I care about re-sale? I buy vehicles to hold onto and use. |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:27:28 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Two states have already legislated a complete ban on the sale of ICE vehicles by 2030. The federal government has been pushing manufacturers to make EVs instead of ICE vehicles, jacking with the free market with taxpayer funded subsidies. They (the "green" commies) are trying to ram them down our throats. That is why I hate EVs, other than the fact I don't want another thing I have plug in and wait for it to charge. Well said! |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:30:41 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Imagine if you were selling your Tesla Model 3 and Hertz just shit 20,000 of them all over the used market. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: buT Ev's ArE thE fUturE¡ Imagine if you were selling your Tesla Model 3 and Hertz just shit 20,000 of them all over the used market.  ...
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:31:25 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get the hate, but what do I know? 9 year old Chevy Volt that gets 50K+ miles from a set of tires. If the battery is holding less charge after 9 years, it isn't noticeable. At Covid peak, I could have sold it for $4K less than I paid for it 7 years before. Still very reliable, only significant repair to date was a new A/C compressor. Very happy with it. Much more than I've been with my chevy and ford pickups. Thats a hybrid, right?... |
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Posted: 2/5/2024 7:32:17 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The depreciation on used cordless tools is huge too. You'll lose 50% just buying it and walking out the door. Why would battery powered cars be any different? Try selling a used IPhone that's six years old. |
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