Posted: Yesterday 1:22:43 PM EDT
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Picked up a used P30L DA/SA and tried the trigger and grip vs a PX4, Beretta GTS, and P226. All are stock and all seem pretty much the same. There may be some minor differences in the pull weight but they all work similarly with the reset, distance of pull, etc. The grips are somewhat different, but all feel similar after gripping them for a short time. I then shot a G17, which had a similar grip feel to the others. Are people too critical of pistol triggers and grip? |
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
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I think people like to bitch about triggers because it makes them sound like connoisseurs. The new guy down the road never shoots his spartan collection, but poo-poos everything as not up to snuff to his standards. Everything is awesome when you wore out a couple of these getting here.  
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“Government is a disease masquerading as its own cure” Robert LeFevere
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A nice trigger is… nice. It’s not necessary though. As long as it’s consistent and reliable it really shouldn’t make much difference how much trigger weight, travel, reset, etc the trigger has. Everyone bitches about Glock factory triggers but I’ve been shooting them just fine for years, just as well as any of my 1911’s or revolvers with significantly more crisp triggers. It’s not much different with rifles. It shouldn’t matter if your trigger has a 10# break as long as you train with it. A lot of people swap in super light triggers to “fix” a skill issue. |
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Originally Posted By HammerHammer: A nice trigger is… nice. It’s not necessary though. As long as it’s consistent and reliable it really shouldn’t make much difference how much trigger weight, travel, reset, etc the trigger has. Everyone bitches about Glock factory triggers but I’ve been shooting them just fine for years, just as well as any of my 1911’s or revolvers with significantly more crisp triggers. It’s not much different with rifles. It shouldn’t matter if your trigger has a 10# break as long as you train with it. A lot of people swap in super light triggers to “fix” a skill issue. Whoa. You want us to actually shoot our guns? For a lot of us, that means we have to leave the house... |
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Most shooters need precision-level triggers to be good shooters, as they help make up for ability shortcomings. The other side of the coin is brand wars. People think "oh, my favorite brand pistol has a better trigger than X brand!" will sway people into thinking the one they picked is the best. |
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I appreciate a good trigger, but I've shot guns decently even with triggers people complain about. I also seem to recall a buddy of mine having a Makarov that had an absolutely terrible trigger. Nothing like I've ever felt on any other firearm ever. Same buddy had an AK with terrible trigger slap. That trigger sucked because you finger would go numb after shooting it a few times. It was truly unpleasant. I also recall some derringer having a trigger so bad I could barely pull it (I was like, 16 at the time). Other than that, I've had no issue with any trigger on any gun that I have. I did change my M&P 1.0 trigger to a metal one, but that was more about liking metal more than plastic, not necessarily the "pull". |
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| People have preferences. The more time they spend with a gun the more they notice things that feel good vs bad to them. People have physical differences that make one gun feel better to one person vs another. Full size duty pistol 9mm, I’ve never noticed anything I couldn’t live with. |
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Most people would be better off with Double actions, or at minimum a DA/SA pistol. It’s easy to pound our chests and brag about how disciplined we are and don’t have to worry about a ND, but we are humans at the end of the day. You never think about dropping a glass of water until it shatters on the tile. I also see a lot of new (and old) gun owners carrying striker guns on an empty chamber, since they think the trigger pull is too short and light to carry the gun loaded. Having a heavy DA pull gives many people the confidence they need to carry with a loaded chamber. Lots of people seem to think that shooting “fast” super important, but a handgun is a not a LMG, and should not be expected to be used like one. |
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Before really getting into handgunning, all the nuances people bitched about flew over my head. Now I know and understand the little differences between grips, triggers, resets, etc... and its reason why I own more than 1 handgun. Every single handgun is a compromise on something, and there can never really be only one. I dont care how many boomer 1911 fanboys tell you otherwise, it aint true. Handguns are subjective to the user, so shoot lots of different handguns, triggers, grip styles and sizes. Find what YOU like and shoot well. Its a journey. Ignore fanboys and be sure to punch any self important/appointed SMEs in the face whenever you can (it helps the community to be a better place). |
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Originally Posted By Squeefoo: I think people like to bitch about triggers because it makes them sound like connoisseurs. The new guy down the road never shoots his spartan collection, but poo-poos everything as not up to snuff to his standards. Everything is awesome when you wore out a couple of these getting here. https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNTk5/z/I2IAAeSw-4pok~bV/$_57.JPG?set_id=880000500F When I go up there, I can pick it up and start rocking shit like its 1991 all over again. Still shoots in exactly the same spot: up and to the left. |
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I started out being spoiled with my first pistols being 1911's. I now have Sig DA/SA's, Glocks, and other pistols. It's just a matter of training. ETA I fit all my sigs with SRT's and E2 grips. those were a matter of getting the reset down to my preferred level. |
America is at that awkward stage, it’s too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards....Claire Wolfe
| There are differences. Most people don’t shoot well or often enough to actually notice them. |
Originally Posted By Aimless:...If you put some rare Russian machinegun in a giant mouse trap and painted "ATF" on the side you'd still find Larry caught in it in the morning
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I think an ideal pistol minimizes your flaws rather than accentuating them. Sure you can train yourself out of them, but wouldn't you rather shoot a handgun that is relatively insensitive to your problem areas? Life's too short to pull staple gun triggers or try not to have technique flaws accentuated by clunky, blocky grips. |
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Originally Posted By Bravo_Six: Life is too short to tolerate shitty triggers. I've shot a shitload of different types of handguns and grip and trigger pulls are a thing. Some are better than others and everybody has different hands. Sure, there are some who will blame their shortcomings on the hardware, too. |
Lol @ the retarded folks
"Blowtorch and Corkscrew" What a great tactic.
Seven Grand children Rich.
DOOM!!
"Blowtorch and Corkscrew" What a great tactic.
Seven Grand children Rich.
DOOM!!
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My first carry pistol after getting my CCL was an Intratec Cat 9. Here's a picture if you aren't familiar. Attached File It was an incredibly unergonomic piece of shit. It was reliable, had probably a 15lb trigger pull, and between being blowback and that large hump, was painful to shoot. Yes, grips and triggers make a difference. |
I've met cats and dogs smarter than Cory and Trevor.
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I'm a trigger snob. I grew up shooting real nice SA and SA/DA revolvers, and 1911 triggers. All striker pistol triggers are dreck. They just are. Are they manageable? Yes, with practice. People choose striker pistols for reasons but trigger quality is not among them. Rifles are precision instruments. Triggers are a lot more important. Pistols are blunt objects by comparison, so triggers are somewhat less important. Use what you want, practice and become proficient. Eh. Grips are another matter. It's the interface between the shooting hand and the gun and they can be changed out pretty easily. Get something that fits, and enjoy the shooting experience more. Most plastic frame pistol grips cannot be changed. They are what they are, you're stuck with them. |
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Originally Posted By Lou_Daks: ... Rifles are precision instruments. Triggers are a lot more important. Pistols are blunt objects by comparison, so triggers are somewhat less important. .... That's kind of a weird statement. I'm not saying that you're wrong. It's just a very different perspective than I have. To me they are both precision instruments. Rifles are able to be shot more accurately and use ammo that can be loaded to tighter tolerances due to the size of the charge, but I try to shoot them both to the best of my ability. In a way, I think that precision is even more important with a pistol, as they generally have less power, capacity, and rate of fire. Ultimately, when it comes to defensive use for most civilians, when the time comes that you need a rifle, chances are that all you will have is a pistol. I train and select my handguns accordingly. Just my opinion on things. |
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Originally Posted By Windustsearch: 90% of the griping about triggers, grips, sights, and every other little thing is people trying extraneoulsy to qualify "I don't like it, it doesn't feel right." It doesn't need to be qualified, it's okay to just plain not like something. Agree. And a lot of the reasons it "doesn't feel right" is we're all made just a little different. |
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Originally Posted By Bravo_Six: That's kind of a weird statement. I'm not saying that you're wrong. It's just a very different perspective than I have. To me they are both precision instruments. Rifles are able to be shot more accurately and use ammo that can be loaded to tighter tolerances due to the size of the charge, but I try to shoot them both to the best of my ability. In a way, I think that precision is even more important with a pistol, as they generally have less power, capacity, and rate of fire. Ultimately, when it comes to defensive use for most civilians, when the time comes that you need a rifle, chances are that all you will have is a pistol. I train and select my handguns accordingly. Just my opinion on things. Why is it weird? The pistol is often used at contact distances. The rifle is meant for much longer engagements. I have owned some very accurate rifles, a few of which were great right out of the box with only a trigger adjustment. I've never owned a pistol like that. A 3" group with a pistol at 50 yds. is remarkable and it generally takes a good trigger to do it. A 3" group at 50 with a rifle is pretty horrible. |
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Originally Posted By mustangduckk: There is a lot of noise in the signal in this thread. How many of you are shooting matches and actually measuring your performance. I recognize a few names, but not many. Shooting matches sounds scary |
I survive purely out of spite.
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When it comes to rifles I’m a self described trigger snob. Rifles are by and large precision instruments, and should be treated as such. I won’t go as far as to say a fine trigger is a necessity, but a fine trigger on a rifle is the best bang for your buck to improve accuracy in a rifle, and by a wide margin. Pistols are defensive tools that are largely for quick encounters at relatively short distances. While I like and appreciate light, crisp handgun triggers, they are by and large unnecessary for their intended real world purpose, and can be detrimental in certain circumstances. What irks me is when people take something like a Glock, swap out a bunch of parts to get a crisp, “1911 like” trigger, and then have problems and blame the gun, when all along they should’ve just shot the shit out of the OEM Glock. |
The posts made on this forum are purely my private opinion and don’t represent any employer or entity I am professionally associated with.
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Originally Posted By BuckeyeRifleman: When it comes to rifles I’m a self described trigger snob. Rifles are by and large precision instruments, and should be treated as such. I won’t go as far as to say a fine trigger is a necessity, but a fine trigger on a rifle is the best bang for your buck to improve accuracy in a rifle, and by a wide margin. Pistols are defensive tools that are largely for quick encounters at relatively short distances. While I like and appreciate light, crisp handgun triggers, they are by and large unnecessary for their intended real world purpose, and can be detrimental in certain circumstances. What irks me is when people take something like a Glock, swap out a bunch of parts to get a crisp, “1911 like” trigger, and then have problems and blame the gun, when all along they should’ve just shot the shit out of the OEM Glock. Unless you need half moa groups then the trigger is largely irrelevant in rifles too. |
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I only gripe about two guns My Glock 43 and 48 I don’t know if it’s the skinny grips, the triggers, or both but I don’t shoot them as well as my other Glocks I can fire off a mag out of my 48 at 25 yards and it literally looks like I hit the target with a round of 00 buck |
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Originally Posted By 03RN: Unless you need half moa groups then the trigger is largely irrelevant in rifles too. Attached File |
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Originally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Yes. This is why you see people that think they need to sink X number of dollars into trigger "upgrades" before they've ever fired the gun. I have a friend who just ordered a CZ P10F match edition "because it was on sale." Then -- THEN -- after the order is complete, he reads some reviews and sees people complaining about the "match" trigger. Now he's got a match trigger on order before the gun has even shipped. Did he listen to me? (Buy a Canik if you want a good trigger and a decent match gun at a lower price.) Of course not. I foresee this CZ either getting sold or never shot again within 6 months. Instead of just buckling down and spending a good month training with it, he'll chase a lighter trigger and in the end, be upset it's not on par with his 2011s. |
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Originally Posted By Bravo_Six: Life is too short to tolerate shitty triggers. Amen. I mostly shoot hammer CZ's that have been Cajunized. When it comes to striker fired pistols, the Walther PDP kicks the shit out of any Glock. The P10c is also a hell of a pistol. |
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I conceal carry a revolver occasionally so most guns are okay to me. At best some triggers feel weird or spongy but that was never a big deal. Some revolvers with really heavy triggers get on my nerves though. I don't know how police officers were fine with the S&W 28 because that trigger is like the ones in my dreams. Heavy and never fires. |
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I think it’s the opposite. It’s easier for me to shoot a milspec trigger AR closer on split times/course scores compared to one of my G$ SSA-E perfectly tuned ARs, than it is to take a shitty stock Glock 19 trigger and perform close to something like my tuned Springfield 1911. IMO the trigger quality on pistols does not get enough attention. |
What kind of dystopian hellscape have we built?
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Attached File On paper, the TUC is a terrible trigger. Lots of stacking and a vague warning before hammer release. Trigger snobs will hate it but everyone I let use it at the range Saturday loved the stupid little thing. |
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Religion is a handy device for keeping the philosophically deficient in line.
It’s nice that we have options so we don’t all have to shoot the same thing… but yeah, so long as the trigger is consistent I can work with it. Same for grip angle and even the dreaded “muh boar axis”. 
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Beautifying the world one logo at a time since 1993.
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