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Posted: 8/5/2022 11:23:33 PM EDT
Title says it all.  Do you think we are being told the truth about what is going on, or are we being fed a steady diet of propaganda?

Poll is inbound like a GMLRS rocket.  Or a Kalibr missile if you swing that way.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:24:14 PM EDT
[#1]
I don't believe anyone. In before the poll.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:24:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Canoeguy:
I don't believe anyone. In before the poll.
View Quote
same
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:25:18 PM EDT
[#3]
Not at all.  Maybe the most propagandized war to date.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:25:27 PM EDT
[#4]
I don’t believe them anymore than I believe them in regards to any other topic.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:16 PM EDT
[#5]
More than I believe the Russian government and disinformation machine.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:18 PM EDT
[#6]
They also said that artificial sweeteners were safe, WMDs were in Iraq, and Anna Nicole married for love.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: raven] [#7]
LOL not at all.

The US/EU/NATO are scumbags. Luckily the EU should fall apart soon due to Germany's economy collapsing and when Trump returns in 2025 we can disband NATO and drain the swamps that makes the US such a destabilizing threat to the world.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:53 PM EDT
[#8]
LOL.  Sure I do, because despite the fact that the government and media have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that they lie to and manipulate us like a bunch of sheep, constantly and consistently..........suddenly like magic, they are telling the absolute truth about the Russo-Ukraine situation..............
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:55 PM EDT
[#9]
I don’t believe the gov or the misledia about anything.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:26:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JaredC1] [#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By madmathew:
Not at all.  Maybe the most propagandized war to date.
View Quote


I think part of the reason it has so many peoples attention is it is the first war with modern countries where the technology allows us to follow along so closely.

I wonder how different the Vietnam war would have been if America could watch damn near live?

Plus both countries generally look and live like us. So it hits closer to home.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:27:16 PM EDT
[#11]
I don’t believe a single thing the US government or their lapdog media says. Not a single word.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:27:18 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By raven:
LOL not at all.

The US/EU/NATO are scumbags. Luckily the EU should fall apart soon due to Germany's economy collapsing and when Trump returns in 2025 we can disband NATO.
View Quote
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:27:37 PM EDT
[#13]
There will always be a spin to it, but pretty hard not to tell the truth in an open society.

Through the spin and selective reporting, yes.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:27:59 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JLPettimoreIII:
They also said that artificial sweeteners were safe, WMDs were in Iraq, and Anna Nicole married for love.
View Quote
Whoa, that's not true?  
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:29:02 PM EDT
[#15]
Nope.  F*ck LGB.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:29:23 PM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Canoeguy:
I don't believe anyone. In before the poll.
View Quote

Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:30:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: kncook] [#17]
We aren’t told the whole truth about anything.

What’s your end game?

“Not caring”?
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:30:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By nihilsum:
There will always be a spin to it, but pretty hard not to tell the truth in an open society.

Through the spin and selective reporting, yes.
View Quote

Which country is an open society? Sure as hell isn’t us.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:31:30 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

Which country is an open society? Sure as hell isn’t us.
View Quote

Soros is the guy pushing for an open society, right?
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:32:48 PM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:

Soros is the guy pushing for an open society, right?
View Quote

Good point, we need to decide the definition of that.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:32:55 PM EDT
[#21]
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:33:21 PM EDT
[#22]
Both sides produce a decent amount of propaganda. Good propaganda is rooted in truth.

I take everything with a grain of salt and try to understand the beliefs and perspectives being pushed by the writer.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:34:11 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Shenanigunz:

Soros is the guy pushing for an open society, right?
View Quote
Imagine taking things at face value.

Next you'll tell me the Patriot Act was patriotic and the Inflation Reduction Act will help reduce inflation.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:34:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: jaqufrost] [#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:
I don't believe a single thing the US government or their lapdog media says. Not a single word.
View Quote
Which is a bit ridiculous. Back in January the US Gov was stating an invasion of Ukraine was imminent. That turned out to be true.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:34:49 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Which is a bit ridiculous. Back in January the US Gov was stating an invasion of Ukraine was immanent. That turned out to be true.
View Quote

Now do what is a woman
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:34:57 PM EDT
[#26]
Biden/liberal racist socialist democratic party proxy war.

The American people will pay for it in future taxes. The Ukrainian, Russian people will pay with blood.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:35:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JPP:
I don’t believe the gov or the misledia about anything.
View Quote



This exactly.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:36:16 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

Now do what is a woman
View Quote
Only idiots don't know what a woman is.

Unfortunately we have a bunch of fools running the asylum.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:36:53 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

Now do what is a woman
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
Which is a bit ridiculous. Back in January the US Gov was stating an invasion of Ukraine was immanent. That turned out to be true.

Now do what is a woman


What was your prediction about the invasion?
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:37:14 PM EDT
[#30]
The federal government is purely corrupt at this point.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:37:45 PM EDT
[#31]
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:38:36 PM EDT
[#32]
Their lips are moving so...
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:38:45 PM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GreyHat:


What was your prediction about the invasion?
View Quote

I didn’t think they would do it. Why? Because it’s fucking stupid. I sat in on several briefings where it was said it was happening and I still didn’t believe it. Was I wrong? Sure. I underestimated stupidity. I still believe nothing the government says. Nothing. Won’t change, don’t care.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:43:10 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By magnum_99:
The federal government is purely corrupt at this point.
View Quote


This is the only believable thing.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:44:04 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

I didn't think they would do it. Why? Because it's fucking stupid. I sat in on several briefings where it was said it was happening and I still didn't believe it. Was I wrong? Sure. I underestimated stupidity. I still believe nothing the government says. Nothing. Won't change, don't care.
View Quote
I wasn't sure if they were going for it or just trying to push a political concession. But you don't move that much equipment and men for no reason.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:44:29 PM EDT
[#36]
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:46:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: FlyNavy75] [#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
I wasn't sure if they were going for it or just trying to push a political concession. But you don't move that much equipment and men for no reason.
View Quote

I thought it was an exercise to push Ukraine to bow down. But looking back it was obvious Russia decided to do this under Biden (certainly not when Trump was in) and not risk Desantis or some other strong leader in the WH. This is why I’m worried about China. There is no better time than now to take Taiwan. The leadership in the US is as weak as it’s ever been and Japan isn’t quite built up enough yet. Now is the time.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:49:44 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

I thought it was an exercise to push Ukraine to bow down. But looking back it was obvious Russia decided to do this under Biden (certainly not when Trump was in) and not risk Desantis or some other strong leader in the WH. This is why I'm worried about China. There is no better time than now to take Taiwan. The leadership in the US is as weak as it's ever been and Japan isn't quite built up enough yet. Now is the time.
View Quote
I agree they chose a Democrat president. IMO they estimated the response would be more measured and we would be far less likely to take direct action.

They were right. Biden immediately offered Zylenski a ride out which would have ended the war almost immediately.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:49:56 PM EDT
[#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By corymc:
same
View Quote

Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:50:07 PM EDT
[#40]
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:52:45 PM EDT
[#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:

I didn't think they would do it. Why? Because it's fucking stupid. I sat in on several briefings where it was said it was happening and I still didn't believe it. Was I wrong? Sure. I underestimated stupidity. I still believe nothing the government says. Nothing. Won't change, don't care.
View Quote
I was in this boat too.  I thought Putin was just blustering in order to gain concessions from Ukraine/EU/US; I didn't really think he would go through with it because it didn't make any sense to me.

Now after 6 months I can see why he did it:  he had Europe by the balls with their dependency on Russian energy (as predicted by Trump back in 2018) and all he had to do was squeeze hard and they would start to yell.  His strategy is to slowly grind the Ukrainian Army into powder while waiting for the economic pain in the EU to become so intense that they force a negotiated solution onto Ukraine.  And so far it appears to be working.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:57:48 PM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
I was in this boat too.  I thought Putin was just blustering in order to gain concessions from Ukraine/EU/US; I didn't really think he would go through with it because it didn't make any sense to me.

Now after 6 months I can see why he did it:  he had Europe by the balls with their dependency on Russian energy (as predicted by Trump back in 2018) and all he had to do was squeeze hard and they would start to yell.  His strategy is to slowly grind the Ukrainian Army into powder while waiting for the economic pain in the EU to become so intense that they force a negotiated solution onto Ukraine.  And so far it appears to be working.
View Quote
IMO his original strategy was to fold Ukraine within a few weeks. Now he's stuck grinding it out, which he has a decent chance of still winning, especially if the Atlanticists quit supporting Ukraine.

If we keep feeding arms and supplies to Ukraine, and Ukraine is still willing to throw fighters into the fray, they may be able to keep going longer than Putin is willing or able to.
Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:58:27 PM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlyNavy75:
I don’t believe a single thing the US government or their lapdog media says. Not a single word.
View Quote

Link Posted: 8/5/2022 11:59:02 PM EDT
[#44]
I don't believe anything the us government or media says.  It's possible some of it is true but it's never the whole truth.  It's usually mixed with lies if not an outright lie.
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:00:55 AM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
IMO his original strategy was to fold Ukraine within a few weeks. Now he's stuck grinding it out, which he has a decent chance of still winning, especially if the Atlanticists quit supporting Ukraine.

If we keep feeding arms and supplies to Ukraine, and Ukraine is still willing to throw fighters into the fray, they may be able to keep going longer than Putin is willing or able to.
View Quote

Or we go broke which is what happened to them in Afghanistan. Not exactly the same but if Russia can bleed us for years, as this looks to be heading, then they may get their own Reagan moment. Or maybe they are just incompetent.
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:01:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: waterglass] [#46]
I don’t think that you should trust any stated facts or motivations from either entity.

A good reason not to like Russia is that they’ve provided weapons and technology to every enemy we’ve faced since the Korean War.

A good reason not to like the federal government is that the Germans would have completely destroyed The Soviets if we had not built their war machine from the ground up for them, which they then used to arm every enemy we’ve faced since Korea, and enslaved over half of Europe.

Both parties mutually profit from endless war, and exist as they do only because of it.
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:03:21 AM EDT
[#47]
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:04:37 AM EDT
[#48]
there's no such thing as unbiased media
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:06:11 AM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jaqufrost:
IMO his original strategy was to fold Ukraine within a few weeks. Now he's stuck grinding it out, which he has a decent chance of still winning, especially if the Atlanticists quit supporting Ukraine.

If we keep feeding arms and supplies to Ukraine, and Ukraine is still willing to throw fighters into the fray, they may be able to keep going longer than Putin is willing or able to.
View Quote
Correct, it's obvious Putin thought this would be as easy and bloodless as the Crimean operation.  After Russia got their nose bloodied they went back to doing what they have done best at war, which is overwhelming their enemy with massive firepower and superior numbers.

They probably could repeat Operation Bagration  right now and be in Kiev in a few weeks if not for their mystifying inability to establish air supremacy.  Apparently the Russian air force doesn't know what SEAD is.
Link Posted: 8/6/2022 12:07:50 AM EDT
[#50]
Do I believe the same Gov and media that lied to us for two years about Covid?
Of course I do!

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