User Panel
Posted: 9/7/2020 11:15:58 PM EDT
The DJI drones look like they would be handy for observing your neighborhood during SHTF.
Assuming you have good neighbors and form some sort of neighborhood watch, how realistic would it be to use drones to patrol a perimeter? How many drones would you need to keep something in the air constantly for, say, 8 hours? ( not daily, i’m thinking of one really bad day, or maybe a couple of bad days). Do the drones need to cool down between flights? Would three drones be enough? Is the Mavic 2 Air the drone to get right now? |
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The flight time on most commercially made drones like that is around 20-25 minutes. It's advertised as 30ish but real life is usually a bit less due to imperfect conditions. The charge time on the batteries is about 1.5 hours.
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Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math.
Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. |
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Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. View Quote |
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Quoted: The flight time on most commercially made drones like that is around 20-25 minutes. It's advertised as 30ish but real life is usually a bit less due to imperfect conditions. The charge time on the batteries is about 1.5 hours. View Quote My mavic gets the full advertised flight time and charges really quickly with an aftermarket charger, it can also charge three batteries at a time. Being up constantly is unrealistic, but keeping an eye out for something that you think might be coming is doable. I’ve used mine to check out approaching dust from a vehicle coming down my dirt road. |
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As others said .......
25m with decent flight time - you could fly at 10m/s the whole time, land, pop the battery out and go again (I think they have that capability, I know the phantoms did) so you just replace battery, and take off again, it's easy to get that down to a 1 minute deal. You'd have to have 4 batteries ready to go in order to cycle in. For super long loiter, fixed wing is best, but they're all 100% custom solutions, with DJI's there's many off-the-shelf solutions. I LOVE my Mavic Air 2, the rage it gets w/ high video quality is absurd. |
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Quoted: You could do it with enough batteries and chargers but you would spend a LOT of time taking off, landing and changing batteries, to keep one in the air for 24 hours. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. Yep. That said, An Autel Evo is on my short list of things to buy. I just want one for fun. https://auteldrones.com/products/evo |
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Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. View Quote I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. |
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I think there is a lot to be said for the psychological deterrent value of drone flybys. I wouldn’t count on having a drone up at all times without a huge investment. Having a drone ready to launch and perform a quick recon/harassment/deterrent flyby? Now your talking
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Quoted: My mavic gets the full advertised flight time and charges really quickly with an aftermarket charger, it can also charge three batteries at a time. View Quote They likely don't because it's going to murder the number of cycles that the battery is good for. |
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Quoted: I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. I could do it with 4 batteries, but I wouldn’t want to. |
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Quoted: I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only "job". But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. View Quote You can do this either programmatically, or fly the flight path once manually and have it record the loop for automation later. |
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Quoted: I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. I don’t think two guys with a few drones will be able to sustain continuous ops. Things will break. Like someone posted earlier, a fixed wing with a programmed orbit would have better loiter time. |
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Quoted: Cool. I bet it's hell on batteries though. Mavic wants to advertise as short a charge time as possible. I am sure they could ship them with a super fast changer, it's not like they aren't aware that they exist. They likely don't because it's going to murder the number of cycles that the battery is good for. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: My mavic gets the full advertised flight time and charges really quickly with an aftermarket charger, it can also charge three batteries at a time. They likely don't because it's going to murder the number of cycles that the battery is good for. You might be surprised, my batteries are years old and still perform well. Like I said, I COULD do it, it’s just not something I would ever want to do. |
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Quoted: I don’t think two guys with a few drones will be able to sustain continuous ops. Things will break. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only “job”. But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. I don’t think two guys with a few drones will be able to sustain continuous ops. Things will break. Sure, but would they be good enough for a few days, or a couple of weeks? I am hoping the answer is yes. That is why I was thinking three of the same drones,. They would have time to cool down between uses and even if one fails you have two more. Seems like if the expectation is for a short term eye in the sky that can counted on for a few weeks...then these should be OK judging by some of the reviews I have read. I understand that these would likely not last long under hard use. But if it lasted for the duration of one catastrophe/shit-storm/incident I would be happy. I guess I'm OK with the idea of disposable gear. |
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Quoted: Sure, but would they be good enough for a few days, or a couple of weeks? I am hoping the answer is yes. That is why I was thinking three of the same drones,. They would have time to cool down between uses and even if one fails you have two more. Seems like if the expectation is for a short term eye in the sky that can counted on for a few weeks...then these should be OK judging by some of the reviews I have read. I understand that these would likely not last long under hard use. But if it lasted for the duration of one catastrophe/shit-storm/incident I would be happy. I guess I'm OK with the idea of disposable gear. View Quote |
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Mavic2 is the best consumer drone made to date
It could easily accomplish the suggested task Wind is a factor on flight time though so figure that in |
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Ethernet cable to a 360 hi def cam attached to a weather ballon.
Like your own Keyhole satellite |
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Someone posted a video of what looked like a commercial drone in the other drone thread a few days ago. It had thermal and night vision with a 50min run time. Hate to see the price tag on that though.
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Quoted: How many drones would you need to keep something in the air constantly for, say, 8 hours? ( not daily, i’m thinking of one really bad day, or maybe a couple of bad days). Do the drones need to cool down between flights? Would three drones be enough? Is the Mavic 2 Air the drone to get right now? View Quote The Mavic 2 air is hot. But for what you're talking about, even a Mavic Mini will do fine. And while one drone can probably keep going all day like that as long as you're moving forward and keeping cooling air flowing in (not hovering all the time), you might want a spare drone just in case. It takes longer to charge the battery than to drain it. The controllers need to be charged, and your phone/tablet will eventually as well. So, all in, to keep them going 8 hours/day, you'd probably need at least 4-10 batteries MINIMUM (depending on drone model), chargers to charge all the batteries at the same time (which means aftermarket chargers), and 2-3 controllers. You're talking a good amount of money there. 2 people could do this. One flying, one communicating and helping swap batteries/controllers/drones. Shoot, one person could do this, if you can stand another bit of time during each return/land/battery swap. Actually... given that they'll return home and land on their own, maybe not. Tell the thing to return home, set down the controller, and get everything ready for when it lands. |
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Just run up a small balloon with a GoPro tethered and it can stay up all day.
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Quoted: The Mavic 2 air is hot. But for what you're talking about, even a Mavic Mini will do fine. And while one drone can probably keep going all day like that as long as you're moving forward and keeping cooling air flowing in (not hovering all the time), you might want a spare drone just in case. It takes longer to charge the battery than to drain it. The controllers need to be charged, and your phone/tablet will eventually as well. So, all in, to keep them going 8 hours/day, you'd probably need at least 4-10 batteries MINIMUM (depending on drone model), chargers to charge all the batteries at the same time (which means aftermarket chargers), and 2-3 controllers. You're talking a good amount of money there. 2 people could do this. One flying, one communicating and helping swap batteries/controllers/drones. Shoot, one person could do this, if you can stand another bit of time during each return/land/battery swap. Actually... given that they'll return home and land on their own, maybe not. Tell the thing to return home, set down the controller, and get everything ready for when it lands. View Quote Yeah, the return to home feature and programmable flight paths with waypoints seems like doing a simple perimeter patrol would be a piece of cake judging by what ive seen on Youtube. I also read that they updated the firmware and now the mavic air 2 has a zoom feature. I ordered two of the Mavic Air 2 Fly More Package, six extra batteries on top of the six that will come with the drones...12 total. I should probably get more chargers and am also thinking about the smart controller. Debating getting a third one. |
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Quoted: Technically, all you need is someone to swap the batteries and press a button to "go". View Quote But, other than that, it's just press "go." |
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Quoted: Would three drones be enough? View Quote |
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Pay 200 extra and get the fly more kit, comes with 3 batteries. We've run them back to back a few times and the drone doesnt seem to care. It's got decent heatsinking onboard.
I'm yet to note how long it takes to charge a battery, that would dictate how many batteries you need. I guess if you want guaranteed 8 hour coverage, but 2 with fly more kits and 10 more batteries. That is 16 batteries total at 30 min per. I guess that whole setup would cost less than 3k, but compared to a helicopter or satellite it's a steal |
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Quoted: I ordered two of the Mavic Air 2 Fly More Package, six extra batteries on top of the six that will come with the drones...12 total. I should probably get more chargers and am also thinking about the smart controller. Debating getting a third one. View Quote |
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Quoted: Lockheed isn’t returning my calls for some reason View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Have you considered an aerostat? Lockheed isn’t returning my calls for some reason An aerostat is just a tethered balloon. The gimbal rig from a Mavic and a tank of helium would give you effectively unlimited “fly” time... |
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DJI will lock your uas down until you update software and sucks your data back to China
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Quoted: I should probably get more chargers and am also thinking about the smart controller. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: I should probably get more chargers and am also thinking about the smart controller. The multi-battery charger from DJI only charges one battery at a time, at least for the Mini. Fstop labs makes a charger that charges 4 batteries in parallel. Quoted: The Mavic Air batteries need to drop below some threshold temperature before they will charge. The one time I had a battery too hot to charge, I pointed a small desktop fan at it for something like 5 minutes, and that cooled it plenty. Keeping a small fan blowing over the myriad of batteries in chargers that OP is talking about would be a good idea, keeping batteries cooler during charging helps longevity. |
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Quoted: You left out the time lost due to compass calibrations, recalibrations, firmware update denials, Fly Safe notification denials, ambient temperature under 59F notifications, swiping left/right/up/down/sideways to acknowledge Elmer's grass field landing strip 4.9 miles away, and god forbid you accidentally swipe into the DJI Store instead of Fly Fucking Now and they try to sell you some shit while there isn't so much as a road within a day's travel. But, other than that, it's just press "go." View Quote |
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Quoted: An aerostat is just a tethered balloon. The gimbal rig from a Mavic and a tank of helium would give you effectively unlimited “fly” time... View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Have you considered an aerostat? Lockheed isn’t returning my calls for some reason An aerostat is just a tethered balloon. The gimbal rig from a Mavic and a tank of helium would give you effectively unlimited “fly” time... That'd be the best solution to surveil a static location. |
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Quoted: Sure, but would they be good enough for a few days, or a couple of weeks? I am hoping the answer is yes. That is why I was thinking three of the same drones,. They would have time to cool down between uses and even if one fails you have two more. Seems like if the expectation is for a short term eye in the sky that can counted on for a few weeks...then these should be OK judging by some of the reviews I have read. I understand that these would likely not last long under hard use. But if it lasted for the duration of one catastrophe/shit-storm/incident I would be happy. I guess I'm OK with the idea of disposable gear. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Consider that most drones have a flight time no more than 30 minutes and do the math. Drones have their uses. We have used them in woods fires and search and rescue. However, I think continuous perimeter surveillance is out of the question from a logistical point of view. I guess what I was envisioning was a couple of guys in a backyard with lawn chairs and nothing better to do. Seems like if you had a dozen or fifteen batteries and a few drones you should be able to keep one up....if that was your only "job". But this is speculation on my part as I have never flown a drone. I don't think two guys with a few drones will be able to sustain continuous ops. Things will break. Sure, but would they be good enough for a few days, or a couple of weeks? I am hoping the answer is yes. That is why I was thinking three of the same drones,. They would have time to cool down between uses and even if one fails you have two more. Seems like if the expectation is for a short term eye in the sky that can counted on for a few weeks...then these should be OK judging by some of the reviews I have read. I understand that these would likely not last long under hard use. But if it lasted for the duration of one catastrophe/shit-storm/incident I would be happy. I guess I'm OK with the idea of disposable gear. Might also be worth considering that if people see drones flying continuously around some place they may figure there's something valuable worth taking there also. |
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Quoted: Quoted: You left out the time lost due to compass calibrations, recalibrations, firmware update denials, Fly Safe notification denials, ambient temperature under 59F notifications, swiping left/right/up/down/sideways to acknowledge Elmer's grass field landing strip 4.9 miles away, and god forbid you accidentally swipe into the DJI Store instead of Fly Fucking Now and they try to sell you some shit while there isn't so much as a road within a day's travel. But, other than that, it's just press "go." First of all, it's in fucking meters, fucking communist units of measure. Second of all, the fucking metal things are what's keeping me from falling to the fucking ground. And, there's a third of all, that I'll recall after the present rage subsides. And probably, a fourth of all. Do you need me to show you on the doll where the DJI software has touched me? Because ... I can do that. |
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I have the Mavic Air 2.
It's a solid drone. I usually get about 25 minutes of flight time. I could push that a few minutes longer but it would be perilously close to an empty battery when landing. I like to land at about 15%. The nice thing about the MA2 is that the last software update added zoom capability and now at 1080p you get a 4x zoom which still looks pretty good. In a SHTF situation, where are you going to get the electricity to charge the batteries from? |
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Aren't DJI products still well known for having to "phone home" to check if they're allowed to take off at a given location? I've seen where you can "unlock" a certain area to allow the drone to take off but supposedly only after registering with DJI's service and it allowing you to do so. In SHTF, when they could just turn off the manual override system, would it even allow you to take off?
Every drone related SHTF or security thread seems to always include a "if you value freedom / privacy, don't buy a DJI" warning similar to not using Windows 10 or your cellphone for anything "sensitive". |
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After watching Operation Red Sea on Netflix a bunch of cheap drones and pyrotechnic devices and loose bolts sound like a solution to acproblem none of us knew we had.
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Quoted: Aren't DJI products still well known for having to "phone home" to check if they're allowed to take off at a given location? I've seen where you can "unlock" a certain area to allow the drone to take off but supposedly only after registering with DJI's service and it allowing you to do so. In SHTF, when they could just turn off the manual override system, would it even allow you to take off? Every drone related SHTF or security thread seems to always include a "if you value freedom / privacy, don't buy a DJI" warning similar to not using Windows 10 or your cellphone for anything "sensitive". View Quote Show me an $800 drone that can fly up to 42mph, for 25 minutes, shoots 4k video at 60fps and 1080 up to The sad fact is that there are no USA made drones under $5,000 that can do those things. Even Skydio, which is twice the cost of the MA2 uses a host of Chinese built components. Plus the DJI drone DO use some USA built component from Texas Instruments. |
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I have a Mavic Pro. Lasts 20-25 min or so. I jailbroke it which allows you to change flight characteristics - I can hit almost 60mph but it kills battery fast.
Would work good for quick missions but all the taking off and landing, people will find you. |
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The FAA can blanket shut those down. You won't even be able to takeoff. Even worse if you live near an airport. Basically a paperweight unless you get away from local airspace restrictions and have internet access (unless that has changed). Other than that, they are amazing drones. But for shtf, look for something not as "smart".
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Quoted: The FAA can blanket shut those down. You won't even be able to takeoff. Even worse if you live near an airport. Basically a paperweight unless you get away from local airspace restrictions and have internet access (unless that has changed). Other than that, they are amazing drones. But for shtf, look for something not as "smart". View Quote Laughs in LAANC authorization, which allows you to fly in controlled airspace, including adjacent to airports. And no, the FAA doesn't have a kill switch that can shut down all drones. They just go arrest you if you made an unauthorized flight in controlled or restricted airspace. |
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Quoted: Show me an $800 drone that can fly up to 42mph, for 25 minutes, shoots 4k video at 60fps and 1080 up to The sad fact is that there are no USA made drones under $5,000 that can do those things. Even Skydio, which is twice the cost of the MA2 uses a host of Chinese built components. Plus the DJI drone DO use some USA built component from Texas Instruments. View Quote Not if you want ready out of the box... But my 7in fpv drone has hit 23minutes flying at a constant 40mph and has none of the nannies that come with a DJI. The issue is that you have to build it yourself and it isnt a flying tripod. You actually fly the thing. You can use other firmware like INAV to have waypoints and a position hold but it isnt as locked in as a DJI flying tripod, something DJI does VERY well. It will get a bit more expensive as an "all in" when it comes to getting controller/goggles/chargers/etc to go FPV. But the knowledge and true abilities can be quite substantial. My 13in FPV drone cruises at 50+mph for 18 minutes. Once I take it to a lithium ion 32v, pack instead of a 24v pack, it will likely either gain time or gain speed. On 32v LithiumPolymer it hits 80+mph. |
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Another poster above already asked this but I too am interested.
Is there an off the shelf fixed wing available that someone could recommend, or even a build it yourself kit? Preferable features I want it to have the ability to fly a programmed route. Fly in up to 10 mph wind. Decent range. Ability to carry a normal and a thermal camera that can pan & tilt. |
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Quoted: Another poster above already asked this but I too am interested. Is there an off the shelf fixed wing available that someone could recommend, or even a build it yourself kit? Preferable features I want it to have the ability to fly a programmed route. Fly in up to 10 mph wind. Decent range. Ability to carry a normal and a thermal camera that can pan & tilt. View Quote The fixed wing drones are still expensive. My Mavic Air 2 can do the first 3 on you list. Would have to upgrade to the Mavic 2 Enterprise or Phantom 4 RTK to get the thermal camera. I've flown my MA2 in sustained wind up to 20 or so mph. with gusts a bit higher. Eats up the battery and it isn't as steady it it's doable. |
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Patrolling? No way. Checking out hotspots and recon of high ground before you make the hike up? Absolutely.
I like the idea of sending up a balloon. I would make the recommendation of hanging an insta360 instead of a mavic or GoPro. Insta360 no shit gives you a view in every single direction simultaneously, and is ultra rugged/water resistant out of the box. |
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Quoted: Another poster above already asked this but I too am interested. Is there an off the shelf fixed wing available that someone could recommend, or even a build it yourself kit? Preferable features I want it to have the ability to fly a programmed route. Fly in up to 10 mph wind. Decent range. Ability to carry a normal and a thermal camera that can pan & tilt. View Quote The short answer is yes for building it yourself. The long answer is you will need likely 6 months to a year of flying it and getting experience with software like PixHawk, Ardupilot, or Inav. Expect several complete losses while learning before you ever get brave enough to try to put an IR or thermal camera on it. Rctestflight on youtube has been building variants of solar powered fixed wing craft for about 2 years now. He has a lot of duration builds that run off Inav from a ground based 3D printed rover to a 4-6 hour duration FPV wing. The knowledge base is out there. Hell I think it was LAbushman that was here on the site with his Dehogaflier(youtube it) and doing thermal night cam guided pig hunts back around 2013. To do what he did took a fairly sizeable ground station and decent knowledge. He was getting FAA attention for monetary gains from stupid Youtube ads if I recall which is why he stopped posting videos. |
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