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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:10:08 PM EDT
Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) is looking into pay abuse at one federal agency. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms misclassified 94 administrative positions as law enforcement jobs. Those jobs were eligible for special pay that’s traditionally reserved for law enforcement officers in government. The Office of Personnel Management partially suspended ATF’s job classification authority after a review found problems with those 94 positions. Grassley said some ATF employees are earning higher pay than they should. He learned about the problems from a whistleblower at the agency.
 https://federalnewsnetwork.com/federal-newscast/2021/10/senator-looking-into-potential-pay-abuse-at-atf/ |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:11:01 PM EDT
[#1]
Now do the VA and Covid bonuses
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:12:05 PM EDT
[#2]
I long for the world where this is the worst an executive agency does in any given day.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:13:02 PM EDT
[#3]
Meh... 'paid too much' isn't really in my top 10 "Things that are wrong with the ATF".... but I'll allow it
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:13:39 PM EDT
[#4]
Betcha they did it for more then just pay reasons.
Bets on these people all having fed LEO creds so they can CCW anywhere they damn well please? |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:23:04 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Betcha they did it for more then just pay reasons. Bets on these people all having fed LEO creds so they can CCW anywhere they damn well please? I kinda agree. I'd say there were plenty of little things they did while pretending to federal LE. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:27:34 PM EDT
[#6]
The best solution would be to abolish the ATF.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:28:59 PM EDT
[#7]
In reality, nobody at the ATF is a law enforcement officer. Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." The ATF does none of this. Their only function is to force compliance with arbitrary regulations set forth for tax purposes. Their interaction with the public is nothing but intrusion and harassment. They do not protect or serve the public.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:29:13 PM EDT
[#8]
So, can THIS be the reason we finally scuttle the fucking ATF, or do they need to shoot a few dozen more mothers in the head?
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:32:40 PM EDT
[#9]
My question is, why are government employees given bonuses? They don’t manufacture anything they don’t provide any services.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:35:22 PM EDT
[#10]
MFrs be stealing my valor
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:36:11 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Meh... 'paid too much' isn't really in my top 10 "Things that are wrong with the ATF".... but I'll allow it |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:39:29 PM EDT
[#12]
This is the type of thing that a agency fears from a party out of power least they regain power. It does not seem like much put don't think that they don't pay attention to it and perhaps start to cool their jets a bit because of it.....No agency wants to be on the outs with Congress when there's a good chance of a power shift least they get hit with austerity measures.....Good job Senator.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:41:06 PM EDT
[#13]
Cancel ATF.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:41:28 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 6:49:10 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In reality, nobody at the ATF is a law enforcement officer. Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." The ATF does none of this. Their only function is to force compliance with arbitrary regulations set forth for tax purposes. Their interaction with the public is nothing but intrusion and harassment. They do not protect or serve the public. How can you say this! They did a GREAT job enforcing firearm laws at Ruby Ridge and Waco. "Protect and Serve" they most certainly did. I feel much safer. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 7:05:09 PM EDT
[#16]
Most of their investigators just audit FFLs, Monday through Friday, day shift. Yet the claim the 25% Federal LEO bonus.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 7:15:56 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most of their investigators just audit FFLs, Monday through Friday, day shift. Yet the claim the 25% Federal LEO bonus. Which is for those LEOs who work a mandatory 50 work week IIRC, when all other bureaucrats work 40 hours. Kharn |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 8:34:03 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I kinda agree. I'd say there were plenty of little things they did while pretending to federal LE. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Betcha they did it for more then just pay reasons. Bets on these people all having fed LEO creds so they can CCW anywhere they damn well please? I kinda agree. I'd say there were plenty of little things they did while pretending to federal LE. Hazard pay, accelerated retirement also. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 8:46:43 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In reality, nobody at the ATF is a law enforcement officer. Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." The ATF does none of this. Their only function is to force compliance with arbitrary regulations set forth for tax purposes. Their interaction with the public is nothing but intrusion and harassment. They do not protect or serve the public. This for the MFW! |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 8:52:22 PM EDT
[#20]
Snagging that LEAP at a non 1811 position?
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Posted: 10/13/2021 8:56:31 PM EDT
[#21]
My guess is that these were 1811s (Criminal Investigators) that somehow shoehorned themselves into a cushy mission support gig that should’ve been handled by non-sworn GS employees at a much lower level.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:17:32 PM EDT
[#22]
Last thing they want is OPM actually reviewing their pay structure and practices. They'd all end up topping at GL 9 with no OT allowed. That'd be a real shame.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:18:18 PM EDT
[#23]
Double tap
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:24:03 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: MFrs be stealing my valor Why would you out yourself as an ATF agent here? That's like wearing a MAGA hat at a gay parade. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:38:01 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would you out yourself as an ATF agent here? That's like wearing a MAGA hat at a gay parade. Who said anything about the atf being le? Damn 21rs |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:40:04 PM EDT
[#26]
What I can't believe is that OPM told them there was a problem, and the ATF just said fuck it.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:41:38 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who said anything about the atf being le? Damn 21rs Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why would you out yourself as an ATF agent here? That's like wearing a MAGA hat at a gay parade. Who said anything about the atf being le? Damn 21rs Ah, I thought you were saying the administrative employees are stealing your valor. Cause you're a real dog kicker, I mean door kicker. Damn nonpaying members. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:53:31 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The best solution would be to abolish the ATF. Too many son in laws and brother in laws work there. Plus it’s easier to skim money off of an entity that size. It’s not going anywhere. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:53:40 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cancel ATF. Nonsense. Defund them 
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Posted: 10/13/2021 9:59:47 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) is looking into pay abuse at one federal agency. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms misclassified 94 administrative positions as law enforcement jobs. Those jobs were eligible for special pay that’s traditionally reserved for law enforcement officers in government. The Office of Personnel Management partially suspended ATF’s job classification authority after a review found problems with those 94 positions. Grassley said some ATF employees are earning higher pay than they should. He learned about the problems from a whistleblower at the agency. https://federalnewsnetwork.com/federal-newscast/2021/10/senator-looking-into-potential-pay-abuse-at-atf/ only 94? figured it would be much higher. aka, all of them. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:04:43 PM EDT
[#31]
Hope all 94 go like this ...
 ATF Agent tased, arrested at gunpoint by Columbus Police - new bodycam footage |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:11:11 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In reality, nobody at the ATF is a law enforcement officer. Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." The ATF does none of this. Their only function is to force compliance with arbitrary regulations set forth for tax purposes. Their interaction with the public is nothing but intrusion and harassment. They do not protect or serve the public. It pays the cost to be the Boss. Thanks. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:14:59 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The best solution would be to abolish the ATF. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:24:47 PM EDT
[#34]
Meh. It's a start, I guess.
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:26:22 PM EDT
[#35]
FATF
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:35:58 PM EDT
[#36]
It's likely they have no idea either.
My job is under a special pay table from opm. It could be completely the wrong pay table and I would have no idea since I didn't get to pick which pay table I'm assigned, it was assigned to me when I was hired. So fuck the ATF, but I feel sorry for the individual agents that might get raked over something that is likely outside of their control. |
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Posted: 10/13/2021 10:40:30 PM EDT
[#37]
The whole lot and anyone involved should be fired on the spot and banned from public service sector ever again. Also all the overpay comes due on their taxes.
Or could do like China handles corruption and.. COC |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 12:35:34 AM EDT
[#38]
 ATF Offers to help the Taliban with operation 2 fast 2 furious |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 12:39:07 AM EDT
[#39]
I was hoping the thread title was bait, cause they are the master of it.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 1:00:32 AM EDT
[#40]
Most LEO'S are sworn to uphold the laws of whatever state/city they are serving in. I think the SCOTUS ruling was that law enforcement has no duty to protect individuals, but only the public at large. Something like that anyway. I think the case involved three women who inadvertently let a thug into their house. They called 911, but the thug yanked the cord out. Cops came, no one answered the door and there were no signs of forcible entry. Cops left and the guy used them for his private harem for 3 days. The ladies were pissed and sued the town for being denied police protection. They lost. The thug was caught and sent to prison.
Good case to remember when the Karen's cry about guns. |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 1:16:07 AM EDT
[#41]
Paper shufflers with combat pay?
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Posted: 10/14/2021 1:26:19 AM EDT
[#42]
OPM will end up getting their money back by docking their checks every two weeks until the debt is paid. Depending how long this has gone on for, they could be in for a very long time of light paychecks. Not defending the ATF but this sounds like a procedural screw up, not a case of people involved in a elaborate scam.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 2:15:17 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OPM will end up getting their money back by docking their checks every two weeks until the debt is paid. Depending how long this has gone on for, they could be in for a very long time of light paychecks. Not defending the ATF but this sounds like a procedural screw up, not a case of people involved in a elaborate scam. Depends. Unless there is fraud or misrepresentation involved, they'll just have their jobs reclassified from, say, GL12 to GS 9 as the cap. They wouldn't have to pay back a cent. Depending on the exact grades involved there might not be any real reduction in pay at all, just no ability to get an automatic raise some time in the future. For example, if GL12 was the cap, but their position, according to OPM, should have capped at GS9, it's possible that some or all of the 94 affected still haven't even reached the 12 level due to just being hired. They might have all been hired as 5s a year ago and are still not even to the 9 level. The article doesn't really provide enough information to know. Also, historically, employees have requested an audit by OPM because they thought they were underpaid, and OPM determined they were actually being overpaid based on actual work performed. It would be hilarious if that were the case here. |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 4:07:15 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Depends. Unless there is fraud or misrepresentation involved, they'll just have their jobs reclassified from, say, GL12 to GS 9 as the cap. They wouldn't have to pay back a cent. Depending on the exact grades involved there might not be any real reduction in pay at all, just no ability to get an automatic raise some time in the future. For example, if GL12 was the cap, but their position, according to OPM, should have capped at GS9, it's possible that some or all of the 94 affected still haven't even reached the 12 level due to just being hired. They might have all been hired as 5s a year ago and are still not even to the 9 level. The article doesn't really provide enough information to know. Also, historically, employees have requested an audit by OPM because they thought they were underpaid, and OPM determined they were actually being overpaid based on actual work performed. It would be hilarious if that were the case here. I have never seen that scenario play out, but I'm not going to say it hasn't happened. Have you ever seen that? I have on the other hand witnessed first hand the one I described.  Usually the error is caught within a few pay periods and the damage is minimal. Even if it's their screw up, they always get their money back, with interest. Just like the IRS.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 4:09:04 AM EDT
[#45]
A - T - F, F - B - I, M - O - U - S - E.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 4:47:41 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In reality, nobody at the ATF is a law enforcement officer. Law enforcement's job is to "protect and serve." The ATF does none of this. Their only function is to force compliance with arbitrary regulations set forth for tax purposes. Their interaction with the public is nothing but intrusion and harassment. They do not protect or serve the public. Atf does do some good work with bad guys. They put legitly bad dudes away. Mess with innocent folks too? Sure. |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 5:00:29 AM EDT
[#47]
Government can get back to me when I can go into a store and buy a suppressor over the counter and shoot it that day.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 6:05:37 AM EDT
[#48]
Pay problems in the federal government actually are pretty rare. My buddy changed agencies and they screwed up his step....and he did have to pay the money back....every cent. The mistake went on for 2 years until they caught it during an audit.
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Posted: 10/14/2021 6:17:39 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now do the VA and Covid bonuses |
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Posted: 10/14/2021 6:59:59 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is this? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Now do the VA and Covid bonuses |
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